Who has had fowler engines from columbus ohio make them 2 sets of aluminum rods? They told me today that they shipped two sets down to texas somewhere and was wondering what machine work it took to get fowler rods to fit and if they were holding up.... May make a good choice for people wanting rods!

Yes I have them, and they are soon to go on the dyno. , here is a picture of them, and the Pistons I used. I am now getting my rods from GRP, IMO they have more experience in this area. I have been using this combination in one other motor, and they work fine. The total bob weight is 2690 grams.
I did not do this to reduce rotating weight as much as to get internal balance. The stroke is 3.750 with a 4.125 bore making a 400 cid. I used Aluminum rods because they are inexpensive, around $1200 for 10. A good rule of racing is to have a few spares. If you need help on spec, pm me ,

this is a GRP rod
http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa147/GREG560/CIMG0007-1.jpg

What is unknown is how many laps the rods will last, at relative low rpms I would check bearings every 5 or so laps until fatigue life is known. I usually check bearings in my Comp engines every weekend, or at least cut the filter open. If I had to guess the life it will be 100 to 150 laps, the gas rods are much lighter and we only run them 75 laps.
I have ordered rods in Steel that are hemi big end and 1.156 wrist pins. The weight savings between these two rods will only be about 100 to 150 grams.
All in all who knows the rods may last a long time, I have seen aluminum rods on low rpm gas bracket motors go 500 laps, and several people have run them on street motors

Cylinder Pressure and weight are what kill AL rods. So if we do nothing other than to compare a duramax cylinder pressure and bob weight to a similar set of conditions you would have a good starting spot to assume what the rods might hold up too. If you are talking a race engine with boost in the 60 psi + range then that fits with a Top Fuel Drag race engine for cylinder pressure but the top fuel engine is less on the weight side. With that in mind a Top Fuel engine replaces the rods about every 20 passes down the 1/4 mile. If your willing to take it apart every 20 or so passes or hooks for sled pullers and replace the rods it maybe something for you to look at. Yes, they are cheaper but it only takes a few replacements trips and you spent more in time and money than buying a good set of steel rods that will last a lifetime for most people out there. So its pay a little now or a lot later IMHO.

Yes, they are cheaper but it only takes a few replacements trips and you spent more in time and money than buying a good set of steel rods that will last a lifetime for most people out there. So its pay a little now or a lot later IMHO.
Good advice.

x2 on what Steve said. Having to tear down a duramax that often to replace rods (that really arent that much cheaper) every 20 passes is absurd. I mean jeez head gaskets alone cost you almost $200 every time you take it apart. Plus couple hundred bucks in gaskets/seals, new bearings, etc.

Even just tearing it down once or twice with your "cost effective" aluminum rods, you just bought yourself a set of crower/carillo/R&R/howards rods.

ben

I think they will go more than 20 laps, 50 would be worth it , but I think it will be more like 100 laps.

A fuel motor is lucky to get 1 pass on the rods now, but that’s at 8500 to 9000 rpms at 8000+ hp and 5000 lbs. of torque.

I will check bearings every 4 or 5 passes until I'm sure how far they will go, the rods are really over kill at this point , until be find out how much we can back down from safe.

If you going to go fast there is a price, and turning the motor hard is what it takes to make a car work correctly.

What you will find when you get really light , the power you make on a 6000 lbs. truck doesn’t correspond to a 1700 lbs. dragster , where the acceleration rates in 1st gear are in the 800 rpms per second range.

The rotating assembly is dramatically lighter, the fluidamper weights 3 lbs. , the flywheel weighs 4.5 lbs. . The crank is much lighter with the rod throws down to hemi. With the shorter stroke the counter weight on the crank is built up to save on heavy metal. I don’t believe in making the motor bigger if you can’t flow enough air to properly feed It at a reasonable rpm, that allows you to get away from destructive peak torque .
We went as crazy of heads as possible to find air flow.

here is the Aluminum Dmax Fluidamper ballancer.


http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa147/GREG560/IMAG0246.jpg

here is the car with its Chevy Trailblazer little brother in the forground, this car gives you the back ground I come from in engine development and thought.
I know there is a learning curve, but that what makes a racer , to work outside the box , on in this case do what we do on other high preformance engine programs . We had a long learning curver with the trailblazer engine program, and now its one of the quickest comp cars in the country , running 7.80's with a 260 inch engine on gasoline only

http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa147/GREG560/282142_1903773749885_1107968363_31704869_7507239_n .jpg

Steve I absolutely respect your opinion, and in your area, your expertise is the knowledge that some chapters in the book will be written.
What I am doing here is take a engine and make it work like a drag racing engine, in a mainstream environment. I will be racing this car at NHRA and IHRA events in both Top Dragster and Super Comp , where the motors must accelerate, and must instantly get up on the pipe. The boost levels that we need are very low, very very low in fact. This ability to make power at low boost will make this engine respond. The heads and cam timing make the difference .

Cylinder Pressure is the key to it all and the rod has to absorb it and not fail. 99 3/4% of the people out there are running 6000 + lbs trucks and an AL rod just isn't going to cut it there. For the few that are building a dragster it might be an option but I do not think they will show much difference in the RPM per second war against a steel rod in a duramax engine. For those willing to hang it out on the edge and get it all at any cost, maybe.

I have run many, many motors with aluminum rods. I think they have merit but not so much with the motor's rpm's. I think they will help with crank life, bearings and block issues. I'll bet money if your fluid dampner is only 3 lbs. (which I don't believe) You will have crank problems. It could be a soild hub at 3 lbs. but if it has a ring inside it weighs more than 3 lbs. Good luck. Jeff

The balancer is all aluminum, even the hub. The fly wheel is aluminum as well. The problem In my educated opinion is the counter weight on the front of the Dmax caused an unbelievable amount of problems in the front bearing. One great aspect of the aluminum rod is that it does have the ability to absorb shock. What most people perceive to be rod failures is really a bearing failure. I feel that no matter what the rod material if the bearing doesn’t have enough oil, and it grabs, it will break or bend the rod. I also believe that tuning for that last little bit of low rpm torque is another problem. Sure the low rpm torque feels good in a truck, but it’s the most destructive cause of unit load failure.
Get the balance inside then engine is critical to making these engines stay together at higher rpms. The aluminum rods aid in this, taking 700 to 1000 grams of bob weight is an added benefit.
These rods make fuel rods look puny, and after 20 or 30 laps, we will evaluate removal of further weight.
As to the ability of the motor to RevGain, its critical to making a light car work,
If I was building a street truck, it would have your rods Steve.
http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa147/GREG560/IMAG0245.jpg


http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa147/GREG560/IMAG0150-1.jpg

I have had this flywheel for about 3 years now , I asked Reactor to build it , funny thing , the new and improved ring gear that the gassers are using is really a Dmax ring gear



http://i200.photobucket.com/albums/aa147/GREG560/268724_217381888298350_212116095491596_570325_5052 630_n.jpg

What most people perceive to be rod failures is really a bearing failure. I feel that no matter what the rod material if the bearing doesn’t have enough oil, and it grabs, it will break or bend the rod.

Have to agree here. Most times someone says they dropped a rod, there is a scored or non-existant bearing to it.

Have to agree here. Most times someone says they dropped a rod, there is a scored or non-existant bearing to it.

all of the broken/bent [stock] duramax rods ive seen never had any crashed rod bearings.

I am by no means implying that the stock powdered metal rods are great, but most failures are attributed to tuning, from either going to crazy, or loading the motor down low. Cylinder pressure is an issue, on any engine. In the old days before good data loggers, I watch the old top fuel tuners measure bearing crush on each cylinder to tune too. The aluminum rod is not for everyone, I will say its for people that want to go to the edge in drag racing. The higher you make power the faster you will go, that is just the physics of drag racing. Engine development is the same whether gas of diesel, these are just air pumps; get more air in, it makes more power. More RPMs gives you the opportunity to get more air in, if the cylinder head and car profile program can match it, The current cylinder heads that we are working with flow well above 300 cfm and the valves want to be lifter above .600. I have also found enormous gain in cam profiles.
This may today seem like crazy forward thinking, but go back to what I have always said, “diesel development is 30 years behind the gas work in innovative curve . Those that have experience in gas engine development programs, have the road map of history already laid out.
So to aluminum rods, in high rpm drag racing engine programs, and , in limited turbo charged engines like 2.6 , even more important.

Greg

You had better rethink your 2.6" limited charger idea. Currently with that size charger and #2 only we are producing over 900 Hp and over 1500 ft lbs with peak engine speed of 5500 RPM. I just do not think that the AL rod is going to handle that for very long even if its a drag race application.

The guys I’m working with on 2.6 developments are well over 1000 hp with boost levels less than 25 lbs. of boost. The peak torque numbers are unknown, as they never run the engine below 4500.
I know that at lower rpms the diesel makes big cylinder pressure, and the answer is simple, don’t run them down there. Top fuel rods take torque numbers 3 times the amount you’re talking about.
I plan on 1400 + HP and never allowing that big torque, until the engine is above 4500, the stall of my convertor. You know if you tune the destructive torque out of the lower part of the power curve, you have a more reliable engine, I’m not trying to make big numbers by grunting the motor on the dyno, but big numbers on the race track

The torque number I've given you is up at 3800- 4000 RPM so they are not down low but we make more boost than 25 lbs. In any case good luck with the AL rods.