I to would like to hear some feedback on the Banks Six-Gun. Somebody pull the trigger!
Click on pic
For those of you who already have purchased a tuner box:
SPECIAL REBATE OFFER!
If you want the incredible Six-Gun performance, safety and advanced features in your Duramax, but you’ve already bought another diesel tuner, don’t despair. Just purchase the Six-Gun and send us your brand X diesel tuner IN USEABLE CONDITION. We’ll then send you a hefty 20% rebate off the Six-Gun price!
I would say they are pretty confident in their product!
"The new Banks Six-Gun diesel tuner for Duramax pickups allows truck owners to select from six levels of power up to +128 hp and +345 lb-ft while they drive. Six-Gun quickly and smoothly changes the truck’s output at the twist of a dial. Banks’ Stacked for Power™ design combines all tuning elements, pulse width, timing and fuel pressure into one tuner. Six-Gun includes mission-critical safety circuit design for added protection."
"For off-road pullin’ or draggin’, Banks offers the Speed-Loader™ upgrade. Collectively, the Six-Gun and Speed-Loader provide +155 hp and +385 lb-ft and are both easy to install. Six-Gun is introductory priced at $625, and the Speed-Loader option at $99."
I can't believe Banks is finally getting away from selling a high dollar all in one upgrade and finally giving people what they want, more hp&tq in a tuner not tied to a kit.
This is a healthy power upgrade from the conservative guys at Banks. But it falls short on power for us guys dragracing and truckpulling.
Even if they gave me 100% off I wouldn't trade in my brand X tuner that adds 215/425 to the wheels or my brand X box that that adds 145/350 to the wheels. Not forgeting when my two brand X products are stacked my truck runs [email protected] on diesel only in the 1/4 mile. Edited by: mtomac
If they had them out last summer I would have bought one, but the Banks salesman I talked to about the other 73HP system said "Nothing else is in development or planned for development for the Duramax."
Whats odd is their apparent change of heart regarding high hp systems that can damage the drivetrain. A year or so ago I shopped them heavy and almost bought a Stinger kit because their online literature went on and on about having a system that integrated EGT reduction with a smart controller to not beat up on your engine and drivetrain for the sake of HP gains. Engineered to be a complete answer..Now they are selling a module that seems to be what the competition has been offering all along. Their literature now says the six-gun has built in circutry to prevent tranny slippage. Yet they offer a 155 hp module. Whats the point of having 155 hp if all the tuner is going to do is defuel shifts like crazy to avoid slip? I guess if you see enough sales pass you by, anyone can have a change of mind.. Edited by: VFRRider
I have never, and probably will never buy anything from them.
When a company claims hp and torque gains from an exhaust system, I suspect all of their ad copy.
I have seen numerous posts on TDR and dieselstop.com that proves time and again, their marketing dept, engineers and salespeople are all in different depts. and not in communication with each other. Chances are, if you call and ask for more info, you'll get a kid with no experience with the product who is reading a sales pamphlet to you over the phone.
And that pamphlet was written by a "marketing type" who knows nothing other than his ad copy better move some units. There was a time when they had a coherent design philosophy. But now that they're seeing Edge, Quadzilla, Predator, TTS, Van Aaken and others with phenomenal sales and great performance, they're trying to catch up by spreading FUD about high hp tuners until *theirs* is ready, then suddenly it's no problem for your engine... rrriiiiight. OK, Gotcha....
One key difference is where the numbers are taken. Typically, Edge foe example will take the gain in PEAK numbers just like we do when we go to a dyno shootout. Others take the maximum gain at a given RPM.
An example at 2400RPM is this:
Stock 196HP 429TQ Juice 40HP 265, and 579. Not bad for a program claimed at 40 HP. 69HP and 150lb/ft rear wheel gain!
Oh yeah, at 3,000 RPM it went from 250HP to 292HP for a 42 HP gain.
Now you see why I don't get all wound up over Superchips or Hypertech's claims. All you have to do is hook a trailer on and the difference is even more apparent...
This being my first post on the Diesel Place website, I would like to take the chance to introduce myself. My name is Colin Banks and I work for Gale Banks Eng. I have visited the Diesel Place numerous times and have enjoyed the debates. Since I enjoy debate and diesel discussion I decided to join the site.
Mackin: The Six-Gun Tuners are officially released and will be available to ship at the end of the week.
Kennedy: What did you find about our hp claims/tables that didn't jive?
Socaldmax: We do gain hp and torque from our exhaust sytems. Exhaust systems might not net you a 100 hp gain, but a 15-25 hp gain is quite common. There has been instances such as the 94-97 powerstrokes, where the factory muffler was so good we didn't produce much of a gain at all out of our aftermarket muffler. Therefore we never sold a muffler for those trucks. Your right, our marketing, sales and engineering are different depts. That does not mean they are not connected through meeting, training and daily interaction. The pamphlet your referring to was written by our Director of Communications Peter Treydte. He is extremely well respected by the TDR and Diesel-Stop members. He is also one hell of an engineer. I respect the fact that you question a new product, but it's best to get the facts before you make your post.
The Six-Gun is the first of many race/off-road products we are making for the Duramax and other diesels. We recognize the diesel racers and are excited about the prospect of providing them products.
If you look at Banks' dyno charts for the Six-Gun, you'll see thier claim of 155HP and 385TQ are not peak gains vs. stock, but max gains achieved early in the powerband.
<LI>The 155HP gain is achieved at approx. 2100rpm where Banks' dyno chart shows the stock Duramax producing about 175HP vs. 325HP with the Six-gun + Speedloader.</LI>
<LI>The 385TQ gain is achieved at approx 1900rpm where Banks' dyno chart shows the stock Duramax producing about 450 ft/lbs of torque vs. 835ft. ft/lbs with the Six-gun + Speedloader.</LI>[/list]
The Six-Gun + Speedloader's peak HP gains vs. stock is about 85HP.
What is impressive is 800+ ft/lbs of torque at around 1900rpms. By comparison the Hot OJ needs to be about 2300rpms to produce the same torque. Towing heavy with this tuner might be a real treat, but you may not win many races vs. other boxes at comparable power levels.
Welcome. I think it's terrific when a manufacturer will come to an open forum like this and hang it all out for full discussion/debate. As with all the vendors who do the same, my respect for Banks just went up another notch.
Now, my question. I notice that among the factors the Six-gun adjusts is fuel pressure. A number of us here are shy about fiddling with injection pressure due to the number of reports of failures/leaks associated with that practice. What has Banks done to ensure that we don't fall prey to the same ills?
I have a couple of questions.
I have a new 03 d/a and am thinking of making more HP. I have been reading many posts here and want to know what is the least problematic device? Which one will allow me to plug it in and have NO problems with anything. Im not going to go out and race or tow. I just want to be able to keep those pesky rice burners from cutting me off.
It would also be fun to stomp on it once in a while for the smile factor.
Do I need to run a pyro?
Do I need 4" gas pipe?
Do I need Intake?
Can I just plug it into a stock truck without hurting it?
I thought it might be good to chime in here. The best horsepower gain that we measured (+155) occurred at 2000 RPM, from 163 HP stock to 318 with Six-Gun and Speed-Loader set at level 6. The best torque gain occurred at 1800 RPM, from 458 lb-ft stock to 843 lb-ft, a gain of 385 lb-ft. Peak horsepower went from 252 @ 3000 RPM stock to 336 @ 2800 RPM with Six-Gun and Speed-Loader set at level six, a gain of 84 HP. Peak torque both before and after occurred at 1800 RPM, so the numbers are the same as the best gain. We always look at the full curve and present data that shows best gains and peak to peak gains. The curves pretty much tell the full story. You can see them here http://www.bankspower.com/test_results_AC09.cfm, and more data will be posted at a later date.
Tsckey: The fuel pressure is a definite issue of concern. In stock form the Duramax produces about 23,000 PSI of fuel pressure. Based on extensive testing, we have determined that 26,000 PSI is about the point when seals are in jeopardy. We have designed the Six-Gun so that at all levels except level 6 with the Speed-Loader, the systems does not exceed about 24,000 PSI. Level 6 with the Speed-Loader approaches but does not exceed 26,000 PSI. There are a couple of devices that we have tested that exceeded 28,000 PSI, beyond our comfort level.
Problemchild: We always recommend the use of a pyro because exhaust gas temperature is the most vital statistic that you can know regarding the function of your diesel engine. We also always recommend airflow improvements anytime that you are increasing fuel delivery. For those that like the idea of an adjustable fuel calibration like the Six-Gun, we offer Monster Exhaust, air-filters and gauges, for those that never want to be concerned about the proper matching of air and fuel, we offer our Stinger system, which include a set calibration (no adjustment), 4” exhaust, filter, Big Head wastegate actuator and gauges. The Stinger offers the peace of mind of knowing that you will never overtemp your engine. There is enough margin available in a Duramax that you can probably put a Six-Gun on and run at moderate levels without ever having an overtemp problem, but if you tow, you would need to stay around level 2 or 3 on an otherwise stock truck to stay safe. If you are going to tow, I highly recommend a pyrometer.
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