I would pull it out, hook some wires up to it and test out of the truck and see how well it spins. When mine went bad I tested it out of the truck and it wouldn't spin that well. I knew it was toast at that point. Maybe you can score one at a used auto parts place for the time being.

 

Oh i plan to go used. Last time I had a slow starter it spun fine without any load. once back on the truck though it bogged down. 22:1 is a lot of compression

 

Starters are something that can't be accurately bench tested without a load on it. I hate having "techs" tell me starters are still good because when they hooked it up to a battery and spun it, it spun fast and good so it shouldn't have a problem starting the truck and that something else is wrong.

Back when i had a bad starter, the original DD starter was spinning unevenly, the remanned bosch unit would spin just as slow but evenly, which is why i bought the new Bosch unit and it was fast enough but its still a helluva lot slower than my old DD starter was but it can actually start the truck so i can't hate it LOL

 

That's what I meant by the only place to get the starter "reliably" tested. The tech is an old fellow how looks at the Cose or Sine wave readout that his machine prints out. Crappy Tire told me that my last starter was fine. When the other tech tested it he could tell that there was a bad spot in the field winding or that an armature was done.

 

Got a used DD starter today, installed it and absolutely nothing. Removed checked wires, reinstall, still nothing. Pulled DD and reinstalled my old GR starter. Slow as hell cranks. Returned DD starter and the guy I got it from tested it and it spun like hell. I couldn't get it to budge.

When I was tightening the batts I noticed that the pass side +, the double connection, felt kind of stripped. swapped the batts over because I have top mount on the drivers side, certain that was the problem. Still slow cranks. I checked all the + wires going from DS battery to pass side to starter. All looked good and were flexible throughout. All connections shiny and tight. So both batts test at 12.7v but is there a way to load test the batts at home. Maybe not enough amps to make it go?

 

put your meter on the batteries and set it up where you can view it while you crank it over. If you see 10.5 to 11 volts at the batteries while cranking move your positive meter clamp to the starter stud and recheck.

 

Don't you hate it when stuff like this falls on a holiday. It seems that whenever i need to get some parts it's a holiday or it's friday and i have to wait til monday to order it in.

Sounds like the issue i had, only a new replacement starter fixed it. Now that i have an expensive new starter, i'm gonna rebuild my old DD for secondary use.

 

bbbadboy. my multimeter doesn't have clamps, just probes. I'll have to wait for that test til my wife gets home. 10.5-11v, is that good or bad? When you say to put the probe to the starter stud, do you mean the stud that the battery goes to or the switch? I figure the battery stud but just checking. Also I figure you mean to check while cranking.

Koots, I'm n ext to certain it isn't the starter. The starter came out of the wreckers tow truck when he stopped using it a few years ago. Said it was working fine when it came off. And it sppun like mad when he put it on the charger. I couldn't even get it to make a sound. I don't think I have enough juice to get it to turn. Enough to get the GR starter to turn a bit but not that big old DD.

I have the batts back on trickle charge right now. Leave it for today and tonight and see if it makes any difference. BTW Is it real bad to charge on 15amps rather than 2 amps. I've heard that the lower is better but 2 stone dead batteries at 2 amp charge may take a real long while.

Thanks again
Sean

 

You mentioned a burned up ground wire. If all the power is going through that 1 cable then it might be bad. Run another ground wire to block and see if that helps. Also pull each battery cable and verify they are all clean. They might look clean when they are connected but making bad electrical contact.

 

Blazer, The burned up ground is just the little one from battery to rad support. I think it's just for the headlights. The wire itself looks allright, I wrapped it up with electric tape and I think it's good to go. I disconnected all the +'s from drivers side battery through to the starter and shinied everything up. No difference. I haven't checked the 2 main grounds but they feel good and flexible and the ground from the DS battery to intake manifole was removed and cleaned a bit a couple months ago when I had the intake off.

 

hmm so on charge now for 3 hrs and it's worse than before. Not even slow cranks. Anyone understand engine electrical? I know I don't. I

 

well next update. Took bats out of the truck and charged one by one. First one charged for about 15min and the charger said it was done charging. read at 2 amps tho. Does that mean that's how much it's charged or how much it's drawing?

I hate electricity, I wish i had a standard. I live on a pretty good hill

Ok second battery same deal. Took a closer look at the charger and 0amps means battery 100%. So i guess that's pretty good. So if starter is good????, and batts are good and cab gets power, and glows get power, meaning the connection from batts to starter is good, what could the problem be???

 

I would still guess something crappy in the starter.

A real draw test is the only way to really test batteries. It see's how they react.

And I'm with you, I'm not real good with tricity.

 

A battery load test verified to me that i needed new batteries even after just buying a new starter. Once i got the starter that could crank the engine it would crank and drain the battery within seconds. Now i can crank for a good while before the battery is an issue.

 

10.5 volts is bare minimum you should see at the batteries while cranking the engine, this will test your batteries...tho if the starter is done for it will draw more amperage than the batteries can provide. The reason for doing the load test at the batteries and at the battery pole of the starter is to check for current breakdown to the starter (for example internally broken or corroded cables, bad connections, etc.). Probly the best way to check the batteries themselves in your situation, would be to energize the glow plugs with the meter hooked up to the batteries...turn the heater fan and lights on at the same time. If your batteries hold at 10.5v or better with lights, fan, and glowers turned on then your batteries are good. If passing the battery test, next connect the negative probe to the positive battery terminal furthest from the starter, put the positive probe on the big stud of the starter itself (not the cable terminal at the stud, but the stud itself), then attempt to crank. You should see very low reading on the meter with probes connected this way. If you see 1 volt or more on the meter during cranking, then you have a bad connection between the 2 probes. If you have less than 1 volt, replace the starter.

 

You can do the same test on the ground side as well. Connect negative lead of meter to the battery negative post that is connected to the body/frame, connect the postive lead to the engine block and attempt to crank...once again, reading should be less than 1 volt, anything more and you have bad connection or not enough ground to the engine. To be honest, when I do those tests on my vehicles, I like to see less than .5 volts for a reading...anything more and I'm cleaning/replacing cables, terminals, and adding grounds. Basically what you are reading there is battery voltage lost. Whatever your meter reads on those 2 tests is what is subtracted from your battery total voltage to the load and less voltage means less amperage available.

 

Ok I think I've got it. By the time my wife got home the starter wasn't turning at all anymore. Will the tests still work if thr starter won't crank? I do seem to have glows however (light comes on ) and heater and lights are working, but seem dim. I'm bringing the bats into Canadian Tire to get load tested today. Not sure if i trust them or not.

 

Ok I think I've got it. By the time my wife got home the starter wasn't turning at all anymore. Will the tests still work if thr starter won't crank? I do seem to have glows however (light comes on ) and heater and lights are working, but seem dim. I'm bringing the bats into Canadian Tire to get load tested today. Not sure if i trust them or not.

As long as the solenoid engages the starter the test'll work. Even if the starter won't actually turn over. Make sure the batteries are fully charged before load testing them.

 

save yourself some hasslesand 2nd guessing in the future and buy a load tester.

i've had a few brand bew batteries that were bad. I've had one post on a dual post battery go bad.

When you test dual post batteries it's best to test all 4 posts. At least test the posts you are using.
I had terrible luck with Napa Nascar Select batteries. I buy from Walmart or Autozone now. Their Warranties are transferable from store to store and their stores are located all across the country.

You can pick a good load tester up pretty reasonable if you shop around.

A new to me phenominom I ran into a few years ago is bad batteries holding good voltage but not giving up enough amps to crank a starter.

If the batteries pass the load test, you can load test at the starter end of the cable. Sometimes the cables are bad inside and can not be visually inspected. So you can have a good battery, good starter, good connections and still no go.

 

I always at some point in time, charge the batteries, Disconnect them, leave them for at least 1/2 hour and then load test them seperately.

 

Ok so just got back from Canadian Tire. Batts are both rated for 820 cca and on came back at 920cca and the other at 860cca. So that sounds pretty good. I forgot too that when I had the DD starter from the wrecker, and it wouldn't budge, I took the starter down off the flywheel, hooked it back up and tried again. Still nothing. When I brough it back he hooked it up and it spun like mad. I know I had it hooked up right because when I put my old one back on it cranked for a while, s;lowly but it cranked. Now it's doing the same thing as the DD.

So here are my thoughts now. Good batteries, good starter. Bad wire between batts and starter. "felt" good as in when I flexed it along it's length I couldn't feel any crispy parts but who knows. OR bad side terminals on batteries. I have drivers side on top post but Pass side which it has to go through to get to the starter is side post. I have put the multimeter on the side post and get the 12.8v reading but maybe it won't let any amperage through.

Sound like a good theory?

 

I've seen it before. That's why it's well worth the money to have your own load tester. You can test each post and you can test before and after the cables to eliminate or identify connections or cables as problems

 

if you do the tests as I described with the meter, you are in affect testing your cables and connections leaving no doubt as to whether they are good or not...you now know your batteries are good, do the tests from positive to starter stud, negative to engine block as I described...if the cables/connections pass that test...get a new starter.

 

bbbadboy. My problem with those tests is that my multimeter has probes rather than clips and the wires are only about a foot long. I could get another multimeter but the good ones I've seen haven't been cheap. I did do the glowplugs, heater and lights trick and I still got 11.8v.

So I got some 0/0 gauge wire today and tried to make a new battery to starter cable. The thick wire wouldn't actually go in any ring terminals that I could get so instead i used the battery crossover wire with one side top mount and attached the other end to the starter. Top mount eliminates the possible bad side mount and that wire felt really good throughout its length and the batteries when hooked together always showed the exact same voltage to within .01v so I figured the wire was good. Only hooked up the one battery but they were both close to 900cca and I disconnected the glows so no draw from them. Turned the key and all I got was a click. What the ??? I figured I'd at least get a slow crank. At least tomorrow I can bring the starter into the NAPA that has the tech I trust to do a load test on it. Did I mention ARRRGGGHHHH.

Oh well at least I'm working in town

 

I have to admit, I don't know a dam thing bout those bench starter testers...do they REALLY simulate the load of a V8 engine with 21.5 to 1 compression?

 

No the starter bench test that most places do just give the starter power and if it spins it passes. The Napa that I'm bringing it too has a pretty old school tester that has a printout and a bunch of cos or sine waves that means something to someone that can read it. The fellow that tests there does understand it so that's why I;m bringing it there rather than Canadian Tire or anyother parts place.