Suncoast's new Gmax kits utilize the same C1 & C2 components as the Stage IV kit. C3 and C4 clutches now consist of 12 single sided clutches, the clutches stack on top of each other without traditional steels--just like there C1 clutches. Clutch material appears to be the same as there C1 only they are a full waffle design for improved oil cooling/retention, they do have slots like the stock or previous Alto clutches.

 

Huh........Didnt know they had something new out.

 

Going to be a good year for the Allison. The new Alto one sided clutches show a lot of promise.I will have some new options shortly, one of them proven allready and the other going into testing.

 

Thats good. Hopefully by summer when my turbo gets some company Ill be looking into refreshing mine. Its been a hard 40k miles on my tranny.

 

sweet just in time for dirtymax85's trans, maybe I will get more than a year out of it this time

 

Will cost be going up or down?

 

cost for the kit on the suncoast website looks to be around 1400 but my guess is that that price doesn't include a converter.

 

so are these kits going to be "better" than the old kits?

Looking to build mine around this summer and wondering if i should wait until the new style gets the bugs worked out.

 

so are these kits going to be "better" than the old kits?

Looking to build mine around this summer and wondering if i should wait until the new style gets the bugs worked out.

"better" probably. They have been in testing for over a year now so bugs should be worked out. I've seen a pair of C3s from an 800 hp truck sled puller, drag racer, daily abuser 10,000 miles and no signs of distress--looks like a winner.

 

interesting............new options are always good

 

are all pump and VB modifacations the same as the IV? mike have you worked with this kit yet (im guessing you have) what do you think of it?

 

are all pump and VB modifacations the same as the IV? mike have you worked with this kit yet (im guessing you have) what do you think of it?

Yes I have and it's a great kit.

 

how long before this kit is ready mike...im fixen to buy something but will wait if its a short while.....

 

TTT for this Question.

 

also mike how does the price compare to the old kits? and are the new ones stronger, or why are they changing the design?

 

this sounds cool,good thing i have to build mine now

 

Mike or Big Dipper........what is the purpose of a "one sided clutch disc".....????? Thanks guys.

 

Heres my theory on why this is better, on the old kit the steels are thinner then the clutches right? so if you had 5 clutches and 5 steels in a clutch pack and the steel discs were and 1/8 inch thick (.125) and the the clutches were 1/4 inch thick (.250") then lets say you could fit 10 to a clutch pack how many more could you fit it the discs were all the same thickness by having one clutch side and one steel side to them? and if they all measured the same thickness and that thickness was thinner then a 1/4 inch by a 1/16 of an inch?

 

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One purpose of the steels is to help dissipate heat correct? Won't the steel handle heat better than the clutch face? If all the heat is dissipated through the "one sided" clutch won't this cause a overheat problem with the clutch? Thanks.

 

One purpose of the steels is to help dissipate heat correct? Won't the steel handle heat better than the clutch face? If all the heat is dissipated through the "one sided" clutch won't this cause a overheat problem with the clutch? Thanks.

yes but arnt the new clutchs waffled. there for your getting alott more fluid between each clutch keeping it cool, and for every clutch side theres a steel side to match its not like theres more fibers than steel. and theres more steel fiber contact spreading out the load and heat.not sure if the new steels are thiner or the same as the old ones. but thats my theary on it. im no trans expert just my 2 cents. im sure mike will ring in on this and make me look like an idiot.

 

The C1's that have been coming in the kits are one sided, and they have proven reliable. I'm no trans builder, but I'm sure if SUNCOAST is going to these it is for a reason.

 

true that.

 

:I'll take 2!:

 

Wasn't disagreeing, just wondering about the theory.

 

Price seems comparable to the Stage IV kit with a 1056... Did the IV kit have anything that this kit is missing?

 

The Stage IV kit came with 16 Alto single sided carbonite C-1 Clutches, 7 Alto Red Eagle double sided clutches and 8 Kolene steels and 1 wavy steel, 6 Alto Red Eagle double sided C3 clutches and 5 Kolene steels (12 friction surfaces total), and 6 Alto Red Eagle double sided C4 clutches and 5 kolene steels (12 friction surfaces total).

On this kit it comes with the same C1 and C2 setup. C3 and C4 have been switched to 12 single sided carbonite clutches (still 12 friction surfaces in each pack). The carbonite clutch material bites into the metal better so that it should slip less. They have the waffle pattern so that it will flow more across the surface since they no longer have slots in the frictions and steels to let fluid flow through. Both kits come with the same valve body and pump modifications.

I have heard nothing but good for racing applications. My only concern is the lack of fluid flow through the pack for daily driving and towing applications - not saying they won't hold up well, but IMO only time will tell. IMO the Alto red eagles have proven to be a great compromise between holding power for racing and pulling and longevity for daily driving and towing.

 

does the new single sided clutches have a kolene treatment to protect against heat warpage?

 

One side of each disc is friction material and the other side is steel - no kolene steels.

 

So then their new kit is a downgrade from their previous kit they were offering.

Maybe they are cutting manufacturing costs...?

 

I wouldn't say that at all. The new kit is a different clutch material and they have changed it to single side clutch/steels. If you do the kolene treatment before your put the clutch material on I think you'd have bonding issues - and you can't do it after the clutch material is bonded.

The C1 clutches have been this way for a long time and fail the least of all the clutches in a built trans.

 

that is true since the single sided C1's are reliable because of their shear number over that of stock = more clutch material surface area big time,,, the surface area of C3 and C4 single sided is no more increased over the suncoast IV kolene steel set up versus the new single sided kits, and with out kolene,.
I guess time will tell with a few high HP installs...