I don't race and won't be racing. My truck is a daily driver and I tag tow a toy hauler aroune 10,000 lbs loaded. When I take the toyhauler out it is usually to Glamis or Pismo (sand dunes).

I've been thinking about getting traction bars. I hate wheel hop in the sand and figured this would be a good fix. I will be getting and RCD 6" lift soon and have been looking at the RCD traction bars. I have looked at the Caltracs traction bars which I've seen people using here but I'm not sure if you can use those with a lift.

I did a search and found some threads on traction bars but the did not have much info and none of them were recent.

What traction bars do you guys use and what are your comments on them?

I have seen some comments regarding binding and the they were not good if you towed. I'd appreciate any insight you could give to help me decide what to do.

Thanks, Mark

I've been using Caltracs for a couple of months. I don't race either but I too hate wheel hop and spring wind up. The Caltracs connect to a replacement they provide for the plate under the axle that the spring U-bolts connect to. I don't see why a lifted truck would be a problem (though mine isn't lifted). The Caltracs are adjustable so that some free play can be allowed. I haven't had a binding problem, but the free play when empty disappears when loaded.
Mounting them is not a problem, except for the removal of the front bushings on the leaf springs and you have to cut about an inch of of the front spring mounting bolt to get it past the fuel tank. You need an air chisel, or a huge clamp, a sharp chisel, a big hammer and a bad attitude as in my case to get those son of a @#&* bushings out.
They haven't stiffened the ride but they sure have nailed the rear end down.
If you're interested, John Kennedy has them for as good a price as anywhere else. Hope this helps.
John

Yes, I've looked at the Caltracs and heard what a pain they are to install. They are actually relatively inexpensive. If anyone has traction bars and tows I'd really like to know your observations on what it is like towing with them.

To be honest with you I think that tire pressure is a big part of the problem as well as the width of your footprint in the sand. Stock my truck bucked like you wouldn't believe pulling our 30ftWW in the sand, but I also had 60psi in them and never aired down. Now with the 40x15.5's I run less pressure 40psi and have a wider footprint and it rarely ever bucks or hops. It is a pain in the a$$ but taking the time to air down a bit, to (20-30 PSI) would probably help alot and save you some $$$

I'm getting ready to build a set of trac bars for myself. I have done quite a bit of research and with-out going into too much detail, the quick, easy way to solve most of the wheel hop is to use a single bar attached to the bottom of the axle with a rod-end and bushing at the frame mount. As the wheel roll forward the bar forces the axle to rotate to the rear of the truck, this stretches the leaf spring and keeps it from wrapping. The other way to go is with a ladder bar style, but this requires a little more work and a shackle at the frame mount. The RCD bars are of the single bar desing and a good solid way to go plus they will match the rest of your lift and the geometry has already been done. The caltracs are great for racers but as said above they are a pain to install, the can rattle if not properly adjusted, and can cause binding when off-roading. I personally don't like the added stress they add to the thinnest part of the leaf spring but that's another topic. If it were me I'd go with the RCD bars.

Just my $.02,

Chris

The cal tracs can be adjusted to take away any effect at all, ones that are rigid mounted to the frame ect cant. If your bar lenghts werent the right size I believe they could also send you different lenght bars. Install is easy if you know a few tricks. I notice a bit of a slapping noise sometimes depending how I have em set going over bumps. That about it. They work great at eliminating wheel hop

I'm looking at getting a set from So Cal Diesel. I need to get rid of the wheel hop on the pavement.

Since is don't track race or smoke ricers I'm really only concerned with the hop in the sand. I will have to see how it is going from the 245's to the 315's.

I'm always aired down to 20 - 25 when in the sand but even aired down, the 245's are so skinny it helps but does not make a huge difference. I'm betting the BFG 315's aired down will make a big difference.

I'll have to see what its like and if the hop is still there I'll probably just go with the RCD bars.

Thanks for the responses.

I don't understand the "Cal Tracs binding during off road" comment. Could you elaborate?

Perhaps there's something I forgot to consider.

Thanks in advance :D

I don't understand the "Cal Tracs binding during off road" comment. Could you elaborate?

Perhaps there's something I forgot to consider.

Thanks in advance :D


Let's start this with my biggest problem with Cal tracs is the noise/rattling you get(I'll get back to the binding). Take a look at these pics:
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/5495caltracs09-med.jpg

http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/5495caltracs04-med.jpg

http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/5495caltracs03-med.jpg

The basic pieces of the caltracs are the axle mount, the bar, and the leaf spring mount/pivot. Now the rod itself has rodends at both ends so that in itself creates a loose bar that can rattle as you go down the road. The leaf spring pivot is also loose to rattle against the top of the spring unless you "Preload" it against the leaf but when the suspension droops the "preload" is undone so you get the rattle back.

The second biggest problem I have with caltracs is the way in which rotational energy from the axle is transferred to the leaf spring at it's thinnest spot. Now this is where the spring tends to flex and alllow axle wrap so it makes sense but with large tires, tons of Torque(Diesel), you are applying a lot of force to a small area, this wears on the springs over time and can actually break the leaf spring in half (I've seen it).

So now to the articulation/binding. Most of the Cal tracs kits I've seen come with small "misallignment" rod-ends, means that there is not a lot of axial/rotational movement along the centerline of the bar. Basically if the axle drops considerably on one side while the oposite side travels up, thus twisting the rod on the caltrac, the rodends can come in contact with the mounts or simply bottom out on themselves. This is aggrivated by their short length. Also if you've ever seen a leaf srping set-up flexing you know the axle actually moves side to side and the leaf springs twist and flex. A lot of the leaf springs ability to flex comes from the rubber bushing at the rear shackle and front frame mount. With the caltrac pivot/mount plates on either side of the springs bushing, articulation is limited.

All this being said, Cal tracs work really well for most applications, especially for drag racers but I think in an off-road vehicle there are better options. Such as the ladder bar set-up or the single bar type from the bottom of the rear axle with a high misalignment rod end and a rubber bushing mount at the frame.

Just my $.02,

Chris

Chris,

Thanks for sharing your thoughts I appreciate your info.
I feel there are trade offs with all the different bars I've seen currently available. The Cal Tracs to me, seem like the best all around solution for the masses.

A free moving suspension:

Most bars that I have seen will create an even greater bind in the suspension as it articulates through it's available movement, both rotational and side to side. Most bars don't take into account the arc that axle housing travels in as it moves up and down. Installing a set of bars that attach to the housing and then run forward of the front leaf spring mount will travel in a totally different arc than the Cal Tracs or the axle housing.

Bolt on installation:

Using the proper tool to press out the front leaf spring bushing will make the Cal Tracs install go very smoothly. Basically, it's a ball joint/bushing press that is nothing more than a very beefy C-clamp. I think they sell for around $80.00 or I will loan mine to anyone that needs it for the cost of shipping back and forth and a deposit on a CC.

I feel that welding attachments on to the axle housing without removing the housing and checking for runout after welding is going to create more problems than the "weld on" bars solve. I have seen axle housings toe in or out 1/4" at the flange after welding. Think of the added stress to the wheel bearings/axles, and the addiditonal tire wear this would cause.

Rattle:
Most can be eliminated with preload and/or by using a rubber or urethane sleeve around the bolt that comes in contact with the leaf spring.

Broken leaf spring:

Now this concerns me, as this is a safety issue. I understand your theory, but question the actual circumstances in which it would occur. I'd like to hear more about the one you saw. Yes we are applying a tremendous amount of Torque, and yes we are trying to move a very heavy vehicle, both scenarios could equal broken parts, however I have to question whether or not a different style would hold up under the same conditions that would break a leaf spring, I doubt that the Cal tracs would be NHRA approved if they were prone to breaking leaf springs. However I respect your observations and would like to learn more. If it is a legit safety issue, specific to this design, I will quit selling them.

Thanks again for your opinion, I'm enjoying the discussion.....Can I get you another beer while I'm up?:D

Trippin,

I'm enjoying the discussion as well. Again these are just my opinion based on my personal experiences and the few things I remember/learned while getting my engineering degree(trust me I don't remember that much:D ). Anyway, as far as safety is concerned I will say the broken leaf springs from cal tracs are not that common but more of an issue that owners should know about and check periodically. In all the cases I have seen there was no major damage to the vehicles, just a big bang and lean to one side, although on the off-road truck it did almost roll becuase of the sudden weight shift. A quick field weld with a backer plate and the truck made it through the weekend.

I do disagree that the caltracs are the best for the masses. I think the everyday wheeler should look more at the ORU style traction bars, although a little expensive I think they offer the best all around performance.

http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/5495ORUbars-med.jpg

And I don't know if they make them for Chevy's yet.

The tricky part about a leaf sprung axle is that the arc the axle travels through is constantly changing because the leaf spring is curved from the axle to the front mounting point on the frame. This spring bends and straightens as load is increased/decreased and each time it does it changes the distance from the axle to the front spring mount which is the radius of the arc the axle travels through, so any type of attached bar attached to the axle has to compensate for this or else it will cause a rotation of the axle as the axle travels up and down, Cal tracs including. A ladder bar style traction bar that is attached to the axle in two locations so that it and the axle rotate together must have a shackle type attachment at the frame that allows it to move forward and backward to prevent binding. The single type bar attaches to the axle with a movable joint but as the axle travels up and down the bar end must travel through a fixed arc thus causing some rotation of the axle, the longer the single bar, the less rotation it imparts on the axle. The Caltrac bar is rather short but hopefully close to same length as the spring is from the front mount to the axle but as the spring flattens and curves(like it's supposed too) the caltracs bar will move and apply a force to the axle and the spring. If you look at the ORU style traction bars you'll notice they are attached solidly to the axle like a ladder bar but also have a rotating slip joint near the front mount. This allows the axle to move freely side to side and front to back but keeps it from rotating and causing axle wrap.

I do agree that a professional should be used when welding on the axle tube to prevent deformation and to keep from frying the gear oil in the axle, I considermyself a pretty good welder and I even went to an axle building pro to have the tabs welded on my truck, just in case.

In my particular case I couldn't use the ORU style trac bars because mine will be serving double duty as traction bars and to transfer the load to my airbags similar to the picture below:
http://www.hotboatpics.com/pics/data/500/5495barwbags-med.jpg

Why I'm running them like this is a whole nother topic.

Anyway back to the masses.......if you can run a set of the ORU style bars that's the best option, after that I say the single bar style like the RCD or Fabtech style(most are bolt-on and will match the lift kit), the long radius of the bars will have minimal effect on the axle rotation as it travels up and down, and third the caltrac style because of the reasons I listed the first time, the rubber bushings will wear and eventually rattle, overtime the leaf springs can be weakened and may break, and overall they look funny:D :D

Again just my opinion and you know what they say about those.:rant:

Chris

This is great! Just the kind of discussion I was looking for. Good reading. Please continue...

By the way, I will probably be getting air bags after I do my lift to help level the 3" of squat I get after hooking up my trailer. Any issues with having the airbags with traction bars?

I don't run one yet, but will be building a single bar set up soon. Here is an example. This one is on my Jeep. The one I build for my pick up will be able to be much longer. A set up like this is very effective for controlling axel wrap and pretty much does not effect articulation. The mount's for it are built onto the pumpkin, as close to the driveshaft as I could.

beerman

Tim, great observsations. For years everyone has tried to adapt 4 link ladder style bars into a leaf spring vehicle, completely forgetting about the different arcs that the ladder bars and axle housing must travel through. A shackle type arrangment at the front mounting point or a slip joint certainly would solve that issue. Without that shackle or slip joint, binding will occur and spring rate will become infinite. Yet with a slip joint how does the rotational force and axle wrap get prevented or transfered into any usable force such as the Cal Tracs do?

FYI, the ORU bars are listed at $1050.00

Hence my earlier statment about the $339.00 Cal Tracs being the bars for the masses.

Heybeerman,
Your stuff looks good! :cool2:

A "single-bar" is also known as a Torque Arm. Look under the back of a 1998-2002 Camaro or Firebird.

Not sure about the "changing arc" thing though. The rear axle will travel through an arc as function of compression. It's just that the arc does not have the same focal point as the front leaf hanger. If your front mount jived with the focus of the actual axle arc, you should be fine.

Or am I hallucinatin'? ;)

PS - No traction bar setup will insure removal of wheelhop. It will supress it, but the only guarantee is 100% traction. If the tires do not slip, wheelhop cannot start. Of course you cannot guarantee 100% traction in many cases, hence why traction bars can help. Like above, first thing to try is traction via tire selection and pressure.

Great input from everyone. All good points.

Here's a great article that covers most aspects of traction bars.

http://www.4x4wire.com/jeep/tech/susp/axlewrap/

Probably the best overall explanation I have found and good pics too. Read it and make your own decisions, instead of listening to my crazy ideas.:D

Chris

I have a set of single bars made by full-Throttle. They work great, I have had no problems.

The key is that they run parallel to your driveshaft, so they are on the same arc.

That axle wrap link was interesting. A pretty clear explanation of the issue and solutions. Looks like the single shaft traction bar like teh RCD design is good but not as good as the ladder bar design. 4 link is good but probably not practical for a lot of people since it is more complex and will be more costly and also introduces its own issues.

I see Daystar and Fabtech make ladder style traction bars. Daystar is only for Ford and are about $1,000. Fabtech makes them for our trucks and they are around $520.

Anyone use the Fabtech ladder bars? Anyone with an RCD lift have these?

It was an interesting link. Lots of food for thought.
But not to be taken as gospel.
Just another enthusiast's opinion. :D

Yes, if there is one thing I've learned since I've gotten my Duramax its that everyone has an opinion! Getting down to the facts, on the other hand, can sometimes be tough, especially since a lot of issues are not black and white as is the case for this one.

What I saw in that link, though, generally matches up with what I've heard a lot of people say. I wish I was an engineer but since I'm not I tend to have to rely on surveying people and going with the consensus tempered by some gut intuition. The masses are not always right but are usually a good indication of which direction to go.

I towed a smaller enclosed haulmark trailer with a camero in it for a bud since it fried his 1/2 ton gassers trans(01 and the first time he hooked up BTW) Believe it had 11k worth of axels underneath it. It was good sized but not huge.

With weight on it threw my bar adjustments WAY off. I knew it would, yanking the spare tire and tailgate will throw em off. But I noticed my range of adjustment was getting pretty close to being topped off. Bigger trailer ect and I may need shorter bars? I duno? I was on the overloads pretty good. Also......with the cal tracs I was able to back em off and adjust em pretty easy. Wonder how that would work with a traction bar that was fixed to the frame? The way traction bars are set up raising or lowering the rear end will affect your pinion angle. If you set it unloaded and add a bunch of weight and the suspention squishes down the traction bars starts trying toi "work" basicly. With a cal trac you can easily back it off though till its lose, load up and fine tune from there. Wonder if forcing the bar to work is all that good of an idea or iff you really should adjust your bars everytime you change load?

What do you guys think???

ratlover - could the problem you had be because the caltracs bar connects to the spring itself? The RCD bar I have been looking at connects to the frame much farther forward. Seems like a bar connected forward on the frame would not have the same issue when putting a load on.

If the rear end moves at all the bar will start to rotate the pinion. Look at the arc or path everything takes as it moves. The bars would have to follow the exact smae path as the rear end as it moves. Have the same center of the arc ect.....

Because the cal tracs are connected around the spring and actually touch the springs, the amount of "Pre-load" adjusted on the springs will change each time a significant load is placed on the rear of the truck. This is because as the springs compress the distance from the front spring hanger to the axle changes and thus changes the relationship between the cal tracs and the springs.
On a single bar set-up the longer radius of the bar lessons the affect on the axle but it will rotate the axle downward as the axle travles up(actually the rearend of the truck traveling down) with the added load. Typically not a problem as long as the single bar is long enough. The minor change in pinion angle caused is usually offset by the additional axle rotation caused by the heavier load on the wheels trying to roll forward.

LOL. What I meant...only much better said....

Can I use caltracs if I have the HD airbags, where the bump stop used to be?

Can I use caltracs if I have the HD airbags, where the bump stop used to be?

I've got Caltracs installed exactly this way (with air bags mounted where bump stops used to sit). I was wondering about the same thing regarding load, effect on Caltracs and if leveling rear end with airbags would reverse the effect on the Caltracs? :confused:

I towed a cargo trailer full of quads and bed full of wood a few weeks ago which squatted the ass end pretty good ...then I leveled truck with airbags. However I never checked the load/effect on the Caltracs ...made a 600 mile r/t and didn't notice anything different.

I am running my own set up. It's a 1.5 solid bar, attached to the bottom of the leaf spring clamp (simular to caltracs), and mounted to a custom mount on the outside of the frame about 6ft in front of the axle. I use 3/4" rod ends on both front and rear mounts. The only problem I have is, since they are ridgidly mounted, I can feel all the bumps in the road coming from the axle, right into the frame. At the truck pull last night, my buddies said they seen noticeable flexing of the bars, this even with my springs clamped together. Just shows how much torsional force in going threw that axle.

Actually, most leaf springs are designed to have the majority of flex in the spring take place behind the axle housing. Notice that the front of the spring (axle housing forward) is generally thicker and there is more arc in the spring after it passes by the axle housing on its way to the rear shackle. This minimizes the amount of rear steer that would take place, by dynamically changing the mounting distance from the front leaf spring eye to the axle housing during compression or rebound.

Because the Cal Tracs are a "free" moving system, you will experience a difference in preload with varying chassis heights. A static system with a heim on either end will simply induce or remove pinion angle as the arc of the axle housing travel conflicts/binds with the arc of the static system, during compression and rebound.

The C-C distance from the front spring eye to the axle housing is approx. 32". This means the axle housing travels in an arc of approx. a 32" radius, or a 64" dia. circle. Anything that solidly attaches to axle housing that travels in a different dia. arc/circle is going to bind the suspension. Installing a slip joint in the ladder bar as some have done to accommodate the change in length needed to prevent binding only lessens the effectiveness of the bar.

:blahblah:
Then again, I could be ingesting way too much diesel smoke, which is affecting my brain for the worse. :D

I've been out of town for a couple of weeks, I see this thread still has life. I am running Firestone air bags with Caltracs. I think the adjustability of the air bags are just what you need to avoid constantly adjusting the Caltracs to maintain free play. If you preload the Caltracs (or the added weight in your truck preloads them for you) rear suspension travel is limited, the ride is rougher, and I believe that excessive stress is put on the bars and springs where the Caltracs shackle bolts make contact. Preloading may be what you need when drag racing, but the ride is way too stif for everyday use. The airbags allow for an easy method of maintaining suspension height and therefore suffient free play to suit the seat of your pants, in my case 5/8" between the Caltracs upper shackle bolts and the top of the springs. This should allow the traction bars to do thier job without excessive wear on them or the springs.
Just another opinion.
John