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Discussion Starter #1
I am trying to find a local dealer that would have Total Power fuel additive. I don't want to order a large quanitity without giving it a try first. I have checked all the local chain type parts houses with no luck. They all have Power Service brand, or something like that. Anyone have any suggestions
 

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Try their website for contact info, and give them a call. I recall someone else doing that and having them be very helpful in locating a local retailer.


John
 

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I called FPPF, and the gave me a number of dealers in my area. Be sure to call the dealer before hand, as not all FPPF dealers carry Total Power. I paid $6.60 per qt locally for Total Power.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Thanks guys. I followed your advice, and FPPF gave me two dealers in my area. I am headed to pick some up
. However, Roegs, the best I could do was $8.75 per quart
. Oh well, still not bad. Later !
 

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Does anyone in the DFW sell this stuff. FPPF gave me six location in the DFW area but all six stopped selliung it.
 

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Avlube sells Primrose 405 which is high quality additive and is the water emulsifying type.

I bought 12 bottles from George Morrison a couple of weeks ago. Highly concentrated and available in a winter blend also (409)

www.avlube.comEdited by: hoot
 

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Kennedy sells it on his site.
 

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I saw so fppf at a truck stop. The label indicated it contained, IIRC, glycol ethelene. I assume this is alcohol. If so that makes this additive an emulsifyer. I read on a thread somewhere that GMC recommended demulsifiers, ie Stanadyne, Primrose, . . .


Am I correct?


Thanks,
 

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Believe Primrose and FPPF work much the same way .... different from Stanadyne .... got my FPPF from Kennedy


Jim
 

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I sure hope Promise is an emulsifier, that's why I bought it.
 

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John, It sure is.
 

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Deadeye said:
I saw so fppf at a truck stop. The label indicated it contained, IIRC, glycol ethelene. I assume this is alcohol. If so that makes this additive an emulsifyer. I read on a thread somewhere that GMC recommended demulsifiers, ie Stanadyne, Primrose, . . .


Am I correct?


Thanks,
Correct. Check out the GM bulletin on fuel additives in the TSB section of the board. Actually, alcohol is specifically to be avoided because of it's corrosive nature. Being an emulsifier is also not recommended by GM - it will allow water to pass through the fuel filter and either slowly wear (it's abrasive at 24,000 psi) or destroy the injectors (when water changes state to steam it will blow tips off injectors with additional potential damage to cylinder and valves, etc).

It's amazing what a bunch of guys on the internet can talk themselves into.


jeff
 

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Uh, forgive me for forgetting organic chemistry, but I'm inclined to say that ethylene glycol (HOCH2CH2OH) isn't alcohol (CH3CH2OH, ethanol).


Now they may have similar effects in a diesel/water solution, but I think we'd be technically amiss by equating the two.


Any real chemists out there? Thanks, Mat
 

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nwpadmax said:
Uh, forgive me for forgetting organic chemistry, but I'm inclined to say that ethylene glycol (HOCH2CH2OH) isn't alcohol (CH3CH2OH, ethanol).


Now they may have similar effects in a diesel/water solution, but I think we'd be technically amiss by equating the two.


Any real chemists out there? Thanks, Mat

Holly Cow!!!



It sure looks like you are a real chemists or just way to much time on a Saturday night with your Periodic Table...I just had a college flashback.



All I know is glycol melts the snow and ice off the wings of airplanes.



Great info...for real!!
Edited by: NoWake200
 

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Both Primrose and FPPF emulsify.





I run the FPPF, always have, and will continue to do so. I've seen the sample vials (have the kit) with emulsified water in fuel at several years old along with untreated fuel turning brown in the same type of vial. I've also seen the demo where the competitive product makes jelly fish, fisheggs, or chickenbroth depending on the makeup...
 

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Ethylene glycol is anti-freeze. You know, the green stuff.
 

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When I said he was "correct" above - I was referring to the statement that GM specifically states to avoid using an emulsifier.

Hold on - doesn't anti-freeze stick rings and gum up an engine... (blow a head gasket and let it go for a while and see what happens...)



jeff
 

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Kennedy said:
Both Primrose and FPPF emulsify.





I run the FPPF, always have, and will continue to do so. I've seen the sample vials (have the kit) with emulsified water in fuel at several years old along with untreated fuel turning brown in the same type of vial. I've also seen the demo where the competitive product makes jelly fish, fisheggs, or chickenbroth depending on the makeup...




John,


I have been too the fppf website and seen the demonstration,


http://www.fppf.com/pDemoWtrDsprtnHB.html


It's easy to look at this demo and say to yourself "It's clear now, that's great because the water has "disappeared" and now it will no longer be a problem" But the water is still there and the problem is that water in emulsion will wear and damage the injectors just as well as free water in a 24,000 psi fuel injection system.


From a discussion I had with a Shell engineer concerning their rotella DFA additive (which disperses minute amounts of water, but demulsifies larger amounts)...


"Free water, or water/fuel emulsion delivered to an injector, can be a disaster. Water is instantly turned to steam with sufficient force to destroy injector tips. Not only is the injector ruined, but metal debris enters the combustion chamber where it can damage pistons and liners, as well as turbocharger fins."


On the issue of corrosion and not wanting to have free water settling, etc...


"ROTELLA DFA contains corrosion inhibitors that reduce corrosion on steel surfaces, thus protecting tank, lines, and other steel surfaces when water is present."


Stanadyne also incorporates a corrosion inhibitor.


Both you and George at avlube have encouraged the use of an emulsifying additive (both here and on that "other diesel site" too). Both of you market, sell and profit from the sale of these products. Both of you sell them and recommend them without warning user's of the risk they are taking on.


Both you and George are highly respected on this board and now those who respect your opinion now recommend it to everyone else without qualification.


GM states that one shouldn't use an emulsifying additive. Maybe if they would have went into more detail as to why with graphic photos of mangled injectors, then maybe things would be different here. Instead, it seems to always turn into a "bud versus coors argument".


So fppf has always worked great for you - that's great. Unfortunately, you are "statistically insignificant" and so am I. Out of the tens of thousands of trucks out there, will using an emulsifying additive contribute to the premature wear and failure of one injector? Five? a hundred? How much water are you going to get in your fuel one day?


Neither you nor I have the qualifications or statistical data to definitively answer, but the one thing I hope we can both agree on is that it is greater than zero. You know that someone is going to pull up to a station and get the bottom of the tank somewhere in the u.s. this year; So maybe that poor soul bought fppf from you and is now out of warranty; Maybe if he wouldn't have been using an emulsifier his "water in fuel" light would have come on before that water reached his injectors and blew them apart. Maybe.


jeff





Edited by: dmax lover
 
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