Diesel Place banner
1 - 20 of 29 Posts

BryanVilaubi

· Registered
Joined
·
382 Posts
This is a C&P from another thread, think it'll help others too. Tim

No...EFI live is not capable of doing what the Co-Pilot does. You can "imitate" what the copilot does with EFI but the Co-Pilot does something not controlable by the TCM. It increases clutchpack Apply pressure based on engine load and controls the Torque Converter lockup. (IE: TPS reading and MAP readings primarily is what it looks at)

A VERY common misconception is that EFI can do exactly what the Co-Pilot does. Not the case.......With EFI Live, you can quicken the timing of the on-going and off-going clutches which feels like a firm shift, but in all reality, what does that do for your actual apply pressure to your clutches?? Nothing. Without pressure, it can still slip. EFI is a FANTASTIC program but does not have the capability to regulate pressures.

The Copilot on the other hand comes with a Solenoid that controls pressure bleed off to increase the holding capacity of the clutches. Because of the higher pressure, this actually speeds up the time in which it takes the of-going clutches to release and the on-going clutches to apply so the result is an actual firmer shift.

Pressure in our EXTREME transmission with a co-pilot can reach 300psi to the clutches which dramatically reduces slip. Just as a reference....On a stock trasnsmission, 5th gear pressure is about 85-90psi. With the addition of only the CO-Pilot, apply pressure will jump to 250psi.

Hope this clears somethings up!
Bryan
 
With this much pressure, have there been any concerns with accelerated ring to drum wear, rubber seal blowout, or cracked piston complaints?
 
Discussion starter · #4 ·
With this much pressure, have there been any concerns with accelerated ring to drum wear, rubber seal blowout, or cracked piston complaints?

Woops! Sorry about the late response on this one. I haven't looked at it for a while.

There isn't an issue with pressure because it only reaches that much pressure when you go full throttle and high boost. If you are "everyday driving it" it's only going to make the normal amount of pressure. The Co-Pilot looks at Boost and TPS and if its not seeing a high enough reading on either of these to justify the high pressure, it's not going to raise it.

Basically........As boost increases, Apply pressure to the clutches increases.
 
Discussion starter · #7 ·
Can I put a co piolet on a stock ally? How hard is it to install?
Yes it can be installed with a stock transmission. It wont give you much of a benefit if the trans has already been slipped because the damage has already been done. It is probably a 3-4 hour install for someone fairly mechanically savvy
 
The co-pilot was my first mod on my 02 GMC after I limped the tranny. The first generation co-pilots were not that easy to understand, at least for me and I limped it again. In hind sight I don't think I was operating it correctly. Anyway that quickly progressed to a full blown built transmission. I've got co-pilots on my daily driver, the one race truck that is runnning an Allison and I just bought another one to put on the 06 Chev I just bought that's for sale. I only use the co-pilot for racing. Everyday driving I leave it off. There is plenty of strength in these built trannies for daily driving, at least at the power levels I run. I didn't not like how the co-pilot acted when I tried using it for towing. Actually locked and skidded the back tires a couple of times on the 1-2 shift. Don't know what caused it but never towed with the co-pilot on again.
 
How difficult is the co-pilot to install?
 
If you install a co-pilot on a stock allison, how much extra hp could it allow the tranny to safely handle?
 
If I run this with a SC Stage III and ATS converter, would I still be getting a benifit from it?
 
I built my Allison myself with the Suncoast stage IV kit and ATS 5 star conv. and Co-Pilot. The difference from the co pilot was very noticable. You can adjust conv lockup rpms +/- and the control main pressure is only increased/decreased when the accelerator is increased or decreased directly. Resulting in very tailored shift firmness. Only downside to having the pressures so high, is higher operating temps. I doubled the coolers and added a fan, now it runs cooler than stock.
 
so if I am just going to use my truck as an everyday driver with an occasional play time included and a few long haul tow trips with around 11-k lbs , Do I need the co-pilot on my built ally ? If down the road I am just going to start slipping the tranny w/out it I should just do it when she goes in for the tranny upgrade ?:confused:
 
x2 on phaze2phae's question
 
so if I am just going to use my truck as an everyday driver with an occasional play time included and a few long haul tow trips with around 11-k lbs , Do I need the co-pilot on my built ally ? If down the road I am just going to start slipping the tranny w/out it I should just do it when she goes in for the tranny upgrade ?:confused:
In a case such as this, I believe ATS would be able to advise you most accuratley on your build. I have customers state "occasional" play time also and come back with damaged engine components or drivetrain due to abuse they didnt think they would ever engage in. It only takes 1 time to destroy a weak link. If you think you will reach that level, than build for it. The Co-Pilot is a great addition I think. It picks up where a mechanical shift kit leaves off and cant do for that matter. As I stated previously, it tailors your transmissions characteristics depending on accel. position, which essentially correlates to engine load. Additionally, the Co-Pilot is a most beneficial addition when towing. It will compliment a shift kit or strengthen most builds for that extra capacity some users might need.
 
Ok, stupid newbie question from someone who is trying to learn.

From what I have read, the Allison is good for an extra 75-100 HP or so before "limp" mode in gears 1-4.

So does the co-pilot just increase the 5th gear load carrying ability?
 
^^^X2^^^

I have had a few slips in 5th gear also, and would like to know if this would hold my HP. I have approximately a 70HP tune, that while rolling in 5th and gradually rolling on to the throttle will cause it to slip. This is a VERY light gradual rolling-ON. Probably less than 50% throttle. Like when you have the cruise control set and your creeping up on someone in the right lane and you can see a stack of cars gaining in the left lane and I wanted to squeeze around that last slo-poke and get back in the slow lane. This was with almost NO towing load, I was towing a few dirt bikes, maybe 1000 extra lbs than empty.

Also it was totally embarrassing since I had just passed this guy and had to pull over on the shoulder and drop the tune down a level and shut the truck off to clear the limp.

I would REALLY like to know if this might help.
 
1 - 20 of 29 Posts