Anyone know of another company that makes those headlight wiring harnesses? You know the kind I'm talking about; they not only boost the volts going to the bulbs, but they also allow the lows to remain on when you hit the highs.

I've got one from www.suvlights.com on my truck, and now I want to get one for my wife's SUV. suvlights.com has been jerking me around a bit so I want to see if there are other companies making them too (her truck uses 9007 bulbs). I know about the one from Kennedy Diesel, but IMO they charge too much $$ for it. Do any other companies sell a GOOD harness?

See Casper info (http://dieselplace.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3302&KW=harness)


or this link Harness Search (http://dieselplace.com/forum/search.asp?KW=harness&SM=1&SI=TC&FM=4&OB=1)


I'm getting ready to change mine and have not seen anything that compares to John's or Casper Electronics (same?)


$135 from either, I ain't skimping

See &lt;FONT face="Times New Roman" color=#606420 size=3&gt;Casper info</font> (http://dieselplace.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=3302&KW=harness)


or this link &lt;FONT face="Times New Roman" color=#606420 size=3&gt;Harness Search</font> (http://dieselplace.com/forum/search.asp?KW=harness&SM=1&SI=TC&FM=4&OB=1)


I'm getting ready to change mine and have not seen anything that compares to John's or Casper Electronics (same?)


$135 from either, I ain't skimping




In this case... you do get what you pay for. I know just for the short factory 4x4 harness that goes from the front diff to the wheelwell is $65 wholesale and there are no relays involved.

Wasn't it Mackin who was the low buck harness guinea pig? IIRC he had a Painful Wiring harness for a while. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif

The "low buck" harness I installed in my truck is from suvlights, and it hasn't given me a hint of trouble. But now that the company seems to be less customer focused then they were before I decided to look around.

For me, $135 for a harness is just too much.

suvlights states that if you use their harness on a dual battery vehicle, you should purchase two harnesses. That would make the cost over $100--very close to the KD harness @ $135.

I have two suvlights harnesses I will trade for one Kennedy harness, I pay shipping.. anybody?

I just rec'd an issue from Stylin Concepts. they had a all four headlights on kit for chev/gmc for 49.95. they said it was unique to them, and it was the only one on the market that would work with DRL and auto headlights. they probably have it on thier website to stylinconcepts.com. this is the first time I have seen it in thier catalog, and I'm not exactly sure if it is the same thing this topic is about , but seems like it might be.

I just rec'd an issue from Stylin Concepts. they had a all four headlights on kit for chev/gmc for 49.95. they said it was unique to them, and it was the only one on the market that would work with DRL and auto headlights. they probably have it on thier website to stylinconcepts.com. this is the first time I have seen it in thier catalog, and I'm not exactly sure if it is the same thing this topic is about , but seems like it might be.





Check this carefully. For this price it is likely just a jumper setup. The KD harness has relays, extermnal power, and uses the stock wiring and switch for just control. It is more than just having 4 headlights on at the same time.

Have this on a 2003 and a 2004.

http://www.painlesswiring.com/relayheadlight.htm
#30822 - For 2003 GM fullsize trucks and SUVs (NO KITS FOR OTHER OEM BRANDS AVAILABLE)

Since the 4-headlight system was introduced in 1988 on GM pickups and Suburbans, owners of these vehicles have wondered why their low beams go off when the high beams are turned on? No good reason we can think of. These kits will increase the intensity and improve the spread pattern by keeping all four lights on when in high beam mode.
http://www.painlesswiring.com/catlarge/30821.jpg

Around $35

It looks like all it is doing is adding more load to the already undersized wire.


The Casper and Kennedy harness uses battery voltage and takes the load off the undersized wiring and the switch circuit.





I guess you pay your money and you get your choice. Me I spent the 135 for the conplete harness.

I have a Kennedy, too.

Are you saying Painless Wiring does not know what they are doing? I did a product liability search and found nothing on this product. Do you have some information you can share?

------------------------------------
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attend SEMA) and the names of some of the past winners: names like Edelbrock, K&N, B&M, Hedman, Crane, Auto Meter and so many more prestigious companies. What makes those companies great is not just their products, it’s the commitment of their people.

So when you buy a Painless product, you’re not just buying a part. You’re buying the commitment and dedication of 72 employees, from the men and women who work in our manufacturing facility and who put such care and quality into the products that we sell, to our engineering and technical staffs who design products to work right the first time and every time, to our customer service personnel who are just a toll free call away to help you with your wiring and electrical needs.

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THE HIGHEST QUALITY WIRE YOU CAN BUY
A wiring harness is only as good as its wire. That’s why Painless harnesses use only the highest quality wire available: thermal cross-linked (TXL) polyethylene wire rated to 275 degrees at 600 volts. TXL wire has twice the voltage rating of standard general purpose (GPT) wire. It delivers performance on demand in high performance applications. Plus, it will not kink and is abrasion resistant, making it much easier to route.
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The nerve center of every Painless chassis harness is our OEM-style fuse block. These fuse blocks feature easy-to-find, modern blade-type fuses, clearly labeled circuits, corrosion resistant construction and a compact design.

WIRING PRE-TERMINATED TO FUSE BLOCK
This is the most important feature of a Painless chassis harness. How well the wiring is connected to the fuse block, how secure and permanent the connection, determines how well the entire system will perform. Every Painless chassis harness comes out of the box with the wiring already terminated to the fuse block, not by hand but with sta

It looks like all it is doing is adding more load to the already undersized wire.

The Casper and Kennedy harness uses battery voltage and takes the load off the undersized wiring and the switch circuit.
Both the Painless and suvlights harnesses do the same thing that the Kennedy one does; add heavier wires and relays to take full alternator (not battery) voltage to the lights.

I just rec'd an issue from Stylin Concepts. they had a all four headlights on kit for chev/gmc for 49.95.
As Larry mentioned, this is merely a relay setup to get 4 headlight highs. The harnesses actually bring full voltage to the lights too (which is usually over 14).

But that voltage isn't a problem for the bulbs, because all automotive headlights have to work with up to 16 volts, so 14 isn't a problem for them.

Have this on a 2003 and a 2004.

http://www.painlesswiring.com/relayheadlight.htm
#30822 - For 2003 GM fullsize trucks and SUVs (NO KITS FOR OTHER OEM BRANDS AVAILABLE)
This is what I'm trying to find -- and is identical to the suvlights harness I have in my truck -- but on my wife's SUV it uses 9007 bulbs. They have both high and low in the same light, so it's been hard finding something that works with that.

Unless you see something that I'm not seeing in that picture it isn't the same thing as the Kennedy harness and doesn't claim to be. All it says is that it keeps all 4 headlights on, nothing about replacing the wiring and picking up alternator voltage.

Remember is only takes 1 strand of wire to deliver 14 volts, its the heavy wire we need to run the amps which is whats gonna make them lights stronger.. the small oem wiring is limited on that and the KD harness and others larger wiring helps get more of the avail amperage to the bulb. I notice on the suvlights harness that the relay's are not sealed, also, mine didnt come with any diode for havign all lights on.... Guess hindsight is 20/20, but I will chose wiser next timehttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Cry.gif

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif After a lot of research into relay headlight harnesses I ordered a harness from kennedy: http://www.kennedydiesel.com/ and installed it this weekend on my 2004 2500HD.

I could have built the harness from scratch (too much work), just used diodes (does not provide maximum voltage to the bulbs) or purchased on from Caspers, Painless, SUVLights, etc, (not sure of the quality) but in the end the Kennedy harness appeared to be the QUALITY harness of choice.

The harness is very well made, the relays are sealed, the black wire loom matches the factory wiring, it fit prefectly and work as advertised. I took my time with the installation and if you did not know exactly what you were looking for you can not tell anything has been added to the truck. I am very happy with the harness.

All that said, that does not mean the other harnesses are bad or that the diode only method won't work, I just chose to go with what I determined to be the best quality harness avaialble. I agree with one of the other posters that in this case "You get what you pay for". I talked to John kennedy before I ordered and he was knowledgeable, helpful and pleasant. Just food for thought. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Thumbs Up.gif

Performed a little test on my 03 today... http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Geek.gif


With the engine idling, I measured the voltage directly across the High and Low beam bulbs with the OEM wiring (passenger side). Results were as follows:


High Beam: 13.73V, Low Beam: 13.85V, Battery/Alternator: 14.63


(Battery voltage was measured at the Red junction box where the alternator connects to the battery cable).


These measurements indicate that the JK and/or Casper harness will definitely boost power into the bulbs. I have my homemade version with the fog light option and switches built but I'm waiting for the weather to warm up so I can install it (it's in the teens here and my garage isn't heated). Once it's installed I'll do some more before and after measurements, but I expect to have a full 14.6 volts across all the bulbs using the relays and 10-gauge wire.


http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif

Wasn't it Mackin who was the low buck harness guinea pig? IIRC he had a Painful Wiring harness for a while. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif





Yup





I tried some junk alright ....


I bought the HD headlight harness sold by JK at the time and haven't looked back ...


What your forgetting is the OEM switch and wires aren't possible going to like the added draw of 4 HO lamps over time ,as it wasn't designed for it... Best spend the money, you be glad you did ...


To each there own is the bottom line ...





Mac http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Geek.gifEdited by: Mackin

Performed a little test on my 03 today...With the engine idling, I measured the voltage directly across the High and Low beam bulbs with the OEM wiring (passenger side). Results were as follows: High Beam: 13.73V, Low Beam: 13.85V, Battery/Alternator: 14.63
Wonder if the 03's are using heavier wires then the 02's were, because I was only getting 12.2 at the lights before I installed my harness.

On the 03s the lamps are turned on by relays in the engine compartment fuse box, one relay for high, one for low, one for fog etc. That's why there is less voltage drop, and why turning them all on by operating these relays doesn't add any load to one individual circuit or another on the power side. On the ground side however I don't know if the high/low beams are individually grounded or not. By turning both beams on if they are not individually grounded we would be adding to the ground circuit load. Mine appears to run cool so so far so good.

... On the ground side however I don't know if the high/low beams are individually grounded or not. By turning both beams*on if they are not individually grounded we would be adding to the ground circuit load...

Army,

Good point on the bulb grounds… I haven't tracked them down completely on my 03 but I did find a secondary connection from the drivers side negative battery terminal to the frame near the fog light (drivers side). It looks like it has at least 2 small (16-18 ga) ground wires attached to a terminal along with the approx 8ga ground wire from the battery. I plan to use this connection point as a single point ground for my homemade set up. It will run a single 10ga ground wire from each bulb (R/L Hi, Lo, Fog) to this terminal along with a separate 10 gauge (hot) wire from the added relays to each bulb.

Based on the actual bulb voltages measured with the 03 OEM harness, it seems that a significant power increase is possible with a harness upgrade that delivers the maximum alternator voltage to the headlight bulbs.

Calculations are as follows:

P=I*E (Power in watts = Current in amps times Voltage in Volts, and
P=E2/R (Power = Voltage squared divided by Resistance)

For a 9005 (high beam) bulb rated 65watts at 12 V, bulb resistance would be

R = E2/P = (12)2/65 = 2.22 ohms

For a measured OEM harness bulb voltage of 13.7V

P = (13.7)2/2.22 = 84.5 Watts

For a "Boosted" bulb voltage of 14.6V (using a modified harness)

P = (14.6)2/2.22 = 96 Watts

An increase of 11.5 watts

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Geek.gif Edited by: jbplock

If you would like to check out the wiring diagram for the headlights (and most everything else) go to https://www.gmupfitter.com/secure/html/publicat/ld_2004.htm and select "C/K Full-Size Electrical 2003 & Beyond". This will initiate a 4.3mb download of the whole manual as a pdf file so you will need some bandwidth. The headlight wiring diagram is on page D-132.

For other years, tech bulletins, and other manuals, you can start at the home page and poke around. Lots of good stuff. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif

Thanks freddyo!http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Thumbs Up.gif Now if I can just get some time to try a few things.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Embarrased.gif

Hey freddyo, that's a gold mine.


Usually folks put "stuff" on an https (secure) server for a reason? I wonder if they realize that someone left the door open? http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Geek.gif

gwmayes -

I don't think that they consider it "proprietary". The purpose is to support companies that are making major modifications to GM vehicles as in making them into motor homes, etc. I imagine that the rationale is to keep the "upfitters" from screwing up, resulting in GM a bad rep even though somebody else created the problem. It's free.

Another site that has some good material that you can still access for free can be found at http://service.gm.com/index_en-US.html . Currently Tech Link can be accessed. For a $1200 a year subscription you can get an SI logon have access to most everything which includes all the service manuals.

If you would like to check out the wiring diagram for the headlights (and most everything else) go to https://www.gmupfitter.com/secure/html/publicat/ld_2004.htm and select "C/K Full-Size Electrical 2003 &amp; Beyond". This will initiate a 4.3mb download of the whole manual as a pdf file so you will need some bandwidth. The headlight wiring diagram is on page D-132.

For other years, tech bulletins, and other manuals, you can start at the home page and poke around. Lots of good stuff. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif


I cannot get to this link, or any other link on the secure side of GM Upfitters. Is anyone else having this problem? I sure would like to get a hold of this file! More specifically, the page Freddyo calls out here. Can anyone help?


Thanks,


Kevin

I paid the price and got the JK big harness. Since then my battery leaked acid on the sealed relays. Melted one of them open about a year ago... I didn't do anything about it but it all still works.

It's heavy duty and yes it ain't cheap. That's usually the case isn't it?

Iam having trouble with the link also! I would love to have the download. Can someone help?


Russ

Try this link:


http://www.gmupfitter.com/publicat/ld_main.htm

I've looked around at that one before, but I don't see detailed schematics like Freedyo was describing. I cannot even line up the page numbers. Thanks for looking. Maybe someone will know how to get in or have the manual downloaded already.


Kevin

I just tried the link - http://www.gmupfitter.com/index.htm#
and it works. Select "Publications", then "Body Builders Manuals", then "Light Duty Body Builder Manuals", then "Light Duty 2004 Manuals", then "C/K Full-Size Electrical 2003 & Beyond". This will initiate the download of the pdf file.

If all else fails, contact me direct and I will email it to you. There's lots of other good material on the site so you should try to get in there yourself.

Got it, thanks. I was a knuckle head and wasn't exploring the 2004 links like you said in the original post. Still does me no good, I was hoping for a 2002 equivalent. Great resource, though!


Kevin

Use this link:


http://www.gmupfitter.com/publicat/ld_main.htm


Then click on 2002 manuals. I haven't looked at the 2002 manuals, but I would think it would have what you are looking for.