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Discussion Starter #1
I have searched for this info. and haven't been able to find it on the forum. I finally found it in my owners manual buried way in the back. I thought I would put it here for others ease of access.

The information below is for a 2003 K-2500 Crew Cab Short Box HD (4WD) also known as a 2003 GMC Sierra 2500HD Crew Cab (with Duramax and Allison Transmission).

GVWR - 9,200 lbs
GCWR - 22,000 lbs
Maximum Trailer Weight - 14,700 lbs*
GAWR (Front) - 4,670 lbs
GAWR (Rear) - 6,084 lbs

*Tongue weight should be 10% to 15% of trailer weight up to 1,500 lbs. Fifth-wheel or gooseneck kingpin weight should be 15% to 25% of trailer weight up to 3,000 lbs maximum.

Maximum Trailer Weight is limited to 12,000 lbs with weight distributing hitch.
 

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Discussion Starter #2
Do tires make a difference

One thing I still don't understand is that the information above is for stock size tires. I have upgraded my tires and am told they can actually take more weight. How does that play into these numbers?
 

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Any manufacturer is going to go a little light on tow ratings just from a liability standpoint. Tire load rating is part of it, but a bigger part is going to be the braking. Just going from a tire load rating of "D" to "E" won't help the brakes. You can get a way bigger load moving than you can stop.
 

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Discussion Starter #4
Any manufacturer is going to go a little light on tow ratings just from a liability standpoint. Tire load rating is part of it, but a bigger part is going to be the braking. Just going from a tire load rating of "D" to "E" won't help the brakes. You can get a way bigger load moving than you can stop.
Completely agree! I do have a good brake controller and the Allison Tranny is certainly a help!
 

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I have searched for this info. and haven't been able to find it on the forum. I finally found it in my owners manual buried way in the back. I thought I would put it here for others ease of access.

The information below is for a 2003 K-2500 Crew Cab Short Box HD (4WD) also known as a 2003 GMC Sierra 2500HD Crew Cab (with Duramax and Allison Transmission).

GVWR - 9,200 lbs
GCWR - 22,000 lbs
The difference is only 12,800. Most large 5ers will load the truck to or over the 9200.
Maximum Trailer Weight - 14,700 lbs* If you can get the truck light enough when the trailer is hooked and loaded. Then the pin weight will be too light to be stable.
GAWR (Front) - 4,670 lbs
GAWR (Rear) - 6,084 lbs
With 6,084 on the drives, the front will likely be about 4,000, your truck is over the 9,200 by about 800 lbs. ( where many of us run).

*Tongue weight should be 10% to 15% of trailer weight up to 1,500 lbs. Fifth-wheel or gooseneck kingpin weight should be 15% to 25% of trailer weight up to 3,000 lbs maximum. I believe that 3,000 number is for something likely a standard cab, short box, 2 wheel drive, gas powered truck, no passenger truck. All your options including the 5th wheel hitch work against that and all the other weight numbers the book shows. With a curb weight of 7,200 on my 2500HD, the carrying capacity of my is about 2,000 to the 9,200!!!!!

Maximum Trailer Weight is limited to 12,000 lbs with weight distributing hitch.
So, the bottom line is a bunch of compromises. If you buy a 10,000 lbs empty trailer, then add all the camping needs (groceries, clothes, fishing gear, beer, lawn chairs, and fresh water) you can easily be about 12,500 for trailer alone. But hooked to the truck, about 2500 maybe on the truck and you will be a bit heavy on the truck.
The truck will pull fine, but the problem as mentioned is stopping. Also will the aluminum rims handle the weight (they have low low weight limits)? Stock tires stamped for this 6,084/pair.
Get it loaded and balanced close, and you can do what a lot of us do.:D
 

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I have searched for this info. and haven't been able to find it on the forum. I finally found it in my owners manual buried way in the back. I thought I would put it here for others ease of access.

The information below is for a 2003 K-2500 Crew Cab Short Box HD (4WD) also known as a 2003 GMC Sierra 2500HD Crew Cab (with Duramax and Allison Transmission).

GVWR - 9,200 lbs
GCWR - 22,000 lbs
Maximum Trailer Weight - 14,700 lbs*
GAWR (Front) - 4,670 lbs
GAWR (Rear) - 6,084 lbs

*Tongue weight should be 10% to 15% of trailer weight up to 1,500 lbs. Fifth-wheel or gooseneck kingpin weight should be 15% to 25% of trailer weight up to 3,000 lbs maximum.

Maximum Trailer Weight is limited to 12,000 lbs with weight distributing hitch.
Why would this be less with a weight distributing hitch??
 

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I believe the maximum trailer weight with the GCWR, and GAWR's F/B is the heaviest the truck can pull 5th/goose/bumper.
The max with weight distribution would be off the bumper which is lower then a 5th or goose.
 

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As has been noted here many times, tow capacity is the GCWR minus the weight of the TV when ready to tow.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
So, the bottom line is a bunch of compromises. If you buy a 10,000 lbs empty trailer, then add all the camping needs (groceries, clothes, fishing gear, beer, lawn chairs, and fresh water) you can easily be about 12,500 for trailer alone. But hooked to the truck, about 2500 maybe on the truck and you will be a bit heavy on the truck.
The truck will pull fine, but the problem as mentioned is stopping. Also will the aluminum rims handle the weight (they have low low weight limits)? Stock tires stamped for this 6,084/pair.
Get it loaded and balanced close, and you can do what a lot of us do.:D
What you have described here is my exact situation. I have upgraded my rims and tires. The tire shop tells me both have a higher rating than the same stock equipment. I have upgraded suspension as well (no air bags though). I have never had any issues with slowing/stopping as I do not push it too hard.

Thanks for the info.

Dan

PS. Thanks Mod for moving the thread. I forgot about the towing sub forum!
 

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Discussion Starter #11
Actual Weights

Here are my weights from a recent trip:

Truck w/ Trailer 10,350
Truck alone 7,950
Difference 2,400 (pin weight)

Trailer on truck 10,450
Pin weight 2,400
Total Trailer 12,850

The truck doesn't feel uncomfortable to drive or out of control at all. With the brake controller and the Allison tranny all seems well. I hope I am not being foolish. The trailer is not over weight based on original post, however the truck is 1,150 lbs too heavy.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
Upgrade Towing Ability?

Is there anything I can reasonably do to increase the towing capacity of my truck? I have a programmer but that's not what I am talking about. I am talking about the ability to carry additional weight.

I am looking at a new 5th wheel with a dry weight of about 11,600 lbs and a hitch weight of about 2,525 DRY weight. I estimate that I will put 1,500 - 2,000 lbs of weight into it (gear, clothes, food, water, etc).

This is pushing the top limits of the stated capacity, but I feel the truck will handle it.

I plan to upgrade the brakes to slotted rotors as well. What else should I do?

Am I worrying too much about this?
 

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i am so confused i have a 2003 GMC Sierra 2500HD SLT

Gross Vehicle Weight Rating Cap (lbs):9,200

Gross Combined Wt Rating (lbs):16,000

How heavy can the trailer be?

Im looking at 36' HURRICANE GOOSENECK GVWR 14,000

is this right? GCWR 16,000 - GVWR 9,200 = 6,800

can only get a trailer that has GVWR of 6,800?

dose that mean that it can not tow the 12,000 lb tow ratting?
 

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i am so confused i have a 2003 GMC Sierra 2500HD SLT

Gross Vehicle Weight Rating Cap (lbs):9,200

Gross Combined Wt Rating (lbs):16,000

How heavy can the trailer be?

Im looking at 36' HURRICANE GOOSENECK GVWR 14,000

is this right? GCWR 16,000 - GVWR 9,200 = 6,800

can only get a trailer that has GVWR of 6,800?

dose that mean that it can not tow the 12,000 lb tow ratting?
well, first you need to know the truck empty weight, likely around 7200 lbs.

then you need to know the actual loaded weight of the trailer.

then you need to know the pin weight of the trailer.

suppose the trailer does weigh 14K, pin weight will be around 20-25% or 3K

so, 7200 +3,000 =10,200 so your over truck GVWR

and 14,000 +7200= 21,200 so your over GCWR

in reality I suspect your going to be over GVWR, GCWR, and likely over the rear axle and rear tire load.

The reality is that mfg assume a 10% tongue weight on conventional trailers and something closer to 15% on 5th wheel/goosneck. However it s almost impossible to have a conventional or 5th wheel/gooseneck that has that low of tongue or pin weight. And then they assume a driver, no passengers, no cargo in the tow vehicle.

So, it is a rare case where you can tow the max rating.
 

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well, first you need to know the truck empty weight, likely around 7200 lbs.

then you need to know the actual loaded weight of the trailer.

then you need to know the pin weight of the trailer.

suppose the trailer does weigh 14K, pin weight will be around 20-25% or 3K

so, 7200 +3,000 =10,200 so your over truck GVWR

and 14,000 +7200= 21,200 so your over GCWR

in reality I suspect your going to be over GVWR, GCWR, and likely over the rear axle and rear tire load.

The reality is that mfg assume a 10% tongue weight on conventional trailers and something closer to 15% on 5th wheel/goosneck. However it s almost impossible to have a conventional or 5th wheel/gooseneck that has that low of tongue or pin weight. And then they assume a driver, no passengers, no cargo in the tow vehicle.

So, it is a rare case where you can tow the max rating.
ok i think the weight is 6,000 this is the sticker
Truck is Curb Weight - Front (lbs):3061Curb Weight - Rear (lbs):2305 = 5366

http://i61.tinypic.com/23udhua.jpg
 

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A few thoughts........

I believe the warranty gross combination rating was/is 22,000 lbs. Now that you are off warranty, some other factors can be considered.

Most important is the axle ratings of the truck and trailer. If you have OEM or similar tires the rating maximum on each truck axle is likely 6200 lbs..... 3100 lbs per tire. And the maximum trailer axle weight ratings as shown on the builders plate on the left front corner of the trailer.

So consider what the ACTUAL weight will be with the trailer on the truck, loaded for your trip, rigged and ready. The truck gross of 9200 is to be considered as areas of the tires, axles, brakes and frame are all rated for that 9200. So don't push that limit very much. The trailer has the same design ratings to consider.

So drop the rig on a scale, weight each axle, and each unit, and the combination in total. Think about the numbers.

FYI: the empty weight is useless!!!!!!!!!!!

The real actual weights in relation to the ratings are what counts. For your safety, and for the law if the law gets ugly.

So you could try to load the trailer so the rear axle of the truck stays under about 5200 lbs. Likely as in my experience with an '05 2500HD, the trailer pin weight will have to be about 2000 lbs. And then loading the trailer will be a challenge to keep the pin weight down to that one ton. When you get that much weight on the trailer without the needed weight on the pin, the tail will wag the dog...... trailer will drive the truck..... no good.

Just my 1 cent worth for what it's worth.
 

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9200 is truck max weight loaded no trailer involved. When you add a trailer (fifth or GN) then you can be u to the max of the axles or tires whichever is less. I tow commercial and have to go over the scales with the truck in my Sig. I have towed as heavy a trailer as 21,000 pounds over the scales it was loaded with most of the weight over the trailer axles and only 2000 pin weight. DOT gave me no grief.
 

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9200 is truck max weight loaded no trailer involved. When you add a trailer (fifth or GN) then you can be u to the max of the axles or tires whichever is less. I tow commercial and have to go over the scales with the truck in my Sig. I have towed as heavy a trailer as 21,000 pounds over the scales it was loaded with most of the weight over the trailer axles and only 2000 pin weight. DOT gave me no grief.
nope nope, nope the 9200 is Gross vehicle weight rating of the truck. doesn't make any difference if your pulling a trailer or not. the max legal weight of the truck is 9200lbs. when you go over the scales. period. legally you must be at or under the axle ratings, the tire ratings AND the GVWR.
 

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nope nope, nope the 9200 is Gross vehicle weight rating of the truck. doesn't make any difference if your pulling a trailer or not. the max legal weight of the truck is 9200lbs. when you go over the scales. period. legally you must be at or under the axle ratings, the tire ratings AND the GVWR.
so should i just go with a bumper pull instead of a gooseneck or 5th? the tow capacity is 12k it does have a class 4 hitch and i can get a weight distributions at 12k.
 

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The bottom line is that as big as these trucks are, the ratings, the HD designation and people's expectations, the 2500HD trucks don't have all that much capacity when it comes to 5th wheels. It's certainly gotten better over the last couple of years but unless you want to go with a small 5th wheel, the 2500HD is probably too small. I had to go to a 3500 SRW to get the additional CC I needed for my 5th wheel and I am right at that CC limit. If a person decides to go over the ratings then there is no limit. If it doesn't break it must be fine.
 
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