Yesterday we ran some tests on a six-gun w/ speed loader on the local mustang dyno, Ken Imler Diesel, in Sacramento CA. i ran each test twice, but due to time constraints was not able to remove it to get a true stock run. here is the data from the runs. Dyno was set for 20 second sweep time, and we ran the test from 30-75MPH with a tech 2, locked in 4th, OD Lockout on, and truck in Tow/Haul mode. I waited for the converter to lock-up in 4th at ~1400-1500 RPM before putting it to the floor to start each test. Truck was a 2003 D/A CC/SB with Banks 4" Exhaust (CAT-Back version). Wastegate actuator was stock, tires were stock. Truck had approx 24k on it. Air temp was 60 degrees with nice weather. Once i get the scans of the dyno sheets i will append this post. I didn't write down the first run of level 1 or 2. Sorry.



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<TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17>
<TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" height=17 x:num>3</TD>
<TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>3</TD>
<TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>313.3</TD>
<TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>580.4</TD>
<TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>20</TD></TR>
<TR style="HEIGHT: 12.75pt" height=17>
<TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; HEIGHT: 12.75pt; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" height=17 x:num x:fmla="=A2+1">4</TD>
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Looks like the HP is lower than a 125Hp Hot Juice but TQ is close


The level 6 run for the 1/4 mile ET is slower than the HOT OJ as well.



Not a bad showing but no where near the claim if 155 HP/385 TQ....



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<TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num></TD>
<TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num></TD>
<TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num></TD>
<TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num></TD></TR></T></TABLE>Banks has some PR work to do I guess.



http://dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/F73_sixgun-hp-tq.jpg

so guys what happened to the torque? must have gotten lost in the advertising





Thttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Embarrased.gifNYEdited by: GMC-2002-Dmax

Uhh ooo, here we go again... http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif

Something about this thread tells me things are gonna get interestinghttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif

[QUOTE=Diesel Power]


Yesterday we ran some tests on a six-gun w/ speed loader on the local mustang dyno, Ken Imler Diesel, in Sacramento CA. i ran each test twice, but due to time constraints was not able to remove it to get a true stock run. here is the data from the runs. Dyno was set for 20 second sweep time, and we ran the test from 30-75MPH with a tech 2, locked in 4th. Truck was a 2003 D/A CC/SB with Banks 4" Exhaust (CAT-Back version). Wastegate actuator was stock, tires were stock. Truck had approx 24k on it. Air temp was 60 degrees with nice weather. Once i get the scans of the dyno sheets i will append this post. I didn't write down the first run of level 1 or 2. Sorry.



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<TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>313.3</TD>
<TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>580.4</TD>
<TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num>20</TD></TR>
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Taking the lowest results for Level 6 with the SpeedLoader shown here (349.1 HP from run #6 and 715.8 lb-ft from run #12) the peak-to-peak results are a horsepower gain of 84.5 HP and a torque gain of 261.9 lb-ft. Banks advertised data shows a peak-to-peak power gain of 84 HP (sounds pretty close to me) and a torque gain of 385 lb-ft. Since these tests are run in basically the same fashion as the previously discussed and over-discussed tests, I would imagine that this is further proof that the difference in test methods will account for the discrepancy in torque gains. For a full review of the different test methods, see the other thread. I can’t further comment on things like best gains and EGT’s because that information is not present.

Nick, I am curious, aside from the dyno test, what are your impressions? Drivability, smoke, EGT, shift characteristics, etc?

Taking the lowest results for Level 6 with the SpeedLoader shown here (349.1 HP from run #6 and 715.8 lb-ft from run #12) the peak-to-peak results are a horsepower gain of 84.5 HP and a torque gain of 261.9 lb-ft. Banks advertised data shows a peak-to-peak power gain of 84 HP (sounds pretty close to me) and a torque gain of 385 lb-ft. Since these tests are run in basically the same fashion as the previously discussed and over-discussed tests, I would imagine that this is further proof that the difference in test methods will account for the discrepancy in torque gains. For a full review of the different test methods, see the other thread. I can’t further comment on things like best gains and EGT’s because that information is not present.

Nick, I am curious, aside from the dyno test, what are your impressions? Drivability, smoke, EGT, shift characteristics, etc?









Did Banks run the test vehicle with a TECH II enabling 4th gear and locking the TCC ???????http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Ermm.gif


The numbers are very similiar to Regular Juice numbers.......a little more TQ than a standard non Attitude 90 HP juice.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clap.gif


Looking at the dyno graph's provided by Banks I cannot see how such a discrepency between HP/TQ is possible, with just testing TECHNIQUEShttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Confused.gif


We are hopeful that here on the East Coast we will get a Six Gun to roll on a dyno here....same truck, same dyno, same day........straight up "NO BS" runs........


Peter,


I am not being critical................the six gun has been a topic of discussion here as you can tell..........If you have a different test method please explain it in this thread if you would........





THANKS,





Thttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clown.gifNY

Looks like the HP is lower than a 125Hp Hot Juice but TQ is close


The level 6 run for the 1/4 mile ET is slower than the HOT OJ as well.



Not a bad showing but no where near the claim if 155 HP/385 TQ....



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<TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num></TD>
<TD class=xl24 style="BORDER-RIGHT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-TOP: #d4d0c8; BORDER-LEFT: #d4d0c8; BORDER-BOTTOM: #d4d0c8; BACKGROUND-COLOR: transparent" x:num></TD></TR></T></T></TABLE>Banks has some PR work to do I guess.



http://dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/F73_sixgun-hp-tq.jpg

so guys what happened to the torque? must have gotten lost in the advertising





Thttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Embarrased.gifNY








Maybe they added 2 pieces of reflective tape on the harmonic balancer?

While you were on the Dyno, you should have seen if it stacks with the Quad better than the Edge. Since it makes its power in a different way, its results stacked with any tuner might be suprising.

Tony,
In all of our testing of the Duramax, we do use the Tech II to select 4<SUP>th</SUP> gear and lock the TC. This allows us to lug the engine down low in the RPM register. Here is a brief review of the type of testing represented here vs. the type of testing that Banks does.

The testing that was done at Ken Imler is an acceleration test. The applied load from the dyno is preset, and the vehicle is brought to a beginning RPM while under partial load. The test is started and the accelerator is applied to full throttle. The engine accelerates through an RPM range and horsepower is determined by the rate of acceleration. While this may be useful from a comparison standpoint, it does not allow for an application of full load. An acceleration test can be compared to stepping on the accelerator to pass a vehicle on the highway, while a load test is more like climbing the grade at full throttle with a heavy trailer such that you reach a terminal velocity. An acceleration test is completed within a matter of seconds.

While acceleration testing is useful for some things, Banks uses full load testing for the majority of our tests. We do so by running the engine up to a specific RPM at or near redline, hold a sustained full load condition at that RPM for a given period of time (usually 8 to 15 seconds) while readings are taken, and then apply more load so that engine RPM drops. We do this type of test in increments of 100 or 200 RPM until we have tested to below the torque peak or we reach a point that the test equipment will not allow us to drop any further. A complete test takes anywhere from 1.5 to 5 minutes depending on how much data we are gathering. Tests are repeated a minimum of 3 times to ensure repeatability.

The fact that the horsepower peak data is similar to the Banks data, but the torque data is not is due to the test method. You cannot achieve full torque while the engine is accelerat

Peter,


Couple things i noticed on the dyno. The truck used has the electronic gauges that connect directly to the six-gun, with the EGT probe installed in the manifold. While doing the dyno runs, it would reach 1250* about half-3/4 of the way through the run and stay there until the end. one of the two level 6 runs netted 1325*. not sure if any temperature limiting was coming into play as i know it does it, but i can't remember when. Also it never made over 19 (usually 18) PSI of boost, and we even tried a simulated 20k load. I'm not sure if this is due to the boost being read from the OEM boost sensor or if this is correct as he has an unmodified wastegate setup.


As for smoke, I didn't appear to smoke at all. Maybe just a wisp on level 6. I bear in mind I was sitting in the driver's seat looking out the side mirror, but I'm sure i would have seen it.


The truck the testing was done on is not my own. We used a stock 2003 CA / EGR truck (airbox, tires, etc) with the exception of the cat-back Banks exhaust. My truck has some modifications that i felt would skew the results as i was looking for honest comparison. Due to time constraints I didn't drive it. the truck belongs to FISHHOG, a member on this forum. He asked me to run the truck for him as i've done it before, plus I own a Tech II. I believe he has already commented on its driveability so I would hate to speak for him. Perhaps he can add his comments to this thread. I just got copies of the dyno charts so i will be posting them in a short while.


Nick

Nick,


Thanks for the info. Concerning ATS and Suncoast, what level of tranny upgrade would be required to insure tranny lonjevity and maximum performance with the 6-gun, if any?

I have just updated my first post with the dyno charts. Thanks FISHHOG. It was fun beating up your truckhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif


Bronco- I don't believe i know enough about it to say. My guess would be any tranny upgrade and converter would hold it just fine. i've thrown a lot at my TTS/Transgo tranny and have zero complaints.

<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=2 width="90%" align=center bgColor=#999999><T>
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<TR bgColor=#999999>
<TD width=690 bgColor=#999999>
<TABLE cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=9 width="100%"><T>
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<TR>
<TD width=181 bgColor=#ffffff>Six-Gun, Level 6 (http://www.rv-truckpower.com/System.cfm?appid=AC08&amp;sysid=SC16)</TD>
<TD align=middle width=100 bgColor=#d9d9d9>Stock</TD>
<TD align=middle width=100 bgColor=#f3f3f3>Banks</TD>
<TD align=middle width=100 bgColor=#d9d9d9>Improvement</TD>
<TD align=middle width=100 bgColor=#f3f3f3>Results</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#f3f3f3>Rear-wheel horsepower: best gain</TD>
<TD bgColor=#d9d9d9>163 hp
(2000 rpm)</TD>
<TD bgColor=#f3f3f3>290 hp
(2000 rpm)</TD>
<TD bgColor=#d9d9d9>+127 hp </TD>
<TD bgColor=#f3f3f3>78% more (2000 rpm)</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top bgColor=#f3f3f3>Rear-wheel Torque:
best gain</TD>
<TD vAlign=top bgColor=#d9d9d9>458 lb-ft (1800 rpm)</TD>
<TD vAlign=top bgColor=#f3f3f3>803 lb-ft (1800 rpm)</TD>
<TD vAlign=top bgColor=#d9d9d9>+345 lb-ft torque</TD>
<TD vAlign=top bgColor=#f3f3f3>75% more (1800 rpm)</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top bgColor=#f3f3f3>Rear-wheel horsepower: peak-to-peak</TD>
<TD vAlign=top bgColor=#d9d9d9>252 hp (3000 rpm)</TD>
<TD vAlign=top bgColor=#f3f3f3>322 hp (3000 rpm)</TD>
<TD vAlign=top bgColor=#d9d9d9>+70 hp </TD>
<TD vAlign=top bgColor=#f3f3f3>28% more, peak-to-peak</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#f3f3f3>Rear-wheel Torque: peak-to-peak</TD>
<TD bgColor=#d9d9d9>458 lb-ft (1800 rpm)</TD>
<TD bgColor=#f3f3f3>803 lb-ft (1800 rpm)</TD>
<TD bgColor=#d9d9d9>+345 lb-ft torque</TD>
<TD bgColor=#f3f3f3>75% more, peak-to-peak</TD></TR>
<TR>
<TD bgColor=#f3f3f3>Rear-wheel horsepower: upshift point (automatics)</TD>
<TD bgColor=#d9d9d9>249 hp (3200 rpm)</TD>
<TD bgColor=#f3f3f3>322 hp (3200 rpm)</TD>
<TD bgColor=#d9d9d9>+73 hp </TD>
<TD bgColor=#f3f3f3>29% more (3200 rpm)</

[QUOTE=PeterT]
Tony,
In all of our testing of the Duramax, we do use the Tech II to select 4<SUP>th</SUP> gear and lock the TC. This allows us to lug the engine down low in the RPM register. Here is a brief review of the type of testing represented here vs. the type of testing that Banks does.

The testing that was done at Ken Imler is an acceleration test. The applied load from the dyno is preset, and the vehicle is brought to a beginning RPM while under partial load. The test is started and the accelerator is applied to full throttle. The engine accelerates through an RPM range and horsepower is determined by the rate of acceleration. While this may be useful from a comparison standpoint, it does not allow for an application of full load. An acceleration test can be compared to stepping on the accelerator to pass a vehicle on the highway, while a load test is more like climbing the grade at full throttle with a heavy trailer such that you reach a terminal velocity. An acceleration test is completed within a matter of seconds.

While acceleration testing is useful for some things, Banks uses full load testing for the majority of our tests. We do so by running the engine up to a specific RPM at or near redline, hold a sustained full load condition at that RPM for a given period of time (usually 8 to 15 seconds) while readings are taken, and then apply more load so that engine RPM drops. We do this type of test in increments of 100 or 200 RPM until we have tested to below the torque peak or we reach a point that the test equipment will not allow us to drop any further. A complete test takes anywhere from 1.5 to 5 minutes depending on how much data we are gathering. Tests are repeated a minimum of 3 times to ensure repeatability.

The fact that the horsepower peak data is similar to the Banks data, but the torque data is not is due to the test method. You cannot achieve full torque while the en

Fish Hog,


I here you! What's up with the defuel at 3000? Was it due to slip or EGT? According to Pete if uou slip you stay defuled for 5 TQ Con. lock ups?


ON EDIT: How do you hook up without the shift on the fly? What level would it be on?Edited by: Bronco

Trippin wrote:


I'd like to volunteer Tony's truck for this comparison.


http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gifhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clap.gif

Fish Hog,


I here you! What's up with the defuel at 3000? Was it due to slip or EGT? According to Pete if uou slip you stay defuled for 5 TQ Con. lock ups?


ON EDIT: How do you hook up without the shift on the fly? What level would it be on?

plug the speedloader in set it on 5 and go for it.
slam the hood. if you get beat you still have one more try with level 6

Fish Hog,


I here you! What's up with the defuel at 3000? Was it due to slip or EGT? According to Pete if uou slip you stay defuled for 5 TQ Con. lock ups?


ON EDIT: How do you hook up without the shift on the fly? What level would it be on?

still trying to research this but it seems to be only at 3000
i'm thinking GM may be trying to keep boost below 19 OR 20
ive tryed with no sucess to increase it. will see this weekend on a couple of steep grades and see what the torque-ometer says

I will give credit when credit is due.thanks Peter for the good explanation. I grew up working with a crew that was racing vws
1975 all work we did on the dyno was to bring engine up to set level
of rpm and then apply a load with water back in those days.we did tests step down by step down to achieve our desired results and then took it to the track to prove it. our best time even in those days of 11.65 1/4 have not been reached by anyone here that I know of. I wonder how they would feel to get whooped by a 4 cyl 1956 VW FROM 28 YEARS AGO. DYNO #### DON'T WIN AT THE RACE TRACK. ENGINEERING DOES

[QUOTE=Trippin][QUOTE=PeterT]
Tony,
In all of our testing of the Duramax, we do use the Tech II to select 4<SUP>th</SUP> gear and lock the TC. This allows us to lug the engine down low in the RPM register. Here is a brief review of the type of testing represented here vs. the type of testing that Banks does.

The testing that was done at Ken Imler is an acceleration test. The applied load from the dyno is preset, and the vehicle is brought to a beginning RPM while under partial load. The test is started and the accelerator is applied to full throttle. The engine accelerates through an RPM range and horsepower is determined by the rate of acceleration. While this may be useful from a comparison standpoint, it does not allow for an application of full load. An acceleration test can be compared to stepping on the accelerator to pass a vehicle on the highway, while a load test is more like climbing the grade at full throttle with a heavy trailer such that you reach a terminal velocity. An acceleration test is completed within a matter of seconds.

While acceleration testing is useful for some things, Banks uses full load testing for the majority of our tests. We do so by running the engine up to a specific RPM at or near redline, hold a sustained full load condition at that RPM for a given period of time (usually 8 to 15 seconds) while readings are taken, and then apply more load so that engine RPM drops. We do this type of test in increments of 100 or 200 RPM until we have tested to below the torque peak or we reach a point that the test equipment will not allow us to drop any further. A complete test takes anywhere from 1.5 to 5 minutes depending on how much data we are gathering. Tests are repeated a minimum of 3 times to ensure repeatability.

The fact that the horsepower peak data is similar to the Banks data, but the torque data is not is due to the test method. You cannot achieve full torq

Its still more hype than horsepower and torque and until they change their advertising to represent real numbers instead of their dreamed up hype Im going to SCREAM bullsh*t. Tony you hit the nail on the head. Peter this is nothing personal between me and banks I just feel you guys got a little creative in your advertising and never expected anyone to challege or queston a 30 year old company. Correct your advertising, sell your products, provide goood customer service and I will not have any issues.

For the record the hot juice with attitude(125)(When you add the guages) is still a better deal and does meet or excede Edge's advertised ratings . It is more powerful than the banks and is made in the USA

I also agree on the claims vs. the actual numbers. How can the Hot Juice meet and even exceed their claims and Banks falls way short of their 155/385 w/loader? I went from a Hypertech (96hp/160tq) to a Banks (155hp/385tq) and didn't gain jack in the quarter mile. Bottom line, spent $1500 for a 60hp/225tq gain and ended up the same. Ya, I'm real happy. Banks, what are we going to do about this?

Sdaver,
What part of our advertising is it that you have a problem with? All the data that we present is based on our dyno testing, and so far, both tests that have been talked about in these threads have been equal to or exceeded our advertised peak-to-peak gains. There has not been enough data provided to evaluate best gains, and as already discussed, the torque numbers are skewed by the test configuration. What is it that you are referring to as hype? And for the record, the Six-Gun is 100% designed, built and tested in the USA.

Removed by Bronco.Edited by: Bronco

Tony,


I'm glad you didn't take too much offense to my post. I hope were cool! I'm only interested in discovering the truth as well. I just see the testing procedure as a bigger deal than most I guess. This forum has been a great source of learning/information for me. Thanks to all who contribute their ideas and opinions. Tell you what, find a dyno, lets agree on a testing procedure and I'll send you my Banks Six gun/speed loader to test? Fair enough? I wouldn't mind testing your VA on my truck. It's getting harder and harder to explain to my wife why I need to buy all this stuff. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Cool.gif

Tony,


I'm glad you didn't take too much offense to my post. I hope were cool! I'm only interested in discovering the truth as well. I just see the testing procedure as a bigger deal than most I guess. This forum has been a great source of learning/information for me. Thanks to all who contribute their ideas and opinions. Tell you what, find a dyno, lets agree on a testing procedure and I'll send you my Banks Six gun/speed loader to test? Fair enough? I wouldn't mind testing your VA on my truck. It's getting harder and harder to explain to my wife why I need to buy all this stuff. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Cool.gif





Which VA would you like ?????????


One that will run or one that will destroy ??????


We are cool......no problem.





Thttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gifNY

Peter T,


I hope you do not take anything personal here, this is a tough crowd of HP/TQ junkies always in search of the most HP/TQ.


We do appreciate your participation here as well as all vendors or non vendors that have information to share.......the membership here is hungry for info.


Please continue to update us with new Banks Products and as more members test and tune I am sure we will see more real world results posted as well.





Thttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clown.gifNY


Edited by: GMC-2002-Dmax

You guys are being pretty harsh on Banks here. It seems that what they advertise and what has been tested independently isn't too far off. As I read through various thread posted here there are other tuners/boxes that don't live up to what they are advertised for. Give it a break! It appears that Banks is providing a quality product that keeps EGT's in check and protects the tranny. What more do you want? If ya want a race car then buy a race car that's all there is to it. I've read through all of this and watched this bickering take place, and quite frankly if i was looking for GOOD info then i wouldn't know where to start. Lets not get into another pissing match here, dynos give us numbers, experience gives us proof.


Justin

Tony,


Does the destroyer make more power? http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Evil Smile.gif

Tony,


Does the destroyer make more power? http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Evil Smile.gif





How soon are you looking for a transmissionhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Evil Smile.gif


Probably will last a week..........http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif


PM me, we'll discuss stuff !!!!!


Thttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clown.gifNY

You guys are being pretty harsh on Banks here. It seems that what they advertise and what has been tested independently isn't too far off. As I read through various thread posted here there are other tuners/boxes that don't live up to what they are advertised for. Give it a break! It appears that Banks is providing a quality product that keeps EGT's in check and protects the tranny. What more do you want? If ya want a race car then buy a race car that's all there is to it. I've read through all of this and watched this bickering take place, and quite frankly if i was looking for GOOD info then i wouldn't know where to start. Lets not get into another pissing match here, dynos give us numbers, experience gives us proof.


Justin





As I have stated, this is a tough crowd. I do not know if you were around when the Predator came out and it was discussed elsewhere.


As I stated to PeterT, we do appreciate the info, apparently Banks does different testing than most do.......as more info is learned people will come around I am sure.


The Dyno charts for those of us that have spent alot of time on dyno's did not look beleivable....


sorry if I was not being clear, that was the intent of the questioning about the Six Gun.


It has nothing to do with Banks....it had to do with the claim of HP/TQ.


Peter has explained the procudure Banks used.....





Thttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clown.gifNY

Peter T posted

"Sdaver

What part of our advertising is it that you have a problem with? All the data that we present is based on our dyno testing, and so far, both tests that have been talked about in these threads have been equal to or exceeded our advertised peak-to-peak gains. There has not been enough data provided to evaluate best gains, and as already discussed, the torque numbers are skewed by the test configuration. What is it that you are referring to as hype? And for the record, the Six-Gun is 100% designed, built and tested in the USA."


Scotty S provided the answer you just ignored it.

Scotty wrote
" I also agree on the claims vs. the actual numbers. How can the Hot Juice meet and even exceed their claims and Banks falls way short of their 155/385 w/loader? I went from a Hypertech (96hp/160tq) to a Banks (155hp/385tq) and didn't gain jack in the quarter mile. Bottom line, spent $1500 for a 60hp/225tq gain and ended up the same. Ya, I'm real happy. Banks, what are we going to do about this?"


Six-Gun Diesel Tuner
• Stacked for Power™: tunes pulse width, timing and fuel pressure, all in one device
• The highest horsepower and torque value availablehttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Ermm.gif
• For towing or sport, six levels of power: stock, 20%, 40%, 60%, 80% or 100% of Six-Gun’s power increase (+128 hp and +345 lb-ft…with recommended airflow improvements)
• With Speed-Loader upgrade: +155 hp and +385 lb-ft…with recommended airflow improvements

Pete I guess you recognize the ad...well most of itEdited by: sdaver

The reason Banks is getting bashed is because of a long history of misdirection advertising. They have done it for years and yet they keep going (honest company doesn't have a chance). I first found there hype in advertising in the early 90's with a cummins kit that was supposed to be +100 hp and was over $3000 but once it was installed you could tell absolutely no difference. They obviously are making money by copying company's like edge and claiming to be better when in all reality they are about equal to the product edge sold 2 years ago.

I didn't mean to offend anyone personally. It is just that as a person that reads all of this trying to learn some things it is hard to tell heads from tells with this constant bickering. I agree with the fact the Banks seems to have some misleading advertising, but doesn't everyone? I enjoy looking at the dyno sheets and seeing what really went down and seeing you guys that are knowledgable tell us why it was that way, not everyother person saying, "ha ha, told you so, misadvertisement again", not that anyone had said that word for word. It just seems to the general theme here.


Justin

Diesel Dummy,


I here you and understand your concerns. However if you would of been following this discussion in real time, you would of relized that this topic has come along ways. Alot of good info. has been brought to the table. We are now at a conclusion or finallity. We are down to some simple questions about questionable advertizing techniques. I have worked for a small growing corporation that was holding 75% market share and making money hand over fist. They tend to promise there customers the world!


Things are not as bad as they look in regards to the tone of the this conversation. We have all worked together like a disfuntional family on it's best behavior. We have done good here.

can anyone figure out why the tests show sudden drop of tq. in levels 4 5 6 at 2250. this was also present in the sound of the truck as the tests were being done. level 3 has always been smoothest as i think these tests show this also. my questions are as follows
can a 2003 allison have some kind of torq. management software allowing this? could this be the six-gun backing down because of egt's? could this be at the peak boost? it's odd that these 3 levels all did it at the same spot? this thread was not started for people to bash any vendors about ad hype. those of you that are unable to read the #'s that I posted about peak to peak and not try to twist the #'s are only trying to show their true mentality.18 years ago I was installing BANKS products on 6.2 diesel's and these trucks are still on the road. lets see who the players are 18 years from now.

Fish Hog,


Those are some good questions about the 03alli. I have been told the torque ratings are up to 565 due to torque control management electronically??? There is also other writings that link the TCM to the ECM?


I am curious to see the 6-gun on a level 5 transmission either ATS or Suncoast with an aftermarket lift pump????


ON EDIT: NO CATS NO EGR Edited by: Bronco

Fishhog - i believe i mentioned it earlier, but i think it was the EGT's. your tranny wouldnt' slip with that much power locked in 4th on the dyno. i'm betting if anything was backing it down it was temps. after all, when i run on the dyno my pyro gets much higher at times, but i don't have any temp limiting 'cept my right foot..

I have been at Banks 11 years. I started as a Test Technician in Engineering, running dyno tests, analyzing data, meeting with Gale to determine what to try next. When I started there were about 10 people on our engineering staff. I worked as an Engineering Technician for about 3 years, then took a year off to serve as a Youth Pastor at my church. I came back to Banks as the Engineering Manager, did that for a couple of years before moving into my current position. I now provide a bridge between Engineering and Marketing, my responsibilities including the proper dissemination of Engineering Data to the public. Today our Engineering staff exceeds 30 people. All this to say that when it comes to Engineering data, we certainly know what it is, how to get it, and how to present it, and I am intimately involved in the process.

When we gather and analyze data, we look at everything; horsepower, torque, turbine inlet pressure and temperature, turbine outlet pressure and temperature, muffler inlet pressure, cat inlet pressure, intake manifold pressure and temperature, compressor discharge pressure and temperature, timing, fuel pressure, pulse width, opacity, air cleaner vacuum and temperature, ambient conditions, and more, sometimes up to 50 channels of information. When all is said and done, we look at how to best present the data. As long as I have been at Banks, we have made a practice of presenting data both in Peak-to-Peak format, and in a Best Gain format. Peak-to-Peak is a comparison of the very highest number on the horsepower or torque curve, from stock to performance enhanced, regardless of RPM. Best Gain represents the power improvement at a specific RPM, identifying the RPM at which the best gain in horsepower and torque occur. By nature, the best gain is always at least equal to, and in most cases better than the peak-to-peak gain. We have never made a secret of the fact that we advertise the best possible horsepower improvement. The fact that others only choose to advertise their peak-to-peak gains is simply an indication that they do not compare the complete set of data in the same way that we do. For instance, both of the dyno tests previously presented in these forums provide individual runs on individual sheets, indicating the peaks for horsepower and torque. Without overlaying that data, it is impossible to know what the best gains are. Therefore, the only point of comparison is peak-to-peak. As has already been mentioned, the peak-to-peak data agrees with our published peak-to-peak numbers. Nobody has done a best gain comparison with that data yet.
<P class=MsoNormal styl

Where are you located?

Azusa, California, about 10 miles east of Pasadena, right where the 210 and 605 freeways meet.

CPMac,


Maybe I should add a little truth to your post. Our top of the line PowerPack system for the 91-93 B 5.9L (12-valve) Cummins are priced at $2299.32. This includes a complete intercooler replacement. Our power gains are 70 hp and 240 lb-ft torque.


"Once you installed it you could tell absolutely no difference". Do you think all of the diesel shops that have been selling our products for 25 years would continue to sell this product if it didn't make a power difference? Don't you think the word might have gotten out by now, 15 years later?


Is the sky falling too? Posts like the one you just made are nothing but counterproductive b.s. Get your facts straight about the company you're going to slam. Your wasting everybody's time.

CPMac,


Maybe I should add a little truth to your post. Our top of the line PowerPack system for the 91-93 B 5.9L (12-valve) Cummins are priced at $2299.32. This includes a complete intercooler replacement. Our power gains are 70 hp and 240 lb-ft torque.


"Once you installed it you could tell absolutely no difference". Do you think all of the diesel shops that have been selling our products for 25 years would continue to sell this product if it didn't make a power difference? Don't you think the word might have gotten out by now, 15 years later?


Is the sky falling too? Posts like the one you just made are nothing but counterproductive b.s. Get your facts straight about the company you're going to slam. Your wasting everybody's time.





I had to quote this one to make sure it did not get deleted. Can a person be shocked and laugh their arce off at the same time??

Colin


The more I read about the trashing Banks takes the less I want to read. Banks has produced a quality product that is truly engineered. I have not heard of many of your customers that have experienced mechanical failures do to the addition of your product.


It seems that some contributors are not very open minded and only offer negative comments instead of offering constructive comments.


I thought it was nice that we had Vendors contribute to the forum it started off very informative but quickly turned ugly.


It wont be long before more members decide to just sit back and watch the hacking take place and soon it will be a ghost forum similar to the Page.


There is a lot of good that comes out of this forum hopefully this outweighs the hacking.


Concerned.Edited by: RanaExcavating1

I'll bet you Peter T. has forgot more about turbo charged diesels
and the PROPER &amp; SAFE WAY to make horsepower and torque than most of us will ever learn. maybe we need to look at what they are trying to tell us and then think about what we are really doing to our trucks in the long term. we all learn from trial and error and banks is only trying to market a product that is on the cutting edge of technology with safety features that eliminate the chance for human error. if nobody is willing to use these products and give info like I have on here for others to view and help make up their minds as to which one they want to use, how can technology be advanced. thanks Peter and Colin

Let’s not rewrite history. The page is a ghost forum due to MP's poor decision-making. It's as simple as that.


This is an open forum of diesel enthusiasts, not a professional society. There will always be loyalties, emotions, bickering, and the inevitable unscrupulous and/or unprofessional manufacturer/vendor/marketer trying to make a sale. I accept that, welcome the discussions, and enjoy reading the forums.


Let's try to stay focused on reality.

There is some good in this what appears to be madness at times ,,,, The delivery of info some times barbaric, but useful ....


A well informed public is the end result ....


Although the info provided is all valid ..... I have to wonder as to the reasoning to the ones most vocal,why .... I feel these individuals wouldn't consider the product in the first place ..... I wonder why do they feel shunned or were they previously ripped off ,or have an axe to grind ....?? We need to get back to questions and answer not a


http://dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/ZAF_080999borgman_600x366.jpg


Mac Edited by: Mackin

does anyone have stock 1/4 times

Let’s not rewrite history. The page is a ghost forum due to MP's poor decision-making. It's as simple as that.


This is an open forum of diesel enthusiasts, not a professional society. There will always be loyalties, emotions, bickering, and the inevitable unscrupulous and/or unprofessional manufacturer/vendor/marketer trying to make a sale. I accept that, welcome the discussions, and enjoy reading the forums.


Let's try to stay focused on reality.





I shouldn't have an opinion as to what you wrote but ,you are 100%correct as long as we don't insight a riot ...Edited by: Mackin

does anyone have stock 1/4 times


MotorTrend tested it at 16.8sec I forgot the MPH, but I can look it up if its important.

It was disappointing to have my PM ignored concerning this subject.





Anyhoo, now that I know where I stand...





I ordered and recently received my 6 gun/SL combo, and hope to test it soon!

Colin


The more I read about the trashing Banks takes the less I want to read. Banks has produced a quality product that is truly engineered. I have not heard of many of your customers that have experienced mechanical failures do to the addition of your product.


It seems that some contributors are not very open minded and only offer negative comments instead of offering constructive comments.


I thought it was nice that we had Vendors contribute to the forum it started off very informative but quickly turned ugly.


It wont be long before more members decide to just sit back and watch the hacking take place and soon it will be a ghost forum similar to the Page.


There is a lot of good that comes out of this forum hopefully this outweighs the hacking.


Concerned.





The information being disseminated here is valuable....to all parties.


The members at times will let the emotion of the moment get the best of them.......I do at times myself.


It is easy to get on a soap box and rant http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Unhappy.gif.


I am guilty at times myself as everyone is...........


I would like to say to all that the Forum is here for discussions of products, service, ideas......it is a very unique situation here.


We try to let things roll because discussion is good........I personally would like to see some of the personal arguments go away and turn into healthy discussions....at times the message get's lost due to bickering.


Although the facts can speak for themselves, the interpretation of those facts is up to each and everyone of us. We all come to a different conclusion and all have a difference of opinion.


I would urge a healthy dialogue to continue, I would also request that we all try to act more civil and put at least some of our emotions aside.


Sorry for the somewhat off topic post I am hopeful that we can all continue to learn here and not shoot ourselves in the foot with accusations and arguments.


Enough of the members here have spoken out about the bickering...


It's time we all start listening.





TONY

Fishhog


The only 1/4 mile times that will show before and after results would be to use the same truck, same day, same track and do the testing. From what I understand the six gun can be bypassed very quickly so one would only need to make a couple of passes then reconnect the unit and run a couple of more. This is the only true way to show what it does in the real world performance test. Takeing results from different trucks just give bogus results.

Colin I don't care what your current price is on the kit I am talking about what it cost in the early 90's and the kit went on a 90 truck without a intercooler so it wasn't a replacement but an addition. If you want I will scan the receipt but just realize you should never call me a liar again.

This is a tough crowd.....no doubt......but for the most part a very informed one. Buyer beware sums it all up. Hype does not equal horsepower even when supplied with cool stickers and exaggerated manufacturers claims.

BELLIGERENT- adj. Taking part in actions that are likely to provoke fighting. Inplies a warlike or hostile nature. Suggesting a readiness to fight.


CONTENTIOUS- adj. Suggests an inclination to argue or quarrel. Usually with annoying persistence.

I'm not sending a personal PM to PeterT or Colin Banks as some of us have. I'm typing it here that I appreciate their input, professionalism and openess. Most companies shun forums. Although it can be argued that all of the information presented by different people is valuable, I think it definitely has a limit. Looks like a couple of people here have an axe to grind or they just like to argue. Most of us see through their superficial ranting for what it is. Pretty clear on the charts where and when the HP/TQ is made, and pretty clear there are other factors to consider. Those of you who keep ranting look foolish. Let it go and take the high road. Use your energy more productively....in the end you just degrade yourself. Anyway..I wish to thank everyone for the continuing knowledge this forum provides.


Keep it up...


(Now I wait for the cut/paste and editing...geez!)


Harry K.


http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Approve.gif

HarryK, Moto Head,





You should see some of the fuel quality/injector, additive, and filtration threads....http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Ermm.gif

HarryK, Moto Head,





You should see some of the fuel quality/injector, additive, and filtration threads....http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Ermm.gif





Nahhh, my run of 543 HP takes the cake i think.... that was a record for # of views/replies until it was locked.Edited by: Got Juice?

YEA JUICE AND YOU WERE A NEWBIE WHEN YOU POSTED THAT. YOU GOT THE SAME TREATMENT THAT THE NEW GUYS OF LATELY HAVE GOTTEN.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Confused.gif MIGHT MAKE IT EASIER ON THE NEWCOMERS IF THEY COULD READ THE UN-WRITTEN RULES EH?http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif

NO JUST MAKE JUICE'S POST REQUIRED READING BEFORE JOINING.


oooooooooooooops, I wanted to feel like a NUT. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif

NO JUST MAKE JUICE'S POST REQUIRED READING BEFORE JOINING.


oooooooooooooops, I wanted to feel like a NUT. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif

Right never openly claim you made 2000 + pounds of torque and be a "Newbie" .... Otherwise people have many questions .....

Mac http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif

For those of you who don't want to read it, turn off your computer.





Banks claims in their advertising, "The highest horsepower tuner on the market."


Since their dyno chart shows an 85 hp gain, yet independent tests show more than 100hp, lets use the highest number seen so far, 113.8 (round up to 114hp).


Since this is a peak number, it can be directly compared to peak numbers from independent dyno runs using other modules or tuners.


The Quad 215 has made anywhere from 194hp to 220hp.


The Juice 125 makes 130 to 140hp.


TTS makes up around 200hp.


The VA box can make huge numbers... 200?


Stop me when I mention a box that makes less than 114hp. If the ad copy said, "The SAFEST, most exhaustively engineered box on the market" then I'd have no issue with that, but to say you have the HIGHEST HORSEPOWER on the market with only 85 or 114hp is just inviting some questions about who writes the ad copy and how much do they really know about the competition.


As far as engineering goes, my favorite example is: NASA spent millions ($10 million?) developing a pressurized ballpoint "space pen" that would work in zero G.


The Russians just used pencils.


Sometimes, the smarter guy doesn't have a degree, but he does have his shoes tied.

I agree. I'm dissapointed with my Banks Six-Gun w/speed loader. Hey Banks, let the people who bought your Six-Gun get a module upgrade for FREE. This time with something that performs. This thing falls flat on it's face halfway up the rpm gauge........

Graphite floating free in a zero G and ESD sensitive spacecraft environment? The Russians must not have been as concern with the longevity of their spacecraft. By the way those pens don't cost near the 10 million you falsely claim in your exagerated hyped up advertising. I get them free at work.

YEA JUICE AND YOU WERE A NEWBIE WHEN YOU POSTED THAT. YOU GOT THE SAME TREATMENT THAT THE NEW GUYS OF LATELY HAVE GOTTEN.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Confused.gif MIGHT MAKE IT EASIER ON THE NEWCOMERS IF THEY COULD READ THE UN-WRITTEN RULES EH?http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif





No kidding, maybe if we were as queer as southern california it would be more believable





Time for a drink of Canadian whisky and ride the G-Tech around a burning ring of steeltex tires

Got Juice,


You might want to rethink your 'queer as southern california' statement.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Disapprove.gif Some of us don't take kindly to such statements (especially those that are FALSE!!!!).http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Cool.gif

Graphite floating free in a zero G and ESD sensitive spacecraft environment? The Russians must not have been as concern with the longevity of their spacecraft. By the way those pens don't cost near the 10 million you falsely claim in your exagerated hyped up advertising. I get them free at work.


They write on the paper with it, they don't sprinkle it around. And what does ESD have to do with graphite? Nothing.


As far as the price goes, I put a question mark there for a reason, (READ it) and YES, they DID spend MILLIONS of taxpayers dollars on engineering it. The fact that you steal them means only one thing...

Got Juice,


You might want to rethink your 'queer as southern california' statement.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Disapprove.gif Some of us don't take kindly to such statements (especially those that are FALSE!!!!).http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Cool.gif








same about your sig..... you seem comfortable with it.

i suppose it would have been better if i spelled it Kalifornia ....then you woulda realised the humour in it and not gotten your panties in a wad!

Scotty wrote
"I agree I'm dissapointed with my Banks Six-Gun w/speed loader. Hey Banks, let the people who bought your Six-Gun get a module upgrade for FREE. This time with something that performs. This thing falls flat on it's face halfway up the rpm gauge"........

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gifMaybe edge will offer you a tradein

come on colin do some marketing.Edited by: sdaver

socaldmax, you need to relax. The ESD reference only shows the sensitivity of the environment. You have guys in bunny suits build it and then bring a graphite generating pencil on board. Not to mention sharpening them. Talk to a contamination guy about that.


BTW, the program offices give the pens/coffee cups/tee-shirts out for milestones etc.

If Edge does trade-ins, don't imagine they need to (http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif), I'd bet they would have a boat load of banks trade-ins.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Approve.gif

Oh yeah, before I forget, hopefully someone will get a tour of their facility, I'm sure it's very impressive with all of the engineering staff and advanced equipment they have.





I'd also like to see a pic of that room with the 400+ Edge boxes they took in trade, or if I get a tour, I'll snap a pic.

Steve,





i've toured the facility before.. almost 2 years ago now..

If they did take a bunch of trades of used edge boxes I wonder what % of those customers called within the first week of installing the Banks and wanted to trade back. Taking trade's on this type of material would seem helpfull to someone who had a less than adequate tuner or module but Banks doesn't appear to be a trade up for anyone.

I've toured the facility.

We are thinking about having a rally/dyno day this summer. Would some of you guys be interested in coming?

I'll be there.

Sure, its only five minute drive from Covina http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif

Colin


YOU NAME THE DATE

Southern California and Duramax trucks? Count me in.Edited by: Trippin

count me in

i'll be there to


02 chevy drw cc lb 4x4 lt.10 lug conversion,xde 245r 19.5 alcoas,afe,magnaflow,banks acutator,amsoil bypass,transynd,delvac 1,putco running boardsEdited by: tulsa1718

I'll be there!


The more I read about banks the more I like the company. Way to go Peter and Colin. Future Customerhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Approve.gif. The biggest issue for me is the saftey of my investment. But thanks to Trippin at the LA Dyno day and setting my stock truck up with one of his many power chips I was bitten by the HP bug. And yes I was the lucky guy who won the Grand Prize Banks 6 Gun and speed loader at the LA Dyno day. I want to say thank you again to Colin BANKS!! I will be doing the complete install of the BANKS SYSTEM.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif Thank you for the Forum DIESELPLACE.com

I don't what you've been reading, but recent reports are that banks has a long way to go to be competitive with the dmax power product community. Last weeknds dyno report had banks' enginerds leaving before the dyno attempt. Apparently the banks unit failed to perform and instead threw diagnostic codes. It doesn't sound like a Yippy Ki Ya time to go running to your local banks dealer

Ray,


To be fair, the 6 Gun they tried to install was not completely hooked up, they left a few wires off in an attempt to just get a quick run on it. The 6 Gun uses the same 2 large connectors as the Juice, but then there are 2 wires that need to be spliced into the TCM, which they didn't want to do for such a quick install effort.


I just don't want anyone to think that the unit didn't work - it was not fully installed. There might have been other issues as well, but with some of the wires disconnected, that would be my first guess as to why it didn't work.

I'll second what SoCal indicated. Most people had left and the Dyno shop was getting ready too close. So those that were left quickly scanned the instructions. The SixGun / SpeedLoader hardware was pieced together quickly. The TCM was not connected nor was the exhaust gas temperature sensor installed in the manifold (though the sensor was connected to the box). There was a small LED on the end of the unit that was flashing green then red. Everyone was too tired towards the end of the day to pursue it any further. One dyno run was made and essentially stock power was made.


The Banks unit looked to be of good quality construction (I've worked in the Electronics Industry for over 25 years). In some aspects, the connectors that are used are better than the Edge. The instruction manual that came with the unit is substantially better than what came with my Juice/Attitude combo. Once more of the Banks units are out there, I am certain there will many favorable reports on them. They are the new device on the market. It just does not have the widespread acceptance that the Edge Juice does.

Ray,


To be fair, the 6 Gun they tried to install was not completely hooked up, they left a few wires off in an attempt to just get a quick run on it. The 6 Gun uses the same 2 large connectors as the Juice, but then there are 2 wires that need to be spliced into the TCM, which they didn't want to do for such a quick install effort.


I just don't want anyone to think that the unit didn't work - it was not fully installed. There might have been other issues as well, but with some of the wires disconnected, that would be my first guess as to why it didn't work.


Ok, that's understandable. Thanks for clearing it up. I definitely want to be fair! http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Approve.gif

OK time to chime in on the banks box not working. it is not a plug &amp; play toy like most of them. without the 2 wires that monitor the tcc it will not add power. diagnostic code 2-4. without the thermocouple it will not add power resulting in stock fuel delivery. diagnostic code 2-3

OK time to chime in on the banks box not working. it is not a plug &amp; play toy like most of them. without the 2 wires that monitor the tcc it will not add power. diagnostic code 2-4. without the thermocouple it will not add power resulting in stock fuel delivery. diagnostic code 2-3


Thanks to all for pointing out what really went on and being fair. Head line should read "Trippin the idiot tries to scab in unit and fails miserably!" http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Cry.gif


Stay tuned. I want to get it over to the Superflow and do some serious load testing/comparing of EGTs to other units.


Jeff, enjoy the unit, it was cool of Colin and Peter to show up and make a donation to the event. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clap.gif


Edited by: Trippin

Actually, I prefer "Trippin made valent effort to get dyno numbers for Bank Unit at the end of a long day, but ran out of time"

Tomorrow hopefully...





Sounds like kind of a PITA install. How smart is this thing? Can it tell if the pyro temp is too cool? If not.I could just add a probe and leave it hang...

Tomorrow hopefully...





Sounds like kind of a PITA install. How smart is this thing? Can it tell if the pyro temp is too cool? If not.I could just add a probe and leave it hang...





Tomorrow??? Does that mean some dyno lovin?


I asked the same question and the Banks people said the thermocouple needs to see approx. 300 degrees to give you the top tune. I tried to wedge it between the exhaust manifold and the cylinder head.

Tomorrow hopefully...





Sounds like kind of a PITA install. How smart is this thing? Can it tell if the pyro temp is too cool? If not.I could just add a probe and leave it hang...

maybe you can fool it by having someone hold a torch to the probe while you run it on the dyno as i dont think it will add power until it sees a 300-400 degree egt. let me know if i can help with more info

You could likely fool it with a variable resistor. I think I saw specs of the range somewhere.

Im surprised there was not enought hot air blowing around to make it workhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif Would have worked in CT or FLhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif

I know compressor out temps top 400°.


I may try to latch onto the probe for my SPA, but the way that one reacts, we'll be pulling fuel in a couple of seconds.





I'm hoping to get it to just show true potential, and then come back and see what EGT limits will allow. I guess I could go post turbo with a clamp in style probe. How about the TCM connections, can we fool those? I just HATE to tie into wires like that. I regret doing this with my ATS trans as I now use a tuner to clip the speed limiter...

Im surprised there was not enought hot air blowing around to make it workhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif Would have worked in CT or FLhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif


And the point is........http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif


Thttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Embarrased.gifNY

I know compressor out temps top 400°.


I may try to latch onto the probe for my SPA, but the way that one reacts, we'll be pulling fuel in a couple of seconds.





I'm hoping to get it to just show true potential, and then come back and see what EGT limits will allow. I guess I could go post turbo with a clamp in style probe. How about the TCM connections, can we fool those? I just HATE to tie into wires like that. I regret doing this with my ATS trans as I now use a tuner to clip the speed limiter...

Do you know what it is that they are looking for? One is TC lockup from what I understand. What is the other? If you let me know what wires they are supposed to be hooked up to I might be able to help you fool them. Pin# and wire color would help a lot.

I know compressor out temps top 400°.


I may try to latch onto the probe for my SPA, but the way that one reacts, we'll be pulling fuel in a couple of seconds.





I'm hoping to get it to just show true potential, and then come back and see what EGT limits will allow. I guess I could go post turbo with a clamp in style probe. How about the TCM connections, can we fool those? I just HATE to tie into wires like that. I regret doing this with my ATS trans as I now use a tuner to clip the speed limiter...
owners manual says to skip tcc wiring harness if you have a manual trans so I WOULD SAY NOT TO PLUG IN THE HARNESS WITH THE BLUE AND GREY WIRE. To activate the speedloader these directions came straight from Banks
There has been some confusion about this sequence because we have had some variations in software in our product.
Here is a procedure that will work for your product no matter what version of software you have, or what you have done or been told previously. To detect the SpeedLoader after everything is installed: Set the switch to the #1 position. START the engine (previous instructions said Key On, Engine Off). Leave the switch in the #1 postion for at least 5 seconds while the engine is running. Move the switch to the #6 position for at least 5 seconds. Move the switch back to the #1 position for at least 5 seconds. The sequence is now complete.

Im surprised there was not enought hot air blowing around to make it workhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif Would have worked in CT or FLhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif


Sdaver, your bad............ROFLMAOhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif

Oh well, I vampired my TCC wires anyhow.





Couldn't get the Speed Loader to work, without installing the probe, and time ran out as we worked this aft on wiring the dyno in permanently.


L6 was like 720ft lbs and 343 HP IIRC.