Okay I searched for topics related to this, but as you can imagine, I get a TON of results when I type in diesel, fuel, etc lol

Is the diesel that comes from one gas station better than another? I.E. Chevron vs. Valero?

I know you can get a bad batch of diesel on occasion, maybe from a small gas station, but if we put Chevron diesel and Valero diesel next to each other, would there be a difference?

I do not think the fuel is better at one station compared to another, most states have minimun requirements with at least 40 for a cetane number, some stations advertise a higher cetane number. I think it is all in the amount a station pumps, if fuel sits to long in a tank , you have water contamination, dirt contamination and bacteria contamination. At home I try to fill up at the same station all the time , when on the road I try to use a fairly busy truck stop. just my thoughts===charlie

Easy answer is it depends.
Like said, if the truck that brought it in is dirty, the tank at the station is dirty, not used much, ect...
Seems like everyone says the diesel itself comes from the same distribution center though. However say the trucks, tanks at the station were brand new. It still depends on brand. Each one puts in their own additive. Like Chevron has Techron and whatever everyone else has. So yes it can be better at some stations. But to add to that the additives are added to meet a set requirement. Such as cetane rating, lubrication requirements, cloud point, ect... So still your should be getting a big difference out of fuel from one station to the next.
Only thing I would say is like Charlie B said, I mainly go to only 1 station (a high use truck stop at that) and try to continue the trend of high use truck stops when I travel.
Reasoning is fresher fuel, less chance of water, dirt, basically contamination.

Unless you get premium diesel who knows what you get.
If you'll notice the diesel pumps at most shells, ect don't have the "quality fuels" ect selling point on the diesel pump. Most diesel we sell comes from which ever terminal has the best price/amount we need on hand. Shell, Phillips, whoever knows this is standard practice I guess and doesn't place the trademark on the pump.

If you are wondering if there is a difference between Exxon's diesel and Chevron's diesel, vs Valero's diesel, etc, the answer is NO. It's all fungable product as per API and ASTM standards. They actually buy and sell between eachother all the time. It's anyone's quess from which refinery the product actually comes from. That being said, if the Valero station around the corner has brand new tanks in the ground, and the Citgo station down the street has 30 y/o tanks in the ground, the Citgo station will probably have dirtier fuel. Same thing goes for the quality of the delivery trucks. Old shitty tanker trucks will have what looks like poop in the bottom of them. Some of that poop ends up in the fuel delivered to the station.

If you are wondering if there is a difference between Exxon's diesel and Chevron's diesel, vs Valero's diesel, etc, the answer is NO. It's all fungable product as per API and ASTM standards. They actually buy and sell between eachother all the time. It's anyone's quess from which refinery the product actually comes from. That being said, if the Valero station around the corner has brand new tanks in the ground, and the Citgo station down the street has 30 y/o tanks in the ground, the Citgo station will probably have dirtier fuel. Same thing goes for the quality of the delivery trucks. Old shitty tanker trucks will have what looks like poop in the bottom of them. Some of that poop ends up in the fuel delivered to the station.

And that is why you need better than 4 micron rated fuel filters on your Dmax! Says it all. New tanks - old tanks they all have poop in them....

In my section of the country, most of the diesel comes from the pipeline, but there are some refined in the nothern part of the state. All the diesel starts out the same, but the additives that each company puts in are different as someone already stated, and how much contamination a tank has in it affects the product. With all the regulations and working at some UST sites (underground storage tank) I doubt you have many stations with 30 year old tanks, although I won't say there ar none, but the odds are with the EPA laws you won't find many.

Last year I contacted Power Service while I was having problems with their products and according to the engineer they test fuel samples from each state. The fuel samples that came out of MT showed Cenex being the best fuel available.

Nope. Its basically all the same. The only thing that matters is what station will have water in their fuel tanks that can mess up your fuel system. That is what is hit and miss otherwise fill up at mom and pop or a big name it shouldn't matter

Gas or diesel it all comes from tank farms nearest to the dispensing stations location. It's all the same stuff. Most important is how clean the fuel is kept from the tank farm to you fuel tank.

Gas or diesel it all comes from tank farms nearest to the dispensing stations location. It's all the same stuff. Most important is how clean the fuel is kept from the tank farm to you fuel tank.

That is important but what about self reliance? No way you can monitor the delivery and storage system for cleanliness. Clean up of the poop and slurry takes del;ivery equipment and storage systems out of service -it doesn't happen very often.

I have seen tanks in the ground for less than 6 months have 2" of poop slurry when a sample is taken and or show several inches of water on the Color Cut paste when sticked.

Knowing this stuff means my truck gets better filtration than stock......Your Mileage and Paranonia May Very:D

In my section of the country, most of the diesel comes from the pipeline, but there are some refined in the nothern part of the state. All the diesel starts out the same, but the additives that each company puts in are different as someone already stated, and how much contamination a tank has in it affects the product. With all the regulations and working at some UST sites (underground storage tank) I doubt you have many stations with 30 year old tanks, although I won't say there ar none, but the odds are with the EPA laws you won't find many.

The "30 years" was an exaggeration to make a point more clear. I'm pretty sure you can't have tanks over 15yrs in my area.

Does Chevron add Techron to diesel as well as gas? And has anyone ever gotten bad diesel from one of the big brand stations?

I have a Valero and a Chevron less than one block from each other, and the Valero's diesel is 30 cents a gallon cheaper than Chevrons...what gives?

Thanks for all the replys!

A couple years ago there was a post on some testing that was done on stations. IIRC they didn't come out the same. Not sure if it was a problem in the tanks at the station or the diesel being put in them. I also remember that out of all tested, Flying J had the worst/dirtiest diesel. I also heard from my friend last year when he was filling up his RV at flying J, the diesel looked really dark, almost blackish he said.

I tend to stay with Chevron of 76 stations that I know go through large volumes of diesel.

LA DMAX

I found this that I cut/pasted from a link back in 10/2008. Gives a little more info.


LA DMAX



I got this email from a Texaco fuel technician:

Some companies marketed “premium diesel” before an industry definition for what "premium" meant was established. Because of this, there had been some confusion on what, if anything, made "premium" diesel different from other diesel.

On July 16, 2003, the National Conference on Weights and Measures (NCWM) created a new definition for Premium Diesel.

To qualify as a Premium Diesel the following four properties of the fuel had to be met (ASTM is the American Society for Testing and Materials):

a) The cetane number must be 47 or greater (using ASTM D 613 test method)

b) The thermal stability must be sufficient to meet a minimum reflectance limit of 80% (as determined by test ASTM D 6468)

c) The fuel must show suitable low-temperature operability by passing either the Cloud Point Test (ASTM D 2500) or Low Temperature Flow Test (ASTM D 4539) at the tenth percentile minimum ambient air temperature for the region and time of year where the fuel will be sold. Ambient temperatures for areas are noted in ASTM D 975

d) The lubricity must be sufficient to produce a scar no larger than 520 microns in diameter as determined by ASTM D 6079 (HFRR)

If the diesel meets theses requirement it will be posted on the pump that it is a Premium Diesel.

Most of the time all Chevron & Texaco Diesel meet the Premium requirement therefore you might not see the premium designation.

Texaco or Chevron Branded Diesel
Cetane Number:
· In general, the processing required to reduce sulfur to 15ppm also reduces the aromatics content resulting in an increase to the cetane number.

In the United States, the properties of diesel fuels are under the auspices of an industry organization, the American Society for Testing and Materials (ASTM). The ASTM Designation for diesel is D 975 -Standard Specification for Diesel Fuel Oils. D 975 sets limits (requirements) for the values of these properties. Most of the requirements of D 975 are the minimum ones needed to guarantee acceptable performance for the majority of users. In addition, the specification recognizes some requirements established by the United States Environmental Protection Agency (USEPA) to reduce emissions. Chevron abides by all of these specifications.

The Cetane number limit (minimum) is 40.
There is a Federal cetane spec. for Ultra Low Sulfur Grade No. 1-D and 2-D (Grade No 2-D would be the one used in most all on-road vehicles). D 975 requires an aromaticity of 30 % vol. max. or a cetane index of 40 min.. Our understanding is that this is a Federal requirement and did not originate with ASTM. Typical Chevron production excluding California and Hawaii is 48 cetane. Chevron guarantees product limits only; typicals are average properties, and higher and lower values are to be expected.

Typical California Chevron production is 52 because of additional requirements of the California Air Resources Board (CARB) for vehicular diesel fuel.

Typical Hawaii Chevron refinery production is 61.

Their is no maximum ASTM Cetane number limit.
U.S. average cetane is 45. There is no way to tell what the "at the retail pump" cetane value would be and is not required to be posted by law, as is the case for gasoline octane minimum rating.

ULSD will not change these typical averages much. Not lower. Maybe a little higher. (1-2).

Energy Content:
· In general, the processing required to reduce sulfur to 15 ppm also reduces the aromatics content and density of diesel fuel, resulting in a reduction in energy content (BTU/gal).

· The expected reduction in energy content is on the order of 1% and may affect fuel mileage.

Good article, and it mentions information about California which is where I am.

A long while back I read somewhere that diesel fuel was allowed to contain up to 5% water whereas gas only 1%. Where I really notice the difference is on occasion I've stopped at small, out of the way truck stops that still pump #2. The power increase is immediate and noticeable as is the fuel economy.
I have fueled up at Flying "J"'s for the past 10 or more years and have never had a fuel or filter problem.
I use the OEM filter as a pre-filter and my secondary filter is a Racor, 2 micron with water separator and primer pump mounted on a custom fabricated, stainless steel bracket mounted where the optional alternator mounting holes are. No problems!

Good article, and it mentions information about California which is where I am.

Yeah, good thing to know about Chevrons and California stations in general, Chevron is one of my usual refill spots.

BTW, watch out for that Azusa Canyon mud, it makes your truck smell. I use to go there a lot with my old 87 Blazer until the inside just got too stinky, needed to pressure wash out side, top side and underneath as well as shampoo carpets and interior. I live about 15 miles from that canyon.

LA DMAX

A long while back I read somewhere that diesel fuel was allowed to contain up to 5% water whereas gas only 1%. Where I really notice the difference is on occasion I've stopped at small, out of the way truck stops that still pump #2. The power increase is immediate and noticeable as is the fuel economy.
I have fueled up at Flying "J"'s for the past 10 or more years and have never had a fuel or filter problem.
I use the OEM filter as a pre-filter and my secondary filter is a Racor, 2 micron with water separator and primer pump mounted on a custom fabricated, stainless steel bracket mounted where the optional alternator mounting holes are. No problems!

Can't remember exactly when it was that I read that article, but I was a regular at Flying J especially traveling to Laughlin NV or Vegas. After reading that article I stopped. I'm sure your dual filtration really helps keep the fuel clean. Would you have any pics of your filter setup? Thanks

LA DMAX

The "30 years" was an exaggeration to make a point more clear. I'm pretty sure you can't have tanks over 15yrs in my area.




Understood, no problem. I don't know if we have an age limit on tanks here. I'm guessing it must be the same around the country, the EPA sets the standards and states have to meet it and some go even further making it more strick than the EPA.

A long while back I read somewhere that diesel fuel was allowed to contain up to 5% water whereas gas only 1%. Where I really notice the difference is on occasion I've stopped at small, out of the way truck stops that still pump #2. The power increase is immediate and noticeable as is the fuel economy.
I have fueled up at Flying "J"'s for the past 10 or more years and have never had a fuel or filter problem.
I use the OEM filter as a pre-filter and my secondary filter is a Racor, 2 micron with water separator and primer pump mounted on a custom fabricated, stainless steel bracket mounted where the optional alternator mounting holes are. No problems!

Yes pictures please.

I have found I get much better MPG with Shell diesel in my area.

Yeah, good thing to know about Chevrons and California stations in general, Chevron is one of my usual refill spots.

BTW, watch out for that Azusa Canyon mud, it makes your truck smell. I use to go there a lot with my old 87 Blazer until the inside just got too stinky, needed to pressure wash out side, top side and underneath as well as shampoo carpets and interior. I live about 15 miles from that canyon.

LA DMAX

Advice taken. I've been almost everywhere in this state with both trucks and no problems yet. Azuza is good for some tough testing so that's why I go. Its fun, but the three hrs I spend at the car was after isn't so fun lol.

There are a lot of pavement pussies around O.C. so I'm just doin my part to make sure they see what a truck is supposed to be used for :)

Advice taken. I've been almost everywhere in this state with both trucks and no problems yet. Azuza is good for some tough testing so that's why I go. Its fun, but the three hrs I spend at the car was after isn't so fun lol.

There are a lot of pavement pussies around O.C. so I'm just doin my part to make sure they see what a truck is supposed to be used for :)

Well said, no trailer queen that I can see.

LA DMAX

Well said, no trailer queen that I can see.

LA DMAX

The Blazer has open diffs at the moment so there are some challenges. I've had it stuck in the bottom of a HUGE bowl in Glamis just last year. Had to have an H1 pull me out lol. I was trying to get my buddy who didn't quite make it back out of that same bowl.

I started the thread but I better get back on topic myself...

Thanks all for the replys, I'm interested to hear what else you guys have to say.

I used to get Valero all the time. I would also have to run additives, as my engine would be loud without them. My favorite additive was seafoam. it quieted it down the most, and improved my mileage the most.

One day a couple months ago, I had no choice but chevron. With no additives (anywhere between 3 and 9 dollars per tank) I got as good mileage, and a much quieter engine for less money

Think about it....you pay an extra 5-10 cents per gallon at the pump. My tank is 26, so say i fill up with 20 gallons...thats an extra 2 dollars...less than any additive (2 smoke oil @ wally world here in bako, plus tax is hitting the 15 dollar range for a gallon, so $3.50 per tank now)

I think it is a bargain.

richard: Bako as is Bakersfield? My best friend lives up there.
You can't really go wrong with Chevron at least here in Cali. I usually go between Chevron and 76. Chevron is about 1-2 cents more but well worth it. You're right about the milage. I seem to get the best milage (about an extra 10 miles per tank) with Chevron diesel.

Kevin: good luck with an open dif in Glamis, wow you're brave for runin that in the dunes.

LA DMAX

ladmax

yep.......NECKERZfield lol

ladmax

yep.......NECKERZfield lol


Buck Owens baby!

LA DMAX

Is there any list of stations that members consider good fill ups?? As a example, I am traveling to Kitty Hawk, NC this summer and would like to have a line on a good station to use while there. (I too have two local stations that I use).

Is there any list of stations that members consider good fill ups?? As a example, I am traveling to Kitty Hawk, NC this summer and would like to have a line on a good station to use while there. (I too have two local stations that I use).

try gasbuddy.com
I think it goes by region and fuel type. I have searched on it in the past, but usually I stick with 1 of 3 local stations that have reasonable prices.

LA DMAX

Gasoline has an association pushing for a higher LAC than required. We are talking about fuel detergency vs tendency to form deposits.

With diesel the same principle apply but, to my knowledge, there is no standard voluntary or otherwise that cies must follow. Because of this I recommend to always add a whole combustion system cleaner in every diesel fuel up tank.

Another variation might be biodiesel content from one location to another. If you consistently use biodiesel you should control water very carefully and-or add a biocide.

Water content: around 70% of fuel in north america at the pump contains more than 1% wtaer. this is a huge issue.

Filtration: use the diesel pumps that pump fuel slowly so that you are sure that it is filtered properly. I know that these seem to take forever to fuel up but that is the best thing to do.

Regulations: assuming that all fuel meets regulations would be, in my opinion, a mistake. They just don't. Even if you purchase 500K$ a month of fuel it will be difficult to get a certificate of analysis for the product you purchase. At the cie I work at you get one if you buy 250 cc of a product. This attitude makes me very suspect of actual fuel quality.

Quality vs color: take some in a mason jar and look for translucid fuel that is almost clear (not yellow). If the fuel is murky stop buying at that location. If the fuel gels when you leave it outside then it will gel in your vehicle's tank: stop using at that location.

If you know someone who works at the station ask them to test the water level in the tank using the stick they use for level. Put some water finding paste at the bottom of the stick. If the zone where the paste turns red is important then this station has a lot of water in their fuel. Avoid it. Of course do this in the morning when the fuel has had time to settle.

hope this helps.

Thanks! This is good information. I think it is against the law here to put fuel in a mason jar but I may try it anyway.
I am not aware of any stations that use an in-line filter here. But one (East Coast) claims to clean their tanks out on a semiannual basis.

a Friend of mine told me that when you put diesel in a clear container, placing it in the sun on a warm day, it raises the cetane level

is this true?

Cetane would not change with temperature. However, diesel that is hotter will burn more easily, will vaporize more easily, will form smaller droplets on injection, will make it easier to start on a cold day, etc.

This i guess is just common sense.

It all comes from the same dinosaurs, who cares. :)

Ben