Who's pulled with the Allison in 1st gear hi-range and what was your results?

I think everybody that pulls knows 4th gear is A LOT taller gear than 3rd. I did some testing today, all at 3000rpms, and came up with the following:

22mph - 3rd gear low range
25mph - 1st gear high rang
28mph - 4th gear low range

For those looking for something in between 3rd and 4th in 4-low, 1st high seems like a good option. I wonder how torque converter lockup works in tow haul, with and without the Co-Pilot. Someone told me the CoPilot can lock the TC somewhere in 1st.

Who's done it? How'd it work?

Doug

I keep wondering the same thing about locking the TC in 1st, but the only answer I've ever gotten is that it will not lock in 1st. Mike L. has commented that a Tech II can command the lockup, but IIRC Steve, John, and Eric believe that it does not actually happen. The quote I remember is "it is hydraulically impossible."

Experts, correct me if I'm wrong.

To get the converter locked up in 1st high you need to get into 2nd gear, lock-up then downshift back into first. No lock-up in 1st is what makes 3rd low a better gear. Also you have the option of shifting up to 4th if needed or downshifting to 2nd if needed.

Ive Tried 4hi 1st Sometimes But You Have To Have Ther Right Track Conditions, If Not You Will Get Beat By Trucks That Are Not Suppose To Beat You, If Your Converter Is Not Locked You Will Not Get Your Full Transfer Of Power, Thats Why Drag Racing As Soon As You Go Into Second You Nedd To Be Locked Or You Will Not Have A Good Et. Just My $.02

I tried 4lo 3rd twice last year and my truck pulled like crap. Switched to 4hi 1st and pretty much walked away from everybody and won the COTPA diesel class. It seemed like it was a perfect gear for the traction and hp i had last year.

This year is a different story. Next pull, i will be pulling with 4hi 1st as i have 2 pulls this year in 4lo 3rd and they were less than stellar with the hp i have now. This past weekend i figured i would try 4lo 4th....well -:t -:t -:t -:t -:t it was the worse pull i have ever done :mad: I asked to come back as an exibition at the end of the class, and i chose to go with 4lo 3rd to compare. It went better, but less than impressed. Trucks that i beat last year are now beating me, and i have 100+ more hp and they have stayed with the same hp :(

I had a better pulling truck last year than right now. So i am going back to what i know worked awesome on my truck last year and see if it is any better, got nothing to loose. Alot has to do with track condition, sled weight and transfer speed as well. I analyze all the pull vids posted and i know we don't have the same tracks that Tomac and Ryan pull on, so whatever they do necesaraly(sp) doesn't work for me, and its quite apparant with my results thus far compared to theres.

I don't have a co-pilot, but do know a guy who does, and the last pull he went to, he had to turn the co-pilot off as his first pull(test puller luckily) was making the converter lock and unlock and caused some bouncing and jerking. Turned it off for the next pull and it was smooth.

If i was a betting man i would have to say it has to do with the converter of choice not gelling with the co-pilot as my buds truck has the tts converter, Nick has it, Doug, and BigD. Coincidence :think: that all 4 trucks had issues running the tts converter with the co-pilot on, then turn the co-pilot off and problem gone. Just speaking out loud...........not knocking either product as they both rock, but just don't know if they can get along together and not cause a problem while pulling. Personally i don't think you need a co-pilot with the tts converter for pulling, but thats my opinion:cool:

Thanks for all the input fellas. I might try 1st high next time and see what happens. I know theoretically I'm not getting all the power to the ground if the TC is unlocked, but my TC makes torque like mad, so I might be okay. It will be different going from 0-whatever in 1 gear; I'm so used to popping off 1-2-3 in low-range. To bad we can't get lockup in the top of 1st.

If i was a betting man i would have to say it has to do with the converter of choice not gelling with the co-pilot as my buds truck has the tts converter, Nick has it, Doug, and BigD. Coincidence :think: that all 4 trucks had issues running the tts converter with the co-pilot on, then turn the co-pilot off and problem gone. Just speaking out loud...........not knocking either product as they both rock, but just don't know if they can get along together and not cause a problem while pulling. Personally i don't think you need a co-pilot with the tts converter for pulling, but thats my opinion:cool:

thats interesting, strange this would all pop up at the same time, there was a couple of pulls with stock air and sticks that it shifted funny,

Since I have never looked into what the co-pilot does, anything is possible. What I can say is that the converter only does what it's told to do. The major difference in our converter is the higher torque multiplication when not in lock-up, once the clutch is locked up all the converters are equal unless the clutch is slipping. Since the problem BigD is having is well after lockup it's a co-pilot problem or transmission problem. Remember that the transmission shifts from gear to gear using output shaft speed as a control. So if it shifts to 4th gear and the shaft speed slows the TCM will command a downshift to 3rd. If 3rd gains shaft speed above the set point it will command a shift to 4th again.

To get the converter locked up in 1st high you need to get into 2nd gear, lock-up then downshift back into first. No lock-up in 1st is what makes 3rd low a better gear. Also you have the option of shifting up to 4th if needed or downshifting to 2nd if needed.

Doe that really work? I've commanded the Tech 2 to lock in first and it seems that it is hydraulically unavailable.

My expereince with 4 hi is that unlocked converter does not yield enough wheel speed to match RPM. Regardless of what you have for a converter, it is hard to get slip percentages into the 90's without going out way past HP peak.


Heartbeat,
If you have the power go for 4th low...

Doe that really work? I've commanded the Tech 2 to lock in first and it seems that it is hydraulically unavailable.

My expereince with 4 hi is that unlocked converter does not yield enough wheel speed to match RPM. Regardless of what you have for a converter, it is hard to get slip percentages into the 90's without going out way past HP peak.


Heartbeat,
If you have the power go for 4th low...

I ended up going back to 4hi 1st for 2 pulls, and the truck seemed to do better, but still not what i think its potential is.

Since then i have been running 4lo 4th gear and haven't been doing too bad. I let the truck rev out in 3rd to 4000 and shift to 4th when i have some ground speed and had the revs up there for a bit, then shift(ussually by 100ft). I still am turning 3800-4100 in 4th. OUr tracks are far from hp tracks and i still turn close to 4000rpm in 4th.

This weekend is finally a hp track and our final pull, so it wil be a 4 low 3rd gear and i'll let her scream, as i need 3 points to take 1st and keep the throphy:o:

I have actually ran 2nd high in a test hook before, I don't think it locked up as it would of fell on its face, in yielded about .5mph slower ground speed than 3rd low did. Don't know the distances. This was on a fairly decent biting track.

Just remember anytime you run in 4hi you put more stress on the tranny IE input shaft... 4low takes stress of the trans but puts more stress on the drivetrain after the t case...

It just depends on the track, Loose track I pull 4hi 2nd gear Im just giving a example because I dont have a auto,Our a D Max-:t :joke:

Jeremy,

You might try 4th a bit earlier. Not sure if your turbo will take it, but if the opportunity presents itself (first hook of the class etc) I'd not be afraid to try it.

Jeremy,

You might try 4th a bit earlier. Not sure if your turbo will take it, but if the opportunity presents itself (first hook of the class etc) I'd not be afraid to try it.

I found that if i went to 4th too early i would just blow the tires away still. Not enough ground speed to let 4th work like it should, just dig bigger trenches.

The tracks we are running on are total crap, i would be doing alot better with my last years power as the power to traction ratio is not in my favour. The sled operators are also stuffing us huge time. For an example, last year i constantly ran 22-24 mph with full pulls all the time. This year, 18mph -:t and full pulls are few and far between, usually we are in the 250-280 range.

I have thought about going to 4hi 2nd and see if it would work better, but didn't want to chance loosing more points, as i allready lost to many this year trying new stuff, which resulted me 2 points behind 1st :mad:.

Has anyone tried 3rd gear hi with an alli?

Has anyone tried 3rd gear hi with an alli?

Dude, that would be like >35 mph.....what are you thinking? :confused:

I tried 4lo 3rd twice last year and my truck pulled like crap. Switched to 4hi 1st and pretty much walked away from everybody and won the COTPA diesel class. It seemed like it was a perfect gear for the traction and hp i had last year.

This year is a different story. Next pull, i will be pulling with 4hi 1st as i have 2 pulls this year in 4lo 3rd and they were less than stellar with the hp i have now. This past weekend i figured i would try 4lo 4th....well -:t -:t -:t -:t -:t it was the worse pull i have ever done :mad: I asked to come back as an exibition at the end of the class, and i chose to go with 4lo 3rd to compare. It went better, but less than impressed. Trucks that i beat last year are now beating me, and i have 100+ more hp and they have stayed with the same hp :(

I had a better pulling truck last year than right now. So i am going back to what i know worked awesome on my truck last year and see if it is any better, got nothing to loose. Alot has to do with track condition, sled weight and transfer speed as well. I analyze all the pull vids posted and i know we don't have the same tracks that Tomac and Ryan pull on, so whatever they do necesaraly(sp) doesn't work for me, and its quite apparant with my results thus far compared to theres.

I don't have a co-pilot, but do know a guy who does, and the last pull he went to, he had to turn the co-pilot off as his first pull(test puller luckily) was making the converter lock and unlock and caused some bouncing and jerking. Turned it off for the next pull and it was smooth.

If i was a betting man i would have to say it has to do with the converter of choice not gelling with the co-pilot as my buds truck has the tts converter, Nick has it, Doug, and BigD. Coincidence :think: that all 4 trucks had issues running the tts converter with the co-pilot on, then turn the co-pilot off and problem gone. Just speaking out loud...........not knocking either product as they both rock, but just don't know if they can get along together and not cause a problem while pulling. Personally i don't think you need a co-pilot with the tts converter for pulling, but thats my opinion:cool:



I have called ATS and asked how the co-pilot works for pulling(because I recently started pulling) and was told that the main level adjustment being all the way to the right is for drag racing which overrides the tcm's control of lock-up. I was told that if the co-pilot is bumped 1 "click" back from right it will allow for the tcm to control lock-up and eliminate the problems mentioned. I think it works only because I have done it and had good results. Hope this is of help to anyone having co-pilot troubles.

nwpadmax-

Thats a lot of wheel speed for a sled to slow down. I have a feelin not all of third would be used so that when the tranny downshifts to second i would think the tc would be locked could be wrong:confuzeld