If you have ever wondered if investing $3-600 in either a simple Nictane Kit or a full blown AirDogII or FASS fuel filter system was worth it..these pictures may just sway you to do so. The reason I did so, was to delay or totally prevent having to replace the below two items at some point.

Injectors are likely $2500 per set of 8 + install-labour
Injector Pump (CP3) is likely 1500-2000 + install-labour.

Which would you prefer to do..??

I use a smaller Stanadyne System that uses a 5 mU filter in a POST OEM configuration. It is mounted in the engine bay.

http://inlinethumb18.webshots.com/6801/2616560070047245006S500x500Q85.jpg

http://inlinethumb51.webshots.com/45362/2798995670047245006S500x500Q85.jpg

http://inlinethumb20.webshots.com/5203/2449054990047245006S500x500Q85.jpg

I don't know what the filtering efficiency of the OEM filters are, but would suggest they do not do a very good job of stopping those particulates (5-12mU), that are the very evil little things that wear out the fuel system components.!

These have been in the truck until I hit 50% on my DIC. I am going to say that is only about 18-20,000km..! Needless to say, I am glad I have that little extra filter. I had recently bought a fiter head and large CAT filter from Toromont CAT here in Barrie but have yet to install...seeing these filters has put that mod to the front of the priority list. (I'm just torn between Doing the Nictane one + a lift pump or going full hog with an AirDogII)....DROOL big time..!!

Rgds,

Stk

Thats some nasty lookin stuff, i like the idea of the airdog, just the price is outrageous, but its hard to believe all the things that gets filtered out jeeze

Might be caused by bad injectors,a bad injector can cause soot to travel back to the fuel tank via the return line.The only way to monitor that is put a small clear fuel filter in the return line.

now thats not a bad idea.! I might do that..or I might have one of my buddies plug me into his EFI live and see if we can determine if any one of the injectors is not up to snuff. Mind you if that were the case, I would see a lot of that crud in my OEM fliter which is first inline from the tank..??

stk

For most secondary filtration is a wast IMO more so for those that have a post OEM setup. CP3 and injector failures are far from common on the 04.5+ trucks. So for anyone planing to get rid of there truck before 200K-300K it would be just about pointless. Adding a filter but not a lift pump you maybe doing more damage to the CP3. By making it work harder to pull fuel through the filters. I'm not saying don't do it just that it isn't worth while all the time. I have one set up pre and get the filters for about free so it saves me a bit. Since I'm only changing out the expensive OEM every 40K.

How many miles are on those filters?

For most secondary filtration is a wast IMO more so for those that have a post OEM setup. CP3 and injector failures are far from common on the 04.5+ trucks. So for anyone planing to get rid of there truck before 200K-300K it would be just about pointless. Adding a filter but not a lift pump you maybe doing more damage to the CP3. By making it work harder to pull fuel through the filters. I'm not saying don't do it just that it isn't worth while all the time. I have one set up pre and get the filters for about free so it saves me a bit. Since I'm only changing out the expensive OEM every 40K.

40k seems a bit to many miles to me for changing your oem. I would change my fuel filter every 10k miles, but since I have put the pre-oem filter on, now I just change the pre filter every 10k miles and then at the 20k mile mark change the pre and the oem filters.
But that is a good point about the CP3 having to work harder. Is there anyway to find out if I need to put in a lift pump?

How many miles are on those filters?



40k seems a bit to many miles to me for changing your oem. I would change my fuel filter every 10k miles, but since I have put the pre-oem filter on, now I just change the pre filter every 10k miles and then at the 20k mile mark change the pre and the oem filters.
But that is a good point about the CP3 having to work harder. Is there anyway to find out if I need to put in a lift pump?
Check the pressure before and after the filter.

If you are asking me...the OEM might have 18-20,000 km but now that I think about it, the post OEM filter (the really dirty one), is likely over 30,000km.

As for adding a lift pump - that is in the works DB..at that time I'll delete the engine bay unit and go with a pre-oem ala Nictane or do an AirdogII.

I still think that filtering twice is better than once...but that is my opinion.

stk

Not a cure to the filtration methodology, but using high volume diesel sales stations, like Truck stops definately reduces the particulate in the fuel as well as lets less collect in out tank. i am a fan of extra filtration as well, just my 2 cents on where the gunk originates.

i have a FASS, those get changed every 10k, i change my oem filter every 5,000 miles to be on the safe side, and my #2 injector still went bad and i only have 35,000miles

For someone that wants the most life out of there fuel system and thinks a secondary filter is a good idea a lift pump is too. As power goes up the value of a lift pump increases. It will never be proven because of the lack of failures but I feel that a lift pump might be more helpful to the fuel system then extra filtration. 20' is a long ways to try and suck fuel from through a 2 micron filter or 2. Like I said though IMO extra filtration is overrated on these trucks. We just don't see enough failures to warrant it unless you have issues getting fuel of average quality.

Or you could consider replacing the OEM filter with the new Delco TP-3012 Filter. GM PN 98081884/12633243(printed on filter). These filters are designed to remove finer particulates and more water then the original filters. I am using the TP-3012, and it is working normally, with no problems. The Nicktane unit remains in place with a CAT 1R 0749 equivalent filter. Water in the fuel is just as big a problem as particulates. I used either Primrose 405C or XPD Diesel Fuel Improver additive with every fill up, thus far there had been no sign of water contamination or any fuel system problems. Keep in mind that the 2 micron CAT filter has a much larger filter element area, so that it loads more slowly than the OEM filter. IIRC the new TP-3012 filters down to 1 micron. Included below is the service bulletin:

Subject:Information on Improved Fuel Filter for 6.6L Duramax™ Diesel Engine


Models:2001-2009 Chevrolet Silverado
2003-2009 Chevrolet Kodiak
2006-2009 Chevrolet Express
2001-2009 GMC Sierra
2003-2009 GMC TopKick
2006-2009 GMC Sierra
Equipped with 6.6L Duramax™ Diesel Engine (VINs 1, 2, D, 6 - RPOs LB7, LLY, LBZ, LMM)



This bulletin is being revised to provide additional information to the field on fuel filter applications for the Duramax™ diesel engine. Please discard Corporate Bulletin Number 04-06-04-070A (Section 06 - Engine/Propulsion System).
Important: It is acceptable to use diesel fuel containing up to 5% biodiesel (B5). Higher concentration (i.e., greater than B5) biodiesel-containing fuels or the use of unmodified bio-oils blended into diesel fuel at any concentration is not recommended and could damage the fuel system and engine. Such damage would not be covered by your warranty.
A revised fuel filter is released that will service all 2001-2009 Chevrolet and GMC C/K models and 2003-2009 Chevrolet and GMC C4500/5500 Series vehicles with the 6.6L Duramax™ Diesel. The new coalescer filter provides the following benefits / improvements over the existing dual pleat design:

• 150-200% increase in service life, depending on contaminant type
• Improved fuel system protection with some premium diesel and B5 biodiesel blends
• Equivalent coarse water droplet removal efficiency of previous design
• Greatly improved removal of emulsified water - a major contributor to fuel system issues

I used either Primrose 405C or XPD Diesel Fuel Improver additive with every fill up, thus far there had been no sign of water contamination or any fuel system problems.

Thats because Primrose is a Emulsifier and mixes that water in with the fuel and burns it. If you ever saw water or rust you got some really bad fuel. Thats doesn't mean that Emulsifiers are good though.

Dozer. I take no issue with a lift pump. Agreed. But at this time, My wallet surely does.! LOL

It's on the list and at the top. As for additive I mix a qt of 2 stroke with 2 gallons of Power Service Diesel Kleen Winter grade and use that all yr round. Been doing that since I got the truck and spicers lubricity study kinda said yea, that works. BioD (summer time), would be nice but just cant seem to find it up here.


On the filtering thing though, I have been buying my fuel filters en masse from e-bay. Reason is they cost so damned much up here. Well over $55.00 + 13% tax ea CAD. and if I am not mistaken those are the std old style..not the new ones. Flea bay works out to 22.00 ea CAD - the standayne runs 23.50 per. And I do hear ya on the distance fuel travels.

PPE or TTs..just not sure yet. Maybe I'll be able to swing it once we sell our McMansion and get into a much downsized home. Less mortgage and way less taxes may well free up up some coin for some nice things ... maybe even a nice vacation to a warm spot in the sun...?? ahhhh.! (snows flying here already)

stk

You think that is bad...Look at these!:eek:

Another...

Do you run another lift pump with the extra nicktane filter?

Hey Doc...long time no see..!! WOW talk about bad SheeHite..!! Is that actually rust in the first ones.? and what kind of tadpoles do they put in diesel down there in the second pic...holy smokes that IS bad lookin.!!

cheers,

stk

Do you run another lift pump with the extra nicktane filter?


I don't, but everything is stock, so there has been no indication of fuel starvation. Also, I drive like an old man, come to think of it - I am an old man! I like the Air Dog concept, but I'm too lazy to crawl under there and install another set up. I suppose for those that tow long distances the Air Dog or a lift pump would be a good investment.

Hey Doc...long time no see..!! WOW talk about bad SheeHite..!! Is that actually rust in the first ones.? and what kind of tadpoles do they put in diesel down there in the second pic...holy smokes that IS bad lookin.!!

cheers,

stk


Yes, that is rust from water in the fuel system. Things are comming apart from the corrosion. That second pic is actually a sample taken from an auxillary tank at home that a guy used to fill his truck with. It wasn't sealed up very well and it sat for a long time and started to grow some things as well.

We had some Bosch engineers come and visit our shop and they said that the filtration problems were the main reason for the injector problems. Bosch and GM came to a settlement and that is why the above bulletin and filter change happened. That was a compromise and Bosch would like to see a two or three micron filter, not ten. For a stock truck without any added power a secondary filter will not harm the CP3. Under the higher demands of performance applications where a larger quantity of fuel is needed, the stock CP3 has problems keeping up with only the stock filter. If you look at other diesel applications, it is common to have multiple filters. Usually there is a 30 micron filter first and then a smaller one second. That does a better job of filtering and lengthens the time between filter changes. When using a FASS system or similar we put the better filter first (3 micron). In that situation if the filter is doing it’s job the factory filter should never get dirty, instead it serves as a back up to the first filter but will still let thing through that the first filter is designed to get.

For most secondary filtration is a wast IMO more so for those that have a post OEM setup. CP3 and injector failures are far from common on the 04.5+ trucks...

The injectors were redesigned to be more tolerant of the bad fuel here. The CP3 pumps did not change. We are seeing more and more trucks with higher mileage needing CP3 pumps. Only time will tell if the newer trucks will have the same issues. The fuel problem did not change is still dirty. Extra filtration can only help the situation.

I like my nictane filter as I can get cat filters very very cheap compared to the crazy price they want for the oem. Even aftermarket oem filters are pricy around here and being small don't last long.

Here is a filter cut in peices, a tad over 10K miles. Now with the cat filter the oem stays clean and the cat filter lasts longer.
http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/garageimage.php?do=full&p=22472&d=1167694352

As mentioned though, getting fuel from stations that move a fair amount of diesel is always a good idea.

With bigger power, dual pumps (Kennedys), how ristrictive is it with a 2nd filter like Nicktanes?

The injectors were redesigned to be more tolerant of the bad fuel here. The CP3 pumps did not change. We are seeing more and more trucks with higher mileage needing CP3 pumps. Only time will tell if the newer trucks will have the same issues. The fuel problem did not change is still dirty. Extra filtration can only help the situation.

Thats my point if you don't plan on keeping your truck for a long time its not worth it. Care to put a # on at what mileage your seeing more frequent failures? I was under the impression that GM was seeing more CP3 failures then similar setups with a lift pump. I don't remember where I read that, but I'll se if I can find it.

We are seeing CP3 replacements in trucks over 100K. I understand your point. Why do any maintenance on an engine if you only plan to keep it for a couple years? Remind me to not buy a truck from you! :D Diesel engines by their very nature are built extra strong and that is why they have a reputation for long life. With the prices of new trucks and the bad economy we are seeing more business in the repair area than in the upgrade area. Plus add in all the additional emissions equipment on the new trucks that are resulting in less mileage, I plan on keeping my truck as long as possible. :ro)

Thats some nasty lookin stuff, i like the idea of the airdog, just the price is outrageous, but its hard to believe all the things that gets filtered out jeeze

Dude,

Please keep your porn on your own computer. Lose the avatar.

Thats some nasty lookin stuff, i like the idea of the airdog, just the price is outrageous, but its hard to believe all the things that gets filtered out jeezeWhen you figure in the lifetime pump warranty and the fact that you can move that pump to another vehicle should you get a new one, it seems like a small price to me! Plus the fact that it filters down to 2 micron and a water separator!

Well..I ordered my PPE lift pump from Spi Performance late last week. 1 Large filter set up (with water separator), right after the pump and I can loose the Stanadyne unit.. (currently for sale in the Market), I do plan to keep this vehicle as long as it runs and can generates coin. Rather be drivng this than a smaller vehicle given the territory I travel.

Interesting comments Huck.!

Now to find a nice warm big garage to do the install of both the filter/bracket and the pump..

stk

Dude,

Please keep your porn on your own computer. Lose the avatar.Its a X-ray of a foot in someones @ss!

We had some Bosch engineers come and visit our shop and they said that the filtration problems were the main reason for the injector problems. Bosch and GM came to a settlement and that is why the above bulletin and filter change happened. That was a compromise and Bosch would like to see a two or three micron filter, not ten. For a stock truck without any added power a secondary filter will not harm the CP3. Under the higher demands of performance applications where a larger quantity of fuel is needed, the stock CP3 has problems keeping up with only the stock filter. If you look at other diesel applications, it is common to have multiple filters. Usually there is a 30 micron filter first and then a smaller one second. That does a better job of filtering and lengthens the time between filter changes. When using a FASS system or similar we put the better filter first (3 micron). In that situation if the filter is doing it’s job the factory filter should never get dirty, instead it serves as a back up to the first filter but will still let thing through that the first filter is designed to get.This is one of the reasons I have a bad CP3. I ran with a 490HP tune in my truck for a year without a lift pump. I now have a AirDog, but it was already too late. In two weeks I will have a new CP3, injectors, and the new fuel filter. I am hoping that the higher volume that a modified LBZ CP3, AirDog with 2 micron filter and water separator and the new filter design will make not only these new injectors last, but also give the CP3 more than 150K miles.

..update. After doing endless search and read. I have changed my mind on lift pump..cross out the ppe as it needs a bypass not being flow-thru. I do not want to be stranded on the side of the rd if it fails and it seems some guys have had issues with that. So Kennedy it is.

Hard pipe the pump to the fuel filter head with 1/2" npt pipe. Then AN8 ftgs with Airdog hose the rest of the way.! Found a Retail AeroQuip store in Concord that has absolutely everything in the way of fittings...gonna be there tomorrow am.!

cheers,

Stk

stk

Its a X-ray of a foot in someones @ss!

So it is. I should have looked more closely. My bad.

Horse haulin...It totally sucks that you have to get a new cp3.!! I just installed my PPE lift pump as well as a 10mU lrg CAT style filter housing and filter. I looked around - simply could not afford an AirDog II (although I think they are awesome), and even though I had to build a bypass for the PPE..I now feel vindicated in spending the money to do so. The last thing I need is a bill for $2500+ for a cp3.

I run my banks lightly..level 2,3 and the odd time when some punk in a ricer is bothering me..I'll go up to level 4-5 and create a bit of a smoke screen..

My set up now: 3 fuel filters

1st filter in array is a large CAT type (Racor) with water separator at 10 mU
2nd is the OEM filter (I've been buying them on E-bay..but next one will be from the Stealer so as I get one of Co-alecsing type.
3rd in line is the Stanadyne FM100 (with water separator - glass bowl type), and that one will likely remain at 5 mU for now as I just changed it out. However next time I just might get the 2 mU filter for that mount (engine bay-see garage). I figure the lift pump set at 7psi can handle all three.

some interesting and good to know info / stuff here guys..!

stk