O.k. :help:
recent reprogramming is forceing me to go with a new trans:ro)

now I have been talking with a couple of installers about tranny upgrades
and the more I read and talk with dealers(tranny) the more I get lost :eek:


co-pilot vs transgo:confused:
5 star vs 1057-3d:confused:

the ats guys tell me that they replace c1-4 make pump changes(cut-off valve"suncoasst?") and install co-pilot(vs the transgo):confused:

I have read alot about the suncoast but very little about the ATS which makes me think maybe ATS isn't as good.... :mad:

4k plus is alot to spend and not be happy, so all input is welcome:exactly:

:) :knight: thanx:)

Unless you are doing a lot of drag racing, copilot is not really needed. I really like my 5-star converter, but I don't have any experience with the Mcrat converter.

I'd pick one of the two that you are considering (Suncoast, personally) and decide where you're getting the work done. THEN, I'd call/stop by and talk with them personally by telling them exactly what you like and don't like as far as drivability as well as performance plans and uses of the truck. THEN, I'd take their "expert" recommendations, assuming I wasn't an expert myself (which I, personally, am definitly not).
I've heard good things about Suncoast HQ down here in Fort Walton Beach...heck, call them, they manufacture the things, and get their recommendation (shoudl you decide on a Suncoast flavor).

O.k. :help:



Alright, you buy the trannies and I'll test them for ya and report back. I can be there in 2 and 1/2 hours.

:joke:

later
good luck

well if i were to go with the ats i like the fact that the co-polit is adjustable and increases holding pressure
lazy shifts are one of my promblems now:mad:

co-pilot vs transgo:confused:
5 star vs 1057-3d:confused:

the ats guys tell me that they replace c1-4 make pump changes(cut-off valve"suncoasst?") and install co-pilot(vs the transgo):confused:

I have read alot about the suncoast but very little about the ATS which makes me think maybe ATS isn't as good.... :mad:



There is no comparison between the co-pilot and the transgo, they do two completely different things. And the 5 Star vs 1057-3d have not been compared as of just yet, so it's hard to make an honest comparison.

We not only replace the c1-c4 clutches but we also convert some of them to a single sided clutch disk to enable us to put more clutches per clutch pack and acheive a greater friction surface throughout the tranny and distribute the load over more clutches to help them hold more power and last longer.

We modify the pump spring and valve to produce higher pressures from the pump to enable us to acheive much greater clamping force to the clutches when combined with a co-pilot. The co-pilot will adjust pressures based on the level that you choose and applying that pressure proportionatly to your boost levels so you don't run excessive pressure all the time.

If you would like to know more about our products feel free to give me a call anytime, I'm more than willing to help out in anyway I can :) .

Cheers,
Wade

With the co-pilot you have total control over shift firmness. With the transgo, you have no options.

With my co-pilot I can drive around with my tranny shifting completely stock, then by pushing a few buttons, I can have tire chirping shifts. The only disadvantage is the price.

I have a Suncoast III with an ATS Co-Pilot........

I would opt for the SC-IV kit of a drop in SC V.......then if you want to dragrace add in the Co-Pilot........or maybe some Custom EFI-Live transmission tuning.........:cool:

T:D NY

See, like I said, IBDMAXIN chimed right in. I stick with my advice. Talk to an expert on each and see what they recommend. Enjoy whatever you go with!

I tested the CoPilot by itself without the Transgo.

You will need the Transgo regardless of whether you run a CoPilot.

The CoPilot is a good product, and will improve your ET's, but it does not replace mechanical parts, it just helps them.

Mc rat
so do you think that getting a trango shift kit is a must, and the copilot is an option?
:(

Absolutley...transgo is very neccassary! The Copilot is an option that on LB7's has been proven to gain .2-.3 sec in the 1/4. On LLY's, it unfortunatly doesn't have quite that effect!:mad:

If you go with the full ATS innards and co pilot it will work. You dont need a transgo kit in an ATS trans.

The suncoast just bases part of thier kit off the Transgo kit.

The co pilot will realy make you feel like your going like hell but in reality unless your looking for every tenth of a second in the 1/4 mile it realy isnt needed. If your planning on spraying N2O it can help though....not in holding power becasue I ran a **** ton of n2o on a stage 5 suncoast but it will help with the training of the trans. You add 200HP to a trans that aint used to it and it will take it some time to figure out WTF is going on.

There isnt 1 converter thats perfect for everybody. I would have who evers trans you are installing pick out your converter based on what you tell em on your power and driving habits and such.

I would be more apt to get a suncoast trans though. Drop in unit or a unit built local or by you depends.....or there is the option of driving to sunny FL and having Joe do it for you. Decide on your trans and then talk to either ATS or Joe at Suncoast and see what they recomend(drop in unit or a local dealer to do the upgrade for you)

Your saying a full out drop in ATS trans dont work on the LLY's? I'm not much into them so I didnt know that?

Mc rat
so do you think that getting a trango shift kit is a must, and the copilot is an option?
:(

I ran a 425HP tune with a brand new Allison trans and just a CoPilot. 5 1/4mi passes later it limped.

Would it have supported a 375HP? Dunno. Suppose I should "crept up" on the power to see.

Suppose I should "crept up" on the power to see.

What fun would that be? Besideds.....we know your not a ***** in regards to beating the snot outa your truck in the name of testing :D

go see joe.... get one inhouse..... you wont be disapointed.

there is that time factor
going to cali or FL just isn't in the cards for me
I think I am going to crank it diesel (a supporting vender)
for a ats trans
or
going to tn for a suncoast 4
I am still on the fence
but all the post are welcome:grd:

there is that time factor
going to cali or FL just isn't in the cards for me
I think I am going to crank it diesel (a supporting vender)
for a ats trans
or
going to tn for a suncoast 4
I am still on the fence
but all the post are welcome:grd:

Don't think that your gonna get much better of a deal then Crank it Up is offering, for the product, service and price including installation he's kicking some serious a$$.

The Co-Pilot on the LLY doesn't really feel different unless it's all the way up. Of course this is where most people use it so I guess it is OK. Keep in mind you can not run the Co-pilot all the time as the TCM starts to relearn and can start to get a little goofy.

What about ATS tranny, no CP but add the TransGo? Anyone running that config?

Don't think that your gonna get much better of a deal then Crank it Up is offering, for the product, service and price including installation he's kicking some serious a$$.:ro) Call Kyle at Crank it Up. Your close to him. They did mine and all is well. Friendly, great service, quick and support after the sale describes the boys at Crank It Up Diesel.

You mean a transgo kit with ATS clutches basicly?

You mean a transgo kit with ATS clutches basicly?

Done a lot of those. ATS Triple Pak, ATS pump upgrade, Transgo shift kit and add a CoPilot. The rest I cannot talk about.
mike

come on mike
what is it going to take to get u 2 talk

a couple of beers and a stripper;)

hey lawnboy
how do u like that 5 star tc

hey lawnboy
how do u like that 5 star tcSo far so good. Have not hooked it to a sled yet but it makes it alot more fun to drive around. Call Kyle, I can't say it enough, their GREAT to work with.

I'm running the ATS stage V with Co-pilot,working quite well.Looking forward to getting it to the track this year.

.Looking forward to getting it to the track this year.


:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

I sent matt from crankitup an email
I wanted to see if they would install a transgo shift kit
with the ats tranny upgrade but I haven't heard anything back yet

I sent matt from crankitup an email
I wanted to see if they would install a transgo shift kit
with the ats tranny upgrade but I haven't heard anything back yet

The reason you haven't heard back from him yet is because he is here at ATS this weekend for our open house, I'll let him know your looking for information.

thanx IB
also give him some really cool parts to install in my truck
I will test it out for you guys and give you an HONEST feedback
hehehehehehehehehehe

suncoast W/1056 OR 1057 no other choices IMO

turbo max
have u been in a truck with an ats trans

how about BD, I have seen guy's run there trans and they seemed pertty tough

i am kinda partial to suncoasts warrenty, let alone how well it works for me.

to directly answer your question, no, never been near an ATS equipt truck

never been near an ATS equipt truck

Well then why would you claim...
suncoast W/1056 OR 1057 no other choices IMO
?? IS ATS' warranty worse than Suncoast's?

You defiantly hear alot about suncoast trans
you really don;'t hear that much about ATS
I am really getting interested in there product

I wonder how ats's 5star couples compared to the 1057 3-d

I don't think I could go wrong with either, but 4-5k is alot not to
have what makes you happy

I called Suncoast looking to upgrade my 1050-3 to a 1057-3. They told me they'd check on it and never got back to me. Hmmm, may have to look into the ATS 5-Star.

Josh

Well then why would you claim...

?? IS ATS' warranty worse than Suncoast's?

Don't you think it's time to cut to the chase and get a trans?):h You have asked enough questions allready.:grd:

LOL - yeah I know. :o: You are right. I am definately over thinking :think:this thing. Since I am running stock power and have not had to tow - my urgency fell off. Every time I get close to pulling the trigger, I learn something that shifts me another direction. Probably any of the options I have considered would be great choices.

Ok its a deal :Handshake - no more tranny questions until I pull the trigger and am driving a built trans.

Well then why would you claim...

?? IS ATS' warranty worse than Suncoast's?

not a claim, just my opinion like i stated...so spend your dime on an ATS and lets race...pulling a cat D3....for 30k miles....and see what trans holds up :)

I'd like to race and I'll put a D6 behind mine.

kyle
do u have the co polit

I'd like to race and I'll put a D6 behind mine.

your poor truck...lol

I'd like to race and I'll put a D6 behind mine.:funnypost The biggest I has on was a Case 550. Just a little guy.

and i thought ats didn't think it was worth being a sponsor here?

your poor truck...lol

POOR? He spends more time and money on that truck in a year, then most men will spend on a woman in a life time;)

Co-Pilot, YES, Definatly.

I am thinking about a ats stage 3(including c-4's) with 5star TC and a trango shift kit withOUT the co-pilot
I have sent matt with crank it diesel an email but haven't heard back yet ....
we will see

when I search trannies for suncoast I get more info then I care to read about(but I do), not the same for ATS..... but the more I do find out the better I like em

I am still on the fence on which tranny co to go with but I think I am leaning toward ATS,

so let hear some more about ATS tranny guys

No matter which tranny you go with, you will not be disappointed. They both get the power to the ground just fine, the only major differance is the co-pilot vs the transgo.

I was under the understanding that the Co-Pilot was not a replacement for the transgo just a good addition. Guess i could be wrong.

I run both on my truck.

Its tough to get an honest opinion on this subject. Not many people will have a fully informed opinion. They buy one brand and that's the best even though they've never used the other option. I'm not by any means saying that everyone here is that way, just the majority. With that said I've only owned ATS and I've only rode in ATS equiped trucks. So, I won't say ATS is the only way to go. I will however say that my transmission shifts much like stock with the co-pilot off. Its a totally different when the blue lights are on :)

I was under the understanding that the Co-Pilot was not a replacement for the transgo just a good addition. Guess i could be wrong.Me too. I was under the impression that a Co-Pilot was something electronic that manipulated line pressures, shift points, etc. and a transgo is hard mechanical parts that were installed inside the transmission.

By comparing the pictures that is the impression I get anyway.

Co-Pilot:

http://www.atsdiesel.com/atswebsite/images/ProductsGM/GCoPilot.gif

Transgo:

http://suncoastconverters.com/images/gmc/shift%20kits/allisonshift%20kit.jpg

Me too. I was under the impression that a Co-Pilot was something electronic that manipulated line pressures, shift points, etc. and a transgo is hard mechanical parts that were installed inside the transmission.

By comparing the pictures that is the impression I get anyway.

Co-Pilot:

http://www.atsdiesel.com/atswebsite/images/ProductsGM/GCoPilot.gif

Transgo:

http://suncoastconverters.com/images/gmc/shift%20kits/allisonshift%20kit.jpg

You are correct in your assumtions. Many run the Co-Pilot on Sun Coast built transmissions.

I'd like to race and I'll put a D6 behind mine.

Why dont you hook up to the D6.:badidea:

The Co-pilot very much controls a mechanical part. Totally goes about controling pressure to the packs in a different way than the replacement trim valves that come with the transgo.

You do not need any transgo parts in a co-pilot equiped transmission.

I watched a Duramax put down 900+ Horsepower this weekend and guess what, no transgo parts in that trans.

The electronically controlled solenoid that is part of the co-pilot can do more than any trim valves or springs in a transgo kit could ever think about doing.

Hey 100HP
how does your truck shift, with the copilot on and off

The Co-pilot very much controls a mechanical part. Totally goes about controling pressure to the packs in a different way than the replacement trim valves that come with the transgo.

You do not need any transgo parts in a co-pilot equiped transmission.

I watched a Duramax put down 900+ Horsepower this weekend and guess what, no transgo parts in that trans.

The electronically controlled solenoid that is part of the co-pilot can do more than any trim valves or springs in a transgo kit could ever think about doing.

so why not have "the best of both worlds" amd use a co-pilot with the trans go?...is the co-pilot all external plug n play tyoe of thingy?

The Co-pilot very much controls a mechanical part. Totally goes about controling pressure to the packs in a different way than the replacement trim valves that come with the transgo.

You do not need any transgo parts in a co-pilot equiped transmission.

I watched a Duramax put down 900+ Horsepower this weekend and guess what, no transgo parts in that trans.

The electronically controlled solenoid that is part of the co-pilot can do more than any trim valves or springs in a transgo kit could ever think about doing.

You're not just going to stop there without explaining that are you?
mike

I watched a Duramax put down 900+ Horsepower this weekend

Whos truck? Yours? Was it an engine dyno, or vehicle dyno? I know your truck is capable of those kinds of numbers!:eek:

I think it was pretty clear. You can do more with a solenoid than changing valves. And especially when the TCM adapts to valve changes. The new co-pilot can be left on all the time, and modifies pressures in such a way that the tcm does not adapt.

I am not at all saying that transgo kits don't work. I'm saying that they are not needed for shift quality or power holding capacity of a co-pilot equipped transmission.

Without a co-pilot, a transgo is still better than nothing.


Whos truck? Yours? Was it an engine dyno, or vehicle dyno? I know your truck is capable of those kinds of numbers!:eek:

Not mine. Rear wheel Load cell Dyno.

My truck just makes a lot of smoke and looks good on videos):h

Was it Clints truck?

I think it was pretty clear. You can do more with a solenoid than changing valves. And especially when the TCM adapts to valve changes. The new co-pilot can be left on all the time, and modifies pressures in such a way that the tcm does not adapt.

I am not at all saying that transgo kits don't work. I'm saying that they are not needed for shift quality or power holding capacity of a co-pilot equipped transmission.

Without a co-pilot, a transgo is still better than nothing.
Thanks for that explaination. Helps.

Was it Clints truck?

It was a truck that we are building for a customer, it has twin CP3's, EFI custom tuning, huge injectors, A5000 and even with the Aurora making 70+ lbs of boost couldn't even come close to cleaning up all the fuel so we decided to spray nitrous to it to help clean up all the fuel, we threw a .070 & .120 on top of the 5000 and made 930hp and 1798 ftlbs and it was still smoking and holding rail pressure at 23,000psi :eek: :eek: . We were expecting to blow it up or hit 1000hp, well we didn't blow it up but I'm pretty sure the rods are a little short ;) .

Hey 100HP
how does your truck shift, with the copilot on and off

Mine shifts as stock when not hammering and chirping gears when hammering.

This is something you cannot do with the transgo.

So there is a NEW CoPilot out?

Can the "old" one be updated?

Casper has a CoPilot on it, but best passes have been running the Kennedy TCM and CoPilot off.

You are correct in your assumtions. Many run the Co-Pilot on Sun Coast built transmissions.

so why not have "the best of both worlds" amd use a co-pilot with the trans go?...is the co-pilot all external plug n play tyoe of thingy?

My Set-Up works great and has awesome street manners.

I never turn my Co-Pilot on unless I am racing.

So there is a NEW CoPilot out?

Can the "old" one be updated?



I would like to know as well........

T:cool: NY

It was a truck that we are building for a customer, it has twin CP3's, EFI custom tuning, huge injectors, A5000 and even with the Aurora making 70+ lbs of boost couldn't even come close to cleaning up all the fuel so we decided to spray nitrous to it to help clean up all the fuel, we threw a .070 & .120 on top of the 5000 and made 930hp and 1798 ftlbs and it was still smoking and holding rail pressure at 23,000psi :eek: :eek: . We were expecting to blow it up or hit 1000hp, well we didn't blow it up but I'm pretty sure the rods are a little short ;).:eek: Seriously?

So there is a NEW CoPilot out?

Can the "old" one be updated?

Casper has a CoPilot on it, but best passes have been running the Kennedy TCM and CoPilot off.

You can upgrade your old co-pilot for a charge of $300, it come's with a new box with new software and the extra wire and pin that you need to hookup to make it work correctly.

:eek: Seriously?

You would have to be there to appreciate how bada$$ it really was, all these numbers were uncorrected on a mustang loadcell dyno. It was pretty cool!!! :ro) :ro)

You can upgrade your old co-pilot for a charge of $300, it come's with a new box with new software and the extra wire and pin that you need to hookup to make it work correctly.

What does this upgrade include? What are the new features?

How long has the new copilot been out?

well it sounds like the new co-pilot is pretty cool

what kind of warrenty do you get with an dealer installed ATS tranny???

What does this upgrade include? What are the new features?

Well it has completely different software in it, it no longer comes with a sub level because it reads the rate of change in the TPS signal to judge how much pressure needs to be applied. It also no longer requires you to hook up your tow haul button to lock up the converter, it reads your TPS signal and if you have the Co-Pilot on and you hammer it, it will automaticly apply full pressure to the clutches and lock in the converter. If you tip into the throttle slow it will raise the line pressure but keep the converter unlocked. All this happens when the co-pilot is placed on it's highest level (Race Level), anything less won't lock the converter up under full throttle and will only apply the clutch pressure that you choose.

Hope this helps,
wade

Not mine. Rear wheel Load cell Dyno.

My truck just makes a lot of smoke and looks good on videos):h

We both know better then that!:exactly:

By the way; 930 rwhp and 1800 rwtq with spray! Was the truck run on fuel only? If so, what were the numbers? 750-800 rwhp?

well it sounds like the new co-pilot is pretty cool

what kind of warrenty do you get with an dealer installed ATS tranny???

Any transmission that doesn't leave our shop complete, comes with no ATS warranty. The converter will still be covered for 3 years or 150,000miles. Also our tranny warranty's have been upgraded to 150,000 miles or 3 years aswell.

We both know better then that!:exactly:

By the way; 930 rwhp and 1800 rwtq with spray! Was the truck run on fuel only? If so, what were the numbers? 750-800 rwhp?

On fuel only it was running mid 700's, the aurora 5000 didn't have anything left in it, that's why we sprayed it, and even then it still had plenty of unburnt fuel left to burn. I would say with a killer set of compounds or with lots of spray and a A5000 we will have a 1000hp+ duramax pretty easy, finding the rest of the weak points will be the fun part.

On fuel only it was running mid 700's, the aurora 5000 didn't have anything left in it, that's why we sprayed it, and even then it still had plenty of unburnt fuel left to burn. I would say with a killer set of compounds or with lots of spray and a A5000 we will have a 1000hp+ duramax pretty easy, finding the rest of the weak points will be the fun part.

Everyone step away from the vehicle!!!!):h

The Co-pilot very much controls a mechanical part. Totally goes about controling pressure to the packs in a different way than the replacement trim valves that come with the transgo.

You do not need any transgo parts in a co-pilot equiped transmission.

I watched a Duramax put down 900+ Horsepower this weekend and guess what, no transgo parts in that trans.

The electronically controlled solenoid that is part of the co-pilot can do more than any trim valves or springs in a transgo kit could ever think about doing.
Pump mods are still necessary right?

Pump mods are still necessary right?


Yes!

On fuel only it was running mid 700's, the aurora 5000 didn't have anything left in it, that's why we sprayed it, and even then it still had plenty of unburnt fuel left to burn. I would say with a killer set of compounds or with lots of spray and a A5000 we will have a 1000hp+ duramax pretty easy, finding the rest of the weak points will be the fun part.

Mother, that is some power!! You told me that on the phone but it didn't sink in until I read your post. This thread is about ATS v/s SUNCOAST. My first Mod was a Quadzilla Stealth. I was so impressed with the power that after about the 10th time I ran on the high setting I limped the tranny. I got pissed an had the Stage 5 with TripleLoc and Co-pilot installed at my local tranny shop. End of problem. I have been through about every mod with the exception of N2O you can do to a LB7 and the tranny has never let me down. It took a long time to figure out how to use the co-pilot (not sure I know even now), the only issue I ever had was using it when I was towing, once in awhile when shifting on a slighty releasing throttle it would lock the rear wheels and chirp the tires. I usually towed with the co-pilot off.

Another thing I didn't care for was the higher tranny temps. Mind you they were still under 200 degrees, but ran about 30-40 degrees warmer than the stock one did. I installed a big tranny cooler and deep tranny pan and it hardly every gets about 150 even on the hard heavy pull-off event in Montana, or around town on a hot day. In Montana, one of the guys who was running a Suncoast got pretty hot and blew tranny fluid all over the tow trailer. Have never had a Suncoast but have rode in a couple and feel under a heavy pull and high power that my tranny shifts better.

Cost is another issue and if I remember correctly, Suncoast is a fair amount cheaper. My next truck might well have a Suncoast, but have really loved the ATS.

Lets not let this go personal guys :) Keep it on track and about ats and SC please, this isnt about different installers etc:)

I don't see where ats is any higher then sc on price

there are alot more sc installer\dealers

I don't see where ats is any higher then sc on price

there are alot more sc installer\dealers

Seemed like the last time I ck'ed Kennedy's prices, (he handles both) that the ATS was a fair amount more money. If I'm wrong great. I don't think ATS offers kits anymore, don't know about Suncoast.

Keep in mind on pricing the Co-Pilot adds up the money faster. If you compare base kits side by side, you'll find them to be pretty close.

The Co-pilot very much controls a mechanical part. Totally goes about controling pressure to the packs in a different way than the replacement trim valves that come with the transgo.

You do not need any transgo parts in a co-pilot equiped transmission.

I watched a Duramax put down 900+ Horsepower this weekend and guess what, no transgo parts in that trans.

The electronically controlled solenoid that is part of the co-pilot can do more than any trim valves or springs in a transgo kit could ever think about doing.

Kyle -- I've seen inside an ATS transmisison and I saw what appeared to be Transgo C2 return springs and the Transgo boost valve? If so then perhaps there are are Transgo parts in the 900+ hp Duramax's transmission.

I also doubt a Duramax could make 900+ hp, love to see it but....

Nasty Girl is doing a lot of big mods to his truck and they are expecting 900hp on #2 only but we will have to wait till later on this year for that.

Nasty Girl is doing a lot of big mods to his truck and they are expecting 900hp on #2 only but we will have to wait till later on this year for that.

Agent - there are internal mods? Not just the plug in and play "computer hot rodders" methods? If so then I can see the big hp. :ro)

Yes internal mods. I am sure of it;)

he needs boost and lots of it................. so how much Nathan is he gonna have

Yes internal mods. I am sure of it;)

Gee Eric you think?
;)

he needs boost and lots of it................. so how much Nathan is he gonna have

I've seen the monster/s in question and let's put it this way, it would eat a cat, a big cat. :ro)

Kyle -- I've seen inside an ATS transmisison and I saw what appeared to be Transgo C2 return springs and the Transgo boost valve? If so then perhaps there are are Transgo parts in the 900+ hp Duramax's transmission.

I also doubt a Duramax could make 900+ hp, love to see it but....

I can assure you there are no Transgo parts in any ATS tranny, unless you put them in after you received your unit.

People didn't believe that people could fly either, but all it took was a couple of guys with some brains and a brass pair of b@lls to make it happen, it was guys that didn't believe that it could happen that were left on the ground :thumb: