I just had my transmission rebuilt 3 weeks ago and Sunday it went out. Friday I had the fluid changed to AMS oil and left for the coast. Sunday when I went to leave I had reverse but all foward gears where slipping real bad and I was throwing codes. If I took off real slow with no power I could get it to walk through the gears and shift all the way into O/D and it would hold it there as long as I did not slip the trans. After about 15 miles at 60mph my trans temp was 250-270* so I pulled it over and shut down. It cost 800 dollars to get the truck towed 228 miles. It is back in the trans shop right now and they have no idea yet what is wrong. The pan is clean, the fluid is clean, reverse works great but all the foward gears are slipping.

5 speed allison
trip loc bill torque converter
trans go shift kit
alto red clutches

What do you guys think?

what codes? Sounds like the transmission shop messed something up and it should be all their problem/concern...

0776
0730
0721
0725
It threw all kinds of 700 codes, I had to keep clearing codes to get the transmission to work so I could get to the next town. They are going to fix the transmission but I would like to know what happened in case they try to give me some kind of song and dance. I had my PPE set at the #3 setting and I drive at this setting every day.

check all of the wiring connections/plugs on the TCM, speed sensors, and the transmission case connector.

I don't have a code list in front of me but was it low on fluid? You said you HAD it changed, like you didn't do it yourself. Is it possible that it didn't get filled properly? They can be kinda touchy that way.

they just called and said the percision tripple lock billet converter failed. When the foward clutches failed it smoked one of the clutch packs in the trans and warped all the plates. Percision is sending me a new torque converter and the shop is rebuilding my transmission again.

they just called and said the percision tripple lock billet converter failed. When the foward clutches failed it smoked one of the clutch packs in the trans and warped all the plates. Percision is sending me a new torque converter and the shop is rebuilding my transmission again.

Id be willing to bet money they screwed something up in the install..... ;)

What they told you (what I highlighted in bold) makes no sense. There are no "forward" clutches in an allison. Converter failures are VERY VERY rare. And when they do fail, it does not take out the rest of the trans. Im guessing they didnt set clutchpack clearances correctly.

The fact that they are taking care of this so quickly and rebuilding your trans for free also throws up a red flag; if it really and truely just was a parts-only failure, I feel like they would complain a bit more and not be so quick to jump in and give you a complete free rebuild.

ben

Id be willing to bet money they screwed something up in the install..... ;)

What they told you (what I highlighted in bold) makes no sense. There are no "forward" clutches in an allison. Converter failures are VERY VERY rare. And when they do fail, it does not take out the rest of the trans. Im guessing they didnt set clutchpack clearances correctly.

The fact that they are taking care of this so quickly and rebuilding your trans for free also throws up a red flag; if it really and truely just was a parts-only failure, I feel like they would complain a bit more and not be so quick to jump in and give you a complete free rebuild.

ben


All I have to go on is what they told me. I know the transmission makes no noise at all when you drive it. All the foward gears slip big time and the trans temps climb real quick. Reverse works like normal. There are no abnormal sounds at all from the transmission.

I agree with DuratotheMAX but I have a related question. IF (big if) the converter failed and started shedding clutch material is it possible to plug up the filters so bad that it hurts the clutch packs or does the ally get all kinds of uncooperative long before that happens?

I had a 4L60 go bad on a 1990 half ton right after converter work. I got the same story, converter shed clutch into tranny, no cooling, baked everything.

I agree this sounds shady, the story you're being told might work on an older, less sophisticated tranny but I don't think that could happen with an Ally

Who did the work in Houston?

I had the transmission done in Conroe Texas at diso**** transmission. I saw all the parts that went into it and I know they have done many performance diesel transmissions. I wanted to use Michael's all transmissions in Houston but he could not get me in.

please let us know what you find out.

Id be willing to bet money they screwed something up in the install..... ;)

What they told you (what I highlighted in bold) makes no sense. There are no "forward" clutches in an allison. Converter failures are VERY VERY rare. And when they do fail, it does not take out the rest of the trans. Im guessing they didnt set clutchpack clearances correctly.

The fact that they are taking care of this so quickly and rebuilding your trans for free also throws up a red flag; if it really and truely just was a parts-only failure, I feel like they would complain a bit more and not be so quick to jump in and give you a complete free rebuild.

ben
X2, i agree with you on this too. These clutch packs can take alot of abuse but having the wrong tolerances will burn them up very quickly. Even in stock tune the tranny wouldnt have lasted.

well the factory said the torque converter is fine! I asked the trans shop why the C1 pack was smoked, and the steel plates where all heat warped and they have no clue. They say they have done many of these transmission and never seen this before. They had two other transmission guy look it over and they can't find anything wrong with the trans either. They still think it is the torque converter even thought the factory said it is fine. The shop said the end play on the converter was 40 thousand and felt loose. The replacment converter has 10 thousand play. What would have caused the C1 pack to go up in smoke in seconds?

probably installed the clutch pack in reverse. or got the wrong clearences. also mine burnt up c1's until i put a new valvebody in. i think it was warped and bleeding pressure under high stress situations

well the factory said the torque converter is fine! I asked the trans shop why the C1 pack was smoked, and the steel plates where all heat warped and they have no clue. They say they have done many of these transmission and never seen this before. They had two other transmission guy look it over and they can't find anything wrong with the trans either. They still think it is the torque converter even thought the factory said it is fine. The shop said the end play on the converter was 40 thousand and felt loose. The replacment converter has 10 thousand play. What would have caused the C1 pack to go up in smoke in seconds?

Thats classic :rolleyes:

I hate it when someone tells me they have no idea why it failed. When I get the truck back I am going to drive it like it is rented that is for sure. A couple of burn outs should tell the story.

They swear they have double checked everything and had the master trans guy from GM look at it and they can't find anything wrong and cant figure out what caused this problem.

UPDATE:
I was suppose to pick the truck up Friday after they have driven it for two days. They called me an hour before I was suppose to pick it up and said the transmission has a problem. In park the trans is only making 90psi of pressure so they said they are going to have to figure out what is going on. I think they said it should be making 130psi of pressure in park.

UPDATE:
I was suppose to pick the truck up Friday after they have driven it for two days. They called me an hour before I was suppose to pick it up and said the transmission has a problem. In park the trans is only making 90psi of pressure so they said they are going to have to figure out what is going on. I think they said it should be making 130psi of pressure in park.

Have them increase the throttle over 7% and see what the pressure does then.

My confidence in their allison knowledge continues to fall...... :(

Ben

Well I also discovered that they did not clearance the C1 drum correct. When 5th gear was ingauged it was also ingauging the C1 a little. It is shimmed correct now and they are going to change the pressure control valves. He called in a guy from another shop that is suppose to be an Allison guru to figure out what is going on before this cost him any more money.

you are running a stock TCM right?

forgive me but what is a TCM

Transmission Control Module

crowhater, I would get my truck and run if I were you. There are plenty of better places around Houston area.

Transmission Control Module


I have a factory TCM, is this a problem?

I have a factory TCM, is this a problem?


Doubt it, he was just asking.

I have a factory TCM, is this a problem?

Ask your trans shop if they know what the G-solenoid does (or if they even know what it is) on an allison, and why that might explain their current pressure "problem" at idle. ;)

ben

what is it and what does it do? This is not a game to me, I really want my truck fixed right. If I have to drive this cummins one more week I think I might kill someone. Everytime I come to a light I feel like I need to engauge the pto and lower my cutter. Don't get me wrong it is a nice truck. It is a 1997 dodge crewcab 4x4 cummins with get this 57,000 miles on it!!! My step father bought it to pull a fifth wheel trailer and he sold the trailer so now it sits in the garage under a car cover. This is what I have been driving while my truck gets fixed and it sounds like a tractor.

Obvisouly you are not comfortable doing the repair yourself, you need to go to another shop!!!!!

Call Circle D Trans on Hempstead Hwy and I know of about five other good trans shops.

the 04.5+ allisons have an additional solenoid on the valve body called the "G-solenoid". It is used for modulated mainline pressure at idle or very low engine speeds.

The reason Allison/GM did this was to try to lower temperatures when the truck is idleing, or moving slowly in traffic where air flow over the trans cooler is low.

Pressure being related to temperature means if you drop the fluid pressure in the trans, you will not produce as much heat. Obviously at idle/low speeds/power you dont need lots of pressure in the trans....so they put that solenoid in to drop pressure and increase cooler flow at idle/low speeds.

which, unless Im completely wrong (which I could be!), might be why they are seeing lower than normal pressure at idle; because you have an LLY with modulated main. Have them slowly increase the throttle and I bet the pressure will jump up.

Hopefully crafty1 or mike will see this and either confirm my suspicion or give another possibility to why your trans shop is still having trouble with it.

ben

The cost to rebuild tranny,around $4,000.00
The cost to have it done right, ?
You know.


You should have found that guru they are calling over in the first place!

This is one of those deals where I tried to spend some cash in my own town and it back fired. I know of several guys who have had their trans done here and they work great, I guess I am just lucky.

I certainly hope they have reimbursed you for the $800 tow bill?

crowhater, im sorry to hear about all your troubles, and i hope you get it fixed asap. Not to hijack your thread or anything but i know you said they installed alto red eagle clutchs, but i was curious if they bought a kit or if they just purchased alto clutches and new steels and then just bought a gasket/seal kit? Or if they got a kit from PPE, or suncoast etc, ect.

Don't get me to telling stories, I am not sure. I know I saw the parts but I am pretty sure they did not get them from PPE. I did not ask them where they bought them from.

it's nice to hear they want to make it right at least. Plenty of shady shops who would have told you to blow smoke up your arss.

Give Mike L a call see if he will help.

Give Mike L a call see if he will help.


Who is Mike L?

Only the best Allison builder on here.

http://www.inglewoodtransmission.com/

Really, you don't know?

He is one of the trans, guru's on this site! (IMO the best on the West coast.)
He has his own Trans. business in SoCal and is a vendor here. Check him out.

the 04.5+ allisons have an additional solenoid on the valve body called the "G-solenoid". It is used for modulated mainline pressure at idle or very low engine speeds.

The reason Allison/GM did this was to try to lower temperatures when the truck is idleing, or moving slowly in traffic where air flow over the trans cooler is low.

Pressure being related to temperature means if you drop the fluid pressure in the trans, you will not produce as much heat. Obviously at idle/low speeds/power you dont need lots of pressure in the trans....so they put that solenoid in to drop pressure and increase cooler flow at idle/low speeds.

which, unless Im completely wrong (which I could be!), might be why they are seeing lower than normal pressure at idle; because you have an LLY with modulated main. Have them slowly increase the throttle and I bet the pressure will jump up.

Hopefully crafty1 or mike will see this and either confirm my suspicion or give another possibility to why your trans shop is still having trouble with it.

ben

I just talked to crowhater Ben and I totaly agree with you. The trans was built with Borg Warner clutches. From what I understand the shop tightened up the C1 clearance ( big mistake ). Problem with the B/W clutches is you're only going to get 50% contact on C1 and C2. Even with higher pressure and Transgo s/k it is not enough to hold 500 hp very long.

Mike is the man!!!! The transmission shop broke down and did as I suggested and called Mike. I explained what they where doing wrong I guess and told them he would help the get it right. They are going to pull it apart again and call Mike when they put it back together to get it right.

EXCELLENT

Great to hear! Mike L. is definitely the Tranny Man!!

EXCELLENT

Great to hear! Mike L. is definitely the Tranny Man!!


Kinda weird!!!! lol

This is the thrid time my transmsission will be apart in 1 month. I think Mike feels sorry for me that is why he is helping.

Kinda weird!!!! lol


What's kinda weird??

The tranny man! My mind was in a dirty place, forget about it lol

The tranny man! My mind was in a dirty place, forget about it lol

Sometimes you need to put the sheep aside and get serious. They will wait.:rolleyes::p::D

I only know Mike L from what I've read and after reading this I'm very very impressed to say the least.

Sometimes you need to put the sheep aside and get serious. They will wait.:rolleyes::p::D


Funny you say that, I got a nasty media message from a truck driver today that had a sheep in it! haha lol