[CodeBlue]

:help: I am new to all this so I have some questions so please bear with me, I have a 2005 GMC Yukon XL 2500 6.0 and the rake on the truck looks ridiculous and planning a tire change soon on stock rims dueler revos. So here we go,
I am understanding that these so called green keys are available gm products to raise my front end without cranking down the torsion bar bolts. I also realize that shock extensions are needed,
So here are my questions (I do not do any off roading)

(1) Will the CV joint bind with this lift
(2) Will it ride like[email protected]#$$
(3) will it affect my autoride suspension
(4) Will it affect my tie rods and pitman arm?
(5) Will this cause premature front end wear?
(6) Will it affect my warrantee?

Ok how about this cognito leveling kit, I spoke to them and they sounded very intelligent about their control arms kits but I forgot to ask if I still needed the keys, or about cv joint binding and the ride change we also spoke about the pitman arm kit which they said the stock setup was was a factory flaw design and this would improve it is this all really necessary for this improvement any help would be greatly appreciated

 

[JMGAZ]

For starters the green keys are nothing more than OE replacement keys that are indexed higher than the ones already on your vehicle. You could crank your OE keys approx. 5-6 full turns and end up where the "green " keys will start out at. IMHO: save your $$ and try cranking the OE keys first.

(1) If you just crank the OE keys enough to level your vehicle they wont bind, but there will be some added stress that may cause them to wear out sooner. How much sooner is debatable and depends on many other factors.
(2) Again thats debatable, however replacing the OE shocks or at least adding spacers will definately help.
(3) Not sure, I dont see why it would.
(4) Again the tie rods and pitman are probably going to wear faster, but there are options available to upgrade.
(5) Depends on who you ask. Im of the opinion that if you spend the $$ for good shocks, use aftermarket tie rods and a pitman, get the truck properly aligned and dont abuse it, NO.
(6) Just cranking the OE keys and "upgrading" your shocks should'nt void any part of your warranty. However the tire you put on may. From what I understand GM will not service a Duramax with anything bigger than a 245 due to transmission programming, but Im not sure if this would apply to a 6L gasser? Either way GM would have to prove that a particular alteration caused specifically caused the problem.

Somebody please correct me if Im wrong anywhere.

I am currently using the Cognito UCA's on my HD, just cranked the OE keys and went with Bilstein 5125's and bought their pitman/idler kit but have yet to put them on. Ive got a 2WD HD so Im probably not the best source of info in that area.

 

[DIESELMAN75]

i hqve cranked the t-bars on all of my trucks my dads and my friends and my cousins trucks and we all have never had any problem with the cv shafts and my friend and cousin beat the crap out of their trucks because they are company rigs and we all have good luck with them so crank them as much as you want and just add shock spacers and you will be cool

oh and all the trucks are D/A 3 CC SB 2500 and 1 single cab LB 2500

like i posted in the other thread crank them bars and you will be fine

 

[Kennedy]

:exactly:


Start by working with what you have and go from there. Many times you will find that the OE keys get you plenty of front end lift...

 

[CodeBlue]

leveling kit

so is it better to get the green keys and not tighten the bolts or crank the down the bolts, and will i need to get the shock extenders and a front end alignment so what is the real benefit from this cognito kit

 

[h8nopi]

I didn't need the green keys, I've got enough room for 35's. Ride is still good (I think better than stock)just waiting in line for extended shocks. Pit/idler upgrade is a good idea and will be getting one whenever I find one. Front end alignment is mandentory if you don't like buying expensive tires repeatedly. Shock extenders are no more than washer on the threads of the stock shocks(cheap way). The main point I see is some upgraded parts and the uca upgrade(if you have the money get them if not you will later like me)

 

[DIESELMAN75]

if you dont need the green keys dont get them but if you cant clear your tires with just cranking them get the keys

 

[CodeBlue]

final desision

thank you for the advise
i think i am going to buy the so called green keys (what is the part #), i will make my own shock extenders is a 2" spacer fine, i just want the truck to sit somewhat level and dont really like the idea about cranking the bolts down so much i like to have some room for error,
will i need an alignment after this is done and what are the specs.
and what about this pitman idler arm support kit is it nessassary
what is the whole idea about this cognito control arm kit is it a huge benifit i have no problem buying it if i makes a great difference

 

[h8nopi]

http://www.cognitomotorsports.com/01-06_GM_8-lug/2-3_leveling_system.htm
alignment=good

 

[JMGAZ]

Your torsion bars will still be under the same amount of stress with the OE cranked or the green keys. To get the truck level with the OE keys you will need about 3-5 full turns which is just under 3/4 of their max adjustment range.

The green keys will cost anywhere from $25 to $50 each depending on who you order from. Now factor in the personal time or out of pocket expense to have them installed and you could be up around $250+.

That $$ would be better spent on new shocks rather than spacers.

As for the Cognito UCA's as far as I understand they the vehicle to be realigned to factory specs for both toe and camber, wheras its been a crap shoot after cranking the OE keys or using green keys alone.

 

[Kurt]

Why not try cranking the bars with your stock keys first. You really don't have anything to lose. I've got my stock keys turned up 8 turns and I still could go a little further but I won't. In my opinion, the stock keys will allow you to crank higher than you should ever go, and green keys are just asking for trouble.

As far a shock spacers or extended shocks, I haven't messed with them. I have rancho 9000 shocks that are the same length as the stock shocks. My ride hasn't been a problem and iv'e had my bars cranked up for at least 30,000 miles.

 

[Derek M]

(1) Any raising of the frame away from the suspension components will increase the CV angles, how much is too much.... dunno

(2) It will ride firmer by cranking the torsion bars and or adding green keys for the simple fact is you reduce the amount of load distributed to the rubber jounces that are in contact with the LCA's. The jounces are an integral part of the OEM ride that our trucks exhibit. After about 5 turns of the torsion bar the jounces will no longer make any contact with the LCA or about the equivalent of adding green keys.

(3) will it affect autoride. Don't believe it should at all.

(4) likely to induce some premature wear, how much is subjective. Not an overriding concern to me.

(5) see above

(6) It will greatly affect the chance of you getting a idler arm or torsion bar taken care of under warranty. It should have no affect on the warranty of say your door window motor, or your fuel pump.

Timbren Link http://www.timbren.com/Aeon/aeon/single.htm

I used a modified Timbren snowplow spring (jounce) kit to improve the every day unloaded ride characteristics of my truck of which has 9 turns on the bars. I swapped the snowplow Timbren spring A180-75 for the A180-65. This latter spring has a softer spring rate and thus provides a more compliant OEM like ride characteristic. In addition to this spring I used a longer bolt and some shims to get pretty solid engagement of the LCA.

Also pictured here is the shock modification to reorient the shock body down by about half an inch. Seems after 8/9 turns the OEM shock will top out before the UCA stop will limit front suspension travel. Haven’t quite figured how why it was engineered like that from the factory. There was a noticeable ride improvement (compliant) after repositioning the shocks orientation downward.

 

[Kurt]

I also have timbrens on my truck. I wonder if that's why my ride has never been that bad.

 

[Road Boss]

Derek M, do you have any pictures of the whole truck?

 

[killerbee]

Derek, looks like you haven't been to the alignment shop yet.

 

[80K10/6.5TD]

If one dosent like the rake on the truck why raise the front and get into suspension issues?, why not just lower the rear a tad to level it out? besides the lower it hugs the ground the better the mileage.
Merle

 

[bertman911]

Lowering our trucks??????? Thats just wrong...............:lol:

 

[freewayrandy]

Before I knew....

about just cranking the t-bars, I had a friend with an off-road shop, install new keys from 'Central 4 Wheel Drive' basically their 'leveling kit'. DEFINATELY needed a front-end align. Added Rancho 9000X shocks with no extensions and all is just fine.

 

[h8nopi]

He I want to be first in line to lower my 4x4 TRUCK. That sounds like a great idea-:t

 

[80K10/6.5TD]

I didn't say to slam the thing only to drop the back end enough to level it out.
Merle