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-   -   Home made boost controller (https://www.dieselplace.com/forum/63-gm-diesel-engines/21-6-5l-diesel-engine/347127-home-made-boost-controller.html)

cbr600rx7 12-30-2009 06:10 PM

Home made boost controller
 
This was way to easy not to post and a lot cheaper then paying $110 bucks for one.

Before we started the truck was peaking at about 6 psi on the street and only holding maybe 4.5-5 psi.

We started by cutting the housing where it bends over to brake it open. As you can the inside is very simple.
http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/b...7/DSC00888.jpg

Take a grinder and grind off the little cap on the end of the rod. Take it easy on it so you can save the little cap on the end to use latter.
http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/b...7/DSC00889.jpg

Next take a tap and die set and thread the factory waste gate rod. I ran this one down a little over 2 inches.
http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/b...7/DSC00891.jpg
http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/b...7/DSC00896.jpg

Then its as simple as putting every thing back the way it came off. The only diffrence is your using a nut to adjust the spring pressure. I turned this one all the way out to start off and made about 5 pounds of boost. After a lot of testing i ended up turning the nut about 12 times or about 3/4 of a inch to make about 9 pounds of boost. This is what it looks like on the truck.http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/b...7/DSC00897.jpg

The truck is now hitting about 10 psi then droping to a solid 8 and doesnt drop below 6 even at higher RPM's. During normal driving you can hear the turbo much more and the truck now makes about 6 psi under normal driving conditions unless you get on it a little bit of course ;)
http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/b...7/DSC00898.jpg

There is still a little room for improvment but over all boost is now a lot more controlled and doesnt spike and drop like it did before. Just the few extra PSI has woken this old girl up.

btrapr 12-30-2009 06:16 PM

what size tape did you use?

thanks

cbr600rx7 12-30-2009 06:24 PM

12-24

ak diesel drive 12-30-2009 06:51 PM

did you double nut it?

cbr600rx7 12-30-2009 06:53 PM

Hmmm no but thats a good idea.

Green Machine 12-30-2009 07:07 PM

Added this to the other homemade turbomasters in the FAQ sticky.

awspc 12-30-2009 09:08 PM

this may sound dumb but did you use the factory spring

cbr600rx7 12-30-2009 09:53 PM

Yes i used the factory spring. The more you tighten the spring the more pressure it takes to close the waste gate. I have not tried to push it to see how much boost you can get out of the factory spring but there is still a good bit of adjustment that could be made for guys wanting to run more boost.

mamzerook 12-30-2009 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cbr600rx7 (Post 3634881)
Yes i used the factory spring. The more you tighten the spring the more pressure it takes to close the waste gate. I have not tried to push it to see how much boost you can get out of the factory spring but there is still a good bit of adjustment that could be made for guys wanting to run more boost.

Remember....Yours is not vacuum controlled in a 93, you won't find that spring inside a vacuum WG actuator. This won't work with a 94 and newer actuator.

cbr600rx7 12-31-2009 01:44 PM

This should go with out needing to be said but your must have some way to watch your boost pressure. I paid 22 bucks at advance auto for the sunpro gauge and it works just fine.

T_F_E 12-31-2009 02:12 PM

I think that holding 6 psi going down the highway will hurt you fuel mileage.

cbr600rx7 12-31-2009 09:18 PM

I dont see how it would hurt your fuel mileage. Your not adding any more fuel and your making more power at a lower rpm reducing the need to steep on the gas more or down shift. In fact you may even use less fuel.

I played around a little more with it today and now have the truck peaking at about 11 psi and holding about 9 and you can fill a huge diffrence in power when in OD on the highway.

3500 sierra 01-01-2010 02:01 AM

make sure to watch your exhost gas temp. I just blew a hole through a piston in my 93' due to over boosting my engine, which helps couse more heat, there for melting the pistion down. if you dont have a pyrometer, i would highly recomend one. You should never run the truck with a exhost gas temp of over 1200-1250 deg. if it goes up over that get off the gas untill it drops down.

RCpullerdude 01-01-2010 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by T_F_E (Post 3635812)
I think that holding 6 psi going down the highway will hurt you fuel mileage.

Quote:

Originally Posted by cbr600rx7 (Post 3636359)
I dont see how it would hurt your fuel mileage. Your not adding any more fuel and your making more power at a lower rpm reducing the need to steep on the gas more or down shift. In fact you may even use less fuel.

I played around a little more with it today and now have the truck peaking at about 11 psi and holding about 9 and you can fill a huge diffrence in power when in OD on the highway.


He's right. You don't want any more than 2-5 PSI cruising empty. More than that causes un-needed drive pressure which takes more power to push out of the cylinders. Thus, you're increasing your parasitic losses of scavenging, so it takes more power to just spin the engine, increasing fuel consumption. It is for this reason that the stock 94+ vacuum system dumps boost when cruising. This is why many people have reported a loss in economy when going from the vacuum system to the TM. It is also part of the reason that I'm keeping the vacuum system and not going to a turbomaster. You're running far too much boost for running empty cruising, but unfortunatly, depending on spring, it may be the only way to get your max boost. This is another reason I like the stock 94+ system.

Excellent work on the controller though. It's something that I think has been needed for some time, making an adjustable wastegate actuator from a stock 92-93 actuator.

cbr600rx7 01-01-2010 02:48 PM

Thanks for the advice. I plan on doing a little more testing today and finish getting it set.

cbr600rx7 01-02-2010 12:11 AM

Did a little more testing today and turned the nut back about 2 full turns. The truck is boosting right around 4 psi at 65 MPH. She is peaking around 10 and holding about 7-8 psi at WOT. During normal driving i dont see any thing over 6 psi. I have driven about 60 miles like this today and didnt notice any loss in MPG.

I did a little off road testing as well ;) and i can say i am very happy with this little mod.

T_F_E 01-02-2010 12:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cbr600rx7 (Post 3637780)
Did a little more testing today and turned the nut back about 2 full turns. The truck is boosting right around 4 psi at 65 MPH. She is peaking around 10 and holding about 8 at WOT. During normal driving i dont see any thing over 6 psi. I have driven about 60 miles like this today and didnt notice any loss in MPG.

I did a little off road testing as well ;) and i can say i am very happy with this little mod.


Yup that's exactly where my turbo is tuned.

cbr600rx7 01-02-2010 12:45 AM

You can see in this pic where we taped the upper manifold for the boost line. I wrapped the line in black electric tape to add some extra protection and not make the line stand out so much.
http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/b...7/DSC00908.jpg

And here is a better pic of the finished controller
http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/b...7/DSC00906.jpg

cbr600rx7 01-06-2010 06:07 PM

Still running strong after about a week now. MPG has stayed the same so far and i have not noticed any extra oil in or around the intake or turbo.

3500 sierra 01-06-2010 11:41 PM

awsome, great work! what are you getting for mpg?

Horse-Power 01-07-2010 03:27 PM

Your boost gauge looks just like mine and its in the same spot!....I had to do a double take.

cbr600rx7 01-07-2010 09:13 PM

LOL. Yeah it fit near perfect in there and for a little over 20 bucks the gauge works great.

I went about 100 miles of mixed driving on 1/4 of a tank. My truck is a 700R transmission with 4.10 gears and 275 tires.

RCpullerdude 01-07-2010 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cbr600rx7 (Post 3648120)
LOL. Yeah it fit near perfect in there and for a little over 20 bucks the gauge works great.

I went about 100 miles of mixed driving on 1/4 of a tank. My truck is a 700R transmission with 4.10 gears and 275 tires.

Should be a 4L80E unless it was swapped at one time, which would be crazy, though not impossible. 4L80E was the only auto behind the 6.5TD in a GM pickup/SUV from the factory.

cbr600rx7 01-07-2010 09:29 PM

Hmmm maybe i read the factory option list wrong then. Its a 4 speed auto but when i was looking up some of the option numbers i must have miss read it as a 700R.

cbr600rx7 01-10-2010 07:48 PM

Finaly got a good idea about MPG. Right now the truck is getting about 17-19 MPG in mixed driving on 4.10 gears. I have also noticed a lot more pick up during normal driving. The biggest improvement i would say is going from stop light to stop light where before the truck was making 2 pounds under light load its now making 4-5 and i dont find myself puting my foot on the floor trying to keep up with traffic any more.

dat1truk 01-12-2010 02:04 AM

i have the same gauge lol and did this with a piece of all thread a lock nut and spring to my 95 just bent the all thread into a hook and hooked it in the turbo cost less than 5 buks lol

cheap9665 01-15-2010 03:17 PM

i just removed the actuator and wired it fully closed. . . .gettin the gauge put in next week, wonder how much i can get out of it. only trouble i have had is when its under full load. . . .(gcvw over 25,000) it overboosts and takes away fuel

hydrotech 02-20-2010 07:18 PM

Since you are now making a few more pounds of boost over stock, shouldnt you turn up the pump a flat or two? I bet you could find some kind of progressively wound or 2 seperate springs to allow you adjustment for high and low throttle.

cheap9655- If you wire the wastegate shut, all exhaust gas will be pushed through the turbine wheel and the turbo will make as much boost as it can; boost pressure will now be fuel limited. Usually one would upgrade to a much larger turbo when going to a wastegateless design

Chevysrule454 03-05-2010 10:32 PM

If I find a older wastegate can i redo it to work on my 98 "f". Im not the brightest bulb in the room, but the picture of your 94 put the wastegate in a completely different spot than mine. I know iv read the other thread on the newer wastegate but i was just wandering that the older style seems allot easier to modifie (ie not having to search for the right spring etc.) and can i mod. an older one and use it on my engine?

extremeyoshi 03-06-2010 08:00 PM

Quote:
Originally Posted by cbr600rx7
LOL. Yeah it fit near perfect in there and for a little over 20 bucks the gauge works great.

I went about 100 miles of mixed driving on 1/4 of a tank. My truck is a 700R transmission with 4.10 gears and 275 tires.

Should be a 4L80E unless it was swapped at one time, which would be crazy, though not impossible. 4L80E was the only auto behind the 6.5TD in a GM pickup/SUV from the factory.


if his truck is a 93, its mechanical, and those indeed did come with a 700r4 behind them, no electronics for the 4l80 to talk to so they put in the 700r4.
i used to have one, and when taking her very easy down the highway i would get extremely good mileage, as she was only spinning at 1400 rpm at 65mph, like 25mpg or better.

RCpullerdude 03-06-2010 09:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by extremeyoshi (Post 3749896)
Quote:
Originally Posted by cbr600rx7
LOL. Yeah it fit near perfect in there and for a little over 20 bucks the gauge works great.

I went about 100 miles of mixed driving on 1/4 of a tank. My truck is a 700R transmission with 4.10 gears and 275 tires.

Should be a 4L80E unless it was swapped at one time, which would be crazy, though not impossible. 4L80E was the only auto behind the 6.5TD in a GM pickup/SUV from the factory.


if his truck is a 93, its mechanical, and those indeed did come with a 700r4 behind them, no electronics for the 4l80 to talk to so they put in the 700r4.
i used to have one, and when taking her very easy down the highway i would get extremely good mileage, as she was only spinning at 1400 rpm at 65mph, like 25mpg or better.

Even the 92 and 93 had the 4L80E. The 4L80E was the only auto put behind the 6.5TD in GM pickups (light vans too, to the best of my knowledge). The 4L80E came out in 91, and was even behind certain late 6.2's. In the mechanical Diesel applications, it had a stand alone TCM and a TPS on the IP and an RPM signal from the oil pump drive (combined with the vacuum pump on crew cabs and Suburbans in 91). No need for any communication with the engine. The 700R4/4L60/4L60E wasn't offered behind the 6.5TD because it wasn't strong enough. It was, however, found behind NA 6.5's.

axiom 03-06-2010 09:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by extremeyoshi (Post 3749896)
Quote:
.

here before you get flamed HARD ... read

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Detroit_Diesel_V8_engine

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_GM_transmissions

IamDave0887 03-06-2010 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by extremeyoshi (Post 3749896)
Quote:
Originally Posted by cbr600rx7
LOL. Yeah it fit near perfect in there and for a little over 20 bucks the gauge works great.

I went about 100 miles of mixed driving on 1/4 of a tank. My truck is a 700R transmission with 4.10 gears and 275 tires.

Should be a 4L80E unless it was swapped at one time, which would be crazy, though not impossible. 4L80E was the only auto behind the 6.5TD in a GM pickup/SUV from the factory.


if his truck is a 93, its mechanical, and those indeed did come with a 700r4 behind them, no electronics for the 4l80 to talk to so they put in the 700r4.
i used to have one, and when taking her very easy down the highway i would get extremely good mileage, as she was only spinning at 1400 rpm at 65mph, like 25mpg or better.

92/93 did come with the 4L80E. There was a standalone TCM that controlled the trans. YOu can buy a standalone controller which will allow you to put the 4L80E behind anything that it'll bolt up to more or less.

nogassershere 04-18-2010 10:22 PM

My '93 has a 4L80E and thank goodness! The R4 would never hold up to what I have put mine through!

nogassershere 04-18-2010 10:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cheap9665 (Post 3661559)
i just removed the actuator and wired it fully closed. . . .gettin the gauge put in next week, wonder how much i can get out of it. only trouble i have had is when its under full load. . . .(gcvw over 25,000) it overboosts and takes away fuel

Mine was stuck closed when I got the truck, and when it freed itself up I took it off and wired it shut the next day. Been that way for about 40k miles now. Averaging 16mpg solo with a personal best of 18 (600 miles on one tank!). Only get about 10 when pulling the 12klb travel trailer though. My wife says that I am anal about my mpg, as I check it every time I fill up! :D

DarylP 04-25-2010 12:28 AM

So what would be the Max boost that a 96's turbo would put put under a load if the wastegate was wired shut? Has anyone made a aftermarket electronic controller to control the stock Vac-solenoid?

turbonator 04-25-2010 01:16 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nogassershere (Post 3817414)
My '93 has a 4L80E and thank goodness! The R4 would never hold up to what I have put mine through!

X2......:D

6.2L n/a 3500 in signature

mattchatman 06-19-2010 12:19 AM

Hey I've also got the 93 mechanical 6.5 with the spring actuator on the wastegate. I'm curious if my wastegate is working correctly, I know the spring is good because i took it off and checked it but the wastegate never moves when reving the engine. Should I be able to see it move when reving the engine or does it need a load? Also I have very little power at RPM below 2000. Can barely take off uphill. I think it's a fuel pressure problem but i'm curious what the closed wastegate could do.

T_F_E 06-19-2010 12:23 AM

it needs a load

nogassershere 06-19-2010 12:46 AM

X2, it needs a load to build up enough boost to overcome the spring pressure.

cbr600rx7 06-19-2010 11:47 AM

Some times on bolted 6.5s you can see a little boost when reving the engine but it will be very minimal (1-2 psi on a well bolted truck) A boost gauge should tell you just what the turbo is doing under load where it maters. Most of the mechanical injected trucks are only running 4-6 psi stock so dont expect to see any thing crazy.

If power is a problem check out SSdiesel and there down pipe and intake for the 6.5. Add a boost gauge and check out the DIY mods and i think you will see a hole new animal. For about 400 bucks you can wake a 6.5 up a good bit and still get 17+mpg.

mattchatman 06-19-2010 05:07 PM

Cool that's what I figured. Ill sort out my fuel problem get a boost and fuel pressure gauge and then start with exhaust, cooling, turning up the pump etc. I've an extra 6.5 sitting in my shop out of a 95 and I'm thinking about tearing it down and rebuilding it with better performance in mind, better cooling, lower compression for more boost,a better crank. Any opinions on whether that would be a waste of my time? I know it still wouldn't compare to a Cummins or power stroke but I've got the engine already.


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