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Jetboat, where is the data?


I'm confused........a$$ also hurts since i fell off the K&N milkcrate when i recieved my 30 lashes!
Man I HATE when there are 180deg difference of opinion!I have over 75 K&N filters in the trucks and in the shop..............ooooooooooooo them lashes hurt!
 

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hoot said:
Jetboater,

The results of the testing were not surprising. Over the years almost anywhere you read, oiled foam cell and gauze style filters consistantly came up short... not necessarily horrible, but short compared to OEM accordian pleat paper filters.

What I gather from all this is not necessarily to not use the oil based filters because they do flow better.

What has been substantiated in this test is higher flowing filters sized by the general constraints of the underhood area of a truck have lesser filtering capabilities, period.

My suggestion of dual AC Delco filters would give almost double the flow of stock and increase filter life. You would need a special custom box that somehow had the filters side by side or stacked with seperate outlets that Y together to the engine. Nothing like that exists.

True, paper is #1 in filtration overall. I will not debate that. I will debate efficiencies like the ones in the "test" showed as they are way off base. Again, I cannot repeat enough that many times we have found other company employees and dealers behind the screen names of these negative to K&N tests. Hmmm...
 

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Jetboater said:
I work at K&N and find those results insulting to my intelligence as well as to that of your readers. We do both inside and outside testing of our products and your results are in complete contradiction to what is fact. I am not sure if you work for AFE or another company but we have seen AFE employees post "test results" and make claims of this nature in the past. I can assure all readers that K&N filters for gas motors have 98% or better efficiency and for diesels, it is 99% or better. That is our standard and all products must meet it or they are never released. How do you think a company can stay in business for 35 years, selling over 5 million filters a year and have such a poor product as you lead to believe. Frankly, it is not possible. That fact alone is more convincing than some unknown study. If you really wanted to test filters, why did you not contact K&N and see what help they could provide you? They have decades of data and would have enjoyed laying this urban myth that they do not filter well to rest.




That's the beauty of this test all done independently.Not manufacture endorsed or spacific to the results.If KN came out on top,you be cheering.





Mac
 

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Jetboater said:
I will debate efficiencies like the ones in the "test" showed as they are way off base. Again, I cannot repeat enough that many times we have found other company employees and dealers behind the screen names of these negative to K&N tests. Hmmm...

If you would have seen the dirt in my intake tube, you would not be suprised by the results.
 

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Mac , prove him wrong. It was totaly independent,was it not?
 

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Jetboater said:
Doubtful. And I do not believe this one was 100% independent either.

Are you saying the dust on the clean side and coating our intake tubes are a optical illusion. And don't even mention gasket seal. Go out and hold one up to the light and come back and tell me it doesn't look like a pin cushion.
 

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Mackin said:
Jetboater said:
I work at K&N and find those results insulting to my intelligence as well as to that of your readers. We do both inside and outside testing of our products and your results are in complete contradiction to what is fact. I am not sure if you work for AFE or another company but we have seen AFE employees post "test results" and make claims of this nature in the past. I can assure all readers that K&N filters for gas motors have 98% or better efficiency and for diesels, it is 99% or better. That is our standard and all products must meet it or they are never released. How do you think a company can stay in business for 35 years, selling over 5 million filters a year and have such a poor product as you lead to believe. Frankly, it is not possible. That fact alone is more convincing than some unknown study. If you really wanted to test filters, why did you not contact K&N and see what help they could provide you? They have decades of data and would have enjoyed laying this urban myth that they do not filter well to rest.




That's the beauty of this test all done independently.Not manufacture endorsed or spacific to the results.If KN came out on top,you be cheering.





Mac
I agree with Mac on this one. I highly doubt that Spicer is tied into any kind of manufacturer. If so, he has a good front. He has been working on these filter tests for almost a year before he got a 'break' from the test company. Spending lots of his own $$ on a test stand that he hoped could help..


I wont doubt K&N's reputation, but good advertising also sells too...


I heard a saying that you could always tell who had the worst beer, those who spend the most on advertising....


No manufacturer involvement in this test makes it the most accurate information out there to me.
 

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a bear said:
Jetboater said:
Doubtful. And I do not believe this one was 100% independent either.

Are you saying the dust on the clean side and coating our intake tubes are a optical illusion. And don't even mention gasket seal. Go out and hold one up to the light and come back and tell me it doesn't look like a pin cushion.

LOL, you posted too fast! "Doubtful" was the response to the one above yours
Gasket is due to the air box having an uneven surface that a urethane seal cannot distort to enough to seal off completely. Paper filters have foam seals but are not intended to be reused. Therefore, a faom seal is used which can easily be replaced as needed during the life of the filter. Holding to the light is not a good judge. Look at it under a microscope. What happens when you oil a white piece of paper? It looks transparent too. I almost did not post because I knew I would be attacked. I just know 100% for fact that those numbers are wrong. I have seen otherwise with my own eyes, no cheating or bias.
 

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Each test cost $1700. How many tests were performed? Who paid for it? Just curious.
 

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Attacked? Open minded bunch of guys with some spirited attitude maybe. Often manufactures like youre self come in here and stir the pot for a day or two and then vanish.Spicer has put in the time here with a valid effort. If he works for AC Delco , i'll eat one of my K&N filters with fresh oil.
 

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hoot said:
Each test cost $1700. How many tests were performed? Who paid for it? Just curious.

Damn, that's about right. We have about 10 different filters out at any given time. I do not think any other company goes through the hoops K&N does to ensure quality. Not even the big "F" does that much testing.
 

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BROKER said:
i'll eat one of my K&N filters with fresh oil.




That i gotta see!!!!
 

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BROKER said:
Attacked? Open minded bunch of guys with some spirited attitude maybe. Often manufactures like youre self come in here and stir the pot for a day or two and then vanish.Spicer has put in the time here with a valid effort. If he works for AC Delco , i'll eat one of my K&N filters with fresh oil.

I'll agree to that... Open minded bunch of guys with some spirited attitude
And I'll eat an AFE if K&N is not all we say it is
 

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Jetboater said:
I'll agree to that... Open minded bunch of guys with some spirited attitude
And I'll eat an AFE if K&N is not all we say it is

That's just it,it becomes a he said she said senario.How about you eat an AFE since i took 30 lashes for standing on the K&N milkcrate for 10 years.I have taken some serious heat over the years from all over,but yet i never had anyone prove me wrong like this. Yes, i have had no issues with the filters and my trucks longevity speak for them self.So , all i know is that you will be gone in 2-5 days and i'll still be sitting and pondering on all this.
 

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You know, I get one thing from all this. There are 2 sides to every story. People will trust what they want to trust and brand loyalty like that is a good thing. Its sort of like arguing over the upcoming election. Oh sh!#, did I start another debate
I can tell you all that I am a hell of a nice guy and if you'd drink a beer with me on my boat and we'd be the best of buds. That much is certain. No hard feelings. Group
 

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JB, if the test results presented here are such an insult to your intelligence, how are we to believe the results presented by K&N aren't an insult to ours? I know nothing of the motivation for Testand's involvement in this testing, but I for dang sure know K&N's motivation for their testing.
 

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BROKER said:
Jetboater said:
I'll agree to that... Open minded bunch of guys with some spirited attitude
And I'll eat an AFE if K&N is not all we say it is

That's just it,it becomes a he said she said senario.How about you eat an AFE since i took 30 lashes for standing on the K&N milkcrate for 10 years.I have taken some serious heat over the years from all over,but yet i never had anyone prove me wrong like this. Yes, i have had no issues with the filters and my trucks longevity speak for them self.So , all i know is that you will be gone in 2-5 days and i'll still be sitting and pondering on all this.

I promise I won't go away in 2 - 5 days. I'll stick around and do my best to answer any question posed to me. Besides, what else am I supposed to do all day, work?
Deal?
 
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