[JSarge]

Well, i figured i would start a thread since within the next 3 weeks i will be in the process of tearing out my worn 360k mile old sixfive, and rebuilding a hand-me-down short block (506 casting) from bottom back up.

A few days ago i had asked for opinions on what i should do for an engine, figuring i would find some sort of catastrophically screwed up parts inside of this free short block i received with my truck when i bought it. Turn's out its in fantastic shape. The cylinders have no ridge, the bearings have close to no wear, the crank looks like its new out of the box and so far everything is hunky dory. I will be ordering all necessary parts within a week or so to get started, but having an open thread in the process of both removing and assembling should be helpful.

As far as the block goes, i have read some 506 castings 97-00 (or so) have smaller outer main bolts. This block seems to have the same size main bolts all around (obviously not in length). Im hoping i dont have the weakest of the the links. Another thing is, this block had a DB2 pump on it. Im assuming the P.O. did a conversion, or it was a 6.2 replacement in the 90s. It does have the oil pump drive with the speed sensor on top of it. My question is, are all timing covers compatible with all pumps or do they vary between the DB2/DS4?

I will upload a few pics to show you what i've got. I will upload more as i start tearing into things. Thanks in advance fellow members at dieselplace, you all are a massive help.

- John 'JSarge'

 

[PrivatePilot]

Subscribed!

 

[Maine Towing]

Same here, pulled my old 6.5 out a few years back and replaced it with a 6.2 I morphed using the 6.5 intake, turbo, oil pump and pan.

 

[JSarge]

Well, i just ordered a USB to TTL module so i can start playing around with GMTD Scantech, since i will be re-timing the IP and monitoring the engine heavily as it breaks in. This is for the most part the first step i'm going to start studying, i doubt it can be too complicated. I'm starting my research now, but if anyone knows of an already posted step-by-step write up on timing the DS4, i would appreciate the link!

 

[PrivatePilot]

What I've seen of GMTD Scantech, well....it IS kinda complicated.

Racer55 is well versed on the timing thing so when the time comes I'm sure he'll chime in if you ask.

 

[JSarge]

What I've seen of GMTD Scantech, well....it IS kinda complicated.

Racer55 is well versed on the timing thing so when the time comes I'm sure he'll chime in if you ask.

Well, im not exactly slow when it comes to software heh.. so i'm sure ill figure it out, but racer is the one who recommended it to me. I have plenty of time before the module arrives from china, so no rush on reading up haha.

 

[PrivatePilot]

Admittedly I didn't play with it a whole lot, but what little I did poke around and see/experience (when setting my TDCO) it looked very unintuitive and rather obtuse. Admittedly I didn't spend a whole lot of time with it though, but I know that the TDCO procedure involved a long printed list of commands and instructions vs a simple menu/button selection.

 

[Maine Towing]

I am presuming the factory timing is retarded? How much of an improvement have others gotten out of re-timing them?

 

[JSarge]

Well, i wish i had a scan tool available but, i dont... so i will have to make it work! Im just looking for the information of what/why/when to set tdco lol. I've seen multiple numbers, just time to do homework.

 

[JSarge]

Admittedly I didn't play with it a whole lot, but what little I did poke around and see/experience (when setting my TDCO) it looked very unintuitive and rather obtuse. Admittedly I didn't spend a whole lot of time with it though, but I know that the TDCO procedure involved a long printed list of commands and instructions vs a simple menu/button selection.

Pilot, are you talking about running the TDCO procedure with other software vs gmtdtech? I ask because i just installed Scantech, and its allowing me to 'demo' the program without a license. The learn/time set procedure seem to look like a basic menu based setup. If there is a known way to do it with something other than scantech, i would much rather do it that way .. considering i dont have the $155 to spot on software right now! Bleh!

Thanks-

 

[PrivatePilot]

Yes, I was talking about the TDCO. I don't believe you can actually perform the set procedure without the program being registered as I do remember Racer having to go into his house to retrieve the registration code at one point.

He'd be the one to ask, he's spent a lot more time with the program than me. Send him a PM with a link to this thread.

 

[JSarge]

Well, i had an idea to bring my old engine to TDC, marking the timing gears and transferring everything to the new engine while also at TDC .. then running it. I could do this and then see 'how close' i get the timing by checking it with gmtd scan basic after running it. If it's out of spec, then i guess i'll have to find a way to invest the money into scan tech. Input appreciated.

 

[racer55]

Ok PP is mixing up OBD1 VS OBDII,on his truck I used carcode and it is in no way user friendly-if it weren't for qwomack I would have never negotiated my way through the maze it takes to do a TDCO relearn with carcode.

As far as GMTD ScanTech goes,it is much more user friendly and straight forward.

However Jsarge using basic will only let you know the value for TDCO that is already stored in the ECM from the old engine,without performing the relearn procedure with the licenced version of GMTD ScanTech you will not get any usefull TDCO info.

 

[PrivatePilot]

:facepalm:

I'll go back under my rock again. :HiHi: I was sure it was Scantech we had used on my truck - it's OBD2 as well, no?

 

[Mike K3500]

Can you snap a pic of the lifter valley...??

IF all your main bolts, inner and outer are 12 mm, IT IS most likely the weaker block.
The outer bolts were downsized to 10 mm to leave more "meat" in the main webs in the later blocks.

 

[racer55]

No GMTD ScanTech is 94,95 only OBD1-I do have a licenced copy of it now as well though and built the cable outlined in the thread posted a while back,just need a 94/95 to come by one day to play with it and get familiar!
http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=457933&highlight=obd1+cable

A great many people on the "other site" have joined a petition started by Acesneights1 asking Steph to expand the programs functions to cover OBDII.

 

[JSarge]

I ordered the USB to TTL module according to that post. Fortunately, it should arrive right around the time i will need it. It looks like i am going to have to budget out this build more than i already have, seeing i need to purchased a licensed copy. By time i tow the truck to a shop, etc its not worth the $155 invested into software i could use again in the future.

As far as the block goes, and as far as my eyes could see .. all the bolt's definitely looked to be 12mm. Weaker design or not, i'll be using this block. In between the clean low mile condition its in, and my budget .. there are no other options; and i surely dont think it would be a good idea to re-use my current 360k mile 506 casting. What is it you wanted out of the valley? The engine is about 100 miles north of me right now, but i have it decently memorized. I know that all is casted is a bunch of dots. No numbers, symbols, etc.

 

[JSarge]

As far as timing goes, i read that the TDCO 'sweet spot' is between -1.5 and -1.94.. and wont read beyond -2.2.

I'm assuming, the easiest way i can do this from scratch is like i said above, move everything over to the new engine by marking the gears @ TDC, and adjust accordingly using the relearn feature in scantech. If there are any other tricks to setting this up, any literature is appreciated!

 

[JSarge]

Well, thanks to 94C1500 i came across some literature @ http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showpost.php?p=4553356&postcount=4

This had the useful info, pictures and all, for what im going to be facing while knocking out the timing on this pig. It even covered the dual relay mod for the LP which i wanted to do at some point.

ON WITH THE PROJECT!

 

[VanBoy]

Well, thanks to 94C1500 i came across some literature @ http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showpost.php?p=4553356&postcount=4

This had the useful info, pictures and all, for what im going to be facing while knocking out the timing on this pig. It even covered the dual relay mod for the LP which i wanted to do at some point.

ON WITH THE PROJECT!

VERY nice find.....was it "bookmarked" in the FAQ section?