Hi All,

I decided to get creative with my Jigsaw, so I ended up with this:

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/garage_images/i12247.jpg

My first question: Should I lower my Splash Guard by about an inch in the back?

Doesn't look bad, how much is it helping?

Where do you put your license plate??:) I bet I know what your next picture will be.:)

Hi All,

The license plate is actually mounted above this area - sucks in Maryland to have to use the Front one .... I used to have it mounted at the top, recently switched to the bottom holes although it blocks the small slots in the metal bumper some.

I am thinking about loosing the OEM Lower Air Dam extension - any thoughts?

That is a nice cut and good idea. I was thinking that you might want to think about using some fine expanded metal or something of the like to cover that to keep bugs/rocks/asphault chips/etc from getting thrown from other vehicles. Also, if you paint the expanded metal or whatever you use black, it might give a slicker, more uniform look.

JMO

Hi Clone,

I like that idea - I was wondering how I would attach it to the plastic and still have it look decent? I am open to suggestions.

I would leave the extension until you get to the next step. You might be able to use a plastic repair kit to fasten the mesh on the back side?? That way you would not have any bolts or rivets showing.:)

"Exploding rivets" would work real nice to hold the mesh screen in place, the back side of them are slit and they open as they are popped for more surface area, eliminating the need for washers on the backside.

An aluminum surround would look good and help keep fingers from being cut and clothes from being ripped etc......

I like that idea - there is a lot of room and the hidden part of the metal bumper is bound to have some areas I could attach a frame piece to.

OK, here is my quick suggestion without much thought or even seeing it in person..... the frame idea that TX had would be ok, but it wouldn't conform to the plastic well. I'm pretty anal and for that to look good, the expanded metal would have to be flexible and conform to the plastic's shape to look nice. I would try to get a piece that is the right width of the cut, but have some extra length to go down. Possibly trying to wedge the expanded metal in the top corner of the plastic and running it all the way down past the bend and tieing into the bolting for the black plastic piece at the bottom. IDK really... I'm just throwing out ridiculous ideas:blahblah:

Hi Clone,

Unfortunately the Black plastic just snaps into place - the only bolts are on the edges (one on either side ...)

Dog,

Right there where they snap together would allow you to drill some holes and secure it that way. No one would know.

Go to home depot or lowes and buy some rain gutter guard wire mesh stuff and jb weld or gorilla glue it onto the back of the valance.

It usually comes in alumimum but you could paint it black if you wanted.

did it help with the cooling????

Best question yet! painter 60!!

Best question yet! painter 60!!


:exactly::lol:

I'm just not that brave.:eek:

Hi,

I have no real test data yet - I just completed installing an auxilliary Oil Cooler. I like the ideas so far - keep them coming ....

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/garage_images/i12267.jpg

Nice spot for a cooler. Looks great.

chloeourdog:

Looks good! Please let us know how the oil cooler works out for you! :)

Hi All,

So far I am very impressed with the TD-EOC (additional oil cooler.) I will be towing our 5th wheel soon, but today was an initiation test:

Baltimore, MD OAT 94 degrees today.

City driving - tranny temps stayed at or below 175 which is rare for my truck in start/stop traffic (recent pre-EOC trips yielded 187 + degrees) I am a good 12 degrees cooler.

Also noticed tranny was 137 instead of 150 on 30 mile highway drive this morning (OAT 78 degrees).

... with the AC blowing ICE COLD air which is also something that has never happened on a day above 90 degrees.

ECT (from OEM gauge) was fluctuating between 185 and 195 for highway running trip to work this morning (OAT 78 degrees)

... and would not go past 203 while driving 45 minutes in the city today (OAT 94 degrees). I have always observed 210 (straight up) once I started doing city driving.

No fan clutch operation whatsoever either today.

The real test will be towing .....

:)mark

DMAXITOL has reported on his oil cooler, is this the same equipment ?

Hi All,

So far I am very impressed with the TD-EOC (additional oil cooler.) I will be towing our 5th wheel soon, but today was an initiation test:

Baltimore, MD OAT 94 degrees today.

City driving - tranny temps stayed at or below 175 which is rare for my truck in start/stop traffic (recent pre-EOC trips yielded 187 + degrees) I am a good 12 degrees cooler.

Also noticed tranny was 137 instead of 150 on 30 mile highway drive this morning (OAT 78 degrees).

... with the AC blowing ICE COLD air which is also something that has never happened on a day above 90 degrees.

ECT (from OEM gauge) was fluctuating between 185 and 195 for highway running trip to work this morning (OAT 78 degrees)

... and would not go past 203 while driving 45 minutes in the city today (OAT 94 degrees). I have always observed 210 (straight up) once I started doing city driving.

No fan clutch operation whatsoever either today.

The real test will be towing .....

:)mark


Your exactly right on this one. Good luck w/ your EOC by the way; you're going to need it.:cool:

Adding the Cooler may make it worthwhile, but without a cooler I think you were going in reverse. You are blocking a small amount of radiator air with the license plate AND allowing more air to get under the truck which is where you want less air and pressure so that the underhood air has omewhere to go.

We are heading into the heat today, across MN, ND, WY, and MT. I haven't done much other than a couple of stack stuffs, propping down my splash pan, and running a couple of screws into the POS flap so it cannot flop down. Had there been time/ambition, I'd have baffled the core support down to the splash shield...

Idahofox,

Yes this is the TD-EOC I have installed.

Kennedy,

You are correct about the license plate - I need to get a bracket to move it down some - do you know of any sources for one?

With the EOC - I have also installed the additional air dam which blocks the tow-hook holes - I think this definitely helps alot - my AC is working a lot better, indicating more stack flow ....

Still looking for suggestions to fab a grill over the hole I cut to protect the TD-EOC from rocks, etc.


BTW - your WIF wrench is awesome .... :)

Yes this is the TD-EOC I have installed.
...about the license plate - I need to get a bracket to move it down some - do you know of any sources for one?

Just drill a couple more holes in the middle of the plate. No need for a bracket.

Here's some pics of mine....no towing data yet, but substanstial drops in coolant, oil, and tranny temps since install (15-20 degrees across the board) running unloaded. Very easy, clean install, adds about 2 quarts oil capacity. Takes a huge chunk of heat out of the cooling system.

22046

22047

22048

22049

22050

22051

22052

22053

There will be a day for me with this system , I do not own a high over heater , but it just has to many other benefits for me to ignore. No disrespect for the V2 ,both well done and say thankyou to both , but off the ****ing wall is me.:lol:

:cool2: Looks good, where can we pick this TD-EOC kit up and how much are they???
I did a search and couldnt find anything under TD-EOC
Thanks

Derrick

PM one of the guys that have it. They can help.

Hi All,

Today was my first towing experience with the TD-EOC. I went to pick up my 5th wheel from storage (our HOA does not allow me to keep it at my house for more than 2 weeks in a row - I can get around this by taking a weekend camping trip every two weeks ;)

In Maryland it was around 90 degrees - felt hotter .... very humid.

I hitched up the camper and proceeded to tow it on some town routes (near Ellicott City) - took it up some steep hills on the back roads - no inclines more than 1/2 mile .... and took it out I-70 towards my house. I had it hitchup up and towed for about an hour with the AC going full blast. Then I had my ritual of trying to back it up our somewhat curved/long narrow driveway .... thank goodness the AC was real cold - really needed it today.

I got no fan whatsoever, AC was ice cold, tranny stayed around 175 the whole time in the around town driving, and cooled down one notch on the highway. This was about 12 degrees below what I am used to seeing when the temps are around 80 degrees.

My ECT fluctuated between 195 and 203, never went past 203 and occasionally went to ~185 (all OEM ECT gauge.) Last time I took the same route it stayed on 203 the whole time and the AC was cool but not cold.

I consider this typical towing (~10Klbs since I did not have clothes, water, etc. loaded) on the relatively flat areas of central Maryland. Normally I would get a small amount of fan action in start/stop traffic towing, but got none today.

So far so good - I'll report more when we take our real trip next week.

There will be a day for me with this system , I do not own a high over heater , but it just has to many other benefits for me to ignore. No disrespect for the V2 ,both well done and say thankyou to both , but off the ****ing wall is me.:lol:

I also say thanks to both for a lot of work. The secondary benefits were also a major factor in my decision. ):h

That's just the beginning chloeourdog! Expect twice the life on your oil! It's what I'm seeing out here, towing daily my oil is still clean at 4000 mi. Sill waiting on analysis reports, but for a single filter system this has been nothing short of amazing for me. The EOC will pay for itself in oil changes alone this year in my case. I may yet fulfill that dream of having a 1,000,000 D/A sitting in the driveway.):h

I'd like some info on this EOC, will someone chime up...

I'd like some info on this EOC, will someone chime up...

PM one of the guys that have it.:)

PM one of the guys that have it.:)

I did, thanks

Hi All,

Today was very hot here in Maryland. My mirror read 99 degrees the whole trip home from work. My ECT went to 195, fluctuated between that and 203, then stayed at 203.

My tranny ran 162 for most of the trip home, but went to 175 when I hit some traffic/start and stop. The AC was still ice cold - I really needed it today. My trip was about 45 minutes because of the traffic ....

So far I have yet to hear the fan - I expected to hear it a little today in the start and stop traffic .... but have not heard it since installing the TD-EOC.

Today was unloaded but very hot - I wish I could have taken some time off work and hitched up the 5th wheel - it would have been the perfect test ....

This weekend is the real test - 500 mile trip towing our fully loaded 5th wheel up I81 through some good grades in a notoriously hot area. We'll see what happens then - I'll be reporting the good, the bad and the ugly ;)

I may have to phone in to someone (and let them pass along the info early) as I probably won't have internet in most places I am travelling.

So far unloaded the TD-EOC is cooling my LLY noticeably compared to before the TD-EOC.

I do have one question about oil capacity for those others that have the TD-EOC installed: I filled with 12 quarts - dipstick read full - I did add an extra half quart because I thought the capacity should have been 12.5 to 13 quarts, but yesterday I got worried and drained 24 ounces - dipstick still reads full .... what are your capacities with the TD-EOC? Prior capacity of truck is 10 quarts .... I bought 3 gallons of oil (12 quarts) plus the 1/2 quart ....

Hi All,

Today was very hot here in Maryland. My mirror read 99 degrees the whole trip home from work. My ECT went to 195, fluctuated between that and 203, then stayed at 203.

My tranny ran 162 for most of the trip home, but went to 175 when I hit some traffic/start and stop. The AC was still ice cold - I really needed it today. My trip was about 45 minutes because of the traffic ....

So far I have yet to hear the fan - I expected to hear it a little today in the start and stop traffic .... but have not heard it since installing the TD-EOC.

Today was unloaded but very hot - I wish I could have taken some time off work and hitched up the 5th wheel - it would have been the perfect test ....

This weekend is the real test - 500 mile trip towing our fully loaded 5th wheel up I81 through some good grades in a notoriously hot area. We'll see what happens then - I'll be reporting the good, the bad and the ugly ;)

I may have to phone in to someone (and let them pass along the info early) as I probably won't have internet in most places I am travelling.

So far unloaded the TD-EOC is cooling my LLY noticeably compared to before the TD-EOC.

I do have one question about oil capacity for those others that have the TD-EOC installed: I filled with 12 quarts - dipstick read full - I did add an extra half quart because I thought the capacity should have been 12.5 to 13 quarts, but yesterday I got worried and drained 24 ounces - dipstick still reads full .... what are your capacities with the TD-EOC? Prior capacity of truck is 10 quarts .... I bought 3 gallons of oil (12 quarts) plus the 1/2 quart .....

Doug,
On my last oil change I checked the dipstick at 8 quarts and the dipstick read full. I added the additional 2 quarts and the dipstick reading barely moved. I dont know how the sump section of our pan is shaped, it doesnt make sense to me either.

D Lafleur,

Thanks for the info - I'll add the extra back in and not worry ....

There is some "drain back" from the EOC when you shut the truck down! Don't worry about the appearance of being "over filled."!

D Lafleur,

Thanks for the info - I'll add the extra back in and not worry ....

Is part of the EOC above the "Factory Level" in the pan?

Is there a path for the EOC to drain back to the pan when the truck is not pumping? Does the Mocal thermostat eliminate this?

Dmaxitol, I didnt forget about you. I have just been swamped here.

Hi All,

Today was my first towing experience with the TD-EOC. I went to pick up my 5th wheel from storage (our HOA does not allow me to keep it at my house for more than 2 weeks in a row - I can get around this by taking a weekend camping trip every two weeks ;)

In Maryland it was around 90 degrees - felt hotter .... very humid.

I hitched up the camper and proceeded to tow it on some town routes (near Ellicott City) - took it up some steep hills on the back roads - no inclines more than 1/2 mile .... and took it out I-70 towards my house. I had it hitchup up and towed for about an hour with the AC going full blast. Then I had my ritual of trying to back it up our somewhat curved/long narrow driveway .... thank goodness the AC was real cold - really needed it today.

I got no fan whatsoever, AC was ice cold, tranny stayed around 175 the whole time in the around town driving, and cooled down one notch on the highway. This was about 12 degrees below what I am used to seeing when the temps are around 80 degrees.

My ECT fluctuated between 195 and 203, never went past 203 and occasionally went to ~185 (all OEM ECT gauge.) Last time I took the same route it stayed on 203 the whole time and the AC was cool but not cold.

I consider this typical towing (~10Klbs since I did not have clothes, water, etc. loaded) on the relatively flat areas of central Maryland. Normally I would get a small amount of fan action in start/stop traffic towing, but got none today.

So far so good - I'll report more when we take our real trip next week.What differance does the EOC make on AC temps?? The condenser is in front of the Radiator and the CAC so why would that change??

Now I have some questions.

The dip stick will read " Full " with eight quarts of oil in the sump, and we are two quarts " Short " of normal sump capacity.

Question: when the dip stick reads one quart " Low ", are we in reality, " Three Quarts Low " ?

When the " Low Oil Warning " is seen, are we Four, Five or Six quarts low ?

With a TD-EOC's adding to oil capacity, there would be additional margin, IMO.

Now I have some questions.

The dip stick will read " Full " with eight quarts of oil in the sump, and we are two quarts " Short " of normal sump capacity.

Question: when the dip stick reads one quart " Low ", are we in reality, " Three Quarts Low " ?

That is what I am asking also. I let it sit for ten minutes with just 8 quarts and wiped the stick several times, it was right at full. I then added the last two quarts and let it sit, the level on the stick moved just slightly.

When the " Low Oil Warning " is seen, are we Four, Five or Six quarts low ?

With a TD-EOC's adding to oil capacity, there would be additional margin, IMO.

I agree adding oil volume to the equation only hurts at oil change time, any other time it is a benefit.

Hi Azmax,

"What differance does the EOC make on AC temps?? The condenser is in front of the Radiator and the CAC so why would that change??"

The tranny cooler is in front of the AC condenser .....

Hi Azmax,

"What differance does the EOC make on AC temps?? The condenser is in front of the Radiator and the CAC so why would that change??"

The tranny cooler is in front of the AC condenser .....Don't take this the wrong way.... Give me a break, that is a bit of a ssstttrrrrrrrreeeeeeeetttttcccccchhhhhhh. The condenser is 10x the size of that cooler. Plus the trans is controlled themostatically by the engine. Any reduction in trans temps (slight maybe) will have a very small effect on condensor exchange rates.

Let me guess, all of this "ice cold AC" testing is unloaded too. Why don't one of you guys with the EOC hook up a large load (90% or better of GVWR) and test with the EOC and report back on Engine Coolant Temps. Afterall, that is what we are all fighting.

Mike is a inteligent guy and is trying to make a good product, but the testing is not there. If his project is to hold water then it needs to be tested by a credable person hauling a credable load with favorable results. Selling poeple on "ice cold AC" is so far off the mark of this problem that it sadly only discredits his solution.

I think you all pissed off AZMAX!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

AZMAX,

I did not mean to be sarcastic - no offense taken - I too have wondered why the AC is cooler now ... the only two things I could think of are the tranny cooler (as I mentioned above) and the air dam that blocks the tow hook holes is forcing more air through the stack. Maybe the second item I mentioned is the culprit for the AC being cold. I do run with the 3" OEM extension so that basically blocks the bottom of the air dam.

As for towing with a load, go to post 31 on http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=89277&page=4

I will be doing more towing soon and I'll be reporting back ..... several thousand miles of towing my fully loaded 5th wheel with my family.

Let me guess, all of this "ice cold AC" testing is unloaded too. Why don't one of you guys with the EOC hook up a large load (90% or better of GVWR) and test with the EOC and report back on Engine Coolant Temps. Afterall, that is what we are all fighting.



That's what I am waiting for! I'll say it again... All this "testing" is on trucks that never overheated before, using a lot of mods like stack shields, stack seals , CAI and the like...

More, and cooler oil is a good thing ( except when it adds 12 bucks to every oil change) and the EOC probably does one heck of a job cooling it off... But to claim it is stopping OVERHEATING and gives Ice Cold Air is really sssrrrrrrrreeeeetttttcciiiiihnnnnnnngggggggggggg iiiiiiittttttttt!

This argument has been going on for months! People are getting baned and posts edited on a hourly basis!... ITS TIME TO PUT AN END TO IT!

If the EOC is all it's cracked up to be fine, lets really test it! Send a kit to Rick. He HAULS HEAVY is a great tester, friend to the DP and probably the most unbiased person on the forum! IF the EOC can make his truck stop overheating then ALL of us will be greatly pleased! Until then this is just another unproven product and not worth the oil it takes to fill it up.

Steve
I would not hold my breath waiting for mesquito to send anything out to Rick for testing.

AZMAX,

I did not mean to be sarcastic - no offense taken - I too have wondered why the AC is cooler now ... the only two things I could think of are the tranny cooler (as I mentioned above) and the air dam that blocks the tow hook holes is forcing more air through the stack. Maybe the second item I mentioned is the culprit for the AC being cold. I do run with the 3" OEM extension so that basically blocks the bottom of the air dam.

As for towing with a load, go to post 31 on http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=89277&page=4

I will be doing more towing soon and I'll be reporting back ..... several thousand miles of towing my fully loaded 5th wheel with my family.OK, lets just not try and say cold AC = good ECT.

Let us know how the tow goes. I want to hear about 5+ miles of foot to the floor hauling with no fan or rise in ECT:)

I believe the TD-EOC adds about 2.5 quarts. I might have gotten 2.75 quarts out if I let it drip a long time to drain the lines and thermostat, but probably closer to 2.6. This was measured by draining the EOC through the Fumoto after the install and catching in an empty gallon oil jug. With my FS-2500 micronic bypass filter, my total capacity is now 15 quarts at oil and filter(s) change. I have very happy oil now. :p:

Side note, there are numerous installs going on now/recently completed that will hopefully be giving tow-result information. I have only been towing fairly light boats lately and info is of little use except to say, as I have previously, that all temps are down 15-20 degrees with the EOC. I can absolutely say that this cooler takes a BIG slice of heat out of the cooling system, but I understand that more good towing data is needed. :)

there are numerous installs going on now/recently completed that will hopefully be giving tow-result information.

All:

I'd be willing to take a couple vacation days, do some before and after ECT data logging and report the results with a bone stock truck and a 15,000 lb 5'ver in tow in August. Is there an interested senior member in So Cal with the technical expertise and a data logger? :)

All:

I'd be willing to take a couple vacation days, do some before and after ECT data logging and report the results with a bone stock truck and a 15,000 lb 5'ver in tow in August. Is there an interested senior member in So Cal with the technical expertise and a data logger? :)

Thats what I like to hear! Thank you!

Is your truck an overheater?

As for towing with a load, go to post 31 on http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=89277&page=4



For some of us, this isnt a hard test. OAT @ 90* and low speeds.

This was my easy test. http://dieselplace.com/forum/showpost.php?p=1190337&postcount=797

I didnt really want to post how my V2 towing trip went with the little trailer, however due to the altitude(above 5000), the hours spent above 75 mph, and OAT above 96* for 10 hours in one direction, I went ahead and posted.

Thinking back the ECT of 208* that was recorded probably happened in Dallas, TX during the stopped traffic. The I35E had a bad wreck on the south bound side and the north bound lanes were parked to rubberneck. We were on the northbound side, checking out eye candy in a white vette. That is how I missed the 208* ):h

FYI about oil levels ... through the years, I've learned to not trust the dipstick on oil fills on any of my vehicles. Be sure to allow plenty of time to drain warm/hot oil out of your engine, then use the owners manual to determine oil fill capacities! The OEM knows the product specs and prints them for a reason - use that information. The dipstick is mearly a reference. Mike should have a specification about the EOC oil capacity. Add that amount to the owner's manual specifications for total oil fill.

On edit: I believe the "low" line on the dipstick says ADD, not 1 qt. low. Just a thought ...

About Rick running EOC testing, don't hold your breath. Even if a 3rd party provided the EOC for Rick to test, I doubt it would happen. Rick's a good guy. In my opinion, so is Mike. But they had quite a falling out and I don't think there is interest from either party to validate the EOC on Rick's trucks.

I agree EOC heavy tow testing needs to be done on a known overheater, not on a testbed that had no previous problems.

For the record, I will not be testing the EOC. It is not for the reason given by Jason though. KB (micheal) and I have had some rocky times, but are still talking somewhat. I will leave it at that.:)

Is your truck an overheater?

I agree EOC heavy tow testing needs to be done on a known overheater, not on a testbed that had no previous problems.

Hi Steve & Jason:

Is my truck an overheater? No. I may not be the best candidate to demonstrate the TD-EOC "cures over heat."

My interest is to perform a simple, structured test with a stock truck to obtain empirical data for ECT with and without the TD-EOC and report the data without conclusions.

The test I'm considering takes place on I15 at Cajon Pass. The test vehicle will be my truck and trailer, loaded to 22,000 GCW. The truck will be bone stock, with exception of the TD-EOC and associated mocal thermostat and air dam. Test 1 the TD-EOC will be disabled, Test 2 the TD-EOC will be enabled.

I welcome ideas regarding test method specifics! :)

That is a good start.

It would be great if you could borrow an EFI cable and log the runs.

Most important thing is to repeat the runs to back up your data. One shot info is not nearly as valid. Switching back and forth is the most useful since it allows the runs to catch as close as to the same conditions as possible.

I for one can get my truck to over heat and will be glad to test it.. I even have recorded data of previous tests and the equipment to log up to 10 different parameters... I can pile 4 people in the truck to act as observers and I'll even pay for the fuel!

Have KB send me the kit with his instructions for the install and the test will be performed and results published within two weeks. I'll even take it on a 400 mile road trip to some 6% and 7% grades on I-10..

It will be a fair and impartial test because I know we can get 4 Houston area DPers interested and willing to act as judges... I'll just furnish the truck, trailer, Diet Coke, Fuel and do the driving... Heck I'll even cut up the front of my truck if that's what it takes to get this argument behind us!

Then we can let the results speak for themselves, get on with our lives and hopefully have two proven fixes in the end...

Steve

For those members watching for performance reports from TD-EOC System Owners, be patient please. They have their priorities, families, jobs etc.; they will share when they have something to share.

For those members that have specific and/or personal test requirements, I recommend they Purchase a TD-EOC System and test until they have the data required.

To my knowledge, no one has solicited, equipment, drivers or fuel for testing.

FWIW.

For those members watching for performance reports from TD-EOC System Owners, be patient please. They have their priorities, families, jobs etc.; they will share when they have something to share.

For those members that have specific and/or personal test requirements, I recommend they Purchase a TD-EOC System and test until they have the data required.

To my knowledge, no one has solicited, equipment, drivers or fuel for testing.

FWIW.

So, you want some people to spend upwards of 1,000 dollars for all the bells and whistles, with no real testing to prove it? SERIOUSLY?

Why should people that consider buying them have to test to get their own data? That is the makers job to provide this kind of valuable information, is it not?

Come on guys, the EOC clan has had ample time to show real towing results for a long time. There are some DP'ers on here willing to offer a "hand" in the testing if some of you are too tied up with other priorities at the moment.

Again, please reconsider what I highlighted and underlined in the post. We, the customers, SHOULD NOT have to test a product that is supposed to do what you guys say it already does.

For those members that have specific and/or personal test requirements, I recommend they Purchase a TD-EOC System and test until they have the data required.

FWIW.

Believe me I would... But the manufacture will not back up his product with a guarantee that is worth the paper it is written on.

Come on now, 30 days from the day your receive it to install and really see if it cures overheating? What if it's only 75 or 80 degrees when you receive it and you can't take time off to pull your trailer. Even worse what if you buy it and it works great with your small trailer and you later buy a trailer that is heaver than 10,000 pounds or has a bedroom slide that increases the height of the front profile? You "may" have just spent a thousand bucks on a great oil cooler and still have an overheating duramax. With a thirty day guarantee you "may" never know until it's too late!

I believe a product that cost around a 1000.00 dollars should at least have a 90 day money back guarantee. Don't you?

I say let's really test this dude and get it over with!

How about this.... We set up an account on eBay and I use their escrow service.. I buy one of the EOC's off of KB through EBAY, send them the money and if it does not work out and fails the test I purposed in the above post, EBay sends the money back, KB gets his equipment back and we get on with life.

The 4 judges decide whether if it performs as claimed ( Eliminates Overheating) and if KB gets his money..

Then all the cheerleaders can retire to their sides, people will know if the product works and things can get back to normal around here...

Your talking about GM, right ?

I see the same doubters are back! 30 days this time of year is plenty to see if you like what The EOC does! The supplier is not the hard a$$ he's made out to be by some. Just ask him! If you have some hard ship that delays the installation, just pass the information. He is a great communicator and will understand and make the necessary adjustments. I know, I'm a hard sucker to please myself, with the schedule and routing I have, my install was put off several times! The testing info is out there, yes low tech, but done the way most would do it. Meaning, hook up a load and go! If there are no problems now where there were before, I call that a success! How about a little remedial stuff now? How does the EOC make the tranny and A/C run cooler? The tranny cooler lines run to the RAD 1st, then to the external cooler. If the temps inside the RAD are cooler so is the tranny! The EOC helps this by pulling heat out of the coolant at the internal oil cooler, and does this very well, an average of at least 20* from what I've seen! Verified also by the "other users" cooler tranny temps, it will be more under harsher circumstances. Testing has shown that there tends to be a "recycling effect" of air flow from the back of the RAD (fan) to the front of the truck. Stand in front of your truck when it's hot and the fans running, it blows hot air everywhere, especially where it shouldn't. This phenomena still happens with the EOC, However the temps are much lower as heat is now expelled harmlessly under the truck, It helps the A/C condenser in this way to be more efficient. Also the temps at the external tranny cooler are down, another benefit before it sends it's exhaust down stream. It works, really really really well.

Your talking about GM, right ?

No sir ,, talking about the same guy we have been talking about for 7 months now... KB

I see the same doubters are back! 30 days this time of year is plenty to see if you like what The EOC does! The supplier is not the hard a$$ he's made out to be by some. Just ask him! If you have some hard ship that delays the installation, just pass the information. He is a great communicator and will understand and make the necessary adjustments. I know, I'm a hard sucker to please myself, with the schedule and routing I have, my install was put off several times! The testing info is out there, yes low tech, but done the way most would do it. Meaning, hook up a load and go! If there are no problems now where there were before, I call that a success! How about a little remedial stuff now? How does the EOC make the tranny and A/C run cooler? The tranny cooler lines run to the RAD 1st, then to the external cooler. If the temps inside the RAD are cooler so is the tranny! The EOC helps this by pulling heat out of the coolant at the internal oil cooler, and does this very well, an average of at least 20* from what I've seen! Verified also by the "other users" cooler tranny temps, it will be more under harsher circumstances. Testing has shown that there tends to be a "recycling effect" of air flow from the back of the RAD (fan) to the front of the truck. Stand in front of your truck when it's hot and the fans running, it blows hot air everywhere, especially where it shouldn't. This phenomena still happens with the EOC, However the temps are much lower as heat is now expelled harmlessly under the truck, It helps the A/C condenser in this way to be more efficient. Also the temps at the external tranny cooler are down, another benefit before it sends it's exhaust down stream. It works, really really really well.


I am really glad your happy... Really! Now I want to be as happy as you are..
Last trip I got a coolant hot warning and shut it down... My fan is killing my MPG and I am sick and tired of the fan. My monitored testing shows the stack shrouds to only help 2% at the very best and that was with a CAI installed.

The only thing I can say is look down below you... Your mod list is a mile long with products that cost good money to buy, time to install and even with all those products your truck still rose to 240 degrees and was climbing..

I just don't want to pay a thousand bucks to someone then turn around and buy his 350.00 shroud kit, then his CAI and then cut the front of a good truck up just to get the same results you did. IF I wanted all that other stuff and pulled a low profile light weight fiver I might consider it for the benifits of the cooler oil... But I don't I have a heavy trailer.

I have offered a fair test, even offered to pay for the mod, if it's held in escrow. This test would prove once and for all if it works or not.

We can even call it Put up or Shut up 3 if you like :)

This is exactly why I couldn't wait any longer for results. I wasn't about to go through another summer with over 18,000 pounds combined weight (truck and trailer) puking coolant like I had done before. It was absolutely no fun and not my idea of a "good RVing time" under any circumstances. Problem is now solved and I'm not even sure if GM has yet admitted to any problem!

I still have to chuckle at why one would try and solve a water cooled engine's OH issues by going after the oil. I'm not saying that cool oil isn't a bad idea, it is just not the primary cooling system.

We, the customers, SHOULD NOT have to test a product that is supposed to do what you guys say it already does.

Then all the cheerleaders can retire to their sides, people will know if the product works and things can get back to normal here...

I still have to chuckle at why one would try and solve a water cooled engine's OH issues by going after the oil.

You guys are keeping me up way past my bed time; Mrs. stevebos is not happy with me right now! ):h

I have two statements:

1. We all share a common interest; the Duramax. Many of us own a LLY and are concerned about it's tendency to over heat under
severe conditions.

2. I think we all believe it is a valid concern that a new product be demonstrated to function as claimed before one purchases the product.

and two requests:

1. Some of us wish to share our experiences with the TD-EOC. I'll provide ECT data for baseline and with TD-EOC scenarios as accurately as I'm able . Members may draw their own conclusion about the TD-EOC's effectiveness. Let me know your ideas regarding test method specifics! :)

2. Please... Let's keep Mark's thread constructive and not engage in an us versus them or cheerleading discussion. :thumb:

We're all Duramax enthusiasts, not radiator / oil cooler enthusiasts! :beerchug:

OK guys. Lets see if we can get both sides to ease up a little here. Steve's got a good speech there. :)

The EOC helps this by pulling heat out of the coolant at the internal oil cooler, and does this very well, an average of at least 20* from what I've seen!

I believe the bulk of that 20* in the ECT is the oil not unloading its temp into the stock oil/coolant heat exchanger. The EOC removes heat from the oil, that oil then doesnt unload that amount of heat to the coolant.

There has been no data published to date with a significant enough temp. differantial (oil vs. coolant) to convince me that the oil will "cool" the coolant in the factory oil/coolant heat exchanger. The volumes of each fluid also do not support this as an effective means of removing the heat from the coolant.

Testing has shown that there tends to be a "recycling effect" of air flow from the back of the RAD (fan) to the front of the truck. Stand in front of your truck when it's hot and the fans running, it blows hot air everywhere, especially where it shouldn't. This phenomena still happens with the EOC, However the temps are much lower as heat is now expelled harmlessly under the truck, It helps the A/C condenser in this way to be more efficient. Also the temps at the external tranny cooler are down, another benefit before it sends it's exhaust down stream. It works, really really really well.

The additional air mods (dam) that are installed during the EOC install contribute to the overall cooling benefit the users are seeing, specifically the tranny and A/C. With better airflow through the stack the CAC and Rad will also run cooler.


For clarity, I am not saying the EOC does not help or solve the overheat issue. The coolant no longer has to remove the heat from the oil, that in itself will make significant improvements. The EOC is part of a kit, that kit also includes air flow improvements, the entire kit is what is being sold as a solution.

I am really glad your happy... Really! Now I want to be as happy as you are.. ...(snip)...
Swatkins - No offense, but if you are so pressed for a solution and so concerned about how the EOC will or will not work for you, why not just get the V2 and be done? It's run it's paces on known OHers with good results. My $0.02.
I still have to chuckle at why one would try and solve a water cooled engine's OH issues by going after the oil. I'm not saying that cool oil isn't a bad idea, it is just not the primary cooling system.
Oilbrnr - it's not so much a water cooled issue as it is a heat load issue. The engine's combustion heat is dumped in four places - coolant, engine oil, exhaust and radiated to the air surrounding the engine. We're not going to be able to make many gains removing heat from the exhaust where it matters most which is where the coolant is exposed to the exhaust port walls (and besides, you want that heat energy there for the turbo). How about pushing air past the engine faster to cool it? ... that's the "remove the splash shield" method to help vacate hot underhood air which is not adequate. IMHO, I don't think we'll be able to ever find a way to move enough air in the engine bay to adequately air cool the engine. That leaves the two fluid medias to remove the heat - oil and coolant. Either heat extraction method should work if the heat exchangers (radiators) are sized correctly and have adequate air flow and fluid flow. Make sense?

You guys are keeping me up way past my bed time; Mrs. stevebos is not happy with me right now! ):h

I have two statements:

1. We all share a common interest; the Duramax. Many of us own a LLY and are concerned about it's tendency to over heat under
severe conditions.

2. I think we all believe it is a valid concern that a new product be demonstrated to function as claimed before one purchases the product.

and two requests:

1. Some of us wish to share our experiences with the TD-EOC. I'll provide ECT data for baseline and with TD-EOC scenarios as accurately as I'm able . Members may draw their own conclusion about the TD-EOC's effectiveness. Let me know your ideas regarding test method specifics! :)

2. Please... Let's keep Mark's thread constructive and not engage in an us versus them or cheerleading discussion. :thumb:

We're all Duramax enthusiasts, not radiator / oil cooler enthusiasts! :beerchug:

Stevebos - :exactly: I couldn't have put it better. Thanks for saying it! ... let's get back on task here. I'd love to hear more TD-EOC stories. Especially ones concerning those who tow HEAVY and have had OH problems prior to install ... and now have the problem fixed. Any specific supporting data is always a welcome addition.

Swatkins - No offense, but if you are so pressed for a solution and so concerned about how the EOC will or will not work for you, why not just get the V2 and be done? It's run it's paces on known OHers with good results. My $0.02.

Oilbrnr - it's not so much a water cooled issue as it is a heat load issue. The engine's combustion heat is dumped in four places - coolant, engine oil, exhaust and radiated to the air surrounding the engine. We're not going to be able to make many gains removing heat from the exhaust where it matters most which is where the coolant is exposed to the exhaust port walls (and besides, you want that heat energy there for the turbo). How about pushing air past the engine faster to cool it? ... that's the "remove the splash shield" method to help vacate hot underhood air which is not adequate. IMHO, I don't think we'll be able to ever find a way to move enough air in the engine bay to adequately air cool the engine. That leaves the two fluid medias to remove the heat - oil and coolant. Either heat extraction method should work if the heat exchangers (radiators) are sized correctly and have adequate air flow and fluid flow. Make sense?



Stevebos - :exactly: I couldn't have put it better. Thanks for saying it! ... let's get back on task here. I'd love to hear more TD-EOC stories. Especially ones concerning those who tow HEAVY and have had OH problems prior to install ... and now have the problem fixed. Any specific supporting data is always a welcome addition.

That is what we've been waiting on for months, but to no avail, nothing in concrete yet. This would all be over if what you said would happen, plain and simple. The reason its becoming a pissing match again is b/c The EOC boys' are claiming victory (again) with no real proof (again).

All this about my Cooler Running LLY is unloaded or with a minimal load on our trucks. People that are truly interested in this want one thing, and one thing only... HARD DATA.

P.S. Moderators, not trying to start anything, just my .02.:D

That is what we've been waiting on for months, but to no avail, nothing in concrete yet. This would all be over if what you said would happen, plain and simple. The reason its becoming a pissing match again is b/c The EOC boys' are claiming victory (again) with no real proof (again).

All this about my Cooler Running LLY is unloaded or with a minimal load on our trucks. People that are truly interested in this want one thing, and one thing only... HARD DATA.

P.S. Moderators, not trying to start anything, just my .02.:D

Ditto!

Especially the PS...:)

One thing I would add is that they tow heavy with a full front high RV like mine.. .It's 13'8 tall and has a front end shaped like a brick.. Weight alone is not enough to say "Thermal Dominance - Ends Overheating Completely!"

I would really love this issue be put to rest... Hard feelings, distrust and anger are a true distraction and not needed here..

I would much rather discuss the fact that my 05 doesn't not have a hood, foot well or glove box light! :)

That is what we've been waiting on for months, but to no avail, nothing in concrete yet. This would all be over if what you said would happen, plain and simple. The reason its becoming a pissing match again is b/c The EOC boys' are claiming victory (again) with no real proof (again).

All this about my Cooler Running LLY is unloaded or with a minimal load on our trucks. People that are truly interested in this want one thing, and one thing only... HARD DATA.

P.S. Moderators, not trying to start anything, just my .02.:D

Please view post #31 (as has already been stated once) ... I believe Mark is working to provide some hauling info. I'm sure he'll report once his trip is complete. Please be patient. If there is something specific you wish to see for data, please make note of it and maybe he can accommodate you.

There is always the V2 option. Any reason you (swatkins and turBeau) haven't proceeded down that path rather than flaming the EOC guys for their posts? Is there something you don't like about the V2 and are continuing to wait on the EOC results? If you need results now and you tow HEAVY, why not call KB and work something out. You can choose to contribute to the testing effort you're requesting (I would offer, but I haven't had any OH issues and I simply don't own or know anyone with a trailer large and heavy enough for adequate testing.). My conversations with KB have lead me to believe he is not the hard @$$ & bad-guy this forum has, at times, made him out to be. I'm sure if you're courteous, you can work out a "test and return if not satisfied" deal with him. Just a thought if it's that important to you.

...(snip)... I would much rather discuss the fact that my 05 doesn't not have a hood, foot well or glove box light! :)
Well, our trucks don't have any of those ... not much to discuss.;)

Hey, no hard feelings here ... hope none there either. Like you, I wish the data we're looking for was available (there is some, but not the the extent you, I and others had hoped for). I don't think we'll get it without someone stepping up. KB may have something more refined for data recently, has anyone asked him and relayed the information on (I know he can't post). Where's JJ when you need him?

Please view post #31 (as has already been stated once) ... I believe Mark is working to provide some hauling info. I'm sure he'll report once his trip is complete. Please be patient. If there is something specific you wish to see for data, please make note of it and maybe he can accommodate you.

There is always the V2 option. Any reason you (swatkins and turBeau) haven't proceeded down that path rather than flaming the EOC guys for their posts? Is there something you don't like about the V2 and are continuing to wait on the EOC results? If you need results now and you tow HEAVY, why not call KB and work something out. You can choose to contribute to the testing effort you're requesting (I would offer, but I haven't had any OH issues and I simply don't own or know anyone with a trailer large and heavy enough for adequate testing.). My conversations with KB have lead me to believe he is not the hard @$$ & bad-guy this forum has, at times, made him out to be. I'm sure if you're courteous, you can work out a "test and return if not satisfied" deal with him. Just a thought if it's that important to you.

Now that you bring it up,, ,I did call KB,, In fact twice... I found him to be evasive and not wanting to answer my questions, 1 about what happens in a overheat condition where the coolant is lost and the temp of the engine goes above the 284 degree mo-cal limit and does damage to the thermostat... and 2 what would happen if I found my truck still overheated, his reply, on the phone was "that won't happen".

Then to top it off he said "my product is not for your application and I will not sell it to you." Or words to that effect... Why is it not for my application? I have a 05 lly that is overheating... Is it because I have a high profile 5er tow over 14,000 lbs and don't have all his other products installed? I don't know he would not say....

So I am not "flaming the EOC guys for their posts?" I am asking valid questions of people that support the product after failing to get answers from a guy that is selling a product that says " Thermal Dominance - Ends Overheating Completely!"

As I have said elsewhere I am not saying the EOC will not work or have positive benefits to the engine life and oil temps. I am still open minded, its the evasive answers to the questions I am sceptical of.

In an effort to end the debate and get on with things I have proposed a fair test... I could go ahead an make a cooler exactly like his and install it, the parts are easy to get, but it would not be the same and I would not post anything like that because it would be unfair to KB...

NO flaming here,,,, Just valid questions....



PS.. I know we don't have the lights,,, ANYMORE,,, that's the thing that bugs me :)

Swatkins,


Suggestions are welcome .... I can guarantee if someone does have problems with the TD-EOC - they will report it and all will hear.

Here is an easy one... I know a guy that has made up a seperate ECT gauge and sensor.. He was able to purchase a small pipe that fit into the upper rad hose and had a fitting that accepted his temp probe...

A setup like that should not cost too much and would give you your real temps and not the ones from that Lying gauge! I have proof that mine is at least 24 degrees off of what the computer says it is...

I still get upset eveytime I think of what GM is doing to us :mad: Dumbing down that gauge to give us a false sence of security is low down... Things like that make it hard to trust anyone nowdays!

I don't know swatkins, I think the cats outta the bag! LOL. Months of data printed here. None of it good enough for ya. The V-2 supplier is just down your street, you could solve your problem today Ole buddy! But if ya want an EOC I'll try to get ya one. It wont be easy, but I'm pretty good. LOL. Your whining days here can be over, if you choose! My money is on the continued, "oh, woe is me, wont somebody hep me." Oh, this too is not a "flame job." LOL.

if really there are 2 solutions like you guys say about the oil cooler and the rad V2 then i would like to see the evidence like these guys are asking like when i get anything i look at the competition and then i decide i dont buy by going what the one has proven and rumors about the other why is it so hard to get the several that have fixed there trucks from overheating with this oil cooler to tell there story here??????? summer is going by different options are nice to have if there really are different options but prove it. thanks. jonathon.

DzlFool, you seem to be all over the overheating issue with only 4 posts. Can you start a thread and tell us about your experience's with your truck and overheating. We would like to get to know you better. The Introductions forum will work. Thanks!:)

This still boggles my mind.:confused:

It appears to me that perhaps your truck is not as much of a problem or I would have expected you to have "Fixed it" by now.

Are you trying to fix your truck or are you trying to discredit the TD-EOC?

If you don't feel that the available data and/or the warranty on the TD-EOC is adequate enough for you to get it, why don't you get the V2 radiator kit and be done with it. The V2 is an excellent solution and has already been tested by Rick and he is reporting that he is satisfied with it.

Now that you bring it up,, ,I did call KB,, In fact twice... I found him to be evasive and not wanting to answer my questions, 1 about what happens in a overheat condition where the coolant is lost and the temp of the engine goes above the 284 degree mo-cal limit and does damage to the thermostat... and 2 what would happen if I found my truck still overheated, his reply, on the phone was "that won't happen".

Then to top it off he said "my product is not for your application and I will not sell it to you." Or words to that effect... Why is it not for my application? I have a 05 lly that is overheating... Is it because I have a high profile 5er tow over 14,000 lbs and don't have all his other products installed? I don't know he would not say....

Apparently, you two don't seem to get along. With that said, why would anyone want to cooperate with someone who appears to be looking for ways to discredit him? I don't think I would!

On the other hand, why would I want to buy something from someone that I can't seem to trust? - Not me!

So I am not "flaming the EOC guys for their posts?" I am asking valid questions of people that support the product after failing to get answers from a guy that is selling a product that says " Thermal Dominance - Ends Overheating Completely!"

As I have said elsewhere I am not saying the EOC will not work or have positive benefits to the engine life and oil temps. I am still open minded, its the evasive answers to the questions I am sceptical of.

So far I have not been able to find anything reported to date about the TD-EOC that has been able to satisfy your high standards for product validation. (That's OK - Everyone has very legitimate reasons for their own requirements before they spend their hard earned cash) Again, if you are having so much trouble overheating your truck, why not get the one solution that you feel has already been proven and be done with it?

In an effort to end the debate and get on with things I have proposed a fair test... I could go ahead an make a cooler exactly like his and install it, the parts are easy to get, but it would not be the same and I would not post anything like that because it would be unfair to KB...

Why does there even have to be an on going debate? Those running the V2 are reporting good results. The people that are running the TD-EOC appear to be happy with it; but their reported results to date don't seem to satisfy you requirements.

What will you do if somehow you were to determine that the TD-EOC will not fix your problem? Would you then get the V2 solution? Why not skip all the frustrations and fix your truck with what you already "trust" to be a good solution?

--I consider myself very fortunate, because I am not experiencing any overheating problems to date. However, if and when I do experience overheating, I know where there are two very good but different solutions for the problem and I will get the one that best satisfies my needs. Then I'll go on enjoying my truck.

I can then go on to talking about the "underhood light" or whatever else might be a good topic at the time.:D

NO flaming here,,,, Just valid questions....
NO flaming intended here either.... I'm just trying to understand the apparent criticism of everyone who posts good results with the TD-EOC.

I think both products are excellent products. But they obviously are not for everyone. They never will be! :exactly:

2. Please... Let's keep Mark's thread constructive and not engage in an us versus them or cheerleading discussion. :thumb:

We're all Duramax enthusiasts, not radiator / oil cooler enthusiasts! :beerchug:

I know; it's lame to quote yourself! ):h

This would be a lot more fun if we were all sitting around the same table with a couple pitchers! Common, guys...

My personal gripe with all of the posts favoring the TD-EOC is the almost complete lack of data to back anything up. In fact, chloeourdog is one of the few members who have posted any numbers regarding his experiences with the EOC (post #31, this thread). There was a certain beer-drinking cat who posted about remarkable results, and how the EOC was going to be the solution of everyone's OH problems, but even he didn't post any meaningful results. Instead, we got cute anecdotes and teasing about his $15 OH cures.

I personally like the idea of cooler oil. I like the design of the TD-EOC. I am concerned about the V2 implementation, in that it gives us a downward-facing radiator that may be susceptible to damage (my opinion only). From the purely physical designs, the EOC appears to me to be a bit more stout and compact than the V2.

But without meaningful results being posted, the TD-EOC cheerleading squads just aren't going to convince me that this is a viable solution. I don't think it can be discredited, simply because (other than the post by chloeourdog) there hasn't been much posted that has given it any credit in the first place.

Joseph

My personal gripe with all of the posts favoring the TD-EOC is the almost complete lack of data to back anything up. In fact, chloeourdog is one of the few members who have posted any numbers regarding his experiences with the EOC (post #31, this thread). There was a certain beer-drinking cat who posted about remarkable results, and how the EOC was going to be the solution of everyone's OH problems, but even he didn't post any meaningful results. Instead, we got cute anecdotes and teasing about his $15 OH cures.

I personally like the idea of cooler oil. I like the design of the TD-EOC. I am concerned about the V2 implementation, in that it gives us a downward-facing radiator that may be susceptible to damage (my opinion only).

After installing one on a truck, I would disagree with you on susceptible to damage. It is less suscptible than our A/C or tranny cooler. However our stock radiator is very well protected, that is why it isnt very efficient for it's size.

From the purely physical designs, the EOC appears to me to be a bit more stout and compact than the V2.

I will not comment on the EOC, I havent seen one in person.


But without meaningful results being posted, the TD-EOC cheerleading squads just aren't going to convince me that this is a viable solution. I don't think it can be discredited, simply because (other than the post by chloeourdog) there hasn't been much posted that has given it any credit in the first place.

Joseph

Just my opinion.

PS I liked the beer drinking cat.

Colnago,

I do have a concern about the TD-EOC being vulnerable to rocks and other items that may fly up and hit it. That said, it is recessed a fair amount and I have recently noticed that a large number of other vehicles have open areas at the same height with unobstructed or unprotected radiators/heat exchangers. That is why I started the thread asking for ideas to build a grill of sorts for the opening I cut in my lower valence. It would take a heck of a blow to dent the EOC - it is very sturdy .... but I still worry.

Again, I will be providing ECT (OEM), tranny temps (OEM) and fan running time related to my upcoming camping trip. I'll also report OAT, wind direction relative to the vehicle (not sure how to determine wind speed - but will report relative strength.) I'll also report any other related issues/observations that may come up.

My 5th wheel has the following dimensions:
Height 12'9", Length 32'6" (actual), weight 11,324 lbs (Cat scale, determined after subtracting prior truck weight) - camper fully loaded with 1/3 tank water.

My route will be from Baltimore, MD up I83 to I81 all the way to Wellesley Island State Park, NY. I will be returning through I87 and the Adirondacks.

For the record, last summer driving 65 mph up I81 (truck completely stock, ~2K on odometer) towing the same camper (but somewhat less loaded than this year) I hit 235 on the OEM gauge multiple times, OAT was between 90 degrees and 98 degrees, fan ran full bore after ~ 1 mile into each climb and continued for 3-5 miles on the down sides. Tranny temps were 200 while on flat ground and would climb to ~215 to 220 on grade climbs.

My current modifications are: TD-EOC with Mocal and air dam, CAI (gasser one with extra hole and shrouds isolating airflow to headlight area), KB Shroud kit and Stack Seal kit, 3" OEM air dam extension, edge EZ running in level 1. I also flushed the coolant and changed from Dexcool to Zerex G05 Gold, also replaced cap.

I am unable/unwilling to remove these other mods for this trip (would not want to) so I am aware some will argue about whatever results I do get .... apples/oranges, etc ;) I don't care though - I'll provide whatever I observe :) My intention is not to persuade, I am just here to share my own information so others can be maybe a little better informed. It is not my intention to compete with those that tow for a living - they have my utmost respect. I am providing the perspective of one that tows a typical 5th wheel during the summer with an LLY Duramax.

I am not here to argue or compete with those that have more knowledge, test equipment, heavier feet, larger loads, etc.

Mark,

Excellent! This is exactly the type of info I'm looking for! Personally, I don't care whatever other mods you are using; I think the testing results will still be worthwhile, as long as you have the same mods before and after the addition of the EOC. What I want are driving conditions (OAT, wind, hills, etc), loads (height would be great, but weight is a must), ECT, tranny temps, speeds, fan engagement, and so forth. State all of this before and after adding the EOC. I know you can't control Mother Nature, so your driving conditions may be different between runs, but if you let us know that, then I feel the data is still relevant.

If you (or anyone else) can give us some before-and-after experiences (i.e., numbers), then I can judge for myself whether or not the EOC (or V2, or any other mod) will do me any good. I don't have an 11K-lb fifth wheel; fully loaded, my travel trailer barely hits 8K. But if I can see the benefit of how the OH mod helped you (or others), then I am better able to judge how (or if) it will help me.

I eagerly await your testing results.

Joseph

IIRC from a conversation with KB, the leading edges of the tubes and the tanks are 1/8" thick. If you have ever seen a normal radiator's, or other heat exchanger, tubes that is probably 3 times thicker!

That no good beer drinking cat is in rehab now! Plans to go back and live with her mother in Houston TX. when she gets out! We expect a full recovery, and thanks for asking. LOL

it really ez dude, i love my truck but in the summer I hatw my truck the fan runs allways even without towing but for sure when towing. the fan might be running right now with the truck dead in the garage not suprise me. dealer tells me this is normal the job of the fan is to cool but I call bull but dealer wont do nothin. google overheating duramax lly get me here to this nice site, take away the summers and i would not be here cause other than the dumb fan I love my truck it is awesome and the best truck ever. now there are two so called solutions but maybe they arent but the oil one seems easy or to do. thanks. jonathon.

Mark,

Thank you for posting about your experience with the TD-EOC. You appear to be quite happy so far with your purchase.

We aknowledge that you are NOT obligated to post anything about your experience with this kit. However, you have been gracious enough to post about your experiences and this is very much appreciated...

Obviously, yours is not a true comparison test because, to my knowledge, you have never tried or reported on any of the other "major fixes" that are being proposed. But your results are very relevant.

You say that your truck is not an "overheater" simply because you have not seen the temperatures that other heavy hauler have experienced. However, several of the "OH Gurus" in this forum have insisted that ALL 2004 & 2005 LLY's are overheaters given the right circumstances. So based on that assumption, your results are very relevant to evaluating this OH fix and very much appreciated.

Thanks again for posting about your experience to date with the TD-EOC. We are looking forward to your results after your heavy towing this weekend.

One question: Is yours just the basic kit or did you also get the optional thermostat kit?

Thanks.

Hi RayMich,

The TD-EOC kit I purchased has the following options:

Mocal Thermostat
Air Dam (covers tow hook holes and extends below TD-EOC - although my 3" OEM extension extends the same amount below the TD-EOC....)
First upgrade of lines (not the teflon ones though)
Fumoto drain valve

From this point on lets ALL try not to flame the fire here. Any member of this site is allowed to participate and ask questions. Lets just discuss the technical aspects and testing of the cooler here. Thanks!

Mark,

This may be a dumb question, but here goes. Why did you decide on the Mocal thermostat? Or maybe I should ask, did you ever consider buying the kit without this option? Technically, I understand what the thermostat is doing, but I don't really understand why anyone would buy the EOC without the thermostat. To me, it's the same as installing a radiator without a thermostat (or, in our case, two thermostats), and it could cause the engine to take longer to get to operating temp.

Has anyone else opted to use the EOC without the Mocal thermostat, and why? Is it a good thing to always be cooling the oil?

On a side note to D Lafleur and Turbotug: thanks for your input on the robustness of the V2 and EOC kits.

Thanks,

Joseph

I'm the one who first tested the Td-eoc back in april under heavy tow conditions. keep in mind that the cooler KB and I used was a prototype. He has made them more efficient now and the coulplings that we used at the time restricted flow somewhere around 30%. What I'm trying to say is that the product now is much better now.

My truck is 04.5lly GMC crewcab 4x4 drw.It has all the cooling mods except any coolers. banks catback exaust,edge/***, ATS tranny work.booststick,egr blocker plate,and preditor .( sorry for spelling).

For the test I was towing a 34' weekend warrior that weighed in around 15k. The test took place on the 87. The road to and from Payson. We did the test on the Rye hill heading into the valley( The big bastard). we first did the hill with the EOC hooked up and I was full throttle in 4th gear maybe 50-60mph at 3200rpm all the way up the hill. I can't remember exact numbers but I think the ect's were around 238-240 and my tranny around 200. After the hill we turnred around and went back to the start of the hill at a rest stop next to Roosevelt lake turn off and dicconected the EOC . We then went back up the hill at the same rate of speed and settings. This time I hit 258 ect's half way up the hill and tranny close to the red.

Keep in mind this was a prototype cooler and the production ones are much better. and yes it was only 90degrees out but my truck doesn't care what the ambient temp is.It will OH just looking at a hill.

Thats the best my memory can do.

I'm not running the thermostat at this time. It's kind of a fail safe system. As the coolant and oil systems are joined, the coolant has the ability to warm the oil if needed, controlled by the coolant thermostat. The EOC without the mocal in the summer is not a big deal. Ask any one with an EOC how hot it gets and it does it "right now, with or without. The thermal load (chill) would be too great in the winter though, so I do plan to install the mocal this fall!:ro)

The adapter housing has a bi-metalic type of t-stat built into it. However, it never completely bypasses the cooler when cold, just kinda adds a path with less resistance to flow. IIRC this is removed with the Mocal upgrade.

Hi Colnago,

Turbotug gave the best answer - the Mocal will either be fully bypassed when cold and will force full flow through the EOC when the oil temp passes about 190 degrees. Since I live in Maryland and we have cold weather sometimes (0-5 degrees above zero) I thought the Mocal would be best for providing normal warmup times on cold days.

I did consider buying the base kit - and it took me a long time to decide on getting the Mocal. I initially had concerns about the wax stat and the max temp it could handle, but after asking enough questions I found out it is very easy to replace the wax stat - Mocal housing comes apart with 4 bolts, and to date none have failed in this application. If it failed, it would fail closed/bypass and the TD-EOC would not be doing its job - the EOC would never got hot.

The pricing may have changed since I purchased my EOC (I got mine the week of July 4th) - but when I purchased the Mocal, first upgrade of lines and the airdam I saved a fair amount (package price discount)

That no good beer drinking cat is in rehab now! Plans to go back and live with her mother in Houston TX. when she gets out! We expect a full recovery, and thanks for asking. LOL

DMAXOTOL,

Did you let that Drunk Cat take your Keyboard to Rehab. :(

Sham; Shame; No Respect. ):h

LOL. The cats in rehab not me! To hot down here not to have a few cold ones! Excuse me while I stagger back to the ice chest!;) Here bubba, hold my 50 cal a minute!

Info on Marks trip, sent in today, forwarded for your info......


"7-23-06
Mark called me today, after leaving for his 3 week adventure. GCVW is approx 20,000 lbs, representing a bit heavier load than he had in last years warm weather.

He stated this trip is the same trip/roads he did last year, where he encountered 235+ ECT temps, high tranny temps, and constant fan operations, the Pennsylvania Mtns, near Wilkes Barre. Asked what his response was to 235 last year, he "backed out of it". He has 8 hours, 400 miles into this trip. Ambient temps have been no higher than 80 degrees to this point, where last year, they were 10 degrees higher. Speeds in the the 65-75 mph range.
Here is what he reports, transcribed from written notes:
Oil Temp: no oil temp gauge installed, but pressure is "up"
Transmission: stays mostly in the 150-160 range. Peaked at 175 in one excursion.
ECT: there have been no excursions from normal on the factory gauge, approximately 203 peak.
Fan: Fan ran for 30 seconds when leaving home (morning sickness), has not come on since, in the last 400 miles of climbs.
Mileage: 10.6-11.6 avg (not sure what that represents as an improvement)
Overall improvement with TD-EOC/Mocal/Ground feed air dam: Dramatichttp://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/04.gif

I realize there are others wanting this information, someone please feel free to send this along. He will be updating as time goes on, and I will pass along his reports. If there is anything more specific anyone wants, let me know, I will ask. We will be getting more severe conditions hopefully soon. I am particularly interested in just how much duty cycle the TD-EOC adds."


If ok with moderators, we will forward more of Marks results, good or bad. -Bret

Why do people still rely on the factory gauge when most of us on this site know it reads FALSE.

What was his 203* recorded with? Does he have Auto Enginuity or what?

The hottest OAT he's seen so far is 80*? :cool:

Can you explain what "TD-EOC/Mocal/Ground feed air dam" means?

Is he using TcChristopher's V2 cooling system, or something else entirely?

Anxiously awaiting your reply..........

"Oil Temp: no oil temp gauge installed, but pressure is up."

I wonder why Marks oil pressure is up. What would cause that?

"Oil Temp: no oil temp gauge installed, but pressure is up."

I wonder why Marks oil pressure is up. What would cause that?


Thicker oil possibly or different brand.

"Oil Temp: no oil temp gauge installed, but pressure is up."

I wonder why Marks oil pressure is up. What would cause that?

Cooler oil is more resistant to flow this equals more oil pressure

Can you explain what "TD-EOC/Mocal/Ground feed air dam" means?

Is he using TcChristopher's V2 cooling system, or something else entirely?

Anxiously awaiting your reply..........

He's using Killerbee's TD-EOC (Turbo Diesel Engine Oil Cooler). The Mocal is a thermostat for blocking off flow to the EOC when the oil temps are too low. The air dam goes below the truck. I don't know too much about this, but I am guessing that it helps increase the airflow through the EOC. This is a very basic summary, so if it doesn't answer what you were asking, a search will turn up about a zillion posts on it.

TxC's V2 mod is an extra radiator, and is a completely different method for cooling down the Duramax. Again, there are a zillion posts on the forum for this one, too.

Hope this helps,

Joseph

Oil Temp: no oil temp gauge installed, but pressure is "up"
Transmission: stays mostly in the 150-160 range. Peaked at 175 in one excursion.
ECT: there have been no excursions from normal on the factory gauge, approximately 203 peak.
Fan: Fan ran for 30 seconds when leaving home (morning sickness), has not come on since, in the last 400 miles of climbs.
Mileage: 10.6-11.6 avg (not sure what that represents as an improvement)
Overall improvement with TD-EOC/Mocal/Ground feed air dam: Dramatichttp://us.i1.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/i/mesg/tsmileys2/04.gif




Mother Nature isnt in our test plans, however all of us heavy haulers will not confuse results with different OATs. My truck could tow the world up Pike's Peak at 60* and couldn't tow the trailer on flat ground without the fan at 95*.

How do you average fuel consumption and get a range?

I wish he gets a little OAT temp, if he could get 90*, he would have last years conditions.

Good Luck

Darin

How do you average fuel consumption and get a range?

Good Luck

Darin

Sum of the iterations divided by the number of iterations = Average.

High/Low of iterations = Range.

That's my take.

FWIW.

Why do people still rely on the factory gauge when most of us on this site know it reads FALSE.

What was his 203* recorded with? Does he have Auto Enginuity or what?

The hottest OAT he's seen so far is 80*? :cool:

Although the factory ECT gauge isn't the best, in this case it should give plenty of relavant info. Since he used the same gauge last year and saw 235*, we know the gauge will show that if ECT rises enough. Also, the fact that the gauge stayed well below the 210* mark (which seems to be the point that a lot of the factory gauges seem to stay at through a wide actual temperature range) with no fan clearly indicates that ECT was not rising.

As was stated previously, hopefully some higher OAT's will be encountered soon.

Mark is taking the time during his family vacation to try and give us some useful information with what he has! ;)

when is chlordog going to be pulling. this guy telling his story sounds good so far but my fan dont run when it is only 80 outside stock is this pull being done at night the temps everywhere are really hot how can it only be 80. please let me know when you get to 95 or more temps outside that is when my truck sucks life is good at only 80 thats to lo to count for anything. thanks. jonathon.

when is chlordog going to be pulling. this guy telling his story sounds good so far but my fan dont run when it is only 80 outside stock is this pull being done at night the temps everywhere are really hot how can it only be 80. please let me know when you get to 95 or more temps outside that is when my truck sucks life is good at only 80 thats to lo to count for anything. thanks. jonathon.

Dz.......Chloeourdog is Mark. There are lots of places still not getting over about 80* around. Hopefully mark will get to some 90-100* areas soon.):h

ok thanks they are the same guy i am betting on this oil cooler i hope he can find higher temps above 95 and still pull with good results that would be great. thanks. jonathon.

Sum of the iterations divided by the number of iterations = Average.

High/Low of iterations = Range.

That's my take.

FWIW.


Had a Dr. buddy that did the same thing. I tend to prefer the 2000 miles vs. 200 gallons = 10 mpg, the more fuel and mileage that is run on a calculation reduces the error for tank foaming, etc. I tend to let my truck idle a lot when towing heavy to allow for temp.s to stabilize, all of my mpg results are across the trip with the idle time included.

It's just the way I do it, of course I am almost as anal as ole JJ.

Had a Dr. buddy that did the same thing. I tend to prefer the 2000 miles vs. 200 gallons = 10 mpg, the more fuel and mileage that is run on a calculation reduces the error for tank foaming, etc. I tend to let my truck idle a lot when towing heavy to allow for temp.s to stabilize, all of my mpg results are across the trip with the idle time included.

It's just the way I do it, of course I am almost as anal as ole JJ.

If you want to be real anal, you could keep track of mileage in a spreadsheet and also have a 10 tank (or whatever) rolling average. :D

Why do people still rely on the factory gauge when most of us on this site know it reads FALSE.

What was his 203* recorded with? Does he have Auto Enginuity or what?

The hottest OAT he's seen so far is 80*? :cool:

When the needle on my factory guage is just a RCH below the 210 mark the PDA is in the 190 to 197* degree range.
A good bit of difference I'd say.


Big Max

When the needle on my factory guage is just a RCH below the 210 mark the PDA is in the 190 to 197* degree range.
A good bit of difference I'd say.


Big Max

That needle tends to hang out there from 180*-225* in my truck. When it does cover the 210 mark my truck was always above 225* in the real world.

In the control world that is called averaging, however it appears GM doesnt just average, they also have a window that nets a static result, RCH south of 210*.

The more you watch the real ECT the less you will depend on the gauge.

You know there was some good information in this post once i got through all the bickery and fighting...

More statistics please! Tow mark tow!!!

That needle tends to hang out there from 180*-225* in my truck. When it does cover the 210 mark my truck was always above 225* in the real world.

In the control world that is called averaging, however it appears GM doesnt just average, they also have a window that nets a static result, RCH south of 210*.

The more you watch the real ECT the less you will depend on the gauge.

Where is the sender located for the temp guage on the Duramax?? Is it the same sender as the ECM uses?
On my LT-1 the sender for the guage was in the front of the left cylinder head and the ECM used one in the front of the water pump. There was a difference of 15 to 20* between the two. Being a reverse cooled engine the heads were cooler than the returned water to the pump. Could this be the cause of the two being different in the Duramax?

Big Max

Chloeourdog is in NY near the Canadian border.

To date, No noticeable fan activity; other than Morning Sickness.

Total miles with TD-EOC: Towing 450, Empty 400.

North bound PA and NY: towing ~14,500 lbs.

1. Flat, no hard pulls: OAT 74 °, wind 5 - 10 mph quartering, ECT 190 ° - 203 °, ally T 150 °.

2. Hard pulls: OAT 78 °, ECT 203 ° Max, ally T 187 °, shifting to 4th and 3rd at times.

Speed ~ 65 - 70 mph.

MPG: 10.5 - 11.0. Has not fueled yet so no hand calc.

ECT recovers quickly from a hard pull. Can see the Tstats cycle on the OEM gauge.

Of particular note: Whereas the ally would slowly recover from a hard pull, pre - TD-EOC, it now recovers quickly, in consort with ECT. Can watch the OEM gauges move as they recover.

Where is the sender located for the temp guage on the Duramax?? Is it the same sender as the ECM uses?
On my LT-1 the sender for the guage was in the front of the left cylinder head and the ECM used one in the front of the water pump. There was a difference of 15 to 20* between the two. Being a reverse cooled engine the heads were cooler than the returned water to the pump. Could this be the cause of the two being different in the Duramax?

Big Max

NO, the aftermarket and the factory gauge are using the same sending unit.

Everyone who has been involved with overheating in these trucks will agree the factory gauge is not a dependable device.

That being said the reports of 190-203 and tstats cycling are useless using the factory gauge. This information cannot be accurate and we all know it.

The numbers from the factory gauges are useless, up until the point the truck is in trouble. The only other time the guage is close is when you cold start in the morning, however then it is reading high.

NO, the aftermarket and the factory gauge are using the same sending unit.
This is a True statement.
Everyone who has been involved with overheating in these trucks will agree the factory gauge is not a dependable device.
You presume to know that everyone will agree, you are wrong. I do not agree.

The OEM gauges function as they were designed.
That being said the reports of 190-203 and tstats cycling are useless using the factory gauge. This information cannot be accurate and we all know it.
I know the Range of temperature that the Tstats operate. If I See them cycling I can then extrapolate ECT, Very accurately. Again we disagree.
The numbers from the factory gauges are useless, up until the point the truck is in trouble. The only other time the guage is close is when you cold start in the morning, however then it is reading high.

We do not have to agree, we should be factual with our statement.

What type after market guage are you using? I did not think that the ohms rating of the two guages would be the same. I have a sending unit in my upper radiator hose for my digital gauge that is the proper sending unit for my guage. Ithas always been my understanding that you have to have the proper sending unit for the right guage.

Thanks for posting the update. Wish it was 78 degrees here.

ok telling me about 78 temp pulls are no good that is worse than the story about the 80 temp pulls why bother my fan dont run until it is over 95 without paying for a radv2 or the oil cooler. now what is the story about the guage how come it cant be used to tell about engine temps that is its job. thanks. jonathon.

Originally Posted by D Lafleur
NO, the aftermarket and the factory gauge are using the same sending unit.
This is a True statement.

Everyone who has been involved with overheating in these trucks will agree the factory gauge is not a dependable device.
You presume to know that everyone will agree, you are wrong. I do not agree.

Ok, so you don’t, I will agree that you don’t. I suspect there aren’t many of us that have been working on this that will agree with you. BY the way we are talking about an 05 truck.

The OEM (http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/autolink.php?id=62&script=showthread&forumid=40) gauges function as they were designed.

I agree technically, however it is software designed to not indicate actual temperature for a preset amount of time after the actual ECT has exceeded a set point. It is useless in reporting actual temperatures. As mentioned before , it also reads higher than actual below 180. We have documented this on 100% of the trucks that we have monitored (19 of them).

That being said the reports of 190-203 and tstats cycling are useless using the factory gauge. This information cannot be accurate and we all know it.

I know the Range of temperature that the Tstats operate. If I See them cycling I can then extrapolate ECT (http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/autolink.php?id=41&script=showthread&forumid=40), Very accurately. Again we disagree.

You disagree with no merit. I agree about range of temperature however with the above mentioned Programming of the factory gauge, explain to me how an individual can extrapolate the ECT and the cycling of the Tstat gauges. The truck in question is a 2005 not the 2003 that you drive. My 2005 (early build) has the “custom programmed” ECT gauge. The original post stated that the driver was using the OEM gauge. Has that cluster been programmed different from every other 05 truck?

I spent several months believing that my truck had a faulty fan clutch and it was immune to overheating. I was wrong.

The numbers from the factory gauges are useless, up until the point the truck is in trouble. The only other time the guage is close is when you cold start in the morning, however then it is reading high


These are as factual as I can get based on the data that has been posted on this thread. I am not discounting the effectiveness of the mods on this truck. I am discounting any data posted based on the OEM ECT gauge in a 2005 truck.

For what its worth the air mods alone on this truck are an improvement over stock. Also for what its worth, the terrain being encountered and the OAT are not significant enough to compare this to a typical run made by the "heavy haulers" in "warmer" parts of the country.

What type after market guage are you using? I did not think that the ohms rating of the two guages would be the same. I have a sending unit in my upper radiator hose for my digital gauge that is the proper sending unit for my guage. Ithas always been my understanding that you have to have the proper sending unit for the right guage.

Jimbo, we are reading the ECT from the factory computer using an external digital device that is connected to the CAN Buss. This can be done with several programmers that are on the market and several diagnostic tools using the OBDII port. The problem is not in the CPU for the engine, it is the instrument cluster programming where the facts get muddled.

There have also been several trucks with external monitoring (outside of factory points) has been done. The simplest is installing a thermocouple in the coolant. This has been done too many times. The OH threads are long and colorful, however there is good information.

For the average reader. A little background information.

I have had my truck for 1 year next month. It has 37000 miles on it today. It is used primarily as a tow vehicle, I have 31,000 miles towing the Raptor 3814 or the Four Winns Winner Circle, both of them are high profile Fifth wheels, the lighter one weighs in at 15,500. I have towed in the following states with this truck, Idaho, Wyoming, Colorado, Utah, New Mexico, Texas, Oklahoma, Arkansas, Louisiana, Mississippi, Alabama, Tennessee, Georgia, Florida, and the Carolinas.

I am in tune enough with this truck that I can tell you within one second of a downshift, either on cruise or with me pedaling it. Up until a few months ago, I could predict fan engagement to a few seconds, that went out the window when the temps exceeded 95*.

At one point I had enough automation on the truck to read actual flow through the radiator, you want to talk about tstats cycling. I think I have a handle on how the tstats work.

Good Day.

Thanks for the info.

This thread was started by Chloeourdog to share with the DP members, his TD-EOC experience.

These reports are an act of benevolence, not an obligation.

I know personally that he is very satisfied with the system.

This thread has been " Trashed ", thanks.

I am going to recommend that the posting of reports cease.

Any one that would like a copy of Chloeourdog report's, E-mail me, and at My discretion I will sent you one.

Just seems like I can't get away from the computer without things going bad.

Fox, for what it's worth the factory gauge in my truck is NOT reliable. I'm not taking sides by no means, but after seeing what is actually going on there is no way to trust it, until it is too late.

I think the best thing here is not to try and interpret what Mark is reporting. We should wait until Mark is able to report himself and hopefully he will have some weather and some hills so that it "IS" a worth wild report. I have talked with Mark personally and I have faith in what he says. He will report good or bad. He will also be the first to tell you if it was not a good enough test.:)

Go away for a few days and............ LOL. Thanks Rick for trying and having patience. The EOC is too good to be swept under the rug. Some of the new installs won't touch this site with a dual core processor because of the garbage that goes on here. It makes us all poorer. 34K trouble free, overheat free and worry free miles on my EOC now. Ok you can blame it on me. The EOC makes ya lazy and cheap. When there's no problems any more, how does one justify spending more $ on gauges and programs. :ro)

hi dmaxitol good to hear more about the cooler. what trailer do you tow do you tow when it hot out i think the cooler is cool but so far it seem to me that there have not been good testing on it to seel the deal since the only test hit temps of over 240 not good that worries people. can you be the one to get good solid testing or that bos guy he had a great idea for a pull. thanks. jonathon.

It is this simple really, this picture is a shot we made on a test run, the actual ECT (pc reading) was at 219, by the time we got everything in line for the picture, the temps were down to 216. Every 05 truck that I have put my eyes on will do this, so will the reflashed 04.5 trucks. This has been discussed for the last year.

That factory gauge will sit there until the truck crosses 225 and then it will move towards the right. For those that are new to this, the gauge is not connected directly to the sending unit. The ECM reads the sending unit and then sends the signal to the gauge, the ECM is where the average joe is being fooled by GM.


Now if we want to talk about trashing a thread, how far from the trash bin are we when we make a statement about tstats cycling based on the factory ECT gauge?

Why ruin a good story with a few facts???

It is this simple really, this picture is a shot we made on a test run, the actual ECT (pc reading) was at 219, by the time we got everything in line for the picture, the temps were down to 216. Every 05 truck that I have put my eyes on will do this, so will the reflashed 04.5 trucks. This has been discussed for the last year.

That factory gauge will sit there until the truck crosses 225 and then it will move towards the right. For those that are new to this, the gauge is not connected directly to the sending unit. The ECM reads the sending unit and then sends the signal to the gauge, the ECM is where the average joe is being fooled by GM.


Now if we want to talk about trashing a thread, how far from the trash bin are we when we make a statement about tstats cycling based on the factory ECT gauge?

Why ruin a good story with a few facts???

Maybe an electricl problem. Your battery voltage is Low. ;)

This thread was started by Chloeourdog to share with the DP members, his TD-EOC experience.

These reports are an act of benevolence, not an obligation.

I know personally that he is very satisfied with the system.

This thread has been " Trashed ", thanks.

I am going to recommend that the posting of reports cease.

Any one that would like a copy of Chloeourdog report's, E-mail me, and at My discretion I will sent you one.


This is childish and a holdover of some of the old problems here. No one is saying that the EOC doesn't work, just that no one has proven it with hard numbers. If you look at the V2, we have hard graphs, before and afters, etc. With the EOC, we have several members that are happy with it, but they just need to be careful with absolutes unless they can measure them or post hard data. The only criticism that I read by D Lafleur was that some of the "facts" that were posted were guesswork. Come on Fox, you should have a little thicker skin.

Besides, if you stop posting, who gets hurt? Ultimately it will be KB, your buddy. So you decide.

Maybe an electricl problem. Your battery voltage is Low. ;)

It is 13.8 look in the picture, that is if we can trust that gauge. ;)

hi idahofox. first thanks for telling the oil cooler storys please dont stop but this guy says you have a 2003 that a different truck do you have the cooler on your older truck and tell us what all testing you have done on a newer truck. thats important for you to be able to tell us how the new trucks act up. thanks. jonathon.

hi idahofox. first thanks for telling the oil cooler storys please dont stop but this guy says you have a 2003 that a different truck do you have the cooler on your older truck and tell us what all testing you have done on a newer truck. thats important for you to be able to tell us how the new trucks act up. thanks. jonathon.


I belive he is reporting on behalf of Chloeourdog who does own an 05 but is currently traveling and wanted to relay info as soon as possible. Someone please correct me if I am wrong.

As far as the OEM temp gauge goes, even the service manager at my dealership says they are garbage and are inaccurate as he**. Of course he also says there isn't an overheating problem with my truck either but he thinks my mods are a good idea!!

The stock ECT gauge is just a gauge. Instead of being linear, it seems to stay at around 210 from 203-225. Above and below, it gives usable data. Let's leave it at that!

I watch both the factory and my A2 (accurate) reading.

I'm gratefull for everything I've learned here (a lot) and hopefully contributed (a little) but frankly I've limited my visits here because it's gotten so vicious! I hope it gradually changes! :)

The stock ECT gauge is just a gauge. Instead of being linear, it seems to stay at around 210 from 203-225. Above and below, it gives usable data. Let's leave it at that!

I watch both the factory and my A2 (accurate) reading.

I'm gratefull for everything I've learned here (a lot) and hopefully contributed (a little) but frankly I've limited my visits here because it's gotten so vicious! I hope it gradually changes! :)

What it actually comes down to is programming. It is as simple as:

While input_temp >209 and <= 230
set display_temp = 210
else display_temp = input_temp

Question for the experts. If GM can dumb down program a non-linear reading on our ECT gauge than can we use EFI Live or some other programmer to program the gauge back to read linear and accurately?

Griz

I have read this thread about 3 times now. There is a lot of good info in it. I have also read many other threads on this cooler from its conception. Seems to me, many people are looking for the "Silver Bullet" or "Holy Grail" as in a miracle cure for the over heating problem with just one item. While this may be possible, I think it will take more, but I have been wrong before. We could all solve this problem by adding a Kenworth radiator and be done, but there is that problem of size verses space. That is the reason for different approches to this problem. Is this cooler the "Silver Bullet"?, time will tell. I like the added capacity. I like the added protection by removing more heat from the engine. I also like the Mike L cooler. Added capacity, cooler tranny and engine. I will be adding both these items because they both help, neither one will hurt, and I like the piece of mind knowing that I may be a little over protected. Both these items have a common theme, to remove heat and help the cooling system. There are many ways to do this as we have seen. I think the one common theme here is that GM designed a great truck that pulls large loads, but they designed an undersized cooling system. It simply produces more heat than the cooling system can handle while towing heavy loads in hot weather up steep hills. I think they are starting to figure this out since they added the bigger tranny cooler in the 06 and are testing in AZ. There are some great people on here who have put a lot of effort into building and designing these items to help people like me and I appreciate it. Most people on this forum are here to help. They will all prove themselves over time, give them that time. Give these guys some help, not the bashing. Learn some patience, and remember what Thumper's mother told him about speaking.:think:

I have read this thread about 3 times now. There is a lot of good info in it. I have also read many other threads on this cooler from its conception. Seems to me, many people are looking for the "Silver Bullet" or "Holy Grail" as in a miracle cure for the over heating problem with just one item. While this may be possible, I think it will take more, but I have been wrong before. We could all solve this problem by adding a Kenworth radiator and be done, but there is that problem of size verses space. That is the reason for different approches to this problem. Is this cooler the "Silver Bullet"?, time will tell. I like the added capacity. I like the added protection by removing more heat from the engine. I also like the Mike L cooler. Added capacity, cooler tranny and engine. I will be adding both these items because they both help, neither one will hurt, and I like the piece of mind knowing that I may be a little over protected. Both these items have a common theme, to remove heat and help the cooling system. There are many ways to do this as we have seen. I think the one common theme here is that GM designed a great truck that pulls large loads, but they designed an undersized cooling system. It simply produces more heat than the cooling system can handle while towing heavy loads in hot weather up steep hills. I think they are starting to figure this out since they added the bigger tranny cooler in the 06 and are testing in AZ. There are some great people on here who have put a lot of effort into building and designing these items to help people like me and I appreciate it. Most people on this forum are here to help. They will all prove themselves over time, give them that time. Give these guys some help, not the bashing. Learn some patience, and remember what Thumper's mother told him about speaking.:think:

The flustrating fact is that the Desert Proving grounds for GM is in AZ and has been since the '60s. They tested the LB7 and LLY on the same SR87 that many of us AZ'rs OH on. They knew years ago that the cooling system was marginal, but did not address until the LBZ.

I agree with PRVRT...........I think all these guys are doing what they can to try and address issues that could help. I think each idea (trans cooler, EOC, V2 Mod) are all very good ideas and I get a little disappointed when I read some of the hard comments pushing one idea as being better than another.
Otherwise, I really do enjoy reading about the ideas folks are coming up with and trying them myself.

Question for the experts. If GM can dumb down program a non-linear reading on our ECT gauge than can we use EFI Live or some other programmer to program the gauge back to read linear and accurately?

Griz

There are several people asking the EFI Live people that same question. The current answer is no.

It will come, the mechanical injectors are gone, some of the wastegates are gone, however the tuners have learned new tricks.

I agree on pushing one mod over another, on the other hand one of the mods has been extensively tested (coast to coast) with a known overheater and that truck has not overheated once since install. The other mod hasnt had quite that level of testing. I wish it did, it would be nice if everyone could "feel" confident that we have two choices.

By the way either one of the existing mods (EOC or V2) when installed as designed should be the fix for overheat.

The flustrating fact is that the Desert Proving grounds for GM is in AZ and has been since the '60s. They tested the LB7 and LLY on the same SR87 that many of us AZ'rs OH on. They knew years ago that the cooling system was marginal, but did not address until the LBZ.

Agree, my 94 S-10 with 4.3L V6 cooling system does the same thing( I have put 3 new radiators in it so far). Prior to purchase of the Sierra, I gave cooling a thought, but I figured they wouldn't make that very same mistake on a full size pickup (especially a HD 3/4 ton): I was wrong and you know what assuming leads to!
:cool2:

I agree ... I hate seeing all the "design X is junk, the other is better" and that type of chit-chat. Any comments along those lines of thought are simply bogus and distracting from the thread topic. I believe (as I've stated several times) both are valid solutions. IMO, the V2 has experienced thorough testing on known OHer trucks and was followed by factual, data-oriented results. The TD-EOC, although a good design with numerous happy customers, has not produced the same clear cut, data-oriented reports. The fact there are happy customers tells me the TD-EOC is working effectively! I believe the data we're all seeking is at least partially there, it just needs to be refined along with some additional data and then concisely posted (and locked). The key is for Mark, or any other TD-EOC owner, to post FACTS rather than perceived facts ... there is a difference. Plots, visuals and actual numbers from reliable data sources go a long way!

About the ECT gauge, most will agree that GM messed up the gauge most important to us for recording accurate data. The in-dash ECT gauge is simply not a reliable source and will be questioned by most everyone. The only way around this is to pull ECT data from the ECM directly, or install a thermocouple or independant ECT gauge. I hope that's enough said about that issue.

I'll take a moment to state this ... ... I'm pulling for the TD-EOC owners and encouraging them to collectively gather and report their data. Be careful of perceived facts as they will detract from the report. This is a very technical group demanding very technical results. There is some information already posted and available. If KB or a willing DPer would pull that information together in a clean, concise format and add some heavy load, hot OAT, towing results on a known OHer - I think we can put all this bickering to bed.


.... steps off of soap box and leaves the stage ...

Here's a few shot's of a run to Anthony TX awhile back. Pics taken around Plateau TX on I-10, steep hills and wind! A 32' Montana 5th wheel camper. It doesn't matter if my gauges are 50* off, there's enough cushion and plenty of cool to go around. No need to argue about gauge accuracy in this LLY. :hail:EOC ! :ro)

If KB or a willing DPer would pull that information together in a clean, concise format and add some heavy load, hot OAT, towing results on a known OHer - I think we can put all this bickering to bed.


.... trips over the soap box and leaves the stage ...
:rolleyes: ):h

did everbody stop telling about the oil cooler where is chleoourdog mark or stevebos i hope that they dont stop any info is better than none and the cooler seem like the best idea to me like jason says above lets get some good hard pulls done measured so everybody can see the cooler is the best. thanks. jonathon.

Plenty of hard pulls posted in various areas of this site! I've done quite a few now. Or did the threads get locked before then? I don't remember. I do have some other "hard" test data for a "with...without" comparison. I'll see if I can get it translated to here! Since this is chloeourdog's thread, look for a new one with the "facts and figures only! As for the delay, in my case, "life happens."

I have wrapped up a series of tests to determine some repeatable benefits. The first series, was all low speed, high RPM testing of the unloaded vehicle. Typical scenarios were 2nd gear and 45 mph (3000 rpm), The EOC with air dam/valence kit was compared to the vehicle without the EOC with air dam. OAT's ranged from 108 to 116 F. Mods include CAI, the stack shroud kit was removed. 15 temp plot charts were produced and the following were concluded:
.......................................with....... ....without
1. Fan actuation...............2-3%..............84% :ro)
2. auto AC fan on low.......40%.............never
3. Tranny temp.............175-185..........195-210
4. Filter Oil Temp.(peak)...182...............238
5. ECT............................188................ 206
6. Under hood temps avg...176.............215
7. Fan actuation air temp.202.............212 note:
8. Fan assisted ECT drop...178.............192 this is the rad out coolant temp at 45 mph after one minute of fan.
Note #7: This is the temp of the air passing over the clutch. I concluded that the added airflow past the fan clutch must be having a beneficial latency effect. IOW, more air flow leads to a faster acting fan clutch. While the fan came on earlier, it's occurrence was reduced by 80%. I had grown accustomed to a quiet truck over these last months as the weather heated up. This was "back to reality" as far as the base truck goes, I had taken the EOC for granted, till it was removed.
I made no attempt to measure the benefit of the dam alone, but I will share this. I ran w/0 the dam for a month before I finally added it. The difference is substantial, it was especially noticed in my AC ops and tranny temps. I consider the EOC and dam an inseparable addition.

hi dmaxitol the story you giving there says unloaded why did you test like that please go an give the plenty of other heavy pulls storys you talked about. a few of you guys keep pushing the cooler with great words but you are keeping me scared to be first to find out it dont work. so please tell about the pulls with the cooler that were big heavy pulls and hot out over 95 then thats good. thanks. jonathon.

I have wrapped up a series of tests to determine some repeatable benefits. The first series, was all low speed, high RPM testing of the unloaded vehicle. Typical scenarios were 2nd gear and 45 mph (3000 rpm), The EOC with air dam/valence kit was compared to the vehicle without the EOC with air dam. OAT's ranged from 108 to 116 F. Mods include CAI, the stack shroud kit was removed. 15 temp plot charts were produced and the following were concluded:
.......................................with....... ....without
1. Fan actuation...............2-3%..............84% :ro)
2. auto AC fan on low.......40%.............never
3. Tranny temp.............175-185..........195-210
4. Filter Oil Temp.(peak)...182...............238
5. ECT............................188................ 206
6. Under hood temps avg...176.............215
7. Fan actuation air temp.202.............212 note:
8. Fan assisted ECT drop...178.............192 this is the rad out coolant temp at 45 mph after one minute of fan.
Note #7: This is the temp of the air passing over the clutch. I concluded that the added airflow past the fan clutch must be having a beneficial latency effect. IOW, more air flow leads to a faster acting fan clutch. While the fan came on earlier, it's occurrence was reduced by 80%. I had grown accustomed to a quiet truck over these last months as the weather heated up. This was "back to reality" as far as the base truck goes, I had taken the EOC for granted, till it was removed.
I made no attempt to measure the benefit of the dam alone, but I will share this. I ran w/0 the dam for a month before I finally added it. The difference is substantial, it was especially noticed in my AC ops and tranny temps. I consider the EOC and dam an inseparable addition.

Is this your idea of technical data?:cool: Anyone can type what they want. I just hope this isn't what you consider hard data for the EOC. You have all those thumbnails of your gauges, so I would @ least think you have a REAL graph showing stock vs. EOC... towing.;) Am I not correct in assuming that?

did everbody stop telling about the oil cooler where is chleoourdog mark or stevebos

I'm coordinating before and after data logging to obtain empirical data to demonstrate the degree of the TD-EOC's effectiveness. Those involved and previous commitments involving my truck permitting, I'll post results by the end of August. :)

Ease up turBeau. You want data? Go invest your own money and collect it yourself. People such as Rick Lance and myself are rare. We enjoy measuring the performance of things. If you keep chewing on all the reports that do come in, I wouldn't be surprised if they stopped. Maybe that is your real intent?

Anyway, keep the information coming.

Ease up turBeau. You want data? Go invest your own money and collect it yourself. People such as Rick Lance and myself are rare. We enjoy measuring the performance of things. If you keep chewing on all the reports that do come in, I wouldn't be surprised if they stopped. Maybe that is your real intent?

Anyway, keep the information coming.:exactly: Amen to that brother!

Fingers, you took the words right out of my mouth. Or should I say out of my keyboard.):h

I hope the people who are posting the results of their own experiences with this cooler continue to do so. Keep it coming guys. Doesn't matter to me if you are using the OEM gauge or not; as long as you can post fairly similar runs with and without the cooler, using the same gauges I can extrapolate the results for my own use. Since it's been said many times that under the right circumstances ALL '04 & '05 LLY's are overheaters, your data IS relevant.

Thanks.

You have proven out my point. The data that everyone has gotten so used to seeing was and is a fluke of having the right people involved at the right time. That time has passed. Nobody wants to spend the money for data collection who isn't actually developing something.

I don't want to speak for Rick, but I know that the ability/inability of the EOC to solve the OH was not a factor in his decision.

And as far as the BTU's. I have had access to the development data from nearly the begining. In their current form, both transfer almost the same amount of BTU's. So BOTH should work. How they actually perform for the regular joe is another story that I want to hear. They don't need to be technical, just let them say what their experiences are.

This is a little out of character for me to spout off. I feel it is important to let everyone relay their experiences, good and bad, without additional grief here. To date, my BS alarm has not gone off from those relating the performance of the EOC. It may lack DETAILS, but no BS.

The only question I have is for Dmaxitol. How much go peddle did you have going when you took the pictures of the turbo and EGT gauges? If your EGT is running that cold at 65 with the (~3k rpm) you also have pictured, I need to know your secret.

* I am guessing on rpm based on oil pressure indicated. *

RPM was just over 2K. Smaller tires on the duallys. I snapped the pics because I was amazed. To see those #'s while towing a fairly large unit, well, it just doesn't happen on a stock LLY in those conditions. IOW I wasn't in a hard pull there! I've told myself that the EOC must lower EGT's some. I've just never unhooked it during a towing run to try and prove it. Maybe chloeourdog will say if he saw this when he gets back. I did however unhook the EOC 2 weeks ago to see if my "feet were still planted on the ground." I was returning from a delivery in SLC going through Wyoming (no load) OAT's 96* to 102*, 173 mi of misery without the EOC. (Evanston to Wamsutter) The fan ran full on the whole time, the A\C was sub par and tranny temps were back up to 190* again. I couldn't stand it, so I hooked the EOC back up. I answered my question, yes Virginia, I am well planted in my ravings! :exactly: The oil presure? That's normal for 2000 rpm, even in a hard pull I've yet to see under 52 psi. I usually have full oil presure by 1500 to 1600 RPM even hot!

So the picture of EGT at 375 and the boost at 3 psi was towing a trailer at 65mph and 2000 rpm?

I have a hard time getting 375 after cooling down.

So the picture of EGT at 375 and the boost at 3 psi was towing a trailer at 65mph and 2000 rpm?

I have a hard time getting 375 after cooling down.

No way..........

So the picture of EGT at 375 and the boost at 3 psi was towing a trailer at 65mph and 2000 rpm?

I have a hard time getting 375 after cooling down. It's a poor cell phone pic but if you look closely at the pyrometer the reading is about 525* to 550*. Probably about 4 psi of boost. I use 300* as my shut down temp, usually 5 to 7 minutes of idle time and I'm there. That doesn't include sitting at the red light on the off ramp or what ever else happens along the way to a parking spot. I believe chloeourdog mentioned how fast his truck cools down now after the EOC install! I'm still working on angles to take these pics, it makes a big difference in how their interpreted. I tried using my digi cam to take the whole package at one time but it's always just a blur, I couldn't find a way to stop the "shake," yet! Any photographers out there with some hints? Oh, and no worries on the oil sample analysis! I'm in great shape now. I was just worried about that one I sent you where the intake was loose after a repair. It was a busy week, a new fuel pressure regulator one day and the EOC install the next.

I'm trying to put together another run out west for some more "Mountain Climbing" and desert results. Am I correct in the assumption that ECT's are the biggest area of concern because the factory gauge is off so bad? If so I'll try and get an aftermarket one to install before that trip. I was considering inserting the probe into the "block coolant drain bolt hole." Would that be considered a good area to get coolant temp readings from? Anyone know what size the threads are there? Also this will be the end of phase 1 for me! I am thoroughly convinced that the EOC stops overheating in it's present station of life with no mocal thermostat. Part 2 will be with the mocal !:ro)

I can let you borrow my Edge/attitude. It will show you actual engine temps from the sensor.

It's a poor cell phone pic but if you look closely at the pyrometer the reading is about 525* to 550*. Probably about 4 psi of boost. I use 300* as my shut down temp, usually 5 to 7 minutes of idle time and I'm there. That doesn't include sitting at the red light on the off ramp or what ever else happens along the way to a parking spot. I believe chloeourdog mentioned how fast his truck cools down now after the EOC install!

It looked like 375 range, but it is blurry. At that rpm and speed on flat ground, my EGT towing is more in the 900 range, did the MBRP exhaust make that big of a difference?

I have to get back with the guy at the lab, he has several of my samples, and no results. I guess I am getting what I am paying for. ;)

It looked like 375 range, but it is blurry. At that rpm and speed on flat ground, my EGT towing is more in the 900 range, did the MBRP exhaust make that big of a difference?

I have to get back with the guy at the lab, he has several of my samples, and no results. I guess I am getting what I am paying for. ;) I'm sure the exhaust made some difference, it was one of the first things I did. I suspected the Pyrometer was off some so I replaced the probe about 3 mos ago, made no change. 900* EGT'S wow, that's where I used to start to get into trouble with oil pressure. I rarely see that high a temp anymore.

I'm sure the exhaust made some difference, it was one of the first things I did. I suspected the Pyrometer was off some so I replaced the probe about 3 mos ago, made no change. 900* EGT'S wow, that's where I used to start to get into trouble with oil pressure. I rarely see that high a temp anymore.

You pre or post turbo with probe? Cruising empty at 65 my EGT is always above 650 (unless I get off the go pedal).

I can let you borrow my Edge/attitude. It will show you actual engine temps from the sensor. I don't get that way much but if I do! I would be interested in something permanant for future referance. I gather that the sensor can be tapped into for correct readings? Then an electric gauge would work?

I don't get that way much but if I do! I would be interested in something permanant for future referance. I gather that the sensor can be tapped into for correct readings? Then an electric gauge would work?

Maybe Fingers could mail it to you. This would be extremely easy to hook up for a month or so. Just plugs in between your connectors right on top of the engine......takes about 5 minutes. Then you could see the ect direct readings on the trip. 5 minutes to remove and mail back. Also, there would be no arguing over where the sender was placed, etc., which you know would be the next step for some of these guys! ):h

Finger's offer is extremely generous and would eliminate the "poor data source" issue with the in-dash ECT gauge. I think you should take him up on the offer, but do whatever you'd like ...

You have proven out my point. The data that everyone has gotten so used to seeing was and is a fluke of having the right people involved at the right time. That time has passed. Nobody wants to spend the money for data collection who isn't actually developing something.

I don't want to speak for Rick, but I know that the ability/inability of the EOC to solve the OH was not a factor in his decision.

And as far as the BTU's. I have had access to the development data from nearly the begining. In their current form, both transfer almost the same amount of BTU's. So BOTH should work. How they actually perform for the regular joe is another story that I want to hear. They don't need to be technical, just let them say what their experiences are.

This is a little out of character for me to spout off. I feel it is important to let everyone relay their experiences, good and bad, without additional grief here. To date, my BS alarm has not gone off from those relating the performance of the EOC. It may lack DETAILS, but no BS.

Based on the success of the V2 and from the testing I have seen on the EOC when tested by KB himself on bsanders truck, which hit 242* when towing heavy in only mild 80* weather, I just couldn't believe the above statement to be true, so I emailed TxC and asked him about it.

His reply: "It is true that I shared data with Fingers at the very beginning of the Rad Mod development, but that was ONLY at the very beginning and Fingers was not privy to anything beyond the very first measurements. The original Rad Mod has absolutely nothing to do with the V2 as it is now, as the original Rad Mod was much much smaller, had too small of piping that restricted flow, had absolutely no realistic airflow considerations along with extensive damage to its face blocking flow, and suffered from excessive fan prop wash that reduced its effectiveness by 1/3rd whenever the fan engaged.

All of those issues were addressed in a major way with the V2, a completely new and totally fresh design, and its minimum performance is normally 2 to 3 times and can exceed 5 times and more the performance of the original Rad Mod. I threw the original Rad Mod into a dumpster way back in February, and the performance data of the V2 has remained proprietary information since then.

There was a time at the very beginning when Fingers would have been correct in his assertion that the two do the same amount of work in BTU's but that time has long ago passed and Fingers data is too out-dated to even consider. The EOC numbers are posted all the time from killerbee, so it is a known quantity, and although it has improved over time the laws of diminishing returns are against it as the EOC needs a tremendous temperature difference increase to gain a small amount more performance, in the area of a 10 to 1 ratio compared to the V2, and that is the reason the V2 has been able to soar in performance through development while the EOC has only crept up marginally and will never be capable of doubling itself much less anything along the lines of 3, 4, 5 or 6 times as much work as it originally did. Its just not possible. Its not.

This became obvious to me when I did my own oil cooler testing months before killerbee even thought of developing an oil cooler, and that is the reason I dropped the oil as a real solution and continued the path of the coolant. Heavy, extended, maintained load tow testing in high heat will bear this out if the two units are ever directly compared.There is a huge difference in being in on something "at the beginning" and being in on it "from the beginning". I have all respect for Fingers, and he is a very sharp guy, but the statement that he was in on the development and data from the beginning is not correct at all, Fingers was even unaware that the V2 now had a fan on it, an easy enough thing for him to miss and proof that he hasn't exactly followed along and surely was not kept in the loop of the development process of the V2."

Christopher

Interesting. I came away from my recent conversation with Tx with different info. But I'll refrain from he said/ she said debates. If it is proprietary, we can't compare numbers anyway. Can we? Tx's last call to me before yesterday was in late April. He probably forgot.:rolleyes:


Let the EOC people say their peace about the product, turBeau.

turBeau:

I have one question:

1. Why is Christopher not posting his own rebuttal to Finger's statements regarding his involvement with the Rad Mod V2?

and one comment:

2. I have great respect for both Michael and Christopher. Each is the subject matter expert on their respective products. IMO, their statements about the other's product, valid or not, must taken with a grain of salt.

My comments are not directed at you personally, I hope you don't perceive them this way. :)

Please... Let's keep this thread focused on the TD-EOC.

turBeau:

I have one question:

1. Why is Christopher not posting his own rebuttal to Finger's statements regarding his involvement with the Rad Mod V2? You know the answer to that, stevebos.:cool:

and one comment:

2. I have great respect for both Michael and Christopher. Each is the subject matter expert on their respective products. IMO, their statements about the other's product, valid or not, must taken with a grain of salt.

You can't take TxChristopher's comments about the EOC w/ a grain of salt b/c TxC actually tested engine oil coolers BEFORE KB ever did. He tested them up to and through the 100,000 BTU level w/o the good results he wanted. So, he KNOWS about oil coolers.

My comments are not directed at you personally, I hope you don't perceive them this way.

Please... Let's keep this thread focused on the TD-EOC.

I am sticking to the EOC talk, the EOC was compared to the V2 by Fingers and so I addressed that.

turBeau:

I really don't know... :confused: My apologies if I inadvertantly surfaced a sensitive issue.

The point of my comment is, just as Finger's familiarity with Christopher's current product was questioned, so must Christopher's familiarity with Michael's current product.
Don't want to argue. Let's get a pitcher, I'll buy. :beerchug:

turBeau:

I really don't know... :confused: My apologies if I inadvertantly surfaced a sensitive issue.

The point of my comment is, just as Finger's familiarity with Christopher's current product was questioned, so must Christopher's familiarity with Michael's current product.
Don't want to argue. Let's get a pitcher, I'll buy. :beerchug:

I'm not sensitive and I'm not arguing, just getting the facts straight. As far as familiarity w/ the product, KB keeps telling eveyone the exact BTU capacity of his "current product." The amount of BTU's he's getting out of the EOC is impressive, and I can see why he sould be proud to report it, but theres a lot more BTU's to be had dealing w/ the coolant instead of the oil.

I look forward to your testing and the pitcher of dark beer.:D

turBeau:

I have one question:

1. Why is Christopher not posting his own rebuttal to Finger's statements regarding his involvement with the Rad Mod V2?

...snip

http://dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=93080

Thanks. :)

Mark's not going to believe this !

You pre or post turbo with probe? Cruising empty at 65 my EGT is always above 650 (unless I get off the go pedal). Post turbo, actually, in the turbo housing on the exhaust side. See PM for more info on EGT's.

We could stand to get back to the EOC. When is Mark due back?

Couple weeks.

Mark's not going to believe this !

Mark's thread will be the new inductee to the "Hall of Shame Ovherheat" threads.

Post turbo, actually, in the turbo housing on the exhaust side. See PM for more info on EGT's.

Thanks, that cleared it up completely, if it had been preturbo, I would have paid to disect that baby.

Chloeourdog is in Canada now.

The temperatures have been in the 75° - 85° range, perfect for camping with one's family.

He has run Flat Lands and Mountains.

Still looking for his Fan.

He will be home Friday.

Chloeourdog is in Canada now.

The temperatures have been in the 75° - 85° range, perfect for camping with one's family.

He has run Flat Lands and Mountains.

Still looking for his Fan.

He will be home Friday.

I am happy that Mark is getting the mild weather, who would want to camp in the 100+ stuff.

Here is some more of his report.

Has experienced 6% grades, at around 90 degrees, in the Adirondacks,
55-60 mph, 4800 ft altitude.

No ECT rise.

No fan (has not come on since he left home 2 weeks ago).

Highest tranny temps- 175, avg 150-160.

12+ mpg avg.

Forgive me for asking, but is that with the EOC, or the V2?

Forgive me for asking, but is that with the EOC, or the V2?

TD-EOC. ):h

Please, no more hear say reports. Mark will be back Friday from what I am told. We will let him post, so that any discussion or questions can be answered by him.:)

The TD-EOC is an oil cooler.
The v2 is an add on radiator.

I have created a new thread for the EOC users. I would like to see all eoc owners post there.

http://dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=95245