I was thinking about a water methenol injection kit for my lbz. Anyone have an opinion on these setups? Any suggestions for a kit and do they help mileage. My mods are Triple dog economy tune, transgo jr, 4" exhaust, egr blockoff w/fingerstick. Looking for economy and better towing.

Noboby running these?

im loving it, got a stage 3 by snow and all is great.
as for milage, ive been to distracted as my egt gauge gets eyeballed too often, watching the needle rise real slow.:D

i run minus 35 bluewindshield wassher and there is about 30% meth or so ihear.

iirc, the horse power gain was around 50extra,using blue wash,,and maybe more with other blends:)

I think this thread will get moved to the Fuel Section...as it should be. Derrikdude..take a good look before ya post..there is dedicated section for water meth...and a good one at that.!

Wish I could answer your query..its something I want to do too...when the coin allows.

cheers,

Theo

I have the labonte setup on my truck. They will help keep you cool but I haven't noticed any gains in mpg.

Sorry about posting in the wrong area, I will pay more attention to my random queries. Thanks though I was thinking about a Labonte it has the gauges.

moved to Propane, Nitrous, & Water Meth

I have the labonte setup on my truck. They will help keep you cool but I haven't noticed any gains in mpg.
How much cooler? Mines getting pretty hot at the track again. I read where distilled water doesn't contaminate your oil as bad either. That's all I'd spray is water anyhow.

subscribed....

Someone posted in another thread about a cost analysis on water meth, to see what savings , if any in fuel costs there was and it got me to thinking about it...no one has ever really done that, that I have seen. It does reduce EGT's but is it cost effective?

If you should only run distilled water (to reduce mineral deposits/oil analysis) That is like $1.99 a gallon . How much is methanol per gallon now? in a 55 gallon drum, it used to be about $5.00 per gallon, but it's pretty caustic to handle and have around. I wouldn't want to run windsheild washer soap through my engine, but even that is over $2.00 per gallon, even though it's a mix/blend being used.

How long does a gallon last? How many miles? at say 50/50 or 30/70?

Thanks1

I dynoed an extra 70 hp and 100 ft lbs torque with the labonte kit. I run a #10 and a #14 nozzle. When I am out racing around I dump in -20 blue washer and add a bottle of yellow heat for extra methanol. :) When driving or towing I use the -20 blue washer fluid. Works awesome when your towing, especially when your climbing hills. My tranny rarely downshifts :D

around here distilled water is $.93 a gallon

sometimes I can get the -20 blue for a little over a buck. When I find it I buy a couple cases. you wont get any power from water. When its not on sale its like a 1.60 or so a gallon.

How many miles do you get to a tank of meth. How big is your tank?

Yeah I have been thinking about adding a water meth kit to my truck too. Seems to be some easy and relatively cheap horsepower that helps you run safer. I almost picked up a used kit for 150 bucks the other day but figured I should research it first lol.

Running washer fluid thru my engine scares me though.

A buddy of mine has a 6 gallon tank and when he pulls his large 5er with his Ford he uses about 6 gallons in 250 miles when pulling in hilly terrain. I have drilled and tapped my intake for a system but have not put one in yet as I would only use it when pulling my 5er to cool the EGT's down.

Got mine today. Thanks dave. snow stage 3

How many miles do you get to a tank of meth. How big is your tank?

I just tapped into the bottom of my washer tank, so when its getting low the dash beeps at me. It will last me a week if I dont beat on it all the time, but sometimes I fill it every 3 days :) I dont tow very much, and I would recommend a bigger tank if you do.

Yeah I have been thinking about adding a water meth kit to my truck too. Seems to be some easy and relatively cheap horsepower that helps you run safer. I almost picked up a used kit for 150 bucks the other day but figured I should research it first lol.

Running washer fluid thru my engine scares me though.

Just make sure you only run the blue washer fluid when its spraying. It will also keep your intake clean.

Just make sure you only run the blue washer fluid when its spraying. It will also keep your intake clean.
http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=324274

I'm patiently waiting for Banks...

But I don't know how much longer I can wait

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=324274

WOW! I was just referring to blue washer fluid compared to the others like, purple power, the green stuff, basically the fluid with de-icer in it. I had no idea about all the minerals in the washer fluid. That explains my last oil analysis! They thought I had a head gasket leak! Well, Im shutting down the system until I can find straight meth and distilled water. Any local stores sell methanol? And what ratio do you mix it at? whats minimum and what maximum? I will post my oil analysis on the other page that you sent me.
I really appreciate you sending me that link! Now I know whats going on in my engine!

Thanks for the info. I did get a snow mpg max stage three kit still can't wait to install it.

RJ, you can get methanol in the HEET bottles, and the walmart windshield wiper fluid concentrate that some stores have is also 100% methanol. The ratio is not something I can help with though

RJ, you can get methanol in the HEET bottles, and the walmart windshield wiper fluid concentrate that some stores have is also 100% methanol. The ratio is not something I can help with though

Yah the heet bottles work good :). What is the other fluid that your talking about at walmart with 100% methanol?

Yah the heet bottles work good :). What is the other fluid that your talking about at walmart with 100% methanol?

Some people on the devil's own board talked about a windshield wiper fluid concetrate being sold at Walmart, it was 100% Methanol, and cheaper than HEET, but I can't find it on the walmart site

http://www.alcohol-injection.com/forum/types-alcohol-mixtures/wal-mart-windshield-washer-fluid-concentrate-1688.html

I will check the 2 walmarts that are close to my house tomorrow. If I find it, I will post some pics up. Thanks for the info. Rob

I will check the 2 walmarts that are close to my house tomorrow. If I find it, I will post some pics up. Thanks for the info. Rob

Good luck. I don't know if you will find it or not. The topic seems to have dropped off the map, and even a search on google just turned up this thread and the devil's own thread.

For fluids -20 to -25F window wash average about 30-35% meth. Adding 2 of the 12oz Yellow bottles of HEET (99.9% meth) to 1 gal wwf gets you close to a 50/50 mix. 50/50 is good for about 50-70 rwhp gain, 100% gets you little over 100rwhp but EGTs are going to go up so not recommended for towing or daily driver.

Typical fluid usages will vary based on how heavy you are on the throttle, but average should be 65-75 miles per gal of injection fluid. Or estimate about 10% of diesel fuel used.

FYI - the DIS-S4 is now available for LB7, LLY, LBZ and LMM. Upgrades over the previous S3 kits include EGT probe input and fluid monitoring

http://www.labontemotorsports.com/store/media/ccp0/prodlg/DIS_S4_md.jpg

More info here:
http://www.labontemotorsports.com/store/ccp0-prodshow/DIS_S4.html

can this be added to the 100 system?

can this be added to the 100 system?

Are you asking can a DIS-100 kit be upgraded to a S4 system? If so yes. Would be replacing the VC-100 controller with the S4 and adding a second solenoid and smaller pre-injection nozzle.

You can upgrade just about any system since the S4 has self calibration to flow map any nozzle or 12v pump combination.

Can you send me a price on the upgrade. Thanks bud

Can you send me a price on the upgrade. Thanks bud

Can do an upgrade kit for $425.00. Includes S4 controller with Touchscreen, solenoid, M2 pre-injection nozzle with holder some other fittings and 15ft extra of meth line. About $70 savings over regular price.

Why not just go to the local hot rod shop or chemical supply and buy 100% methanol?

Can I use my SoCal Diesel super boost manifold for the water/meth injection nozzles? I have my boost gauge installed there but there is 2 more ports for other stuff.

Interesting thread, once i get a LBZ ill be looking further into this work on a local sprint car team and we run the car on methanol so its readily available for me. Looks like a great mod.

Interesting thread, once i get a LBZ ill be looking further into this work on a local sprint car team and we run the car on methanol so its readily available for me. Looks like a great mod.

Been to a couple Outlaw Sprint Car races, funny how those little small block sound like blown alky big blocks in the pits.

Been to a couple Outlaw Sprint Car races, funny how those little small block sound like blown alky big blocks in the pits.

Nothing like standing between two 900-1000hp 410s as they are getting them up to temps and clearing them out. You can feel your chest suddenly taking a different beat. Cousin used to run ISMA Super modifieds with 454s those are another great sounding motor.

We run a smaller version a 360cu its around 600-700hp and still 1375+/- lbs. Awesome.

Can I use my SoCal Diesel super boost manifold for the water/meth injection nozzles? I have my boost gauge installed there but there is 2 more ports for other stuff.

Yes that makes install simpler now that a number of aftermarket manifolds are now being built with bungs for the meth injection. Dollar per hp its about the best mod you can do for your truck. Just for little over $400 looking at 50-70 rwhp gain with 50/50 fluid. Lower egts, some increase in mpg and reduced carbon build up so engine breaths better.

Someone posted in another thread about a cost analysis on water meth, to see what savings , if any in fuel costs there was and it got me to thinking about it...no one has ever really done that, that I have seen. It does reduce EGT's but is it cost effective?

If you should only run distilled water (to reduce mineral deposits/oil analysis) That is like $1.99 a gallon . How much is methanol per gallon now? in a 55 gallon drum, it used to be about $5.00 per gallon, but it's pretty caustic to handle and have around. I wouldn't want to run windsheild washer soap through my engine, but even that is over $2.00 per gallon, even though it's a mix/blend being used.

How long does a gallon last? How many miles? at say 50/50 or 30/70?

Thanks1


Both Walmart and my local Culligan sell distilled water for $0.80 per gallon

Meth by the 55 gallon drum has run about $2.25-2.75 per gallon.

I'll be getting another drum by the end of the year and will post the price

what ratio do you mix it at?

Summer I run straight water when towing and about 10% not towing

Winter I just mix it strong enough to keep from freezing.

IIRC 25%meth will get you down to 0F approx

we are board jumpin. lol Have you ever ran 50/50? I wonder what is the safest, and what will give you the most power

I've run 50/50 occasionally. And when I dyno'ed I ran 50/50. Just for most daily driving I keep the meth % lower

thanks for the info! Whats the max you think? Just for dyno and the track.

we are board jumpin. lol Have you ever ran 50/50? I wonder what is the safest, and what will give you the most power

The answer for both in the gas world is water. water is the safest is a good working system, and will make the most power because it has the highest octane(unlimited), but you have to tune really really really lean for it to work.

Water on the diesel, in a good working system is safer in that it can't cause premature ignition, but since it doesn't burn the higher compression of the diesel stands a higher risk of hyrdolock(only in an improperly working system). I don't know enough about the diesel yet to say on the power thing.

When I had the banks system in my truck before EFI, and my smaller nozzles(8 and a 10 i believe), I dynoed 510, and 962. Since then I upgraded to EFI, put 2 bigger nozzles in(10 and a 14) and it was like 40 hp before and 70 with the bigger ones. All on blue washer fluid with 2 bottles of heat added. Now that I see what happens to the oil when washer fluid is run, I turned my system off until I find straight meth and I can mix my own. I know water cools, and meth gives you the power, just trying to figure out what ratio is the max I can run.

Nice #s. I've been too chicken to dyno with a tune in + the meth on. 462/970 was enough for me on my stock trans and engine

Thanks! I would be a lil hesitant on a stock tranny too. Well I just stopped at wally world and picked up some prestone de icer washer fluid. The ingredients are:
methyl alcohol (67-56-1) ethylene glycol (107-21-1) water (7732-18-5) and silicone copolymer.

Does this sound safe to run? Protects to -34

Pretty sure the ethylene glycol and silician are no-no's

Thanks. Wasn't sure. Some were talking about it on another thread. I just need to find straight meth :)

The thing about running wws that worries me and noone has answered for me yet was


Long term use, running wws or tap water, are the levels of minerals in the oil acceptable for a meth injected vehicle. OR are the minerals going to cause problems with build up down the road?

Yea the lab thought your truck and mine might have a blown headgasket. But they were comparing the results based on a non-meth injected engine

They said I may have a hg problem but that was over 125,000 miles ago. And I'm pretty satisfied that it was from the water sources.

I'm thinking about doing an egr delete and intake heater delete. That will have my intake off and allow a look at what 150,000 miles of spray looks like on it

Well since my last lab result I have changed my oil and put the dual remote filtration system on and turned off my water meth injection. When I had the lab result done I forgot to tell them about the system. I am going to do another test in a couple more thousand miles. Then after I find some straight meth and mix it with distilled water, I will do another test. It looks like the tap water is the bad part. I'd be curious to see what your looks like when you pull it apart. Before I blocked my egr, at about 40,000 miles, my heater intake was caked with soot! It took me about an hour to clean it. It was about an 1/8 inch thick black gel around the entire inside. I dot the egr block and meth injection at the same time. Everytime I take out my nozzles for inspection I look in the intake and it looks clean. The injection system is suppose to help with the cleaning I was told. But blocking the egr was the Best thing to help the buildup in the intake. I had a buddy with the same truck and mods and he put the blocker in when new. At 40,000 miles when we took it apart to install the meth injection, his intake was spotless! That's when I was sold on the blocking the egr.

Unless you flushed out all the used oil, you might want to consider waiting until the 2nd oil change to pull a sample. a bit of oil remains in the pan when you change it. Either way, the mineral levels should come down unless you do actually have a coolant leak

No it doesn't. methyl alcohol will burn, the rest won't, at least in the way you want them to, cleanly.

If you can raise the front of the truck on the lift 10 inches or so it drains alot and you have to wonder if that's why the oil gets black so fast after it's changed with new clean oil. Mine stays cleaner longer from that trick. Did the same trick with my Jeep diesel and it helped there too.

No it doesn't. methyl alcohol will burn, the rest won't, at least in the way you want them to, cleanly.

Methanol will burn, to a point. If excessive amounts are introduced to the intake, beyond what will combust, it will seep past the rings and into the oil pan.

Now, on the plus side, methanol evaporates at a really fast rate. Not so fast when mixed with cold or luke warm oil, but fairly quickly when mixed with oil at temps above 210F.

Some Top-Alcohol and Pro-Mod teams actually save their used racing oil, fill a drum with it, and boil it, removing water and methanol impurities. They will do this for a couple of races prior to recycling it. It saves a bunch of money in oil costs.

So, my points are this. Don't introduce anything into a combustion process that is not flammable. Don't introduce anything in excess trying to lower IAT (intake air temps) that could cause ring or bearing damage (methanol is NOT a lubricant).