<!--StartFragment --> I was just on another site where info on the new GMT-900 is being discussed. One member on the site is a dealer and gets monthly info on what GM is doing on the new trucks. He has posted that the new trucks will have a solid front and rear axle. Here is a link to the thread. I would highly suggest reading all 50 pages.
http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14199&page=1&pp=20

William

Fourty minutes, and I couldn't read it all. Brain overloaded with info.

Trust me, its worth the read.

William

Summaries are good too.

What page is it on???

What page is it on???
Did a quick search, looks like post 218 states no SFA. Then in post 945 it states yes definitely SFA in '07.
Seems to me to be pure conjecture, but we can hope....

GM is not going to drop the IFS. The vast majority of truck buyers are not worried about the difficulty in lifting a IFS suspension truck 12". The better ride and sharing components between multiple configurations makes it a no brainer for GM.

I'd like to see a SFA, coil spring front susp. just for 4500 series. (15K GVWR) This would sell well for landscapers/contractors not wanting the big van cab currently offered.

These 4500's SHOULD be a pickup cab and hood, not the van cab as the current 45-5500's are.

Then make the 5500's like they are now.

With Ford, you go from F-250 through the F-550 with the same cab.

I don't care if it's coils or leaf springs just as long as we get a SFA. This ifs is a pain in the a$$ to lift.Which more and more people are doing.Plus a SFA is a much better ranch,farm,plow,construction,work truck.

I've got a feeling that the HD line may get the solid axle, while the IFS stays with the 1/2 tonners and Yukon,Tahoe,Sub,etc. I don't mind the IFS, but I would like to see it upped to a 5500 lb GAWR or better.

I think you all are dreaming we still don't know for 100% what the TQ/HP # are for the '06. But yet some dealer knows that there will be a SFA in '07 is BS. I would like to have a nice riding SFA, but I won't hold my breath. Don't the 4500 and up not have a SFA that really suck.

This guy gets a newsletter direct from GM that says what they are doing for the new trucks. I highly doubt that he is making this up. IF he is, then I appoligize for posting the link.

William

I think they're going rear IFS:muahaha:

I think they're going rear IFS:muahaha:

Bite your tounge:badidea:

William

Solid front means it will ride just as bad as an 05 Ram that I had out for a test drive.........

What is the big deal with a SFA? It still has ball joint, tierod ends, pitman arms, drag links, a differential, axle shafts, bearings, and every thing else a IFS has, but a worse ride. The only advantage I see with a SFA is that there is less moving suspension parts, but how often are your a arm bushing going bad? Do you think a SFA is stronger? With a u-joint you have 2 caps driving all the torque, with a cv you have 3 balls. How many times have you seen a front driveshaft come apart on a duramax vs. a SFA truck. A u-joint is just like a cv joint, there at there strongest when no angle is put on them. With a SFA you will always have some sore of angle. Once the steering problems are fixed, IFS is a much better truck pulling setup. This may sound crazy but think about it. When the truck is twisting while going down the track, the wheels are completely independent of each other, so as the front left of the truck go's up the wheel will stay on the ground. This is not the case with a SFA, just watch some of the super street gassers run, there front right is digging to China and the front left is practically in the air. The power we are now putting out is not the only reason why we are winning, we are getting some major help from our IFS. I would not trade my IFS for a solid front end anyday.

You guys obviously live in the city:rolleyes: .I know a ton of people that will go back to Chevy if they go back to a SFA.Yes,in ranch use the IFS front ends go to-:t Censored fast,thats why almost no ranchers run Chevys anymore and the ones that do are like me and run the old SFA trucks.IFS is to low.It drags on every mound and dip:mad: and leads to being stuck:mad: Censored .I can't count the times I've been stuck due to lack of clearance, with a IFS truck that never would have happened if I had been in one of the good SFA ranch trucks. Also IFS trucks suck in snow. I know most like it just fine the way it is but maybe it should be Chevy SFA,GMC IFS. Then we'd all be happy.:)

Just posted another thread about this in the suspension section.(whoops!!!) I didn't even see this one. ):h I know its to much to ask for, but what would be awesome is if they would make it an option to have either SFA, or IFS. I like my trucks lifted, and it would make it alot easier to lift them. It would also shut up alot of the Ford and Dodge guys who are always dogging on GM for using IFS in the HD's. I have liked my IFS trucks, but I wouldn't complain if they went to SFA on the 07's. Which ever front end they end up with, I will still be in line to get one.:ro)

it should be Chevy SFA,GMC IFS. Then we'd all be happy.:)

That wouldn't make us all happy but making SFA an option might. I still prefer my GMC hood over the Chevy's. That'd make me happier than having to buy the Chevy and then having to rip the whole front end off and only to bolt up a GMC front... to be truly happy.

GM is not going to drop the IFS. The vast majority of truck buyers are not worried about the difficulty in lifting a IFS suspension truck 12". The better ride and sharing components between multiple configurations makes it a no brainer for GM.
A man who speaks the truth! Sorry fellas GM will never go back to a SFA and I for one don't want a SFA!

Why do you guys think Ford outsells GM every year in truck sales? I wonder if the fact that IFS falls apart fast under a "work site" enviroment has anything to do with it?

And YES they need to raise the stance. It made me sick that my 99 OBS Z-71 4x4 sat as low as a grandpa's 2wd. Then I get the HD and Dodge and Ford 1/2 tons set as high as it does factory. Has anyone seen the new Dodge Power Wagon? Now THAT'S what a truck should look like. I have been a hard-core GM man my whole life, but gotta tell you buying a Chevy is not even a consideration until they change the front end and buying the GMC over a Dodge or Ford HD was a hard decision.

Has anyone seen the new Dodge Power Wagon? Now THAT'S what a truck should look like.

I have. I am 6 ft tall and the bottom of the drivers window was at my neck. There is alot of plastic in that truck so don't let it fool you.

William

There's also lockers,a winch and a nice ammount of clearance, but it's a dodge-:t .Chevy should try to catch the wheelin marked too.

Solid front means it will ride just as bad as an 05 Ram that I had out for a test drive.........

Amen brother! I took an 05 Ram out for a test drive recently and could not stand the ride. I felt like I was driving a tractor down the highway. I'll take IFS any day.

I'm happy with my IFS. I think GM could beef it up a bit more and I would like that but I dont know if I want a SFA? My weak IFS has plowed alot of snow with my 9'6" v blade and stood up fine to a lot of 4x4 launches on pavement. Chevy dosnt care about a few people that wheel thier trucks, its a small market and 99% of people that lift thier stuff do so for looks and dont wheel em. Ground clerance? You think that its IFS that is hurting your ground clerance? Ever look under your truck? IFS isnt the lowest point. Bigger tires is what is your limiting factor. Tell chevy to make the fenders able to stuff bigger meats. Dont like that the frame sits so low yet love the allisons beef? How would you fit that trans under there? Ever seen one outside a truck? unless your put a doghouse in there like a freaking scool bus it aint going to fit. I would like to see something that competes with the 550 and 450, the 4500 and 5500 can just be too much truck in some instances.

Why do you guys think Ford outsells GM every year in truck sales? I wonder if the fact that IFS falls apart fast under a "work site" enviroment has anything to do with it?

And YES they need to raise the stance. It made me sick that my 99 OBS Z-71 4x4 sat as low as a grandpa's 2wd. Then I get the HD and Dodge and Ford 1/2 tons set as high as it does factory. Has anyone seen the new Dodge Power Wagon? Now THAT'S what a truck should look like. I have been a hard-core GM man my whole life, but gotta tell you buying a Chevy is not even a consideration until they change the front end and buying the GMC over a Dodge or Ford HD was a hard decision.

Ford sells more because Ford buyers are idiots. How do you figure IFS falls apart in a "work site" environment? Like Ratlover said, he hangs a 9' 6" plow off the front with no problems. Have you noticed how many ATV's have full independent suspension, it's not because there crap and cheaper to build, it's because the ride, durability, handling, offroad capibilities are unbeatable.

ATV's don't belong it this discussion. IFS does offer more traction in some situations,I will agree on that but I hate low clearance.I know the frame has to be the way it is to work with the current trannies,but that's all the more reason to have a SFA:exactly: .To get more clearance. That should be obvious.:rolleyes: I've never torn one up but that's because I only drive it on the highway because of the Censored IFS.I'm sure we could argue this for days but each has his or her own openion and thats fine,BUT SFA RULES:ro) .:D

I always thought Ford's claim to sell the most was based on treating Chevy and GMC as separate brands, and if you compared Ford to GM (Chevy and GMC combined), Ford came in second.

Not true Ford outsells Chevy and GMC combined. Hate to admit it but it's fact. They also sell more Powerjokes than Chevy/GMC Duramax's and Dodge Cummins combined. They may not be better or hold their value as well but I don't feel the GM's IFS is anywhere near as stout as a Ford SFA. My brother has owned all three while I've never owned anything but a GM. His last two Ford's seem to hold up to abuse better than his GMC did and cetainly better than his Ram did. He runs a monster plow every year and the Ford just seems to hold up better. It's not my opinion it's fact. Maybe your Chevy/GMC truck was built special compared to his last 2 and my last 2 but all of his Fords chassis' and front ends took more than I'm willing to throw at my truck. I hate to admit it. My truck rides better, handles better and is faster but I think his is tougher, I wouldn't say more durable but they seem overbuilt for thier ratings.

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=21222

Those figures include Canyons and Colorados and Escalades. The numbers when broken down don't add up to outsell Ford F-Series. You can see here that the GMC Seirra line would have to sell almost 259,000 trucks to overtake Ford including Silverado sales for top seller. I could not find Sierra sales alone but they come in below the 10th place taurus at 248,148. Now if you want to include Tahoe's and Yukon's and Trailblazers to Rangers and Expeditions etc. Gm does outsell all with these so called trucks but raw data of F-series VS. Chvey/GMC full-size trucks comes out Ford.

Here are the ten bestsellers with total sales figures for calendar year 2004, based on data published by Automotive News:


#1 Ford F-Series
939,511

#2 Chevrolet Silverado
680,768

#3 Toyota Camry
426,990

#4 Dodge Ram
426,289

#5 Honda Accord
386,770

#6 Ford Explorer
339,333

#7 Honda Civic
309,196

#8 Chevrolet Impala
290,259

#9 Chevrolet TrailBlazer
283,484

#10 Ford Taurus
248,148

Source: Automotive News Data Center

You sure seem to like ford...

F-series includes the big trucks too, 450-550-etc...

How bout these numbers from pickuptruck.com:

Sales Figures
Top 10 Pickups
Year to Date, June 2005

Ford F-Series
407,754 -5.8% YTD

Chevrolet Silverado
384,228 19.0% YTD

Dodge Ram
195,919 -10.3% YTD

GMC Sierra
126,181 28.3% YTD


That's 510,409 GM to 407,754 Ford, I guess they could still catch up.

You guys obviously live in the city:rolleyes: .I know a ton of people that will go back to Chevy if they go back to a SFA.Yes,in ranch use the IFS front ends go to-:t Censored fast,thats why almost no ranchers run Chevys anymore and the ones that do are like me and run the old SFA trucks.IFS is to low.It drags on every mound and dip:mad: and leads to being stuck:mad: Censored .I can't count the times I've been stuck due to lack of clearance, with a IFS truck that never would have happened if I had been in one of the good SFA ranch trucks. Also IFS trucks suck in snow. I know most like it just fine the way it is but maybe it should be Chevy SFA,GMC IFS. Then we'd all be happy.:)



:lol2: Ha, what a joke a SFA isn't that much better than IFS you should just learn how to drive. There is really only two good things about a SFA one more flex two they're easy to lift.

:lol2: Ha, what a joke a SFA isn't that much better than IFS you should just learn how to drive. There is really only two good things about a SFA one more flex two they're easy to lift.

Three... they look better with only bigger tires. Trucks look like they have a lift.

Four... no excuses needed

Dozerboy: I know how to drive. You just try to drive the places I've put a SFA truck with a stock trailer behind it.

Wow, I'm kinda suprised by the responces that have been posted. I guess I figured more people would be happy.

William

You sure seem to like ford...

F-series includes the big trucks too, 450-550-etc...

NOPE, not at all. Never owned a Ford and I nebver will but I don't like being called a liar. I would not blatently say something that had no validity. If Ford sells more trucks I admit it. I don't think their better though. I love my GMC and the Duramax under the hood. If Ford comes out with a Powerstroke next year that makes 400 horses and 800 lb/ft of torqu and runs 13 seconds in the 1/4 mile i still won't buy one. But I won;t lie and say I'm faster either.

NOPE, not at all. Never owned a Ford and I nebver will but I don't like being called a liar. I would not blatently say something that had no validity. If Ford sells more trucks I admit it. I don't think their better though. I love my GMC and the Duramax under the hood. If Ford comes out with a Powerstroke next year that makes 400 horses and 800 lb/ft of torqu and runs 13 seconds in the 1/4 mile i still won't buy one. But I won;t lie and say I'm faster either.

Who called you a liar?:confused: All I saw was different sets of numbers from different places... Nobody here made them up, just went and found them. I just mentioned the big trucks because ford always talks about f series like it's just the 150 and it includes all the f trucks...

Who called you a liar?:confused: All I saw was different sets of numbers from different places... Nobody here made them up, just went and found them. I just mentioned the big trucks because ford always talks about f series like it's just the 150 and it includes all the f trucks...

Come on NAR... you assumed that posting sales figures favoring Ford meant that "I sure liked Fords," even though I made it perfectly clear otherwise and but it was wrong of me to assume that your posting of results contradicting me wasn't meant to call me a liar?:confused: To ASSMUME makes an ASS out of U and ME!

Ford has out sold GM a total of three times in the last 54 years. Where are you getting your information? Ford out sales Chevy, but not GM.

A pet peve of mine is when I read how the F-150 out sales Chevy`s full size pickup. That is so not true. It is the entire Ford F-series line of pickup`s that out sales Chevy, not the F-150!:exactly:


As for GM never going back to a SFA, why not? Ford did it in there F-250`s, and F-350`s Does anyone remember the junk front end Ford had in the 80`s?
I learned a long time ago, NEVER SAY NEVER!:)


Why do you guys think Ford outsells GM every year in truck sales? I wonder if the fact that IFS falls apart fast under a "work site" enviroment has anything to do with it?

And YES they need to raise the stance. It made me sick that my 99 OBS Z-71 4x4 sat as low as a grandpa's 2wd. Then I get the HD and Dodge and Ford 1/2 tons set as high as it does factory. Has anyone seen the new Dodge Power Wagon? Now THAT'S what a truck should look like. I have been a hard-core GM man my whole life, but gotta tell you buying a Chevy is not even a consideration until they change the front end and buying the GMC over a Dodge or Ford HD was a hard decision.

Read my other post! Ford out sold GM last year! That was just the 3rd time in 54 years. They out sold GM in about 87, and 51, other then those three years, GM always out sales Ford in full size pickup trucks, As well as full size SUV`s (Which isn't even a contest!) And about half the time, GM out sales Ford in the campact pickup.

And one more thing! Ford DOES NOT sale more Powerstroke equiped pickup`s the Dodge and GM combined. Ford now has about 42-43 percent of the light duty diesel market. (That market is all pickup`s under 14,500 GVWR) GM is up from less then 5% in 2000 to more then 31% in 04. Dodge has the rest, which is about 26%.

Not true Ford outsells Chevy and GMC combined. Hate to admit it but it's fact. They also sell more Powerjokes than Chevy/GMC Duramax's and Dodge Cummins combined. They may not be better or hold their value as well but I don't feel the GM's IFS is anywhere near as stout as a Ford SFA. My brother has owned all three while I've never owned anything but a GM. His last two Ford's seem to hold up to abuse better than his GMC did and cetainly better than his Ram did. He runs a monster plow every year and the Ford just seems to hold up better. It's not my opinion it's fact. Maybe your Chevy/GMC truck was built special compared to his last 2 and my last 2 but all of his Fords chassis' and front ends took more than I'm willing to throw at my truck. I hate to admit it. My truck rides better, handles better and is faster but I think his is tougher, I wouldn't say more durable but they seem overbuilt for thier ratings.

If I wanted the stoutest vehicle I would go buy a sherman tank. I dont disagree that a SFA may be more stout, but this is my third truck with IFS and it rides better than anything out there, and has never let me down. If I felt the need for a SFA I would buy a FORD or DODGE, but I want a good ride so I buy Chevy's with IFS. Plus I like that when you put a winch or plow on it is easy to compensate for the weight. I only wish GM would put bigger tires and have bigger wells for more rubber without a lift.

I quess they put IFS on the Hummer H1's because they can't stand the abuse. Don't get me wrong I would take a SFA if I had the choice for lifting ETC. but the ride would go to hell. As for the ground clearance I am pretty sure IFS has almost more ground clearance than a SFA has.

The H1 setup is different and more durable.IFS isn't weak as in the A-arms.I've jumped mine and never broken it.It's the stupid CV setup. IFS is lower to the ground than a SFA unless you crank the T-bars up like I had to do to go down our ranch trails without dragging my whole front end and belly but maybe if the SFA trucks had the small a$$ tires on them they would be lower. As HDMAX said even Furd relized that a SFA was a better setup.Dodge is going back to a SFA on there 1/2 tons:grd: .

A Sfa Is Much Cheaper To Build. Your Still Going To Be Paying The Same If It Was A Sfa Or An Ifs. The Only Differance Is That The Money Ford And Dodge Are Saving Is Going Into The Shareholders Pockets.

I don't think GM will ever go to SFA. They made a statement a few years back that they thought it would be going backwards technology wise.

I get a kick out of that one. IFS has been around since probably the 1930s. It's not like they discovered something of value recently.

GM and Dodges biggest screwups as I see it is the lack of a one-on-one competive truck to the Ford SuperDuty. If the new 6.0 PSD wasn't such a disaster Ford would have the whole frigging HD market pretty much to itself. Contractors want big pickups. Comfort is not high on the list.

Dodge is really bad in this dept. They don't even have a chassis cab option.

One more thing to add.For as many people as I have heard Censored about IFS it seems odd that so many of you are so stuck on it.It's time to run over Furd for a change,with a work truck.

GM and Dodges biggest screwups as I see it is the lack of a one-on-one competive truck to the Ford SuperDuty. If the new 6.0 PSD wasn't such a disaster Ford would have the whole frigging HD market pretty much to itself. Contractors want big pickups. Comfort is not high on the list.


This might be one reason that they are going to a SFA. I know a couple people that want the 1ton srw with the ext cab/ short bed. They need the short wheel base for there work and need to be able to carry alot of weight. They all have looked at Ford.

William

I bet my 04 will be SFA by 06 so nananananananabooboo!

I bet my 04 will be SFA by 06 so nananananananabooboo!

But RCD doesn't make a SFA lift.):h

I think he expects me to... It might be a fun winter project...

I may end up doing a solid axel swap on mine too.It would be a lot faster to just buy an ORU kit for $860 but then ya couldn't say you built it.:D I just wanted to go 4" but I don't think I can go that little.

I may end up doing a solid axel swap on mine too.It would be a lot faster to just buy an ORU kit for $860 but then ya couldn't say you built it.:D I just wanted to go 4" but I don't think I can go that little.

Those kits for $860 do not included the axle. Figure junk yard dana 60 $1000, complete rebuild including brakes, bearings, u-joints, ring, pinion,locker?, seals. Your probally looking at another $1500.

$860+$1000+$1500=$3360 That's alot of money for a SH!TTY ride-:t

And one more thing! Ford DOES NOT sale more Powerstroke equiped pickup`s the Dodge and GM combined. Ford now has about 42-43 percent of the light duty diesel market. (That market is all pickup`s under 14,500 GVWR) GM is up from less then 5% in 2000 to more then 31% in 04. Dodge has the rest, which is about 26%.

I'll find the article in time. Truck Trend magazine reported (NOT my opinion) that not only does IH sell more powerstrokes than Duramax's and Cummins (pickup motors) but that both GM and Cummins do not even have the capacity to produce as many engines combined than IH sells Powerstrokes. I'm just repeating what I read from a reputable source. If you have a reputable source you would like to attach to the figures you've posted I'd be more than happy to take interest in them. However I'm not biting, just because you said so. I know I still have the magazine somewhere. I'll repost when I track it down.

dmaxlover: I buy,sell,and part 1tons 4x4'd for a living,as well as ranch and modify trucks.I have a friend that builds Comp Buggies so it wouldn't be much of a task or cost. I've never given more than $315 for a D60.):h I sell them for a $1000.The one under my 67 was free.:D I bought a good running K30 pulled the D60{which was in perfect shape} and sold the rest of the truck for more than I paid for it.The kit is the only thing that would cost me anything.Maybe springs,but a 52" rear spring swap wouldn't be to bad.

ATV's don't belong it this discussion. IFS does offer more traction in some situations,I will agree on that but I hate low clearance.I know the frame has to be the way it is to work with the current trannies,but that's all the more reason to have a SFA:exactly: .To get more clearance. That should be obvious.:rolleyes: I've never torn one up but that's because I only drive it on the highway because of the Censored IFS.I'm sure we could argue this for days but each has his or her own openion and thats fine,BUT SFA RULES:ro) .:D


Hey fella's, I am a new member here. To me, from what I have noticed, is that people jump on the "IFS" sucks and "low ground clearance" bandwagon without really knowing the facts. From the sources of chevrolet.com and ford.com, here is the actually ground clearance and overall height specs. You might be surprised to see what has a higher ground clearance.


Chevy 2500HD Crew-Cab shortbox:
Height - 77.0"
Ground Clearance - 10.6"

Ford Superduty F250/350:
Height - 80"/81.8"
Ground Clearance - 8.5"/9.3"

Hey fella's, I am a new member here. To me, from what I have noticed, is that people jump on the "IFS" sucks and "low ground clearance" bandwagon without really knowing the facts. From the sources of chevrolet.com and ford.com, here is the actually ground clearance and overall height specs. You might be surprised to see what has a higher ground clearance.


Chevy 2500HD Crew-Cab shortbox:
Height - 77.0"
Ground Clearance - 10.6"

Ford Superduty F250/350:
Height - 80"/81.8"
Ground Clearance - 8.5"/9.3"

Ahhh... do not forget that is STATIC ground clearance. I'm not going to knock the IFS, but oversimplified: when one wheel goes into a pot hole (or any hole) then that wonderful stationary center section will move down real close to the ground. I'm just being simple sorry :) I've driven solid axles for almost 15 years (Jeeps) and they can be made to ride nice, For on road I think the IFS would be tough to beat, but for lifting and using it off road I'm gonna say a coil sprung SFA.

I will be crossing my fingers and saving the $$ for an 08 :)

And for the people saying coils sag well all springs sag. On some of the coil sprung jeeps they have ACOS (Adjustable Coil Over Spacer). you get 1.5" of lift and then you can dial in up to 1.5" more to get the "right height"

Ahhh... do not forget that is STATIC ground clearance. I'm not going to knock the IFS, but oversimplified: when one wheel goes into a pot hole (or any hole) then that wonderful stationary center section will move down real close to the ground. I'm just being simple sorry :) I've driven solid axles for almost 15 years (Jeeps) and they can be made to ride nice, For on road I think the IFS would be tough to beat, but for lifting and using it off road I'm gonna say a coil sprung SFA.

I will be crossing my fingers and saving the $$ for an 08 :)

And for the people saying coils sag well all springs sag. On some of the coil sprung jeeps they have ACOS (Adjustable Coil Over Spacer). you get 1.5" of lift and then you can dial in up to 1.5" more to get the "right height"


I am still debating with myself which is better, I guess they both have their advantages and like anything; both set-ups will have their die hard fans. I need to do some further research before I can confidently say one way or the other. One very evident trend I seem to have caught on to is the misconceptions of SFA that a few people of this forum have mentioned as well. <?xml:namespace prefix = o ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" /><o:p></o:p>
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When you refer to "static" clearance, do you mean on a flat plane? I might not be correct here, but don't they measure ground clearance from the lowest point which is the rear diff? Chevy's sit lower, but they have 2" smaller rims and 245's vs. 265's. With the same size tires, A GM/Chevy sits basically the same side by side with the Ford. The only difference really, is the Ford's Cab extra height.<o:p></o:p>
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Speaking of tires, the same guy who William mentioned who is the source for saying GM is going back to the SFA said the standard tires and rims for the HD's will be 285's with 19" rims.<o:p></o:p>
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As for the coil springs inherent decompression theory, I hear a new design which incorporates a smaller radius near the bottom and a progressing larger radius near the top of the coil has helped to alleviate this problem. I'm not too sure about this one, haven't had time to check this out on a Ford SD yet, anyone else hear of this new design?<o:p></o:p>

19" rims would suck!!! Maybe 18"s but I still like 16"s just fine.You're right the rear diff drags first usurally but the whole front end of mine drags first! Untill I cranked the t-bars.It may be great once I get my 255/85/16"s on.

I hate to spoil the party, but GM is blowing smoke up your arse! Go out and take some measurements on your truck. (Any of you) the rear differential is the low point, and with stock tires it is about 7 1/4" off the ground, at the most. GM must be measuring the frame rails at the tranny, or the front diff area to get 10.6" To get 10.6" of ground clearance, you would have to run 38"+ size tires.

Now the over all height is close on the GM truck, but Ford is exagerating. My truck is 80" tall with aftermarket torsion bar keys, and springs, (About 2" of lift!) running on 285`s. While my Brother`s 2003 F-250 Superduty 4x4 with athe V-10 is 78 3/4" on 285`s. And another Brother`s 2004 F-350 SRW 4x4 6.0L Powerstroke is 80 1/2" on 285`s.

QUOTE=ChevyRacing48;638097]Hey fella's, I am a new member here. To me, from what I have noticed, is that people jump on the "IFS" sucks and "low ground clearance" bandwagon without really knowing the facts. From the sources of chevrolet.com and ford.com, here is the actually ground clearance and overall height specs. You might be surprised to see what has a higher ground clearance.


Chevy 2500HD Crew-Cab shortbox:
Height - 77.0"
Ground Clearance - 10.6"

Ford Superduty F250/350:
Height - 80"/81.8"
Ground Clearance - 8.5"/9.3"[/QUOTE]

Hey guys I was just on the GMinsider site, and suposedly the new 3500 GMT-900's will have 11" ground clearance, and be 80.3" tall (I'm just passing the info on

Ah he got the new info in:D

William

Time will tell if SFA's are for real, whatever the case I'm stoked that the HD's are a full 3 inches taller than the current trucks!:ro)

Time will tell if SFA's are for real, whatever the case I'm stoked that the HD's are a full 3 inches taller than the current trucks!:ro)
ME TOO. I'm taking this ALL with a grain of salt, but DAMN it'll be nice to see this come together

I've got just about everything crossed (that I can) that this will turn out GOOD

Roofline on my Dodge about 79".

I have a leveling kit up front and 35" tires.

Clearance under the frame rails is 18", under the center skidplate is 15"

I think the added height will be in the cab itself. I doubt the solid axle returns as well.

GM has a good design overall with it's IFS. I can honestly say with the many GM IFS trucks I've owned I never had serious issues with the front ends.

I also found them very easy to work on.

It is a predominantly on-road design though and suits most exceptionally.

You don't see much of this though with GM IFS... this truck really is not all that far off of stock Dodge suspension. Big difference is springs and shocks but most of the rest is stock. And it's a heavy diesel so you also have the extra weight.

http://koreperformance.com/images/racing2.jpg

Why do you guys think Ford outsells GM every year in truck sales? I wonder if the fact that IFS falls apart fast under a "work site" enviroment has anything to do with it?

And YES they need to raise the stance. It made me sick that my 99 OBS Z-71 4x4 sat as low as a grandpa's 2wd. Then I get the HD and Dodge and Ford 1/2 tons set as high as it does factory. Has anyone seen the new Dodge Power Wagon? Now THAT'S what a truck should look like. I have been a hard-core GM man my whole life, but gotta tell you buying a Chevy is not even a consideration until they change the front end and buying the GMC over a Dodge or Ford HD was a hard decision.Dont no where you saw that but ford hasnt out sold gm in trucks ever.

Who out sells who I really could give a $hit, I bought what I like and wanted thats all that matters and as far as chevy going to a sfa I highley dought it a step backwards. I owned 2 solid front axle chevy trucks an 84 and a 87 and dont give a crap about ride quality after all its a truck. Solid front axle trucks off-road act like a plow when the axle goes through mud,snow an ruts.You have more ground clearance in the front at the front wheels in a ifs then you do with a sfa running the same size tire on both. And another thing didnt ford get rid of there goof ball ifs I think it was called twin I beam ifs and go with the "A" arm (chevy style) type ifs in there 1/2 tons?

I love my IFS in my farming and ranching and I know a LOT of guys down here that do also. To me, its a tough front end, we have beat on one since 1989 and it has never failed and on the clearance issue, I'm not so sure your right there either. I don't think they are built for rock crawling by any means but in the mud and snow I have had not problem whatsoever. My 1999 solid front Dodge also worked well with the exception that the rear pumpkin killed me. It had a clearance of say 6" and would get me stuck all the time.
They all have they're weaknesses but on these current Chevys I personally think the IFS is great and do not want to go back to a straight axle, been there, done that!

It will definitly be interesting to see if GM actually follows through with this.

William

:exactly: .Summaries are good too.

Anyone hear any more about this?

I went and read through their 2nd thread on that on gminsidenews and didn't see anything that confirmed it. Didn't read it all though...

I'm still waiting for the cliff notes:

<!--StartFragment --> I was just on another site where info on the new GMT-900 is being discussed. One member on the site is a dealer and gets monthly info on what GM is doing on the new trucks. He has posted that the new trucks will have a solid front and rear axle. Here is a link to the thread. I would highly suggest reading all 50 pages.
http://www.gminsidenews.com/forums/showthread.php?t=14199&page=1&pp=20

William


As for which is better...I like both. They both have their advantages and disadvantages. Here are MY thoughts, take them for what they are worth (probably nothing)

Ground clearance. Depends on where you measure. IFS has a tucked up diff and has more center ground clearance (especially lifted). The diff on a SFA never changes (except with tire size). If you measure by the wheel, the SFA has more clearance (no lower suspension arm).

Strength. I bet a 2500HD front axle assy is much stronger than the old 2500 series Dana 44. Yes when you lift it, the CV shafts become a concern, but so was the front driveshaft on the old SFA's. Big power with a locker would kill a front driveshaft even with no lift (happened to many of my fellow truck pullers even with good u-joints). Over time companies came out with beefier driveshafts, axle u-joints, stub shafts, etc. and some aren't cheap. Yes a D60 axle is pretty strong, but you still have to address the front driveshaft. Just as we did years ago, companies came out with beefy parts to upgrade. I'm sure we will be seeing extended and beefier CV shafts for those that run lifts and power. Will they be expensive.....ABSOLUTELY...but so were the first upgrades for the SFA guys YEARS ago.

Again IFS isn't the end all and be all and I still have a SFA under my 80, but I wouldn't hesitate to buy a GM IFS 2500HD as I have used and abused them and have not had any issues (knock on wood :muahaha: ).


I could be wrong, but I doubt GM will go back to SFA in the light duty pickup line ever again. $$$$ is the dictator and the old farmers with big pockets want a truck that is easy to get into (read LOW) and rides nices (i.e. IFS). If teenagers had the money and were buying new trucks, they would all be SFA with a lift and boggers from the factory :joke: but you get the idea.

I think it's the silent majority dictating what GM will do and they do it with their wallets. We can ***** all we want, but until a MAJORITY of buyers want a SFA and are willing to PAY for it, we will never see it.

Those that don't care what kind of truck they get as long as it is SFA will still have Ford and Dodge (for the most part) and the rest who want an easy vehicle to get in and out of and a nice ride (i.e. A LOT of people) will have GM.

I just realized the other day how important it was. My father who is 65 and still works, had a hard time getting into my buddies stock 85 GMC 1 ton truck the other day, forget about him trying to get into my lifted pickup or even a stock Dodge/Ford for example. Imagine having trouble getting in and out of your vehicle EVERY time. What would you want....?

OK :rant: off. :D

With Ford, you go from F-250 through the F-550 with the same cab.
It's not much of a stretch to slap the 350 cab and bed on the 750 chassis. It looks like it only takes minor glass work to get the tilt-out to match the sheet metal.

REAL NUMBERS, from a dealership that sells both Ford and GM:
October/YTD sales numbers

Ford:.........10/05........YTD
Ranger.........6,354.....106,261
F-Series......54,404....749,094
(memo: Mark LT..1,313....7,240)
Exped...........6,047.....97,825
Excursion......1,165......14,748
(memo:Navigator..1,431..21,714)

GM..... ......10/05.......YTD
Colorado/Canyon.......7,922.....123,251
Silverado/Sierra........38,303.....795,952
Tahoe/Yukon.. .......8,961.....192,367
Suburban/Yukon XL......6,849....119,830
(memo:Escalade..1,801..43,677)

Silverado/Sierra is outselling all Forduh F's this year, even with F-1.50's in there!!! Yesss Thank you 6.0psd

ps - SFA sucks, IFS will never go away because as someone said its what the vast majority wants, major selling point for the "typical" truck buyer.

Hey my first post. I currently drive a leaf sprung D60 2004 F350. It rides great to me and I wouldnt trade that setup for anything.

I doubt chevy will go away from IFS. They own that corner of the market. Both have theyre advantages. IFS has a better onroad ride if thats what your looking for. If you do alot of offroading or run big tires (36+) then I would take a SFA any day. Easier to work on, more durable in my opinion, and flex better hands down. The only advantage I see with IFS is center ground clearence and high speed applications like desert racing.

The only reason Im on this site is because I heard GM might be going SFA. Ive owned 2 dodges and now a ford, all SFA. If GM switched "back" to SFA I would seriously consider one. That and if they lost the factory body lift look. My friends front bumper on his 2002 dodge 2500 is half way up my thigh and im 6 ft. tall. A chevy needs a 4 inch lift to even compare.

Its all just what you prefer. I will always buy SFA if its available unless in gonna get a 1/2 ton gasser and keep it stock. But if GM converts to SFA I might be jumping brands.

P.S... My 6.0 has been flawless, :)

SFA does not suck. I would love to have a solid axle under my 04. I can see the masses wanting ifs in a half ton, but these are supposed to be heavy duty trucks. How many tractor trailers do you see with ifs? None, reason is if you need a heavy wieght rating you need heavy axles. The fact you can't put a snow plow on a crew cab without being over the front axles wieght rating is ludacris. The technology to have a smooth riding solid front axle exists, and to tell you the truth my ifs truck does not ride that smooth anyways. Just look at how many people have viewed this thread, looks like a lot of people are interested.