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6.5L Diesel Engine Discuss the 6.5 GM diesel engine & associated components. Automatic transmission questions & problems belong in the 4L80/85 - 4L60E - 6L90 Transmission Forum

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Old 10-08-2007, 10:39 PM   #1 (permalink)
Diesel Al
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Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Baltimore County, MD
Posts: 10
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Newbie from Maryland - Truck will not start

I would like to say HI to all of the great folks at Diesel Place. I hope that you people can help me because I sure need it. I have been driving diesels on & off since 1975. I have been driving an 87 Diesel Suburban since 1991 and it has been relatively trouble free except for the rust.

I purchased a 1995 Diesel Suburban in May of this year. I am having problems at this time with it not being able to start. I have read some of the threads and the FAQs. I have also gone through the diagnostic check list which I am pasteing here. I hope that this is the correct procedure.

1. Does the engine crank, or 'turn over'? Yes
1a. Does the engine start and run? No
1b. Do you have a Wait To Start Light & the amount of time (seconds) lit. Yes, 6-7 seconds
1c. Ambient Condition (temperature outside) 80 degrees F.
1d. Engine Cranking speed (if you have an accurate tachometer). Sounds normal, no mechanical tach available.
1e. Are you experiencing stalling? Yes, when it last stopped on the highway and would not restart.
1f. If Stalling, describe (upon startup only, down the road, hit a bump etc)
The last time the motor ran it started up on Diesel with some white smoke and when it did start, it revíd up like it was clearing an air leak. Drove about 4 miles down the expressway. At this point the engine had warmed up enough for the Frybrid fuel system to automatically switch from Diesel Fuel to Vegetable Oil. When it switched over to Vegetable Oil, the engine shut down. I slowed down and got it off the road before trying to restart the engine. I turned the Vegetable Oil System off and tried to restart on Diesel Fuel for many tries, but it would not restart.
1g. If Stalling, do you notice loss of dash or instruments? Dash and Instruments were working and are still working.
-note if experiencing stalling,you must indicate PMD location in #24.
1.1 Lift pump test - describe results. I can hear the lift pump running for a few seconds after I turn the key off and the oil pressure is still high enough to engage the fuel pump; Fuel comes out hose beyond T handle with no air bubbles into a soda bottle. Fuel comes out Diesel Fuel Filter and on to ground. I do not notice it spurting out the top of the black knob when it is open, but it does run on the ground. Diesel Fuel goes through a temporary replacement clear vinyl hose into Injection Pump with no air bubbles.
2. Service Engine Light - on/off/intermittent Off after Wait to Start light goes off.
3. Model year 1995
3a. Odometer reading (indicate if in miles or km) 151,970 miles
3b. Miles on major engine components if been replaced (example Injection pump)
Donít know. Truck had 149K miles on it when I bought it in May 2007.
3c. Indicate the model number on the Injection pump (starts DS4 or DB2......)
DS4 831-5521
4. Have you scanned for engine codes? (varies by pre/post 96) yes/no Yes
5. List exact results on engine codes: 23(Not 12), 34,36,42,78,87,23(Not 12)
6. Air Filter condition (visual check) Not too bad, knocked dust out of the foam.
7. Fuel filter condition (freshly changed/condition unknown/mileage since changed)
Changed out diesel fuel filter and vegetable oil fuel filters after shut down.
8. Condition of Battery terminal connections (removed, cleaned and tightened) Removed, cleaned and tightened
8a. Known condition and age of the batteries. Stated as being new by previous owner.
8b. Are batteries of differing age or are they a matched set? Matched set
8c. Condition of Major Grounds. (same drill as batt)- removed, cleaned, retightened, have not removed cleaned and retightened glow plug controller cables.
9. Upon cold start, does the radiator hose get hard quickly? Yes/no Canít tell, will not start.
10. Upon cold start, do you have excessive white smoke? Yes/no I did the morning that it shut down on the express way and also at various times before then.
11. Do you have excessive cranking time before the engine starts? Yes, at the times when it was putting out white smoke and clearing possible air leaks.
12. Have you used the block heater, and does this effect engine starting?(only try for starting problems) After the shut down on the highway, I have tried the block heater for about 6 hours one day and it still would not start.
13. During hard acceleration, do you have excessive black smoke? Yes/no No black smoke.
14. Do you have any unusual exhaust smoke issues? No unusual smoke issues.

15. Turbo check out - pass/fail Passed, No black smoke, good power, Heath Turbo Master.
16. Do you have an EGR on the engine? (An F or an S engine code 8th VIN digit) F engine code. 8th digit from the left is an ďFĒ. The engine has an EGR valve.
17. Indicate if you know if itís a 1500, 2500, 2500HD, 3500, 3500HD. K1500
18. Indicate fuel that you are using: Bio-diesel, #2 Diesel, #1Diesel, SVO/WVO, other #2 Diesel and WVO
18a. If running a VO (Veggie Oil fuel) setup, indicate details of your conversion (homemade, or packaged system) Packaged Frybrid 2 Tank System Version 5.6.
19. Are you using any fuel additives? If so, please list. No Fuel Additives
20. Please indicate geographic region you are in: (example: Texas or Canada) Maryland
21. Do you have any service history available that might pertain to the problem you are having? No Service History, but engine was starting to missing when running on WVO. Believed to be clogging WVO Fuel Filter according to Frybrid. There was no miss when running on Diesel Fuel.
22. Please indicate any modifications to the vehicle that might help us diagnose better. Heath Remote Mounted PMD, Heath Turbo Master Boost Controller
23. Upon unscrewing the fuel cap, do you have a large vacuum formed in the tank? yes/no There is a vacuum, I would not say that it is large.
24. Location of PMD/FSD? On the pump/remoted over intake/remoted out of engine bay (please specify placement specifically) Heath Remote Mounted PMD on front plastic skid plate behind front bumper.
24a. If remote mounted, describe wiring harness (homemade or purchased from a vendor?) Wiring Harness Purchased from Heath Diesel, Inc
24b. Indicate the location and condition of the FSD/IP grounding wire. FSD/IP ground is in original location on top of the front part of the IP with what appears to get a white inspection wax across the top of it. It appears to be in good condition.
25. Are ALL glow plugs in proper working order as per this thread? I have only checked the glow plugs on the driverís side of the engine. The glow plugs from cylinders 2, 4 & 6 were wet when I took them out after trying to start the engine. They glowed when hooked up to a battery with battery cables. The glow started from the end and preceded one third of the way over 6 to 7 seconds. I understand that they should start glowing in the middle and glow to the end. Is this correct? When I removed the glow plug from cylinder # 8, the glow plug was dry and it would not glow when tested with the battery. Which glow plugs do you recommend for this application? Do you have any problem with the quick heat glow plugs?

Please come back to me if I missed anything or that I should check further into something(s). Thanks


__________________
95 K1500 Suburban F Engine (L65), 4L80E Transmission (MT1), 8050 GVW (C51),
3.42 Axle Ratio (GU6), LT 265/75R16/E Firestones,
151,000 Miles, Heath PMD Isloator Mounted on Front Skid Plate AS FSD,
Heath Turbo Master Boost Controller, Frybrid Diesel/Vegetable Oil 2 Tank Conversion Ver. 5.6.
Diesel Performance Products High Pressure Fuel Pump (HPFP) for WVO, Followed by a Pressure Regulator to Dial In the HPFP (Cummins Spec) to 7-9#s needed for the 6.5 Diesel IP. Pressure Gauge Mounted Just Before IP, Sight Glass mounted on Return Fuel Line. IP replaced by dealer 9/18/2001 at 104028 miles. G60 Glow Plugs Installed 4/08. Replaced (Carter) LP with NAPA (Carter) LP 8/08.
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Old 10-08-2007, 11:35 PM   #2 (permalink)
j_k_auto
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
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Did you try the t valve at the front of the engine to make sure you are getting fuel?

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Old 10-09-2007, 06:36 AM   #3 (permalink)
knkreb
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Crack open an injector fuel line and see if you have fuel being delievered that far during cranking. If so, we'll move on from there. If not, then gotta figure out why.

Suspect somethin' electrical a bit flukey. Did you do the braided engine ground between firewall and passenger head too?
__________________
Look here-> GM 6.5 Reference Material & FAQ's <-Look here

Diagnostic Links & Common Failures: Turbo System * Lift Pump/OPS * PMD * Stalling


įPlease include your vehicle details in your signature line. Did you read the FAQ's and search before posting?
*Bus 1, rest in peace. Bone stock, now just bones. 4.10 rear 10/13 mpg, 182,000 miles with a set of MCI motor coach seats.
*Currently driving an "Canadian Camo" Snow White 2001 5.7L Chevy Express.
*Bus 2, 99 7.3L PSD.

Last edited by knkreb; 10-09-2007 at 06:38 AM.
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Old 10-09-2007, 09:41 AM   #4 (permalink)
Diesel Al
Heat Sink
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Baltimore County, MD
Posts: 10
iTrader Score: 0 reviews

j k auto

Quote:
Did you try the t valve at the front of the engine to make sure you are getting fuel?
I am getting bubble free diesel fuel from T valve hose. Thanks for your response.
__________________
95 K1500 Suburban F Engine (L65), 4L80E Transmission (MT1), 8050 GVW (C51),
3.42 Axle Ratio (GU6), LT 265/75R16/E Firestones,
151,000 Miles, Heath PMD Isloator Mounted on Front Skid Plate AS FSD,
Heath Turbo Master Boost Controller, Frybrid Diesel/Vegetable Oil 2 Tank Conversion Ver. 5.6.
Diesel Performance Products High Pressure Fuel Pump (HPFP) for WVO, Followed by a Pressure Regulator to Dial In the HPFP (Cummins Spec) to 7-9#s needed for the 6.5 Diesel IP. Pressure Gauge Mounted Just Before IP, Sight Glass mounted on Return Fuel Line. IP replaced by dealer 9/18/2001 at 104028 miles. G60 Glow Plugs Installed 4/08. Replaced (Carter) LP with NAPA (Carter) LP 8/08.
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Old 10-09-2007, 09:52 AM   #5 (permalink)
Diesel Al
Heat Sink
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Baltimore County, MD
Posts: 10
iTrader Score: 0 reviews

knkreb

Quote:
Crack open an injector fuel line and see if you have fuel being delievered that far during cranking. If so, we'll move on from there. If not, then gotta figure out why.
On earlier tries, I have had fuel from Cylinder Injector Lines 2, 4 & 6. No fuel would come out of CIL 8. I need to amend my original post. Thanks to gmporter with the GM Inquiry: The IP was replaced by a dealer on 9/18/2001 at 104028 miles. I don't know the warranty on a replacement GM IP.

Quote:
Suspect somethin' electrical a bit flukey. Did you do the braided engine ground between firewall and passenger head too?
No, but I will do that later today and report back to you. Thanks for your hard work.
__________________
95 K1500 Suburban F Engine (L65), 4L80E Transmission (MT1), 8050 GVW (C51),
3.42 Axle Ratio (GU6), LT 265/75R16/E Firestones,
151,000 Miles, Heath PMD Isloator Mounted on Front Skid Plate AS FSD,
Heath Turbo Master Boost Controller, Frybrid Diesel/Vegetable Oil 2 Tank Conversion Ver. 5.6.
Diesel Performance Products High Pressure Fuel Pump (HPFP) for WVO, Followed by a Pressure Regulator to Dial In the HPFP (Cummins Spec) to 7-9#s needed for the 6.5 Diesel IP. Pressure Gauge Mounted Just Before IP, Sight Glass mounted on Return Fuel Line. IP replaced by dealer 9/18/2001 at 104028 miles. G60 Glow Plugs Installed 4/08. Replaced (Carter) LP with NAPA (Carter) LP 8/08.
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Old 10-09-2007, 08:52 PM   #6 (permalink)
big_kuntry
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 8
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sounds like the same problem i had i changed very thing imaginable and i found out my injector pump went bad cost me around 1200 to get it fixed but since i did get it changed runs pretty good the sad thing is i found living in md not alot of diesel shops deal with the light duty trucks only rigs
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Old 10-09-2007, 09:36 PM   #7 (permalink)
Diesel Al
Heat Sink
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Baltimore County, MD
Posts: 10
iTrader Score: 0 reviews

big ****ry
Quote:
sounds like the same problem i had i changed very thing imaginable and i found out my injector pump went bad cost me around 1200 to get it fixed but since i did get it changed runs pretty good the sad thing is i found living in md not alot of diesel shops deal with the light duty trucks only rigs
Thanks for the information. I still have the braided ground from the passenger side head to the firewall to check out per knkreb's request. I ran out of time today.
__________________
95 K1500 Suburban F Engine (L65), 4L80E Transmission (MT1), 8050 GVW (C51),
3.42 Axle Ratio (GU6), LT 265/75R16/E Firestones,
151,000 Miles, Heath PMD Isloator Mounted on Front Skid Plate AS FSD,
Heath Turbo Master Boost Controller, Frybrid Diesel/Vegetable Oil 2 Tank Conversion Ver. 5.6.
Diesel Performance Products High Pressure Fuel Pump (HPFP) for WVO, Followed by a Pressure Regulator to Dial In the HPFP (Cummins Spec) to 7-9#s needed for the 6.5 Diesel IP. Pressure Gauge Mounted Just Before IP, Sight Glass mounted on Return Fuel Line. IP replaced by dealer 9/18/2001 at 104028 miles. G60 Glow Plugs Installed 4/08. Replaced (Carter) LP with NAPA (Carter) LP 8/08.
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Old 10-11-2007, 08:59 AM   #8 (permalink)
Diesel Al
Heat Sink
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Baltimore County, MD
Posts: 10
iTrader Score: 0 reviews

Quote:
Originally Posted by knkreb;2053534 View Post
Crack open an injector fuel line and see if you have fuel being delievered that far during cranking. If so, we'll move on from there. If not, then gotta figure out why.

Suspect somethin' electrical a bit flukey. Did you do the braided engine ground between firewall and passenger head too?
Quote:
Suspect somethin' electrical a bit flukey. Did you do the braided engine ground between firewall and passenger head too?
There appears to be no braided wire between the firewall and the passenger head, if the firewall termination is at the same location as the frame to firewall location. I removed, cleaned and retightened the 2 grounds that terminate at the intake manifold/passenger head at cylinder # 7.
__________________
95 K1500 Suburban F Engine (L65), 4L80E Transmission (MT1), 8050 GVW (C51),
3.42 Axle Ratio (GU6), LT 265/75R16/E Firestones,
151,000 Miles, Heath PMD Isloator Mounted on Front Skid Plate AS FSD,
Heath Turbo Master Boost Controller, Frybrid Diesel/Vegetable Oil 2 Tank Conversion Ver. 5.6.
Diesel Performance Products High Pressure Fuel Pump (HPFP) for WVO, Followed by a Pressure Regulator to Dial In the HPFP (Cummins Spec) to 7-9#s needed for the 6.5 Diesel IP. Pressure Gauge Mounted Just Before IP, Sight Glass mounted on Return Fuel Line. IP replaced by dealer 9/18/2001 at 104028 miles. G60 Glow Plugs Installed 4/08. Replaced (Carter) LP with NAPA (Carter) LP 8/08.
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