JUST BOUGHT A 2004 GMC SERRIA 2500 C.C. S.B. AND WAS READING ON ANOTHER POST THAT THEY ARE UP GRADING THE DURAMAX IN JANUARY. I WAS WONDERING WHAT THE CHANGES WERE GOING TO BE AND THE BENIFITS WOULD BE?


FIRST GMC FOR ME ALWAYS HAD FORD TRUCKS BEFORE. LAST TRUCK WAS A 2003 F-350 6.0 POWERSTROKE DIESEL C.C. S.B. THE TRUCK TURNED OUT TO BE A LEMON AND FORD BOUGHT IT BACK. I NEEDED A TRUCK SO I ORDERED A 2004 REPLACEMENT F-350. TRUCK ARRIVED WITH A 2003 MOTOR SO I SAID THAT THEY COULD KEEP IT. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clap.gif

Hello all

Real ford users are switching to GM now Because of the new 6.0.. WOW... We did most of our fleet are powerstrokes.. Now where a GM/Ford Fleet.. With more Duramax's to come..

Unreal what ford has done

From steve
Fleet

I am a chevy convert as well, loving the dmax..welcome aboard.

The upgrades to the new motor are the addition of a Garret VNT tubocharger and a redesign of the cylinderhead to allow for easier service of the injectors. I'm not sure if the injectors will be the same or different but the torque and Hp are going to increase! The final numbers appear to be 340 Hp and 580 ft/lbs but they are not out yet so they can and will most likely change as this motor has lots of room for increases.

I read somewhere that GM is going to offer a "municipal" grade DMax that is rev limited with a limit to the horsepower of 210. The torque will be the same, but the lower hp should limit the lead-footed city or fleet drivers that need the pulling power of the engine but not the speed.

Was available in 2003
Engine Details (http://media.gm.com/division/powertrain/products/engine/truckengines/2003/truck_benefits/lb7.doc)

Edited by: Professor

A member over at TDP, states that the engine will be in full production on November 1. He works in the Dmax plant. Trucks with the new engines will probably be available in January. I called my dealer today, as I am still waiting to know the facts before I place my order for the 2004. The dealer said he will find out if it is going into production soon or not. If all is true about the LLY, then waiting an extra month or two is the smart move.

I've been wanting to place my order for a 2500HD 4x4 CC but have been kinda holding off for more info. So I called and talked to my local dealer today. He made some calls to get me some info. He did get back to me and said;

1. No new engine untill 2005.
2. LLY option is only for 3500 4x4 SRW.

GM sent me the specs for the LLY and LB7 and both are the same. I wonder what the difference is?

Now I'm thinking I'm just going to order.

Dealers always seem to be the last ones to know........


Steve

Dealers also want you to come in a buy one off the lot. Telling you the LLY is way off is in their best interest. Same thing by telling you it won't be available in the configuration you want.


My guess is that it would cost them too much money to make both the LB7 and LLY side by side. I bet when the last LB7 is sold, the LLY will replace it across the board. And from what I have heard, the LB7 is already not being assembled any more, and the warehouse is slowly clearing out.

Check out www.chevy.com (http://www.chevy.com) and build a new 2500HD. It has the option for the LLY engine on the website! I called several dealers in the area and not could confirm when the option will actually be available. Right now the option is listed, but without a price with it. A worker from the Dmax plant over at the TDP, posted that full production of the LLY will start November 1. If that is the case, it probably will take a couple months for the LLY to show up on a lot. I imagine when the LB7 runs out, then it could be sooner or later. I, too, am waiting to order. If all is true about the LLY, then it would be smart to wait a few weeks to see if the LLY indeed starts full production. I agree that the dealers will tell you anything to get your order now. That is also why the information is so scarce right now. If they announced it, everyone looking to buy a new 2500HD probably would not want the LB7. Still, putting it on the website is interesting. Time will tell, I will wait awhile longer to find out.

99mo,


Here is what GMC sent me in reply to my question on the LLY. I also asked Chevy the same and the reply was the same with no specs since I didn't ask for them.


Thank you for contacting GMC and for your interest in the 2004 GMC Sierra!
The LLY is the Turbo Diesel engine and is available only on the 3500 Sierra.
The LB7 is also a Turbo Diesel engine but requires dual rear wheels. The
LLY requires 4WD and single rear wheels. Please see your dealer for
ordering information. I have included the specs for the LLY below as you
requested.
>
> LLY DURAMAX 6600 V8 TURBO DIESEL ENGINE SPECIFICATIONS
>
>
> Engine type Overhead Valves
> Piston displacement, cu. in.(liter) 402 (6.59)
> Bore and stroke, in.(cm.) 4.1 x 3.9 (10.41 x 9.91)
> Compression ratio 17.5:1
> Exhaust - single All
> Horsepower 300@3000 rpm
> Kilowatts(kW) 223.80@3000 rpm
> Torque (lb.-ft.) 520@1600 rpm
> Newton - Meters (N-m) 702.00@1600 rpm

Hey guys. Ordered my truck on 9/27. Assumed Id be getting the LB7. Talked to my dealer today and the estimated delivery date is 12/5, a good 10 weeks from when I ordered. This is much longer than I had been told originally. Could it be my truck was too late and they are going to put the LLY in it, accounting for the extra weeks?? koolgt, over at TDP, has said LLY production in Nov, which makes my truck hitting the concrete a month after a candidate for the engine??? Thanks.


Bob


Edit: koolgt, who supposedly works at the Dmax factory, says LLY full blown production on Nov 1. Nov. 1--Dec. 5 roughly 4 weeks for my truck to get the engine. What do you think??Edited by: bowtiebob

bowtiebob while the internet is a great way to learn there are somethings it cannot do. The ONLY way you'll find out what engine you are getting is to call or visit the dealership that placed the order.


99mo,


Here is what GMC sent me in reply to my question on the LLY. I also asked Chevy the same and the reply was the same with no specs since I didn't ask for them.


Thank you for contacting GMC and for your interest in the 2004 GMC Sierra! The LLY is the Turbo Diesel engine and is available only on the 3500 Sierra.
The LB7 is also a Turbo Diesel engine but requires dual rear wheels.*The LLY requires 4WD and single rear wheels.* Please see your dealer for ordering information.* I have included the specs for the LLY below as you requested.
>
> LLY DURAMAX 6600 V8 TURBO DIESEL ENGINE SPECIFICATIONS
>
>
> Engine type* Overhead Valves
> Piston displacement, cu. in.(liter)* 402 (6.59)
> Bore and stroke, in.(cm.)* 4.1 x 3.9 (10.41 x 9.91)
> Compression ratio* 17.5:1
> Exhaust - single* All
> Horsepower 300@3000 rpm
> Kilowatts(kW) 223.80@3000 rpm
> Torque (lb.-ft.) 520@1600 rpm
> Newton - Meters (N-m) 702.00@1600 rpm
The Duramax in it's current configuration, LB7, is a great engine but if the HP/TQ numbers are not increased on the new LLY engine it won't be the end of the world but I will be a little disappointed.

well i did get some more info for u guys yesterday at work...found out from our newsletter....we are working nov 30th.that is the 03 buildout date...they pushed it back a month from the 1st to the 30th so now our 04 starting date is the 30th unless its changed again

Thanks kool. We appreciate you keeping us up to date.

Thanks kool. We appreciate you keeping us up to date.





NP GM also up'd our production this month from 16,500 engines to 16,830, so yeah good stuff:)

I went to the dealer today and just spoke to my dealer he stated to me ( the new LLY engine is only available as a option in 3500 sieries, and could now be ordered for $1300 more). Just thought I would add this info. I did look at this info in black and white. David

Check this out, I emailed Chevy and this is their reply today:


"Thank you for contacting GM Buypower. We apologize for the difficulties that you have encountered while navigating the Build Your Own portion of our web site. This LLY option for a Duramax Engine is incorrect and there is not a different Duramax Engine that can be ordered for this vehicle. We are aware of this issue and have reported this to our web site developers. We hope to have this issue resolved soon.


If you would like further information on this vehicle you may contact the Chevrolet Marketing Support at 1-800-950-2438.


Once again, thank you for your interest in GM BuyPower. If you have any further questions please contact us at the GM BuyPower Customer Assistance Center at 1-800-462-8976. Customer Relationship Managers are available from 8:00 a.m. to 11:00 p.m. Eastern time, seven days a week.


Sincerely,


Kristie Botello
Customer Relationship Manager
GM BuyPower"


Well, I did call and talk to a marketing representative. In a nutshell, the guy at first denied the LLY was option, then backtracked as we talked and he checked out the the website himself. He advised to call back on Monday as the managers who "really knew" what was going with the LLY would be there at that time. I will be making that call on Monday. (the truck I was building was 2004 2500HD 4x4)

--kool, how long does it take for these new engines to go from being made to being put in trucks?? Looks like I will be one of the last lucky ones to get the LB7 before they switch over.

--This is interesting that GM actually responded about the LLY not being an option, when kool is telling us that they start building them on 11/30. What will say when one day all of sudden the LLY IS an option??



Bob

It's normal to have a new product and have a bunch of employees not up to snuff on the info. Once the official news gets out we'll know the details.

kool at least has the inside line.

ur correct hoot, it also has alot to do with GM getting rid of there old stock...i mean if they said yeah we got this new engine thats alot better coming out soon..would u wait or buy the new one? GM has alot of 03 engines in the warehouse now that there trying to get rid of so we can get the 04's out the door, also i have no idea how long it will take to make it from our plant to the truck plant and to the dealer..i have no clue sorry

More Rumors......

"The new horsepower output for the Dmax will be raised at least 20 to 40 hp by all accounts I've heard
(one from a guy who works at the factory and has assembled a few of the
prototypes... prototypes mind you... what they prototype and what gets built
are ALWAYS different) Torque will be high enough to just clear the
competition.. maybe... GM is paranoid of warranty work (as they should be)
and they don't want to certify the rest of the driveline for more than
560ft/lbs from the engine (even though it's been tested to well over
800ft/lbs) .... the Allison, in all its grandeur, is the weak link because
of shift programming, line pressures and clutch packs, all of which have
been purposely reduced to make the tranny, i.e. "easily rebuildable
components", the weak point so as not to fry a rear axle or twist a drive
shaft.

Having said that, the Ally will be programmed to easily hold the 04i
version, as engine is referred to. Heads have been redesigned to make the
injectors accessible without removing the valve covers. Injectors are
supposedly of Tier III emission standards, so in 2006 all they have to do is
some computer remapping at it'll be Tier III compliant (Deere has done this
same thing to some of it's engines). ALL TRUCKS will be equipped with
catalytic converters and will be 50-state emissions certified, which means
EGR will be a component as well.... damn EPA bastards. It will have a
Garret Variable Vane Turbo, which is said to significantly increase low rpm
torque, as the spool up time is reduced tremendously. Suburbans and Vans
are supposed to get the Dmax (or possibly a v-6 version thereof, which my
contacts have all heard of, but have yet to see one) in 2005, though I can't
confirm that. There's also rumors of an inline engine, but nothing more than
that. How much of any of this is fact, and how much is misinformation, I
have no idea. Remember all the hoopla back in '96 when they said they were
going to put a Caterpillar in the trucks? ... misinformation.

GM is currently planning to build another Dmax factory right next to the
current one sometime in late '04 or early '05, as it seems the market demand
numbers they originally came up with were waaaaaay under the reality of the
situation. They still owe an ungodly amount on the current factory, so that
may stall the building of a new one. GM will not begin to build the new 04i
engines until late December, so 2004 trucks with them won't show up on
dealer lots until about February. If you order a truck now, you can get the
new engine and Ally, though your salesman probably won't know the option
code. I believe the new engine is LLY, instead of the current LB7 code.

That's about all I have, besides a few minor technical things.... a few more
computer codes, no more splitter blocks on the fuel rails.. ya' know, little
things that will probably screw the whole thing up."

Having said that, the Ally will be programmed to easily hold the 04i version, as engine is referred to.





I have heard that the changes to the Allison are already available on every 04 LB7 or 8.1L. Is this what you heard also?Edited by: Amric

I have not heard that.

man ur talking to someone other than me:) lol..i couldnt have said any of that better:) good job hoot

I wish mine had external injectors with no CAT...that would be tops

I had a local dealer transfer a '04 HD 2500 for me. I was ready to go pick it up when I found this web site and did some quick back peddaling. We have a local dealership that has put out a chevy Duramax commercial advertiseing the new Duramax. They did the same thing when The Keep America Rolling program came out and advertised 60 month financeing which was definately NOT available then. Based on their ad ( silly ME ) I assumed all the '04s had the new engine upgrades already. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Broken Heart.gif After talking to the sales guy he finally admitted to knowing about the LLY but claims it will only be available in the '04 3500 SRW 4x4. Thats what I wanted in the first place any how. I have only stayed with the 2500HD as I dont want dually's or a crew cab. Now if they would just make the 3500 ext cab in a SWB like Ford ! I dont believe for a second that GM is going to make two Duramax variations and only offer the upgrades in one model. The whole thing was a tough descision for me because I am just under 60k so getting a good trade in $. I am right at that point where I need new tires/brakes but then I am at 0% now Vs the new loan at 4.5% with $2500 in rebates. What bothers me the most is finding out later that I was supposed to change my spin on filter at 7,500 miles or drain the rear end at 500 miles. You know all the important stuff GM forgot to put in my owners manual.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Angry.gif

actually dmax does make 2 varations of the Duramax, and will probobly for a long time, but its nothing u need to be concerned with...they make the regular medium duty duramax, then they make another heavy duty duramax that goes in the kodiak, it basically consist of bigger crankcase, different oil pan, different exhaust adapters, ect..but the 04 duramax will be available on the 2500 as well as 3500 and the heavy duty duramax engine for the kodiak will get revamped as well

Your right about that http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clap.gif I picked up the '04 today. The '04 Duramax manual has vin ID info for both the LB7 and the RPO LLY as well as engine compartment schematics. The bad news is that at 200 miles I have tranny fluid every place.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Dead.gif http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Angry.gif Back to the shop tomorrow. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Cry.gifEdited by: BlueMaxxxx

Well, I made a phone call to the marketing department at GM. They stated that the LLY was unheard of and did check with management. I then inquired if the LLY might be available for the new 3500, and voila!, yes it was, and it was a complete surprise to the marketing rep. She looked it up on the "ordering guide" for the 2004 SRW and there it was. So, at the very least, it will be available for the 3500. (December) As far as anything else about the availability for the 2500, that is still technical hearsay. It is not listed as an option for the 2500 in the "ordering guide", per the rep. BTW, the LLY still shows up on the BuyPower site for the 2500. No disrespect to Kool, just need definitive confirmation from GM. I will wait until this question is answered one way or the other. Edited by: 99mo

no respect taken...nothing against GM but there just playing stupid right now:)...there gonna be available for the 2500 and up...just give em time to get under the hood:)

In my 'o4 max manual the only differences I see on the LLY is a slight variation in the oil cap and the LLY has a fast idle switch built in. I dont see any other differences. They have the slush box out of mine and thet tell me they are waiting for "authorization" ??? from the area GM rep to repair the tranny. They say this is standard for all Allison trans as the " so rarely " have trouble with them. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Confused.gif Hope to have it back one way or the other soon. Driveing a saturn is a real pissser. I had to reach UP to the deposit box at the bank instead of dhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clown.gifwn ! http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Angry.gif

Hello all,


Called a couple of dealers today...all said they had no info on the


LLY. Also asked for a lead time for an order and they gave


5 to 6 weeks from when order is accepted. 'kool', if they begin


putting in the LLYs on Nov1, then all orders now placed will


have them right?





Thanks


Harry K.

Aren't you guys a little worried about getting a newly designed motor?


Hopefully GM has tested this new design extensively, unlike Ford with the new 6.0 mess!


The extra power would be nice if it's still as dependable as the original D/A.

Let's see now, wonder if this will work? I have a 2001 with LB7, came with 100K warranty, currently at 33K. The 2004 with LLY will be available Jan./Feb 2004 and the warehouse will be depleted of the LB7, right.


So if my engine blows up at about 40-50K will they replace it with the LLY or will they hold back some LB7's for replacements?????


Well I can dream can't I? LOL ha ha ha


ERG & CAT Free!!!!! my 2001 is looking better and better!

What is going onhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Angry.gif with GM and this LLY?! It has been removed from their GMBuyPower and Chevrolet "Build your vehicle" website. More smoke and mirrors tricks. I am glad I am not going to order my truck till early next year. Maybe by then the marketing tricks will be over and the new version will be out or gone forever.

I am just glad I have a Duramax instead of the cummins I owned a few weeks ago.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clap.gif

I wouldn't be so quick to jump on the variable-vane turbo/EGR bandwagon so soon. Those are two of several things that caused so many problems with Ford's 6L PSD. I came real close to ordering an '04 PSD a couple weeks ago, but due to all the problems with the '03s (and problems a friend had with his '03 he just dumped), I wasn't sure Ford would have all the problems licked in the '04 redesign. So, I bought my first GM two weeks ago.


For '04 Ford had to redesign the turbo, EGR, fuel injector rails, and other things. For some details, see


https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas/non-html/2004/whatsnew2004.pdf


starting on pg. 17. This is a big document, but worth looking at if interested.


Mark