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Discussion Starter #1
I also posted this under the 3500 dually section.....
Hello Everyone....

Just a couple quick questions. I have a 2005 Chev crew cab 3500 dually (HD?) that i purchased initially for the purpose of towing a little over a year ago. Plans fell through right after that on the toyhauler i wanted then... but now i'm signing papers on the toybox i want... a Weekend Warrior 'Full Throttle' with a custom 2 foot extension to the garage area, making the thing a little over 32 feet in length.

Needless to say when i bought my truck i knew little about diesels, let alone anything about Diesel Place. Well, that 18 months later, my truck is not EFI Lived to death, Banks full system (tuner is something to look at now - doesn't get used - but the intercooler, boost tubes, intake and 'cat'less exhaust are all compliments of the Big Hoss Bundle).... as well as a Suncoast IV with 1057 converter and Mike L '06 cooler... Needless to say this thing SHOULD be able to pull a train with the help of some custom EFI live work....

but back to the point... I've been doing some reading on some of the RV sites (RV.NET was where i found a good thread about this)... and i'm wondering if is SHOULD be pulling something like this. GVRW is supposed to be 17,000 on the trailer.. but it's been whispered to me (by the dealer) that this is conservative and i'm actually adding weight with the extra footage, etc... I figure my trucks about as bullet proof as i can make it.. but not being an experienced 'big' trailer guy... i'm curious of the ratings on my truck (which is stock as far as tires and suspension go) is capable of handling such a beast 'safely'..... I have to believe it is... but in the back of my head i have 3 youngsters that will be occupying the back seat and the queen next to me... safety is a factor and i wonder if maybe i'm stretching things a little too far???

A link to the trailer: http://www.a1warriortrailers.com/ftl.htm#specs

I'm looking for comments... questions.. anything... i sign final paperwork in about a week.... just wondering if i SHOULD be signing it...

Thanks!!

-->Zach
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I thought that the WW FLT40 was 40 ft long. With the added 2 feet that should make it around 42 feet long.

BE CAREFUL - Your Crew Cab 3500 Dually has a GVWR of 11,400 lbs and if it is a 4x4 very likely weighs around 7800 lbs or more with a full tank of fuel, 5th wheel hitch and 400 lbs for driver and passengers; this will leave you with a maximum truck payload around 3,600 lbs or less. If you load the trailer to the full 17,000 lbs GVW, you are going to be looking at pin weight around 3,400 to 3,600 lbs or more and a Gross Combined Weight around 24,800 lbs which will put you 1,300 lbs over the maximum GCWR of 23,500 lbs for the truck.

I would suggest you weigh the truck and the trailer individually to determine how best to load them. Keep in mind that a 5th wheel trailer pin weight should be 15% to 25% of total trailer weight with a maximum recommended pin weight of 3,500 lbs for the 3500 dually. Check your owners manual.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
So would it technically be possible to 'bump' my rating up on the truck with some heaver springs or other suspension modifications? And you are correct.. i definitely made a typo - it will be *42* feet long, not 32... can't believe i did that!...

Anyhow... just wondering if there is something i can do to bump the truck ratings or if i'm really sacrificing any safety. Read posts all over about the rating of these trucks being a fair amount 'under' rated... just wondering if i'm pushing the safety limits....

Thanks!
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Just so everyone catches my mistake.. the trailer is *42* feet long, not 32....
 

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I agree about being carfull about your pin weight. If you are a little overweight overall is not as big of a deal as being over at the pin. Toyhaulers are wierd, they are usually tongue heavy from the get go, but that is to compensate the added weight that you add when you put the toys in. So, I guess my question to you would be, what toys are going in the back? Will it be enough to get the pin weight where you want/need it?

Don't cheep out on the 5th wheel hitch, you are pulling to much weight back there to under rate the hitch. You'll probably need air bags in the rear and make sure your tires are rated for the weight.

Just to compair a little. My buddy had a 40ft Alfa toybox that weight basicly the same as the one you are getting. He pulled it with a newer F250 6.0 Powerjoke, extended cab short bed.:eek: It was very scary to watch him go down the road.:eek::
 

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Discussion Starter #6
I will be putting 3 full size quads and a mini quad along with some 'power wheels' stuff in the back...

As for the Hitch, i'm getting the Reese 24k UnderRail Signature series.... so i should be ok there... i think...

Aire bags... i'll ask the dealer about that and if they can put that in when they do the 'receiver' hitch in the truck. The 'hitch' part of the trailer will have an 'air bag' on it (in between the truck and the frame of the trailer basically)...

So hopefully that helps take some of the jolts off the truck...

-->Zach
 

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FYI: The WW LE3505 has a garage that is 16' 11'' long compared to 14' 0'' for the 42' Full Throttle. It is about 7 feet shorter in overall length and has a 16,000 lb GVWR. It has a dry weight around 9,458 lbs vs approx. 13,000 lbs for the 42' Full Throttle and also carries much less pin weight than the Full Throttle. Even though the GVWR is 16,000 lbs, the available payload is greater than for the Full Throttle due to the lower dry weight. Although it doesn't come standard with the garage wall partition, I believe a partition wall can be added, but that would reduce the length of the garage.

Warrior also makes the LE3705 and the LE3905. The garage in the LE3905 is 20' 11'' :eek:

I am NOT trying to talk out out of getting the 42' Full Throttle, just showing you other options.

Let us know what you decide.
 

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Another thing you probably should do is contact your insurance company BEFORE you buy, to make sure they will cover you at those weights and get it in writing. You don't want to end up in a battle with your insurance company later, if you ever have an accident and they decide that you were overweight.:(

Good Luck!
 

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Just an FYI,
You cannot increase the GVWR of your dually by changing springs or adding airbags or anything else. The weight ratings are set by GM and there is nothing you can do to improve them.

What is the dry weight of your new toy hauler? Just because the thing grosses out at 17,000 lbs does not mean you need to take it there. Find out what it weighs empty, start loading the things you "have to have" in there and then go back and weigh the coach again. If you choose to load the coach up to a full 17,000 lbs just know that you are over weight on your GCVWR. A decision that you and only you can make. Just my 2 cents worth.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Thanks everyone for the input.... I went ot the dealer today as they had the 'first one' of the new model year show up so i could check it out and see what mine was going to be.....

Sadly, the sticker with all the weights, etc. on it went something like this:

Weight: 13,700 lbs (this is only a 40' instead of the 42')
MINUS: 1200 lbs for the water tank
MINUS: 340 lbs for generator gas tank

and there was one more... but when doing the numbers it still came up to about 12,000 and change in dry weight :-( They said my extra 2 feed on the cargo area would be adding about 800 pounds... more bummer....

On the plus side of things... GENEREALLY i plan to haul it mostly empty of water.... but not always... so that will help... there's just alot to consider here that i hadn't been considering until i decided to make this post... now i'm kinda scratchin my head a bit.... the insurance thing IS a big deal so i need to triple check (already called for rates and coverage types, etc.)

Thanks guys...

-->Zach
 

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zfuller123;1559204; said:
Sadly, the sticker with all the weights, etc. on it went something like this:

Weight: 13,700 lbs (this is only a 40' instead of the 42')
MINUS: 1200 lbs for the water tank
MINUS: 340 lbs for generator gas tank

and there was one more... but when doing the numbers it still came up to about 12,000 and change in dry weight :-( They said my extra 2 feet on the cargo area would be adding about 800 pounds... more bummer....
Zach, here is a little more information for you to digest:
___________________________________Weights___
TRAILER GVWR_______________________17,000 lbs
Base Dry Weight (40 ft)____________12,000 ___
Additional 2 feet_____________________800____
_____________TOTAL DRY WEIGHT:_____12,800 lbs

___Available Payload Capacity:______4,200 lbs

FLUIDS____________________(Gals)___ Weight___
Fresh Water ______________150.0_____1,252 lbs
Propane ___________________15.0________64____
Gasoline for Genset________20.0_______125____
Fuel Station Gasoline _____40.0_______248____
______________________TOTAL FLUIDS:_1,689 lbs

_EQUIPMENT, UTENSILS & LUGGAGE______Weight___
Built-in 5.5 kw Genset (Gas powered)__279_lbs
Blender_________________________________5____
Set of pots, pans & bakeware___________15____
Kitchen knives, utensils & flatware__ _10____
Table fan ______________________________8____
Set of wooden TV trays ________________42____
Card table and 4 folding chairs___ ____51____
Area rugs _____________________________42____
19" combo TV/VCR/DVD __________________50____
20 CDs and DVDs (4oz Ea.) ______________5____
Glassware (10 glasses) _________________7____
Coffee/Hot Chocolate Mugs (5)___________4____
Books & Magazines (10)__________________5____
Shirts / Blouses_ (20)__________________7____
Slacks / Jeans____(20)_________________20___
Spring Coats _____( 5)__________________5____
Winter Coats _____( 5)_________________10____
Undergarments_____(40)_________________10____
Socks (pairs)_____(20)__________________2____
Shoes (pairs) ____(10)_________________20____
Sandals / Flip Flops (5 pairs)__________5____
Miscellaneous _________________________70____
__SUBTOTAL (equipment & Luggage)______672 lbs

AVAILABLE CAPCITY FOR TOYS & Tools:_1,839 lbs
But if you load your trailer to its maximum GVWR of 17,000 lbs, you will be around 24,800 lbs for total combined vehicle weight. That is 1,300 lbs above the truck's CGWR of 23,500 lbs. So If you want to stay withing the truck's CGWR, you'll only have enough capacity left for 539 lbs worth of toys and tools. :eek:

This is only a rough guestimate of what five people could typically take with them when camping and doesn't include food or drinks which can weigh quite a bit also. You can adjust quatities and weights depending on what you do take with you and determine your actual load. The point is that all the stuff adds up quickly and we
often carry a lot more weight than we think, so be careful. ;)

Weighing your rig at your local truck stop or city landfill will help you figure out how safe your load
is.

Be safe and enjoy your 4-wheeling & camping outings! :)


 

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guys who run Hot Shot run at 30k+ every day with these trucks. You can run up to 26k combined with a class C drivers license. These trucks can easily pull 30k gross with the right tires/hitch/air bags. So running at 24,800lbs will be fine. Just make sure you feel comfortable hauling that and being able to stop it. 11,400lbs + 17,000lbs =28,400lbs. If you have a CDL then you can run at this weight all day long and be legal.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
No CDL :-(... have to work on that :)
 

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I don't believe you need a CDL if you are only pulling your own property for recreational purposes (At least, not in Michigan). However, if you are running a racing team for profit, then some type of commercial license is required and you'll have to meet all the DOT requirements, including DOT number, log books, medical card, DOT insurance, inspections, etc.
 

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I bought my '04 CC 4wd dually to pull a toy hauler. It is 40' with a dry weight of over 13K and gvw a little over 18K. I live in mine full time so I have a lot of extra crap to go along with the 750 lb bike. I have pulled loaded with 80 gal of water, extra lp tanks etc., etc. Bottom line: it will pull fine - even without airbags. The truck will squat down about level, but with that many toys in the back it should offset some of the pin weight.

It has been proven by many people ballsier than me that the truck will pull that weight safely. Many people are more concerned with the legalities of the what if situation and being overloaded. About that, I truly don't know and there are other threads with heated discussions. That is up to you.

My advice: load up and weigh the combo - so you know and you can also try to adjust weight distrubution. Check the tires and brakes on truck and trailer religiously. Drive carefully - like your family's lives depend on it - because they do. Then take off and enjoy every minute of it.
 

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With my 2005 Duramax 4wd non-dually air bagged crew cab I pull a Weekend Warrior LE3505 (2005) with no slides frequently. Just got back from 10 days in Baja in fact.

I weighed with just half water on board when I first got it a couple of years back and was maxed out on the truck axles without toys, supplies, camp gear, wife and kids onboard. I feel better with some weight past the axles in the back than when no toys are on board. IT is TOO HEAVY on the pin. I am looking at moving the axles forward this spring myself.

Lots of guys out here on the west coast pull the bigger units with triple slides and single off road tires rated for far less weight than they carry and never give it a thought. :eek: :eek: . I max out with my smaller unit all the time. I don't know how they do it? and never seem to get hurt? The tire ratings must REALLY give some margin for error.

Power is not the problem. Guys put all this expensive hop up stuff on their trucks and then over heat the trannies and engines first time they hit a warm pull. Power is great but its the proper loading of rear ends, trans, bearings, springs, tires and brakes that need the attention.

I drive too fast for my rig, I know that. I have CDL too. Doesn't make it any safer when I have to put the binders on hard. These things don't stop so quick!

Be carefull about getting too big a load to carry with your (our) little trucks. If you over load it you have to be aware of it to make a safe journey.
MY.02
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Thank you! I'm going to try it first without the airbags... just drive the thing around empty when it's time to go pick it up (hopefully only 3 more weeks!!!)... just go for a nice flat 100 mile drive or so... get used to it- see what it feels like, etc... then maybe throw some water and gas in it to see how it chugs then.... I purposely had them not install one of the gas tanks (for the generator) and instead had them plumb to the larger fuel station gas tank for the generator. Trying to cut weight - especially front end weight, wherever possible. I'd love to only have the big old bugger weighing in at 16k or so with all the toys and whatever water i plan on carrying.

We'll see how it goes.. but since i'm new to the whole 'big rig' thing (large trailers period)... it's all going to be a curve. I feel pretty confident in my abilities and the truck is set up about as good as a guy can buy IMO - but that doesn't mean it won't need more help. Tranny, trans cooler, etc. have all been done over the past year in anticipation of this load... So hopefully i have a stout enough (for fast or slow pulling) truck to go down the road as safe as i can...

Thanks again!
 

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If you think you want to pull way over GVWR or GCWR, talk to a good attorney first. Check out your liability if you are in an accident and it's your fault. That's why I got a dually even tho lots of guys pull my sized 5er with 3/4s...and are over weight.
 
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