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Discussion Starter #1
I've seen the pics of problemchild's dissected filter, and it shows that there is embedded dirt only partly into the red foam. There is no evidence of dirt in the later half of the red foam, and none whatsoever in the dark foam.


That said, if there was dirt passed through the media, there would be evidence of dirt deeper into the foam, pure and simple.


I still have not been able to detect ANY DIRECT light penetration through both layers of foam. I've seen what LOOKS like light, but is actually reflection from oil film, of an indirect light source. If you believe that you see light through the foam, then you should also be able to eclipse this light AND alter the shade with a piece of something colored. If someone wants to show me "the light" they are welcome to do so.





That's my story and I'm sticking to it...
 

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problemchild

Prove the holes.
 

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PC doesn't have his filter any more from what I understand.
 

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Interesting thought. I looked at the picture in the other discussion. I find it hard to believe that those "holes" are reflections in oil, since the filter is otherwise so dirty. I don't think dirty oil would reflect like that, and I don't think there'd be that much oil on the surface anyway.
BUT, your idea is excellent. Shine a bright light from behind and allow it to produce "dots" of light on a piece of black construction paper below. Then use your hand to interrupt the light.
I don't think problemchild can do that since his filter is now at Uni, cut in two. But for anyone else who thinks they have a similar problem, this would be a good, quick test.


Jim
 

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When this first started, I checked mine. This is my post below. Although it looked like very small light, when I checked it as Kennedy suggests at that time on a piece of cardboard could not see any light. Checked my tubing at the MAF sensor again yesterday and still no dust or dirt. Mine seems to be working fine.





Jack, aztjc



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<TD class=smText noWrap>Posted: 10 February 2004 at 7:52pm | IP Logged </TD>
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Diesel Enthusiast


Group: Diesel Enthusiast
Joined: 06 September 2003
Location: Tucson,Arizona
Posts: 31 </TD>
<TD class=text vAlign=top background="" bgColor=#fefefc> I checked mine today with only 2k miles since install, and yes I can see some small holes as shown by others. Checked tubing with clean white paper towel and no dirt or film. Could it be that under vacuum when engine running and with RPM that the filter compresses and closes these holes? Just a thought. </TD></TR></T></TABLE>
 

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I'll check mine tomorrow provided it is sunny out. I am one who also "sees the light" and will try to see the light in a different way as John suggests.


aztjc's post concerning the constriction of the holes under vacuum is interesting.
 

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Kennedy said:
I've seen the pics of problemchild's dissected filter, and it shows that there is embedded dirt only partly into the red foam. There is no evidence of dirt in the later half of the red foam, and none whatsoever in the dark foam.


That said, if there was dirt passed through the media, there would be evidence of dirt deeper into the foam, pure and simple.


I still have not been able to detect ANY DIRECT light penetration through both layers of foam. I've seen what LOOKS like light, but is actually reflection from oil film, of an indirect light source. If you believe that you see light through the foam, then you should also be able to eclipse this light AND alter the shade with a piece of something colored. If someone wants to show me "the light" they are welcome to do so.





That's my story and I'm sticking to it...

Private and classified ?? Not doubting,you haven't but have a link to view ?? I think we all would like to see them ....


Mac
 

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Discussion Starter #8
If dirt had passed through this filter, wouldn't it stand to reason that there would be evidence that it had penetrated beyong the first 1/8" to 1/4" of the red foam? Sorry, but you cannot tell me that the thousands, if not millions of particles necessary to form a layer of dust somehow navigated through this element, particularly through a handful of pinholes without leaving a trail of distinctive evidence...











 

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Discussion Starter #9
Mackin said:
Kennedy said:
I've seen the pics of problemchild's dissected filter, and it shows that there is embedded dirt only partly into the red foam. There is no evidence of dirt in the later half of the red foam, and none whatsoever in the dark foam.


That said, if there was dirt passed through the media, there would be evidence of dirt deeper into the foam, pure and simple.


I still have not been able to detect ANY DIRECT light penetration through both layers of foam. I've seen what LOOKS like light, but is actually reflection from oil film, of an indirect light source. If you believe that you see light through the foam, then you should also be able to eclipse this light AND alter the shade with a piece of something colored. If someone wants to show me "the light" they are welcome to do so.





That's my story and I'm sticking to it...

Private and classified ?? Not doubting,you haven't but have a link to view ?? I think we all would like to see them ....


Mac




What some of you may not realize is that I am on dial up, and navigating the forum with all of the Avatars, images etc is quite a PITA...





I resized the pic and attempted to load about 4 times before I hit the proper size...
 

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Kennedy said:
I've seen the pics of problemchild's dissected filter, and it shows that there is embedded dirt only partly into the red foam.  There is no evidence of dirt in the later half of the red foam, and none whatsoever in the dark foam.


That said, if there was dirt passed through the media, there would be evidence of dirt deeper into the foam, pure and simple.
  If you believe that you see light through the foam, then you should also be able to eclipse this light AND alter the shade with a piece of something colored. 
First, regarding eclipseing light through a filter.....Probably IMPOSSIBLE even with a clean/straight hole all the way through the media. The eclipse idea is used for viewing the sun through a pinhole made through an opaqe material that is THIN. Typically a piece of black construction paper or a sheet of alluminum foil. Trying to align a media that is an inch or so thick so that sunlight will travel PERFECTLY through a hole that is 200 microns wide is needlessly to say nearly impossible.
Have you ever had a narrow tube or pipe that was dark inside and tried to look down it using sunlight? Try as you may, it is VERY difficult to align a pipe PERFECTLY so that it is in PERFECT alignment with the sun, or any light source for that matter. A long straight pinhole in a 1 1/2 inch thick filter is likened to a 25 foot pipe at 4 inches diameter. I challenge anyone to line up that pipe with the sun so that sunlight reaches the bottom.
Regarding not seeing dirt in the second half of the filter, IF there are pinhole problems, the only place you would see the dirt in the top part of the filter would be if you cut the filter DIRECTLY along the path of that hole(s). IF the dirt was getting through the entire media then yes, there would be dirt in the deeper parts of the filter but that doesn't mean it would be immediately obvious to the naked eye. Microscopes are amazing and if you have'nt looked through one lately it is easy to forget just HOW MUCH is down there at that scale. I'd bet that any air filter would look like a farce if it was scrutinized with a microscope, EVEN AT THE "CLEAN" SIDE OF THE FILTER. SPICER
 

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We may want to check to see if the air filter life indicator located on the air box is still intact. Mine has been knocked out every time I have changed my fuel filter (from the top). I know of three other people w/dmax's that are missing the indicator. My uncle went somewhere between 10,000 -60,000 miles before I pointed it out.


Hope this helps.





SmokeyMax
 

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John





Sorry bout your internet problem,who knew .....



Thanks for the pic ,that is quite dense foam ....


How long did PC have that filter in service ?? Loks like they just seperated the two halves ....


What would be perfect is if the RED side was on the "clean" side that would be the proof ,huh ??


Whatcha gonna do no real way to prove one way or anouther .... Would I try a UNI ?? Yup if they had one fit on my AFE tube I would ...


Mac
 

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NEVER say NEVER.........

You assume the cut up no dirt here test is 100% accurate. When they wiped the filter in front of me the toilet paper was black. He said some dirt and mostly oil. So dirt was passing through.

I will offer this challange to anyone who says that filter didnt pass dirt into my intake tube.

CHALLANGE----->

We will clean my intake tube.
We will install a new same type of uni filter.
We will seal the filter box with some tamper proof seal.
I will drive the truck into high dust desert zones for 7k miles.
We will open the filter box at 7k miles.


If there is ANY dirt/sand/debris in the intake tube you buy my truck from me.

AND Post a full page ad in the Los Angelas Times that UNI builds defective filters that are crap.


ANY TAKERS??????

Anyone want to put your money where your mouth is?

And why is kennedy getting pictures from UNI?
Those pictures dont prove crapola. I have pictures of the dirt in my intake that you so redily dismissed. Edited by: problemchild
 

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Mackin, a number of weeks ago a guy posted here or over there that he put a UNI on his K&N. The filter was # UAP-908 with filter wrap # 01-1122. The filter has a 4 inch connection. All dimensions are on the UNI site. I was wondering if it would fit in an AFE box. Is the AFE tube 4 inch? http://unifilter.com/automotive.htm


Steve Edited by: YZF1R
 

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After reading all of this I checked my filter and what I observe is the same thing that John did. There is no direct hole but if you catch it just right you get reflections off of the oil. I used a spotlight on the other side as my light source. I have had mine on for about 4k miles and the intake tube is perfectly clean. I'll keep using mine until somebody proves it's no good.
 

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problemchild said:
NEVER say NEVER.........

..............I will offer this challange to anyone who says that filter didnt pass dirt into my intake tube.

CHALLANGE----->

We will clean my intake tube.
We will install a new same type of uni filter.
We will seal the filter box with some tamper proof seal.
I will drive the truck into high dust desert zones for 7k miles.
We will open the filter box at 7k miles.


If there is ANY dirt/sand/debris in the intake tube you buy my truck from me.

AND Post a full page ad in the Los Angelas Times that UNI builds defective filters that are crap.


ANY TAKERS??????

Anyone want to put your money where your mouth is?

..........

Hmm, let me see ~ enter into a business arrangement w/someone w/your handle
That'd be like taking horse racing/stockmarket/brain surgery tips from someone w/my handle
I don't doubt you ~ but as my dear ol' pappy would say: "Don't play cards with someone named Ace, eat at a place named Mom's nor date carneys" ~ He's gone now so won't have the opportunity to read your many but intriguing threads but if he did ~ I'm sure he'd have included something in his 'words of wisdom'
Edited by: ShumDit
 

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problemchild said:
NEVER say NEVER.........

You assume the cut up no dirt here test is 100% accurate. When they wiped the filter in front of me the toilet paper was black. He said some dirt and mostly oil. So dirt was passing through.

I will offer this challange to anyone who says that filter didnt pass dirt into my intake tube.

CHALLANGE----->

We will clean my intake tube.
We will install a new same type of uni filter.
We will seal the filter box with some tamper proof seal.
I will drive the truck into high dust desert zones for 7k miles.
We will open the filter box at 7k miles.


If there is ANY dirt/sand/debris in the intake tube you buy my truck from me.

AND Post a full page ad in the Los Angelas Times that UNI builds defective filters that are crap.


ANY TAKERS??????

Anyone want to put your money where your mouth is?

And why is kennedy getting pictures from UNI?
Those pictures dont prove crapola. I have pictures of the dirt in my intake that you so redily dismissed.




Edited by: Max Power
 

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problemchild said:
NEVER say NEVER.........

You assume the cut up no dirt here test is 100% accurate. When they wiped the filter in front of me the toilet paper was black. He said some dirt and mostly oil. So dirt was passing through.

I will offer this challange to anyone who says that filter didnt pass dirt into my intake tube.

CHALLANGE----->

We will clean my intake tube.
We will install a new same type of uni filter.
We will seal the filter box with some tamper proof seal.
I will drive the truck into high dust desert zones for 7k miles.
We will open the filter box at 7k miles.


If there is ANY dirt/sand/debris in the intake tube you buy my truck from me.

AND Post a full page ad in the Los Angelas Times that UNI builds defective filters that are crap.


ANY TAKERS??????

Anyone want to put your money where your mouth is?

And why is kennedy getting pictures from UNI?
Those pictures dont prove crapola. I have pictures of the dirt in my intake that you so redily dismissed.




OK nonbelievers, heres A challenge give it A try if your sure Problemchild is making this up, you'll have nothing to loose except if your wrong.


Problemchild did you get A call, or was this guy to busy sending pictures of your filter over the Internet to make the call he promised? I can't believe this is such A problem for any company to take care of.
 

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I smell damage control .....



I have to check out my pipe size YZF1R but I'm scared to check it out ,after all I'm running a Medical Gauze filter ....



Now back to PC


What happens if you lose ??



Mac
 

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Discussion Starter #20
Problemchild gives the impression of being very offensive, and abrasive. Now he may well NOT be that way in person, but the impression given here is so. Not saying that this is how it was handled, but I am here to tell you, if you come in my door with all guns blazing you won't the reaction you get...





Mr Lewis has perhaps the best method of visual testing, although please be careful not to burn the filter with the heat that a spotlight produces.





PS. There was also some discussion of how the Dmax airbox must be assembled "just so" and I HAVE seen instances where a cover screw was not run in properly, and cocked leaving the filter unclamped. To the naked eye, it looks fine, upon closer inspection...
 
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