I've been looking at fuel additives and found one that I can get locally,
The only thing I'm not sure of, is the bottle says it disperses water in diesel fuel.
Is this good or bad?

what is it called?

The name on the bottle is Power Service, it says diesel fuel supplement.


This is on the front label


Prevents gelling


cleans injectors


disperses water


lubricates pumps & injectors


year around formulaEdited by: John R

Be sure it also says " No Alcohol". Edited by: Bill Gisse

John I noticed you retired from the truck plant in East Pontiac. I went to high school at Pontiac High on Huron Str.in 44-45. My dad was foreman of the old truck line on South Bolevard and retired in later years as superintendent of the truck lines . I tried working for GM then at the old plant on Saginaw Street or in that vicinity. Worked as a helper on lathes turning brake drums for 6X6 trucks. That was back breaking work for me so after a couple months I bailed outand went into the service 9Air Force) for 21 yrs and then Air Force Civil Service for another 21 years. Retired totally 1st of 88. My brother, now diceased woked Tool and Die at Pontiazc Motor and his wife retired as secratary to a top dog at Pontiac Motor. She got me a nice discount on my truck. Appreciated that.

I've used power service in my big truck(not the anti-gel but the grey bottle). It seems to work well. Good cetane boost and lubricity.


whether to disperse or expel water is a bit of a controversy. I'm leaning toward dispersing. Do a forum search and you'll find good info on the subject.

You should only use a demusifier. An emulsifier will allow the water to go past the filter and into the injection system. A demulsifier allows the water to seperate and be drained at the filter. See this post for the GM bulletin.


http://dieselplace.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=154&PN=1

You should only use a demusifier. An emulsifier will allow the water to go past the filter and into the injection system. A demulsifier allows the water to seperate and be drained at the filter. See this post for the GM bulletin.


http://dieselplace.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=154&PN=1

SID,

That is the biggest gray area and has me goofy just thinking about it. It seems the real world diesel users and people in the know disagree with demulsifying the fuel (seperating the water from the fuel through chemical means) They would rather see it stay in the fuel where it safely gets burned up instead of using a demusifier that allows water to seperate anywhere in the system. That my friend is the real problem. Standing water in the pump, rails,injectors = corrosion

I finally agreed with George Morrison and went with emulsion type additive. I do not want the water "wrung out" all through the system. The OEM filter and my Racor "Aquablock" secondary will take care of larger water particles and the rest will stay in the fuel an pass through..... hopefully.Edited by: hoot

My big truck (Detroit diesel) doesn't even have a water removing filter. It is questionable how well they work. I think most agree that free water is the problem, not emulsified water.

Seems to me there have been stories about CAT, I think, studying the ADDITION of water to diesel fuel as a way to increase mileage and decrease emmisions.





If they can deliberatly add water to fuel and make it pass through the system safely it would seem to me that locking up our unwanted free water and passing it through should be the way to go too.

Water in fuel should lower the cetane value and thereby decrease fuel mileage. I know of military applications where water induction increased thrust and therefore power, obviously that's not an engine combustion application.

Here's a link to water/diesel mix.


http://www.chevron.com/prodserv/fuels/proformix/index.shtml (http://www.chevron.com/prodserv/fuels/proformix/index.shtml)





It says it does decrease fuel mileage, but part of the fuel is water so are you using more or less actual fuel?

I for one choose to emulsify. I am no expert on HPCR systems but I do know from experience with heavy equipment in cold climates that water DOES pass through the seperators. Even after three in a series I have seen enough water accumulate to freeze a line solid.





Some folks may consider it a contradiction to add an emulsifying additive to a fuel system that includes a seperator. I see it more as a two pronged approach.


Don't take me for gospel, I'm just another guy with another opinion. --SS http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Ermm.gif

GMCDURAMAX


That was an interesting read, lots of food for thought.


ThanksEdited by: John R

I for one choose to emulsify. I am no expert on HPCR systems but I do know from experience with heavy equipment in cold climates that water DOES pass through the seperators. Even after three in a series I have seen enough water accumulate to freeze a line solid.





Some folks may consider it a contradiction to add an emulsifying additive to a fuel system that includes a seperator. I see it more as a two pronged approach.


Don't take me for gospel, I'm just another guy with another opinion. --SS http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Ermm.gif

That is exactly why I use emulsifying additive.

I use "HOWES" IT WORKS GOOD IN MY BIG TRUCK,get it at all truck stops. I only got 1800 miles on my DURAMAX ,winters comeing will see how it does in my 2003 -SIERRA 3500-truck.http://dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Ermm.gif

OK, we have additives witch emulsify, demulsify and now disperse water, what's next?
The stuff I'm using says it will disperse water, does this mean it will make the water go through the system or does it stop it from mixing with the fuel so the separator can pick it up?

Water dispersion means that the water is formed into droplets so small that they pass through the separator/filter and then through the fuel system. Quality additives like PowerService and Schaeffer's coat the droplets so they lubricate the fuel system as they pass.


These same additives also cause large amounts of water in the fuel to collect for removal at the separator. How do they do these two contradictory things?...that's what keeps chemists and patent attornies in business.

Isn't dispersing and emulsifying the same thing?

Yes, emulsifiers disperse water droplets into smaller particles. Demulsifiers do the opposite.

There is a post in the TSB section from GM that explains about additives. Here it is what it says about demulsifiers and emulsifiers:


Water Emulsifiers and Demulsifiers

If the customer desires to use a fuel additive, care must be taken in its selection. There are two common methods that fuel additives use to cope with water in the fuel. One method is through demulsification of water in the fuel. This method causes water particles to combine together to form larger particles, which drop out of suspension. This allows the fuel filter/water separator to separate the water from the fuel as it is designed to. The other method of coping with water in the fuel is through emulsification. This method, often using alcohol as the emulsifier, keeps water particles suspended in the fuel. Emulsification of water in the fuel can allow water to get past the fuel filter/water separator, in most cases causing damage to the fuel system.

rdixon,


I've seen those GM comments before. I only wished GM was more specific in describing the fuel system damage.

http://www.howeslube.thomasregister.com/olc/73176349/diesel.htm





THIS IS WHAT I USE IN THE 3500 AND BIG TRUCK