Diesel Place banner

1 - 20 of 22 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
63 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
After reading many posts regarding the install of a CAT fuel filter to the engine mount, I have decided to make this easy for anyone whom wishes to try this install themselves.


This filter mount application can work in either PRE or POST OEM fuel filter setup.


This install will take approx 30-45 minutes to complete due to the easy location & no drilling required.


The following is a list of all the CAT parts required. These are available to anyone from any CAT dealer. I have also included a decription of what is required for the mounting bracked & attachement parts.


CAT parts required:
<UL>
<LI>1N3789 =Filter Base
<LI>1R0750 =Filter (short)
<LI>6N4414 =Cover (for top of filter base)
<LI>1P0436 =Gasket (Between Filter base & cover)
<LI>9S4182 =Air Bleeder Plug
<LI>3J7354 =Seal O-Ring (for bleeder plug)
<LI>7B2742 =Bolt (for cover)
<LI>1B2790 =Bolt (for cover)
<LI>5P0537 =Washer (for cover bolt)
<LI>9M1974 =Washer (for cover bolt)
<LI>738-88 =1/2HBx1/2FFL SW (x2)(90' fittings to filter base)
<LI>6801-08-06-NWO =Adapter (x2)(from hose to 90' fittings)
<LI>1101-8 =1/2" Hose (B708) (4' required)
<LI>Hose clamps to fit 1/2" hose (x4)</LI>[/list]


BRACKET ATTACHMENT


Bracket attaches to secondary alternator location as per the following pictures:





Next picture shows mounting bolt holes:





Next picture shows bracket bolted to location:





Next picture shows Filter base attached to bracket:





Since this is a POST OEM application, connect the hose to the outlet (with exit arrow)from the OEM filter to the inlet of the CAT setup.


If this were a PRE OEM application, connect the hose to the inlet (with enter arrow) at the OEM filter to the outlet of the CAT setup.


Light grease or oil can be used on all o-rings for proper seating on the CAT setup. The following picture shows OEM filter with exit hose removed:





The second hose gets hooked up from the outlet of the CAT setup to the fuel rail where the original OEM hose was hooked up to. The next picture shows where hose gets hooked up on fuel rail below turbo inlet:


(In the case of a PRE OEM setup, the existng fuel input to the OEM filter gets hooked up direct to the inlet on the CAT setup instead.)





The next picture show general roughting & location of fuel hose to frame rail. Don't hook up this hose to frame rail inlet until the system is air bled.





My hose lines were routed under the air intake resonator rather than behind which is closer to the turbo & hot exhaust. There is room to run the lines between the turbo intake and the return plenum.


At this point air bleed until fuel comes out of bleeder bolt above new CAT filter base. This was 65 primer pumps for me. Close bleeder bolt & continue to bleed until fuel is visible at end of open fuel line at fuel rail, another 2-3 primer pumps. Then attach hose to f
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
403 Posts
THX for the pics. Nice installation, I made a print of your post and I'm going to build mine using the best features of yours and nassdmax's installation, plus an innovation or so of my own.


Have you had any of the air leak/bubble issues that he had/has? I'm going to think/consider/ponder a bit more on this. But one change I am thinking of is a tee right where the hose from the cat filter attaches to the fuel rail inlet. On this tee place a hose long enough to extend upwards higher than anything else in system. Terminate this branch hose with a valve or petcock.


Then as a final bleed after all plumbing and bleeding has been done, hold the vave up until it is now the highest point in system, open valve, and pump several times to purge last of air that may be trapped between cat filter and fuel rail inlet. Then close valve and tuck hose end and valve down out of the way. AS I stated early in the discussion on NDMax's troubles, I think air in this area may be the whole problem.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
63 Posts
Discussion Starter #3
That is a good idea with the valve near the fuel rail position. I actually have the setup you described & have not had a chance to install it yet since there has not been any air in my system. The only time you would need this is on the very first air bleed after install or if air is normally gettting trapped near the fuel rail.


I have a feeling that NDMAx has a tiny air leak somewhere in his system.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
9,300 Posts
But without a lift pump the filter only has about 3 inches of fuel in the bottom area to filter. I have seen pics from filters mounted in this area (up high above fuel tank) and only the bottom 2-3 inches are used. The rest of the filter was clean and untouched. Thats the problem with having a filter above the fuel level in the tank. You will probably also have air build up and have to bleed it.


JMO
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
63 Posts
Discussion Starter #6
prblemchild, If this were the case then why have people with this setup have thousands of miles on their system wiht no air build up or air present when cracking the bleed valve? (Just my observation from this forum from other people who have this setup)


If there was air in the filter I would think it would be present when cracking the bleeder valve, especially since this fuel is under a small amount of pressure.


If there is no air in the filter then how can only the bottom of the filter clean the fuel? If all air is bled out & not present at the bleeder valve, then the fuel flow creates a vaccuum & must fill the whole filter.


If there was air in the CAT filter then the fuel would not have enough pressure to flow to the fuel rail, correct?


Does anyone else using this sysytem have air present at anytime in their filter or when cracking the bleeder valve?


Can anyone debate or comment whether they feel that only the bottom 2"-3" of the CAT filter at this location would be utilized?


I believe from seeing other posts that the OEM fuel filter only filters from the bottom up. The middle & top portions only get dirty the longer the filter is utilized. The bottom to mid portion only show dirt at regular change intervals & the upper portion at longer intervals.


Any comments............
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,049 Posts
KevTech


1 easy way to see if your filter has air in it is to loosen and remove it and see if the filter is full of fuel or not.


I have a big truck that I drive with a CAT engine and although the secondary CAT fuel filter is full of fuel when I change it, the Primary Cat fuel/water separator usually is NOT full of fuel. But it still works and I never have a problem with it.


Nice set-up by the way Thx for the pictures and hardware list.


I wonder whaqt people with TWO alternators could do for a mounting location?





Bye Diesel Dragon
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
687 Posts
Nice job Kevtech. It will be nice having a fellow in the same club and seeing their performance... Let us know how it works out as you have seen my issues. Questions for you... Why the long looper in the inlet hose to the CAT head? Were you trying for the steady uphill route for the air? How's the vibration of the mount when the engine is running and wound up? I was hoping 1/4" would do it, but when I did mine I didn't have any laying around and did what I did.


As for the air in the filters/usage of media. All vaccuum systems will use the lowest portions first, unless they are constantly below the level in the tank. I have seen many big motors with 3-4" of air in the filter after you remove it. Those motors never miss a beat. I have seen some with just a tiny leak that would injest a slug of air after it was shut down, and be a bear to start in the morning. If one can avoid adding any more air into the system, the first time bleed should be enough to never miss a beat.


Since I have re-put my filter back in the loop, I have been doing a morning bleed (just since Friday night) and am always getting air out. As for the line from the CAT head to the fuel rail, it is uphill towards the CAT bleeder with no droops in it, so the air should make it's way to the open bleeder. Correct me if I am wrong, but doesn't fuel recirc after the fuel rail back to the tank? Wouldn't that take care of any residual air in that line? I have checked all my additions with air pressure and soap, and feel that they are all tight.


If the problem that I am having gets worse with a lower tank, then there has to be something letting air back in. In that case, I am going to let gravity work for me and not let the air in by having gravity push fuel into the leak. In this case the filter would have to be as low in the system as possible.


Good luck, and keep us posted.


MN
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
63 Posts
Discussion Starter #9
nassdmax,


So far no air problem with my setup. I have also seen other posts on the site where people have this setup for thousands of miles with no problems. I will keep you & everyone else posted if I encounter any future problems.


The long looper in the inlet hose to the CAT head was required at time of install for me. The 90' fitting on the CAT head would not hold the hose pointed in the opposit direction due to the mounting bracket being in the way. If I put on a small extesion to the 90' fitting then I could have pointed it the other way & routed the hose differently. I found that the gradual loop worked well for hose kinks & maybe the gradual uphill route for air as you suggested.


As for vibration, I tried my high idle switch at the 1200 & 1750 RPM with minimal effect to the mounting bracket & setup. I think that if I were to do this install in the future I would use 1/4" bracket thickness instead of 3/16". My parts list above shows 1/4" may work best.


I will be following your posts with interest to see if your air problems have been resolved. Good luck & keep in touch!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
430 Posts
I believe Frank Blum was the first to use this location. He used a Racor filter for his installation. Does anyone know if he ended up with any air problems in his system?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
534 Posts
Nice set up.......

Question, when you change out your filter
spillage is not good in the engine compartment.
It whafts into the cab. I'm still sold on putting
filter on the frame.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
63 Posts
Discussion Starter #12
56Nomad,


I tried taking the filter off this afternoon when it was full of fuel. I cracked the air bleed valve, loosened off the filter with the filter wrench & then the rest of the way by hand. Once the filter came off the threads it dropped down nice & slow without hitting anything. Removed the filter full of fuel without a drop.


Actually, there was no spillage compared to any when changing the OEM fuel filter.


Then I put the filter back in place full of fuel & again not a drop any where. I then primed the system, closed the bleeder valve & started the truck up & drove it the rest of the day without any problems.This was definately a very clean procedure.


When I had the filter off, the top 1" was air & the rest was full of fuel.


When I first opened up the air bleeder valve I heard the air suction release. This would have caused some of the fuel to drop in the filter i am guessing..............Edited by: KevTech
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
367 Posts
Kevin, any updates on the performance of yous set-up? Comments from others? This looks like one of the easier solutions to supplemental filtering. I have got a serious case of "DEER IN THE HEADLIGHTS LOOK "
trying to decide on which set-up to go with!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
63 Posts
Discussion Starter #14
All running fine. No problems. It has been -10'F to -25'F here all week & all is working without problems. I am pleased with the setup & simple installation. I like that there is no drilling involved with the total kit & the small amount of time taken for the total install .
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
63 Posts
Discussion Starter #16
I still have the 3/16" bracket on my truck with no extensive vibration or flex. If I were to ever have a reason to take it off, I would maybe put one of the 1/4" brackets on that I have. I just have not had a reason to change over yet with the -35' weather here.Edited by: KevTech
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,563 Posts
I think this would be a pretty sweet kit, because you can easily pull it out quick. 2 bolts remove the bracket, put the hoses back, prime it and go.. You could drain it or plug the hoses, throw it in the toolbox and head to the dealership. Only thing they might notice is a little wetness and shiny threads...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
93 Posts
KevTech,


I love the looks of your kit. My truck has just been ordered. I'll be contacting you in 10-12 weeks.


Couple of questions: Post-OEM is obviously the smart way to do the install, with a quick change back to Pre-OEM just before a visit to the dealer. How quick / easy is it to change from a Post to a Pre install setup? Also, is there a reason that the top of the mounting bracket sticks up above the top of the fiter unit? Any reason not to cut and radius the top edge to match the filter mount?


Is the bracket made of aluminum?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
63 Posts
Discussion Starter #19
To change from POST to PRE OEM would take less than 10 minutes. Just have to switch the CAT hose to hook up before the OEM instead of after.


The only reason that the mounting bracket is higher than the top of the filter unit is due to this picture showing my first bracket ever produced. All brackets are now produced being flush with the top the filter mount. My picture also shows the mounting bolts being a little on the long side. These are all now the correct length.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
63 Posts
Discussion Starter #20
1 - 20 of 22 Posts
Top