Using the treads I gathered here at the Diesel Place, I've made my own boost control.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/774_mapwire.jpg I began by cutting the B pin wire on the MAP. The wire that goes to the MAP is connected to the first post on a 10K potentiometer. the wire connecting to the wire harness is connected to the other two posts on the pot meter. these wires are sodered and the heat shrinks shrunk.


http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/785_wireswitch.jpg Everything is feed into a new wireloom.


http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/91A_wireloom.jpg The finished look under the hood.


http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/F17_dashswitch.jpg The switch in it's new home.


The EASE scantool I have says 102.0 KpaG @ 1.47 volts with the switch off, and 85.7 KpaG @ 1.23 volts turned up all the way. It also showed a steady drop in volts as the pot switch was engaged.( remember that the lower volt reading tricks the PCM into boosting to makeup for the low readings it's getting). I also will try a 50K pot to see what #'s it gives.


Parts list:


wireloom $1.50


10K pot switch $6.00 (it's a volume control from radioshack)


18 awg wire $2.50


time to install 20 min.


My point is this, if you can make your own for under $10, why buy one? Does plug and play command such a steep price, or is it artifical inflation I see everywhere in the aftermarket.Edited by: quantum mechanic

Thats nice, and cheap.


Try to market it though and you will see why companys sell them for 60 bucks or so.

I offered a few things in the past, but I'm through with that. All that's important now is that 6.5 owners who don't want to invest their money in over priced products have an option. I have a chip Reprogrammer on the way and I intend to compile programming files and give them away to anyone who needs them. Down with that $300 flash programming and $600 Eprom programming. I said free. Funny thing is I've learned more about reprogramming from www.thirdgen.org (http://www.thirdgen.org) than anyone. I've learned it's inexpensive to get into. As in less than one aftermarket chip to buy everything you need to program countless chips. And that hex code is as mallable as putty. I also intend to show a mock-up of how I plan to run twin turbos with a water to air intercooler. What's my point, what's my purpose? That someone else out there has a new Idea, or a better way of doing something they've seen. That some guy in podunk who can't affrod overpriced gadgets has the roadmap he needs to build his own. Are you inspired yet? I am.

I say go for it and share it with mehttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif.

QM,


I agree. I would really like to see a movement similar to Linux's free software model develop for the OBD-II standard (open source is a little different, and the subject of much debate). I don't see why multiple developers couldn't contribute to the code. Locate it on a server somewhere for free download. Not sure about copyright and DCMA at this point.


I've also seen some really neat things that I think would be of benefit to the diesel market. For example, A chip tuner for the VW market offers software for free that will allow you to adjust several variables. I think the code was a teaser for things to come due to its limited functionality, but it allowed just about anyone with an ISO9141 cable and a laptop to adjust away.


http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/FDF_LW.jpg


The company also offers a unit that plugs into the OBD port and allows boost, timing and fuel adjustments by turning a simple dial. No computer is needed.


I am pretty sure the performance diesel market would welcome a product like this.

Low voltage readings may also tell the computer the boost is low and not put more fuel in till the boost comes up. May have to do a little balancing act to get the desired control.

This is My Dad's '96 L65 showing the knob for boost control. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/48E_96dashswitch.jpg


I installed it with a straight 3" pipe. The downpipe costs $180, the rest was $25 from the local muffler shop. I had one more bend put in (not shown) at the end, for a turn down.





http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/5FZ_exhaust.jpg


I don't feel a lack of fuel, but let's say it does turn the fuel down till the psi comes up. Humm, let's see, more boost, less fuel,sounds like I'm running at a greater level of effiency. This is all still a warm up for twin turbos.





This is how I've been testing it.


http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/6EA_dailyhaul.jpgEdited by: quantum mechanic

Low voltage readings may also tell the computer the boost is low and not put more fuel in till the boost comes up. May have to do a little balancing act to get the desired control.


I don't think the computer is that smart. It sees lower voltage than it is trying for so it closes the wastegate tighter.


After I installed the pot on mine, I was watching on the scan tool and the only thing that seemed to cut back fuel was the IAT getting high.

Whatnot,


It works 180 deg. opposite of that. It sees lower voltage and closes the waste gate solenoid(from the vac source) allowing the waste gate to open.





One warning: I had a clogged vac line this morning and my pot was at 1/2 , I started it up and the Idle was 1000, I thought this was fast idle for warm up, but when I got on the street I wouldn't shift to OD. All that I changed was both vac lines and everything is normal again.


My dad's truck makes so much more power that the tranny shifts too early now. It also sounds like a BB with a cam and headers. He says "I can finally hear what this engine sounds like." so can everyone else.

How much difference do you feel when you turn the boost control pot?

Whatnot,


It works 180 deg. opposite of that. It sees lower voltage and closes the waste gate solenoid(from the vac source) allowing the waste gate to open.





One warning: I had a clogged vac line this morning and my pot was at 1/2 , I started it up and the Idle was 1000, I thought this was fast idle for warm up, but when I got on the street I wouldn't shift to OD. All that I changed was both vac lines and everything is normal again.


My dad's truck makes so much more power that the tranny shifts too early now. It also sounds like a BB with a cam and headers. He says "I can finally hear what this engine sounds like." so can everyone else.





Lower vacuum opens the wastegate and lowers boost.


When the computer sees more voltage than it wants, it tries to make more by closing it tight.


When the wastegate opens, the exhaust bypasses the turbine.


I am seriously considering getting a Turbomaster. My boost goes all over the place especially when going up or down a large hill.

I feel bottom end torque. enough to run it at 1/2 pot at all times.





if your vac lines are backwards it will make the turbo studder under hard acceleration.


I'm going to dissassemble the exhaust side on the turbo to see for myself.

The variable resistor - potentiometer - should be of linear taper to function correctly.


If an audio taper, or log taper, is used the adjustment will be extremely touchy.


The correct pot will be 10K-L or 103-L, or just ask for 10K linear taper - 1/2 rotation should be 10psi max boost.Edited by: gmctd

OR take the appropriate weatherpak connectors, and add the pot to the wire in between rather than having non sealed connections underhood. Why a guy needs a dial in cab, I'll never know. Just set it and forget it...





P.S. Multi-turn pots give MUCH better resolution...http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Wink.gif

I can give a for-instance, from my standpoint, for an adjustable control -


Having not finished the charge-air cooler for my truck, I prefer to limit Intake Air Temps to below 200deg. At oem-limited 7-8psi, it's a no-brainer.


But, when it's cool out and IAT stays low, I like to play, using the extra power available from higher boost levels. As the day warms up, I can crank it back, to suit.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Cool.gif


And, as John suggests, a ten-turn pot gives much better tweakability!


(Yep - Gen Haig was one of my all-time heroes!)http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Wink.gif





Edited by: gmctd

I had to go back and reread the original post after seeing one from Kennedy. I read that the connections were soldered and heat shrinked. But when I went back and looked at the pictures I see butt splices. Splices like that are a bad idea on any ECM circuits. Solder and heat shrink is the only way to go, doing it that way you still hve sealed connections under the hood.


brian.

The blue buttend connectors you see in pic #1 are 3M heatshrink buttend connectors. You can buy a big assorted package of regular buttend connectors for what a few heat shrinks cost.

Right, but the text says soldered and heat shrinked. Which would be the right way to do it, even though GM sends butt connectors with the repair terminals, and then in all the TSB says to only solder and heat shrink.

Not everyone wants to solder. I have a little hand held torch, but i'm just as like to burn myself as not. I'll take it into consideration on other poeples vehicles, but I think if you crimp it right and heat shrink it, it will work.


http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/991_3m.jpg


I've seen the MAP connector repair kit. $30 for $3 worth of kit.Edited by: quantum mechanic

Fact: solder and heat-shrink prevents oxidation in the splice. Crimp connections for computer signals can be unreliable in the engine bay environment. The PCM is a computer - computers require reliable connections, and even the 'weather-pak' connectors are notable for intermittent connection after a few years. Sometimes a 'fix' is as simple as unplugging and re-seating those connectors.


I crimp and solder a splice, smear with Permatex Black RTV, then heat-shrink over the RTV. Oxygen, water, brine, Diesel fuel, oil, etc, you know - all that stuff in your engine compartment - sealed out.


But, that's just me - I troubleshoot and repair industrial process computers from all over the world, from all types of environments. Clean it - make it work - make it reliable.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Cool.gif


Almost fergot: How's it going, Brian? Been a long time between posts! Edited by: gmctd

When I start getting brine in my engine compartment, I'll want it sealed good.


Did you put an EFI 6.5 in your truck? If not I'd think you're the guy who could make the whole wiring harness from scratch.

Yep - we drive here in Texas - not much need for salting the roads when ice and snow is the environment, but I still seal to prevent.


And yes, it is '95 OBD-I EFI, Green Label Inj Pump. PCM is located above the glove box, using the mounting assembly from a '91 gasser Suburban. Used two harnesses from '95 - one pickup, one van; and two from '89 - one pickup and one van, to reduce number of splices required.


Vans use much longer wire runs to get to same points, so I stripped, collated, and merged the four bundles into one coherent harness. Factory colors, factory circuit numbers, factory connectors - easier to troubleshoot, if necessary.


Set it up like your truck, PCM harness running along the lower firewall above the downpipe area and into the lower passenger-side firewall, but that 750deg heat was worrisome, so I re-wired the harness to pass thru the upper right-center firewall, like the '84 to '91 FI gasser trucks.


Took six weeks evenings to accomplish both configurations, so, as you can imagine, I was more than a little concerned with reliability, salt or no.


That was then - Winter '99 - this is now, a few upgrades, one failure, a few improvements, more to come.


Only failure - lost one FSD\PMD to overheating Summer of ought one. Dissected it, determined failure causative, and the modified module, also a failure from another truck, is still on the Inj Pump, still surviving Texas air-conditioning-required Spring-Summer-Fall seasons.


So - that's my story, and I'm stickin' to it!http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Cool.gif

That's alot of wirebundles to go through. If I wanted to run multiple ECMs with a switch between them you think you could help me? Edited by: quantum mechanic

Could - might be easier to use a prom-pak plug-in, switchable.


Requires coldstart - meaning, power down, switch, restart. Could not be done live, engine running.


All '94-95 PCMs are identical - prom sets up required I\O for each engine\trans configuration. Wiring harness modified accordingly.


My engine was Z-71 K1500 4L80E


Retaining the original K3500 T400\205 T-case required installing a prom from '95 Z-71 K3500 5-speed manual to avoid 4L80E DTC's.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Cool.gif


Left 4L80E wiring in the harness for future option.

I don't know what they run but I 'd get a used 4L80E, Install the 140sq ft friction pack and other HD modifications, beef up the flywheel and put a highflow torque converter and swap it out. Then you have a truck that's capable of highway speeds (80 MPH)and can handle a fully modified turbo 396.


What if you had bought the chip for a 6.5 in a kodiak with a manual? Would its' programming have been more power oriented?

First, a little background -


Fact - highest output oem factory 6.5L is 195hp, upped in '99 from 190hp after '97 cooling mods and piston-spray oiling system proved to reduce occurance of over-heating.


'94-'98 had around 64cmm maximum fuel rate, '99 got over 73cmm fuel, maybe to 78cmm.


However, to factually achieve those factory ratings requires improving the ''92-96 cooling system, improving all-years exhaust systems, opening up the air intake system, and a charge-air cooler, usually referred to as 'inter-cooler'*, which allows higher than factory 6-7psi boost pressures. Oem-limited stock 6.5L trucks never attain factory hp\torque ratings.


Fact - compressor outlet temps can approach 300deg when boost is increased.


Fact - rising exhaust back-pressure in the GM-2~8 T-3 turbine limits effective boost levels to 12-13psi.


(*In multiple-stage compressor systems, inter-cooler is placed between compressor stages, after-cooler is between last compressor stage and receiving device, which can be an engine. Single-stage systems, of which the 6.5LTD is, require a 'charge-air cooler'.)


Fact - Peninsular Marine pioneered mechanical injection 18:1cr 6.2L\6.5L for water-craft, offering a 300hp single turbo version for trucks and a twin-turbo 450hp version for street use.


Big trucks - 4500 series and up - get their power from final gearing - some at 5.13 and lower - and multiple-range transmissions, and\or two-speed diffs.


So, my truck is all that it can be, prior to installing a charge-air cooler (in the works, even as we type), and a chip for increased fuel rates. Cranking up the boost during the Winter (cold weather reduces Intake Air Temps), I could see 62-63cmm fuel, with sustained boost limited to 12-13psi to keep IAT around 100deg. With 15-20psi dialed in, output power decreased due to turbine back-pressures exceeding 20psi (gage limit). And, of course, IAT began climbing rapidly at those levels, as did EGT.


And, I do have a 0.73 overdrive range on 4.10's - cranks ~2200rpm at 70mph with 2.35\85R16's.

I don't limit myself to the perceptions of others. The Creative energy that manifests reality is unlimited, and as such, so am I. The 396 reconfigured has a 500HP, 1000 ft lb Torque potential. Yes, it will need more fuel. Yes, it will need custom cast big headers to twin turbos mating up to custom cast intake manifold. I like water to air intercooling as its' cooling coeffiency is 4:1 vs. 1:1 with forced air, but I will keep 21.3:1 compression, because of the big headers and 5" (x 2) downpipes that will let it flow the heat.


Now, you could legitimitly argue that I have no experience in a foundry and that I don't have the credentials to do any of this, but I won't let that stop me. The 396 is a calling, and I am manifesting its' ability to make power at a higher energy level, and change myself in the process.Edited by: quantum mechanic

No argument necessary - relying on one's own perceptions often set the course......perceiving which are reliable serves to stay, or alter, the course.


As an example, a Boost\Vacuum gage is only seventeen bucks at jcwhitney.com.


A suitable used EGT gage can pe picked up at most 18-wheeler bone yards for around ten bucks - might say Kenworth, or Freightliner, or Peterbuilt, or GMC or Ford on the face, but does give a highly perceiveable indication of what is going on in the engine.


Early on, I perceived that these gages, together with the engine coolant temperature gage, could conceivably enhance a driver's perceived perceptions, and suggest a course of action either for or against his current direction.


Sure, enough - when that orange EGT needle crosses into the yellow, heading for the red, I opt for an alternate course of action which results in the needle passing back into the green.


Cause, perception, and effected response - works for me......

OK,


I'm convinced. I'll find a boneyard for big rigs (I need 3 of them). The boost guages are nice, but not necessary. I can extrapolate on the annadotal data I've recieved here at The Diesel Place and call half potential(numerically speaking) 10 psi and full potential 15 psi. I have the knob installed so that straight up is half numeric potential (according to The EASE enhanced perameter scantool the 10k non-linear potentiometer reduces the MAP sensor reading .22 volts at full potential and I do the math to find half) and it's a 1/4 turn to full potential.

Good - and don't forget the temp probe to match the gage.


Type K, usually in a yellow sheath, with red and yellow leads. Red lead is negative, yellow is positive, and gage is marked accordingly.


Type J is used by some oem, with brown sheath, red and white leads.


Either type is accurate enough, but type J is lower upper temperature range.


Type J probe for type J gage, type K probe for type K gage - if mixed, will be very inaccurate.

QM,


I've done about all you can do in area of bolt ons for more Hp next is to go into the block once my extended warranty goes out. You'd do well by listening to what GMCTD(JD) has to say; he has a lot of been there done that knowhow(used to race turboed cars in addition to his Diesel work). He has been part of my project pretty much since I first bought my truck, and Iv'e not found him to have given bad info yet.


As for gauges "nice but not necessary", yes in stock configuration, and light towing, the PCM should take care of itself; start altering fuel and boost delivery; gauges are MANDANTORY.


Your boost control or JK's or any other home brew version; allows for extra boost by faking out a key PCM input is safe only if you have gauges to see what those changes are doing.


Faking out PCM to get more boost keeps the WG closed which will also elevate turbo turbine temps >1000 F is not reommended, >1300 is point where bad things start to happen you will need gauges to know when this is happening, PCM does not monitor EGT but it does monitor other engine parameters, one being boost to prevent a unsafe condition for the turbo and rest of engine.


If you are going to run with elevated boost you will also need to come up with a method to knock back charge air temp(hotter charge air =hotter overall temps), you aslo increase chance of detonation with elevated charge air themps. IC & WMI 2 methods in use by folks here and at DPage to control charge air temps. I went with IC.

Today was the first real haul I've had in awhile.


http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/ZZF_haul.jpg


I used full potential on a few hills a/c on. I noticed a two click rise in coolant tempature on each hill and backed the boost off at the top of the hill. I think it's time to make a water to air intercooler.

I have had the potential for about 5000 miles and now that I have tempatures running a little cooler while towing and empty, I've keep the switch on full boost all the time, first as a test and now with a little experience with my eye on the tempature guage with little varience, except under full throttle. No, I still don't have anything to watch tempatures by except the coolant guage, but my foot is the other half of the equation. As long as I'm easy on the APP everything's fine. This has sufficed for the present. As soon as I do a water to air intercooler I will be adding a 10k linear resister to the current switch.