I have been reading alot of talk about a "BD manifold" what exactly is it or where can i read about it? thanks

It's a replacement for the stock and very restrictive driver side exhaust manifold. It helps lower egt's, and flows a lot better than stock. Try checking the BD website.

To be honest it's a waste of money. Wait a bit and see what comes out. ;)

To be honest it's a waste of money. Wait a bit and see what comes out. ;)

x2

It may help a little above 500whp but that is debatable

After i posted i got to looking in the vendor list and found "BD" and then realized what it was. I didn't know what the "BD" was.. but thanks guys

Originally Posted by confrontational http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?p=3340569#post3340569)
To be honest it's a waste of money. Wait a bit and see what comes out. ;)


x2

It may help a little above 500whp but that is debatable

You guy`s are the first that I have read that states it is a waist of $$$.
The wait a bit and see what comes out statement "what" else could possibly come out to improve the manifold area??? Not much room.

I am getting the BD manifold mainly to have the use of the egt with my Insight.

I already have a mech egt gauge comming off the pass side manifold
and I want to keep it functioning.

I guess my last ? would be, have both of you installed the BD and speaking from experance and dyno testing ??? Just curious.

Originally Posted by confrontational http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?p=3340569#post3340569)
To be honest it's a waste of money. Wait a bit and see what comes out. ;)




You guy`s are the first that I have read that states it is a waist of $$$.
The wait a bit and see what comes out statement "what" else could possibly come out to improve the manifold area??? Not much room.

I am getting the BD manifold mainly to have the use of the egt with my Insight.

I already have a mech egt gauge comming off the pass side manifold
and I want to keep it functioning.

I guess my last ? would be, have both of you installed the BD and speaking from experance and dyno testing ??? Just curious.

1. I can't speak specifics but there is something great coming out, in pairs.

2. The BD piece is mediocre at best. There is vast room for improvement in many areas.

It's your money, do as you please. But find someone not related to BD who had one and documented any substantial results from it. I know a few people who passed one around and discovered it was a waste.

I promise if you spend the ~$400 on that BD piece you will not be happy in a couple months.

I have installed a bunch of them, and have one on my own truck. My experience is, it does exactly what I wanted it to do, replace the restrictive stock manifold and have a pre-drilled EGT port. I did not notice one bit of difference after the install, but it's a peace of mind thing for me, and nothing else.

I have installed a bunch of them, and have one on my own truck. My experience is, it does exactly what I wanted it to do, replace the restrictive stock manifold and have a pre-drilled EGT port. I did not notice one bit of difference after the install, but it's a peace of mind thing for me, and nothing else.

i have one in my LMM and i like it !

I agree 100% with Chad !

1. I can't speak specifics but there is something great coming out, in pairs.

2. The BD piece is mediocre at best. There is vast room for improvement in many areas.

It's your money, do as you please. But find someone not related to BD who had one and documented any substantial results from it. I know a few people who passed one around and discovered it was a waste.

I promise if you spend the ~$400 on that BD piece you will not be happy in a couple months.

Any particular vendor's website we should keep an eye on??

^ Still being discussed, but rest assured it will be posted about here. God willing this will move forward very quickly.

Fleece

Rick D? Stainless headers and up pipes, probably the best thing going and no need to wait.

Rick D? Stainless headers and up pipes, probably the best thing going and no need to wait.

For the price, sure.

You guys who think you know all the answers then by all means go ahead. All i'm saying is a bit of patience will be worth the wait.

I guess Ill let the cat out of the bag since confrontational thinks everything is supposed to be a secret. There are a couple of guys working on cast manifolds, fleece being one of them. http://www.duramaxdiesels.com/forum/showthread.php?t=14694&highlight=cast+manifolds

Not hiding anything, just figured the mods would frown on linking elsewhere.

Talk to McRat, he knows whats up.

Not hiding anything, just figured the mods would frown on linking elsewhere.

Talk to McRat, he knows whats up.

Whats up just tell us.

Here's the goods...


http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03007_Resized.jpg
http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03008_Resized.jpg
http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03009_Resized.jpg
http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03010_Resized.jpg
http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03012_Resized.jpg
http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03013_Resized.jpg

Those are version 1.. I've added an EGT port on each manifold and a drive pressure port as well to each.

Material is cast stainless.

Thanks,

Brayden

Not my place to do that. But from what I've seen and what I know is in the works, it will be trick.

Just have to wait and see, but i'm sure some solid models will be posted soon enough.

The plastic model shown leaves a lot to be desired design wise.

I'll probably ditch the heat shield mounts too. Not sure yet... what do you think?

Not my place to do that. But from what I've seen and what I know is in the works, it will be trick.

Just have to wait and see, but i'm sure some solid models will be posted soon enough.

The plastic model shown leaves a lot to be desired design wise.


So just how big do you think a log style manifold needs to be? How much cross sectional area does that model have? What kind of port geometry?

Pretty bold statement from glancing at some pictures. If you're gong to step the log style manifold up in large steps then how large do you suppose the uppipes should be? Anything over 2.125 is for the big boys.

Heat sheilds suck, ceramic coating and header wrap will suffice.

Not my place to do that. But from what I've seen and what I know is in the works, it will be trick.
Just have to wait and see, but i'm sure some solid models will be posted soon enough.
The plastic model shown leaves a lot to be desired design wise.

blah blah blah:rolleyes:

Figured as much :D

Heat shields don't let you see the manifolds glow! :)

Heat sheilds suck, ceramic coating and header wrap will suffice.

Neither are enough , my truck with header wrap just laughed at me . custom made blankets were the ticket to keep under hood temps down .

that motor that these new manifolds are sitting against looks very familiar, wish they were already cast and ready for trial, soon maybe.
Keep up the good work Brayden

[quote from confrontational]
1. I can't speak specifics but there is something great coming out, in pairs.

2. The BD piece is mediocre at best. There is vast room for improvement in many areas.
[quote]

So the real fact is you have not personally installed the BD and have actual results to show, to back up your slashing of BD.
Also you have read somewhere that someone is comming out with something better.
The only facts you have is from someone with this supposedly new product that blew smoke up your skirt that they will have a much better product.
That will produce more H.P.
Everyone that sells/builds a product claims theirs is so much better than the compeditor,without actual proof.

Here's the goods...


http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03007_Resized.jpg
http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03008_Resized.jpg
http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03009_Resized.jpg
http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03010_Resized.jpg
http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03012_Resized.jpg
http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03013_Resized.jpg

Those are version 1.. I've added an EGT port on each manifold and a drive pressure port as well to each.

Material is cast stainless.

Thanks,

Brayden

Looks good Brayden. I vote ditching the heatshield too. Question bout that drive pressure port. You can get this reading off the manifol? And what guage you use for this?

You need at least 2 feet of stainless (Brake tubing) to isolate the drive pressure sender or gauge from the exhaust. We sell pressure transducers that integrate with EFILive for this.

You need at least 2 feet of stainless (Brake tubing) to isolate the drive pressure sender or gauge from the exhaust. We sell pressure transducers that integrate with EFILive for this.

Nice.......Can you PM me a price on that.

Neither are enough , my truck with header wrap just laughed at me . custom made blankets were the ticket to keep under hood temps down .

I think we are both talking about the same blankets:cool: this is where I bought mine. Turbo Socks (http://www.crdpower.com/main.sc)

I think we are both talking about the same blankets:cool: this is where I bought mine. Turbo Socks (http://www.crdpower.com/main.sc)

Neither are enough , my truck with header wrap just laughed at me . custom made blankets were the ticket to keep under hood temps down .

Got any pics or info on how you did this? I went to that website and say the turbo blankets. Do they sell the wrap too?

Got any pics or info on how you did this? I went to that website and say the turbo blankets. Do they sell the wrap too?


Before

http://i363.photobucket.com/albums/oo80/trentnell/IMG00086.jpg


After

http://i363.photobucket.com/albums/oo80/trentnell/Picture057.jpg

http://i363.photobucket.com/albums/oo80/trentnell/Picture058.jpg

Looks good. Going to have to order me some. Thanks

My first concern would be by wraping the exhaust manifold would keep the heat in a heck of alot longer than I would think would be good.
Unless your living in Alaska or somewhere like that with freezing temps.
Otherwise I don`t feel it is a good idea, no way for the heat to escape out being all snugley and hot for a long time.

My first concern would be by wraping the exhaust manifold would keep the heat in a heck of alot longer than I would think would be good.
Unless your living in Alaska or somewhere like that with freezing temps.
Otherwise I don`t feel it is a good idea, no way for the heat to escape out being all snugley and hot for a long time.

So? You're just wrapping the exhaust manifold and up-pipes, what's the big deal? Let the truck idle down for a minute after a hard run and the EGT's will come down, everything is fine.

Fact is letting it cool slower is better for everything as a whole.

Heat in the right places doesn't hurt anything at all.

keeping the heat in the manifolds and turbine forces the heat to go out the exhaust, instead of being dissipated. Also it will keep underhood temps and IAT temps slightly lower.

With the blankets would`nt the very high exhaust temps which are much,much hotter that oil and coolant, stay and affect the complete engine including coolant and oil temps.
Making the oil and coolant even hotter without anywhere for the exhaust temps to escapt naturally and quickly.
I don`t think I would do this living in a place like the Arizona deserts.
Or anywhere except a very cold climate,maybe.
But these are just my concerns, obviously not yours.

With the blankets would`nt the very high exhaust temps which are much,much hotter that oil and coolant, stay and affect the complete engine including coolant and oil temps.
Making the oil and coolant even hotter without anywhere for the exhaust temps to escapt naturally and quickly.
I don`t think I would do this living in a place like the Arizona deserts.
Or anywhere except a very cold climate,maybe.
But these are just my concerns, obviously not yours.
you have 2 choices , heat soak the entire underhood area including all the peices designed to cool the engine down , and all the peices that are suposed to be delivering cold fresh air through the motor ,

or you contain the heat to the header/ exhaust components only , tell me wich you think will be worse?

because i know the answer from real life and not just paper theroy's , going down the road under normal driving my IAT temps are only a few degree's over ambient and have no change in coolant temps.

plus after doing 4 real hard dyno pulls you could hold you hand over the motor/valve covers ect, and it only seemed luke warm i have been very impressed by them . plus if it was truely holding that much heat in you would see it in the pyro wich is under the blanket inside the header .

Post 37, Keeping heat in the exhaust makes it go out the exhaust and not into the engine bay.

I was just questioning some concerns, I would have in Arizona.
Both of you guys are in cold climates which probably works quite well.
Since this subject started I have spoken with several diesel shops in my city on this, 2 of them have tested this on dynos, and they all said NO not a good idea especially in Arizona deserts.
So, gosh what should I do,what should I do:confuzeld

Wow, this went well beyond the BD manifold .....


I don't feel wrapping the manifolds will yield any gain in underhood temps while driving .... there is constant airflow through the engine compartment......

I'm not a full on racer though so maybe thats why i don't see the purpose.


Back tot he BD manifold. I run one and i like it. It gets rid of the huge dent restriction and it is tapped for the pyro making it an easy install and if i need the truck to be back to stock i still have a stock untapped manifold ....

I was just questioning some concerns, I would have in Arizona.
Both of you guys are in cold climates which probably works quite well.
Since this subject started I have spoken with several diesel shops in my city on this, 2 of them have tested this on dynos, and they all said NO not a good idea especially in Arizona deserts.
So, gosh what should I do,what should I do:confuzeld
i am by no means saying every one should buy this part , but since when is utah cold climate ? i get 105 deg summer temps for mounths every year . not as sever as AZ but plenty to test this . the shops can tell you what ever they want because i know if they did any testing it was with the cast manifolds and not a full header and doubt they even tested what they are claiming to you . like i said i have it on my truck and test it daily .

i am by no means trying to get you to buy this product , just giving propper info out , and not just posting story's or theroy's


Wow, this went well beyond the BD manifold .....


I don't feel wrapping the manifolds will yield any gain in underhood temps while driving .... there is constant airflow through the engine compartment......

I'm not a full on racer though so maybe thats why i don't see the purpose.


Back tot he BD manifold. I run one and i like it. It gets rid of the huge dent restriction and it is tapped for the pyro making it an easy install and if i need the truck to be back to stock i still have a stock untapped manifold ....
as far as the underhood temps , a guy with cast manifolds is in a total different situation than with full headers . go buy a set and tell me these are not a nec item . and that the improvment was absolutly huge between before and after .

and this is not just wraping the header , i tried that and it wasnt worth anything , these are 7/16" thick fire proof covers/blankets , after driving for hours you can set your hand right on the blanket and hold it there and not get burnt . this is with a hot header 7/16" away from your skin with only fabric seperating them .

i am by no means saying every one should buy this part , but since when is utah cold climate ? i get 105 deg summer temps for mounths every year . not as sever as AZ but plenty to test this . the shops can tell you what ever they want because i know if they did any testing it was with the cast manifolds and not a full header and doubt they even tested what they are claiming to you . like i said i have it on my truck and test it daily .

i am by no means trying to get you to buy this product , just giving propper info out , and not just posting story's or theroy's



as far as the underhood temps , a guy with cast manifolds is in a total different situation than with full headers . go buy a set and tell me these are not a nec item . and that the improvment was absolutly huge between before and after .

and this is not just wraping the header , i tried that and it wasnt worth anything , these are 7/16" thick fire proof covers/blankets , after driving for hours you can set your hand right on the blanket and hold it there and not get burnt . this is with a hot header 7/16" away from your skin with only fabric seperating them .


i am not questioning them not being a nice item.


It's just the original point of the thread was about a BD manifold that is a direct replacement for one side for $300 or less ...

That is being compared to headers that can be anywhere from 3 times that to 7 times that price....


racer stand point - headers and uppies ...


regular towing and daily driver the BD manifold is the way to go.


Just my thoughts.

and this is not just wraping the header , i tried that and it wasnt worth anything , these are 7/16" thick fire proof covers/blankets , after driving for hours you can set your hand right on the blanket and hold it there and not get burnt . this is with a hot header 7/16" away from your skin with only fabric seperating them .

that is pretty badass.

The cost on the blankets are not to bad, pretty resonable.
My class A Motorhome with a 460 cu.in. after pulling a long hill and then stopping at a rest stop the headers were glowing red.
But it didnot take long for them to cool off being open.
I would have to think if they were wrapped, the wrapping would hold the heat in much longer.
And the floor board would be even hotter than it already gets, if that was the only way for the heat to escape, thru the exhaust.
Then more of the exhaust pipe beyond the headers/wrap would be glowing red as well distrubiting the heat even more, along the pipe and the floor board.
"But I could be wrong"

I`m installing the BD Monday, mainly just to utilize the egt readings with my Insight.
Maybe some feel the BD is costly but it bolts right up and not much modifing only the heat shield a little.

It was 85 degrees today and its still spring not exactly cold climate.

It was 85 degrees today and its still spring not exactly cold climate.

"God" 85 degrees how did you`all survive.
The temps we delt with yesterday and everyday from now till the end of Oct. was a chilling 106 degrees. And top out usually somewhere around 120+ in the shade before its all over.

By the way the shop I`ve delt with for 35+ years installed my BD manifold.
I quized him some more on the exhaust wraps/blankets and why they are seriously not recommened.
If they get wet the wraps/blankets will hold the moisture in and will corrode the metal.
The blanket will hold more heat internally which will eventually cause damage to seals etc. etc, from the extreem heat being held in.
And all header manufactors will void the header warranty, if damage/corrosion occures within the warranty period and they find out someone used the wraps/blankets, which I did verify that.

Anyway just something to seriously think about.

"God" 85 degrees how did you`all survive.
The temps we delt with yesterday and everyday from now till the end of Oct. was a chilling 106 degrees. And top out usually somewhere around 120+ in the shade before its all over.

By the way the shop I`ve delt with for 35+ years installed my BD manifold.
I quized him some more on the exhaust wraps/blankets and why they are seriously not recommened.
If they get wet the wraps/blankets will hold the moisture in and will corrode the metal.
The blanket will hold more heat internally which will eventually cause damage to seals etc. etc, from the extreem heat being held in.
And all header manufactors will void the header warranty, if damage/corrosion occures within the warranty period and they find out someone used the wraps/blankets, which I did verify that.
Anyway just something to seriously think about.

we agree to disagree , which is OK , like i said i am not talking about theroy's i actually HAVE the product and have SEEN for myself . the headers are stainless steel they should be able to handle some moister and the header builder knows they are on there . the minute i see that your shop has a set of these "headers" on there "Dmax" and has tested these "blankets" i will trust there statement untill then you are just talking theroy's while i am talking about facts .


also if all this heat is being held in why am i not seeing it on my pyro readings ?

"God" 85 degrees how did you`all survive.
The temps we delt with yesterday and everyday from now till the end of Oct. was a chilling 106 degrees. And top out usually somewhere around 120+ in the shade before its all over.

By the way the shop I`ve delt with for 35+ years installed my BD manifold.
I quized him some more on the exhaust wraps/blankets and why they are seriously not recommened.
If they get wet the wraps/blankets will hold the moisture in and will corrode the metal.
The blanket will hold more heat internally which will eventually cause damage to seals etc. etc, from the extreem heat being held in.
And all header manufactors will void the header warranty, if damage/corrosion occures within the warranty period and they find out someone used the wraps/blankets, which I did verify that.

Anyway just something to seriously think about.


Ok, you're quoting fabricated mild steel headers vs a cast iron manifold.

Care to explain the metallurigical differences between the two?

Question, have you EVER seen ANYTHING made of decent cast iron corrode in a structurally destructive manner? No, and you never will. It's not in the physical make-up of the material. If it's crap pig iron maybe, (like brake rotors) but not good iron.

Notice that every manhole cover, stormwater drain inlet, etc, in the country is made from cast iron. They sit through some harsh winters covered in salted road grime, city pollution, etc and they don't corrode and fail. Go around an older city, Philly etc. The manhole covers are wearing down due to a hundred years of traffic, visible wear on the surface of them. But they don't rust in place, they aren't falling apart from corrosion.

You can wrap a cast iron manifold with whatever you want, soak it in salt water every day of it's life, and it will be around longer than any of us.

Yes Iron "rusts", in a patina sort of way. Fresh iron goes through some stages, turns orange initially, and very soon turns that almost black color. From that point on the corrosion is almost non-existent.

Steel and iron are not the same, don't react the same, and don't wear the same. So comparing a wrapped steel header to a cast manifold is asinine at best.

Ok, you're quoting fabricated mild steel headers vs a cast iron manifold.

Care to explain the metallurigical differences between the two?

You have a smart a$$ answer pretty much on everything so why waist my time. I`m guessing thats why you call yourself "confrontational"
You always want to argue with everyone that ?`s something that makes commonsense on what is bad.

Steel and iron are not the same, don't react the same, and don't wear the same. So comparing a wrapped steel header to a cast manifold is asinine at best.

I am surprised you figured that out, the only part your not considering is cast iron holds heat longer than thin steel.
On my motorhome the floor board was so hot, drivers side and pass side in my motor home with the cast iron manifolds.
At times I could not even keep my feet on the floor.
After the headers was installed the HOT heat was gone and the floor board was only warm.
So with installing blankets, sure the engine compartment and the floor boards are cooler, but the seals and internal engine componits will eventually toast.
Verified by people that truly knows stuff and are real experts in this field.
So who has proven to be the one that is asinine now ?? :eek:
Not me. ;)

By now :D

I dont think that blankets can be labeled as the contributing factor of internal engine failures. The way I have understood wrapped headers was the point behind the procedure was the keep the heat in the exhaust stream. By doing so, the exhaust gases escaped from the engine/manifold/header with more velocity. This additional velocity should help elimate some of the additional heat soak brought on by wrapping. To each there own, honestly in terms of wrapping Ive heard it both ways. Both are running well (wrapped and unwrapped), so maybe nobody is right and nobody is wrong in this instance. Just preferences either way.

I am surprised you figured that out, the only part your not considering is cast iron holds heat longer than thin steel.
On my motorhome the floor board was so hot, drivers side and pass side in my motor home with the cast iron manifolds.
At times I could not even keep my feet on the floor.
After the headers was installed the HOT heat was gone and the floor board was only warm.
So with installing blankets, sure the engine compartment and the floor boards are cooler, but the seals and internal engine componits will eventually toast.
Verified by people that truly knows stuff and are real experts in this field.
So who has proven to be the one that is asinine now ?? :eek:
Not me. ;)

By now :D
dude we are not talking about your gasser motorhome, we are talking about turbo charged diesel motors . it amazes me that you seem to have all the info on something you have never tried . if you had you would re-think you stance on the heat ever maiking it back to the motor to affect seals , that theroy seems rediculious once you have actually USED the parts in question :rolleyes:

I am surprised you figured that out, the only part your not considering is cast iron holds heat longer than thin steel.
On my motorhome the floor board was so hot, drivers side and pass side in my motor home with the cast iron manifolds.
At times I could not even keep my feet on the floor.
After the headers was installed the HOT heat was gone and the floor board was only warm.
So with installing blankets, sure the engine compartment and the floor boards are cooler, but the seals and internal engine componits will eventually toast.
Verified by people that truly knows stuff and are real experts in this field.
So who has proven to be the one that is asinine now ?? :eek:
Not me. ;)

By now :D

What seals could possibly be harmed on a motor by retaining heat in the exhaust system? That is what it's built to do, excavate superheated gases from the engine.

Btw your theory is fundamentally flawed. IF you would have used a decent blanket the heat NEVER would have escaped the manifold, thus the floor board in your moho would have never gotten any hotter than ambient temp, or from the radiant heat of the block itself.

I have blankets on turbine housings where the manifolds will glow red, yet the blanket will barely reach 150F when loaded at full tilt. With in 30 seconds of shutting it down you can hold your palm to the blanket. Find me ANY header you're willing to do that to.

As well, wrapping the manifolds reduces general underhood heatsoak by a substantial margin. Keeping as much heat inside the tubes and pumped out the back is the best possible scenario.

I think you need to stop theorizing your own made up fizix and pay attention to some basics of thermal conductivity.

I don't like to argue, I just can't stand uneducated goods spreading misinformation like it's the gospel.

No matter if its a gasser or diesel heat can cause the same damage.

The part you guys don`t seem to comprehend, is the heat being held in and the only escape is thru the exhaust ends up being extreem internally.
The compairson on headers v.s. cast iron manifolds is cast iron retains a hell of a lot more heat and to blanket them is even a worse idea.

Lets get out there and do some towing in 120 degree temps and pull some long steep grades with my coolant and trans temps hitting 220-230 degrees and see who`s lasts longer, and who`s gets hotter.

And like I have said several times I have contacted several known professionals that deals with this stuff.
And I`m pretty sure I`ll stick with true professional people that I know personally. Besides they could make $$ off of me selling this stuff and they don`t and they won`t even carry them or suggest them.

What does containing heat INSIDE the EXHAUST system have to do with the operating temp of the truck and tranny? Containing the heat inside the exhaust will only lower the "heat soak" condition under the hood and thus the truck will run even cooler.

The other turbocharged vehicles I work on would blister the paint on the hood without the heat blankets. Throw some blankets on there and you can drive them through vegas in 120F temps and there isn't an issue to be found.

The EGT's leaving the cylinder are in the 1300F range to begin with. The temps in the exhaust system will not exceed the temps exiting the cylinder. It's just not fundamentally possible even with the slight bit of drive pressure. And when you're pulling it that hard where the EGT's are that high, the manifold is as hot as it's ever going to get anyway. Wrapping it in a blanket only contains the heat from spreading throughout the engine compartment.

Beyond that, if making a change to the exhaust has an effect on your truck overheating or not, the entire discussion is a moot point as your setup as a whole is completely FUBAR.

Beyond that, if you're soooo convinced that cool manifolds are the answer, why not get some water jacketed manifolds like they run on boats? You can run that motor wide open and rest your hands on the exhaust system. That should be the end all solution by your theories.

No matter if its a gasser or diesel heat can cause the same damage.

The part you guys don`t seem to comprehend, is the heat being held in and the only escape is thru the exhaust ends up being extreem internally.
The compairson on headers v.s. cast iron manifolds is cast iron retains a hell of a lot more heat and to blanket them is even a worse idea.

Lets get out there and do some towing in 120 degree temps and pull some long steep grades with my coolant and trans temps hitting 220-230 degrees and see who`s lasts longer, and who`s gets hotter.

And like I have said several times I have contacted several known professionals that deals with this stuff.
And I`m pretty sure I`ll stick with true professional people that I know personally. Besides they could make $$ off of me selling this stuff and they don`t and they won`t even carry them or suggest them.

thats funny , i only know if one person who builds duramax headers and he made the ones bolted to my truck ;) and knows they are covered in blakets .so who are all of these deasel header experts you have spoken with ? and also tell me because i would love to know how the heat is going to travel into the motor when the exhaust is flowing out of the motor and the blanket doesnt allow heat to soak the block ?

and to your point above i would take your challenge any day of the week , dont get fooled by my racing pics my truck is still a tow rig and tows a 14k load all summer long all through the hot desert .

GOD OH MIGHTY,
Blanket/wraps retain heat in the internal engine longer.
I didnot realize I had to completely spell this out in short.
You talk about the engine compartment being cooler, yes but I don`t eat my lunch there.
Plus I would prefer the engine to cool down quicker and not be retaining the heat internally.
When you shut the engine down where is the heat going then ???
Not out the exhaust.
I know the answer to this, its obvious.
I wonder if this is a option when you order a new vehicle, hmmm.
On info, figure it out for yourself, talk to someone besides ones here that believe in them, or sell them, I did.
Besides I did my leg work this is in you ballpark now,you do the research with qualified knowledgable people, I did.
I don't feel blankets/wraps are worth the investment with possable consequences that could follow.
"So get over it".

I'm failing to see the "Consequences" What can be damaged by a motor retaining heat in the first place? It's not getting any warmer than it would under normal operating conditions.

Reducing the ambient temp of the underhood area is VERY important. As you have said, your floorboard was very hot. Containing that heat would prevent just that. And further, the engine block/heads have a vastly greater surface area than the exhaust manifolds. A lower ambient temp around them will aid the overall cooling effect far more than letting the exhaust system bake everything.

And going even further, having cooler air in the engine compartment only helps keep the radiator, a/c condenser, and FAN CLUTCH cooler, which alone makes huge strides in the overall operation of the vehicle.

It's funny that you site these experts but won't mention names. And oddly enough everything you're spouting goes against not only logic, but known physics.


You seem to be ignoring my previous question. If a super cool exhaust is the answer to all your problems, why don't you just run a water jacketed exhaust manifold, turbo housing, etc?

I'm failing to see the "Consequences" What can be damaged by a motor retaining heat in the first place? It's not getting any warmer than it would under normal operating conditions.

Reducing the ambient temp of the underhood area is VERY important. As you have said, your floorboard was very hot. Containing that heat would prevent just that. And further, the engine block/heads have a vastly greater surface area than the exhaust manifolds. A lower ambient temp around them will aid the overall cooling effect far more than letting the exhaust system bake everything.

And going even further, having cooler air in the engine compartment only helps keep the radiator, a/c condenser, and FAN CLUTCH cooler, which alone makes huge strides in the overall operation of the vehicle.

It's funny that you site these experts but won't mention names. And oddly enough everything you're spouting goes against not only logic, but known physics.


You seem to be ignoring my previous question. If a super cool exhaust is the answer to all your problems, why don't you just run a water jacketed exhaust manifold, turbo housing, etc?

let it go bro, he's not gettin' it.

GOD OH MIGHTY,
Blanket/wraps retain heat in the internal engine longer.
I didnot realize I had to completely spell this out in short.
You talk about the engine compartment being cooler, yes but I don`t eat my lunch there.
Plus I would prefer the engine to cool down quicker and not be retaining the heat internally.
When you shut the engine down where is the heat going then ???
Not out the exhaust.
I know the answer to this, its obvious.
I wonder if this is a option when you order a new vehicle, hmmm.
On info, figure it out for yourself, talk to someone besides ones here that believe in them, or sell them, I did.
Besides I did my leg work this is in you ballpark now,you do the research with qualified knowledgable people, I did.
I don't feel blankets/wraps are worth the investment with possable consequences that could follow.
"So get over it".
you keep forgetting that what you are suggesting is being measured by a pyrometer in my header underneath the blankets , and guess what ......its not happening the way you think it is , at idle after running hard it is the same as before the blankets its settles down to 350-320 , so if all this extreme heat is being held in.......... your theroy , VS being pumped out the tail pipe our theroy , why is your theroy not being shown on the tempature measuring device that is inside this " exteme envirenment" ? :rolleyes:

you keep forgetting that what you are suggesting is being measured by a pyrometer in my header underneath the blankets , and guess what ......its not happening the way you think it is , at idle after running hard it is the same as before the blankets its settles down to 350-320 , so if all this extreme heat is being held in.......... your theroy , VS being pumped out the tail pipe our theroy , why is your theroy not being shown on the tempature measuring device that is inside this " exteme envirenment" ? :rolleyes:

Damn physics and that Fourier guy (heat transfer law named after him).

You mean that upon removing the extreme heat source it rapidly cools? Wow, what a concept lol.

And just the notion that a ~30lb chunk of iron with a fairly large (% of mass) surface area will somehow "heatsoak" a 900lb motor is absolutely laughable.

Well call me a fool but I`ll have to side with snifer on this.
Have any of you ever monitored the coolant temps after a hard pull and after shutting down, of course when the egt temps are around 350.
You will see quite a rise in coolant temps they might be around 210 but after shutting down the temps can go as high as 250.
Even higher with the blankets engine not running and not cooling down thru the exhaust.
This is a pretty simple test for you to try,if you have aftermarket gauges or even just turn the key on(not starting the engine) you might be shocked on how high the temps went up just over a couple of min after you shut down.

I as well have asked this very question with shops and they said NO do not do it.

Now who am I going to believe professional shops I have delt with for years and knows good and bad with this stuff especially in the desert.

Or a few I don`t know from Adam, and the only way I know for sure that you are experts in this field is that you told us you are.
And no credentials proving it besides, I said so.

"Sorry"

^ EVERY single water cooled vehicle ever made does that a few minutes after shutdown. And adding a blanket to the manifold does nary a thing to effect it. It's entirely due to the heat energy of the internal components being absorbed by water that isn't flowing.

Does it hurt anything, nope, not one bit. The engine is under no load what so ever, so it getting to even 250F wouldn't hurt it a bit. Do the same test back to back with and without a blanket on the manifold, it won't change the outcome one bit. The cylinder head isn't cooling via the exhaust so what does it matter.

Again... Please tell me how much radiant heat capacity can a 30lb chunk of iron have on a massive aluminum cylinder head?

Beyond that. As was stated by testing with the internal EGT probe. The internal temps go from what, ~1300F down to the mid 300 range within a few seconds. If the castings and head were really retaining that much heat over the long term, wouldn't it take more than a couple seconds for the probe to cool off?

And to get even more critical... even if the engine was totally cool, and you could some how hold a 1000F manifold to the head. It wouldn't transfer that much heat to the head to begin with. Look at the point of contact, just the flange space which has a gasket as a boundary layer in there. The airspace prevents a good portion of the heat from even getting to the ALUMINUM head. (inverse square of the distance for heat transfer)

It's apparent you guys don't really understand the energy (heat) capacities of iron. It is a very very small casting that you're thinking holds some profound way of heating a cylinder head that contains literally at least 10x as much volumetric material.

To put it simply, you will never ever burn your thanksgiving turkey because you took it out of the oven and set it on the stove, where you had just finished cooling the mash potatoes. The stove might still be hot but that big azz turkey won't know the difference.

Well call me a fool but I`ll have to side with snifer on this.
Have any of you ever monitored the coolant temps after a hard pull and after shutting down, of course when the egt temps are around 350.
You will see quite a rise in coolant temps they might be around 210 but after shutting down the temps can go as high as 250.
Even higher with the blankets engine not running and not cooling down thru the exhaust.
This is a pretty simple test for you to try,if you have aftermarket gauges or even just turn the key on(not starting the engine) you might be shocked on how high the temps went up just over a couple of min after you shut down.

I as well have asked this very question with shops and they said NO do not do it.

Now who am I going to believe professional shops I have delt with for years and knows good and bad with this stuff especially in the desert.

Or a few I don`t know from Adam, and the only way I know for sure that you are experts in this field is that you told us you are.
And no credentials proving it besides, I said so.

"Sorry"
why are these diesel repair shops continually being brought up , i have been a mechanic for 10 years and it by no means makes me qualified to answer this question , what does make me qualified is i actually have it on my truck and have actually tested it . do you guys need a copy of my ASE certs to make you feel warm and fuzzy inside that a "qualified " person told you something then by all meens they can be produced :exactly:

Its funny how my real world actaul data meens nothing :rolleyes:

why are these diesel repair shops continually being brought up , i have been a mechanic for 10 years and it by no means makes me qualified to answer this question , what does make me qualified is i actually have it on my truck and have actually tested it . do you guys need a copy of my ASE certs to make you feel warm and fuzzy inside that a "qualified " person told you something then by all meens they can be produced :exactly:

Its funny how my real world actaul data meens nothing :rolleyes:

I have the opposite side to defend. I'm not an ASE mechanic, but i've been building cars and racecars for years now. Oh, and I do have a degreed engineer who has a fairly substantial basis in thermo.

I can write pages and pages on why putting a blanket on won't make one F-in iota of difference, backed up by tests and factual data.

Yet some fictional race tuner shop who won't be cited is some how the gold standard.

If it's so damaging, PLEASE, someone, ANYONE give me a list of things that are damaged by the exhaust staying warm.. which is actually 1/4 of it's operating temp.

^ EXACTLY!

And the water corrosion is an issue, if you're using a mild steel header. Using high grade stainless tubing or any reasonably decent cast iron (Stock, BD, etc) will pose no corrosion issues what so ever.

IMO, if your header blanket is soaked in gas/oil, you have enough problems to deal with, a small contained fire won't be of major concern, and/or it will be your own damn fault. lol

Hey I`m sorry about mentioning diesel shops that I have asked ?`s about the blankets, they are my only source.
But since I have delt with them for over 40 yrs and one sponsered my race car in the
70`s, so I have no reason not to believe them.
They have tested blankets here in the desert and found some issues to be concerned about and don`t recommend them.
You say they are great, people I know that have tested them in hot temp climates say NO.
I am sorry you just cannot accept my and the shops I deal with opinions on this subject.
You have had great success and they did not, Ok ! Why can`t you just leave it at that.
Or are you just trying to prove that you have the most knowledge.

Besides only the 2 of you have promoted these blankets out of 1000`s of members anyway.
"That is a Interesting theory"

I'm not trying to prove anything... but my logical mind doesn't wrap around "You're wrong, because I said so" with no conclusive evidence to support your claims.

You have people who are currently using them, and have tested the exact parameters you're describing. Which coincidentally matches exactly what the applied physics says should happen.

So you're basically saying that all current tests along with the math backing them up is wrong... and you're only substance is "they said so".

If you can provide some actual factual tests and data to support your claims, proof of damaged parts due only to the addition of the heat blankets, etc.

This is beginning to sound like a discussion with some religious fanatics who are blinded by their own b/s. Smacking reality and proven science in the face with their only rebuttal being "I just know thats the way it is."

And theres only a handful of the thousands of members that are against the blankets. Your point in that statement is moot.


Most high perfomance applications today are using some sort of coating, wrap or blanket to control the effects of the heat produced from the headers to prevent premature failures. The bonus to these products is typically a performance gain as well, by controlling the expelled exhaust gasses better helping the entire combustion process, see scavenging effect. Testing in the real world is often difficult, especially from a distributors standpoint. Obviously they want to provide the best product for their customers, but often times lack the neccesary equipment needed to effectively eliminate all variables from a test, except for the one your testing for. Im not saying the guys your talking to are wrong, but there has been a lot of investigation done in this particular area as of late where real gains have been seen.

For me, I think blankets or some sort of product used to insulate exhaust gasses from the rest of the engine are definately worth looking into. However, daily drivers really arent going to see a HUGE difference or even a gain from using these products. But there is a gain there to be had.

Hey I`m sorry about mentioning diesel shops that I have asked ?`s about the blankets, they are my only source.
But since I have delt with them for over 40 yrs and one sponsered my race car in the
70`s, so I have no reason not to believe them.
They have tested blankets here in the desert and found some issues to be concerned about and don`t recommend them.
You say they are great, people I know that have tested them in hot temp climates say NO.
I am sorry you just cannot accept my and the shops I deal with opinions on this subject.
You have had great success and they did not, Ok ! Why can`t you just leave it at that.
Or are you just trying to prove that you have the most knowledge.

Besides only the 2 of you have promoted these blankets out of 1000`s of members anyway.
"That is a Interesting theory"
Nothing against you DRC , and i dont want to say i know more than anyone , this is not a pride issue . it hard to see people reflect insight on a product they have never tested , and steer others away from a product that works well . I dont sell blankets or headers , i am only a consumer . and i am not discusing the use of blankets on anything other than turbo charged diesel motors , because thats what i have tested them on .

Anyway back to the thread,
I like the BD manifold I just got it on this week and happy with what I got.

Anyway back to the thread,
I like the BD manifold I just got it on this week and happy with what I got.


you will be happy with it !

you will be happy with it !

Thanks ! I am.
What was interesting early in this thread a few was saying to wait, something will eventually come out, even better.
But there was no time frame and proof on how much better.
I`m old and cannot that wait much longer for something that most likely won`t be much better. With my luck.

I liked my BD manifol too. It still boggles my mind why GM pinched that OEM manifol off like that.

Thanks ! I am.
What was interesting early in this thread a few was saying to wait, something will eventually come out, even better.
But there was no time frame and proof on how much better.
I`m old and cannot that wait much longer for something that most likely won`t be much better. With my luck.

The only thing I can think of that would be even better would be actual headers... I mean that's all I can think of...

I liked my BD manifol too. It still boggles my mind why GM pinched that OEM manifol off like that.

I believe it was for the Vans using the duramax engine, it is squashed there to make room for the steering column.

The only thing I can think of that would be even better would be actual headers... I mean that's all I can think of...



I believe it was for the Vans using the duramax engine, it is squashed there to make room for the steering column.


try porting and polishing them. it helps quite a bit.

try porting and polishing them. it helps quite a bit.

Have you ever actually held one? That manifold is less than .100" thick in most places. If you try to do any porting you'll likely cut right through it.

You guys knock yourselves out. In the next 4-6 weeks some good stuff should be out and about, very much like a full header.

Have you ever actually held one? That manifold is less than .100" thick in most places. If you try to do any porting you'll likely cut right through it.

You guys knock yourselves out. In the next 4-6 weeks some good stuff should be out and about, very much like a full header.
i have done them on mine and they work just fine.

i have done them on mine and they work just fine.

Thank You !

Have you ever actually held one? That manifold is less than .100" thick in most places. If you try to do any porting you'll likely cut right through it.

You guys knock yourselves out. In the next 4-6 weeks some good stuff should be out and about, very much like a full header.


i disagree


a header upgrade would be wise for a upgraded turbo .... a stock turbo, a bd manifold would do just fine... just my opinion. but why pay more, create more work for yourself, for a very lightly modified truck ?

i disagree


a header upgrade would be wise for a upgraded turbo .... a stock turbo, a bd manifold would do just fine... just my opinion. but why pay more, create more work for yourself, for a very lightly modified truck ?

Another, Thank You ! Yah, baby.
Boy this is fun :)
BD manifold, best investment since I bought my Dmax.:D
Besides all the other mods.:cool:

Another, Thank You ! Yah, baby.
Boy this is fun :)
BD manifold, best investment since I bought my Dmax.:D
Besides all the other mods.:cool:
ya i mean it is something simple that helps. it may not be a difference you can really feel but it does help and as said, porting and polishing helps even more if you got the time and skill to do it.

i think ill wait and see what comes out. but it needs heat sheilds or the option of blankets that come with that are of high quality. and pricing what have you herd.

I'm suprised banks hasnt came out with some thing.

I like mine and the only thing better would be a set of headers from RDL.IMO

I like mine and the only thing better would be a set of headers from RDL.IMO
:exactly:

My thoughts are if exhaust blankets was such a possitive thing to use then why are`nt they more openly available thru more dealers and suggested by more than just a few people here. :D
None of the blanket dealers have chimmed in on this discussion at all to even promote the product :exactly:

My thoughts are if exhaust blankets was such a possitive thing to use then why are`nt they more openly available thru more dealers and suggested by more than just a few people here. :D
None of the blanket dealers have chimmed in on this discussion at all to even promote the product :exactly:

So, you are saying that exhaust blankets are worthless??

........

My thoughts are if exhaust blankets was such a possitive thing to use then why are`nt they more openly available thru more dealers and suggested by more than just a few people here. :D
None of the blanket dealers have chimmed in on this discussion at all to even promote the product :exactly:


probably because the need is not there with cast manifolds ;) if you had any real world testing the subject you would no this :exactly:, only reason i had to go that route is once a full tube header was installed the under hood temps went up as they always due when compared to a cast manifold , and being how my blankets were hand made i doubt you will find the vendor here to chime in . find the post were i have said every dmax owner needs this product ? if you want to keep being the internet expert with all of your "in head engineering" by all meens its quite funny to watch , for me i will let results speek for themselves and keep speaking about products i own and have used . kinda funny how that works ya know reveiwing a product you have used before............................ its a new concept you should try it :HiHi:

I don't think the BD manifold does anything measurable. Mine is on there just to make both sides the same.



"God" 85 degrees how did you`all survive.
The temps we delt with yesterday and everyday from now till the end of Oct. was a chilling 106 degrees. And top out usually somewhere around 120+ in the shade before its all over.

By the way the shop I`ve delt with for 35+ years installed my BD manifold.
I quized him some more on the exhaust wraps/blankets and why they are seriously not recommened.
If they get wet the wraps/blankets will hold the moisture in and will corrode the metal.
The blanket will hold more heat internally which will eventually cause damage to seals etc. etc, from the extreem heat being held in.
And all header manufactors will void the header warranty, if damage/corrosion occures within the warranty period and they find out someone used the wraps/blankets, which I did verify that.

Anyway just something to seriously think about.

You're unclear on the concept. Coatings are to keep heat in because exhaust that stays hotter stays expanded and moves faster. Blankets do an even better job. A nice side to that also is a cooler engine compartment, as Trent has experienced for himself. The Mormon Missile DMax streamliner has 2 large turbos and extensive turbo piping, done by one of the best engine builders anywhere. Every hotpipe is blanketed and they stay so cool on the outside you wouldn't believe it. Temperature on the salt flats is usually well over 100*. It gets real hot out there.

Sorry for beating on a dead horse........ I should've read all 10pages :rolleyes:

My thoughts are if exhaust blankets was such a possitive thing to use then why are`nt they more openly available thru more dealers and suggested by more than just a few people here. :D


It's about the market. Most people don't run headers and few people make blankets. My new engine will have RDL headers and they'll definitely be wrapped with blankets.

It's about the market. Most people don't run headers and few people make blankets. My new engine will have RDL headers and they'll definitely be wrapped with blankets.

"Thats nice".

I guess my point was not recieved at all.
"Every" mod, performace type dealer (10) I have spoke to, and/or called since this discussion has been going on, does not recomended using blankets or wraps.

Now! Why would that be, they could be making money durning these bad times, but they won`t sell something they do not believe in.

And not one blanket/wraps manufactor has defended their product and promoted it here on this discussion.

I think my point has finally been made.
Have a nice day.

I guess my point was not recieved at all.

And not one blanket/wraps manufactor has defended their product and promoted it here on this discussion.

I think my point has finally been made.
Have a nice day.

You think this forum is so important that people who make things have nothing better to do than come on here? Your point is that you just like to argue. Tell you what. Buy whatever you want, nobody cares.

"Thats nice".

I guess my point was not recieved at all.
"Every" mod, performace type dealer (10) I have spoke to, and/or called since this discussion has been going on, does not recomended using blankets or wraps.

Now! Why would that be, they could be making money durning these bad times, but they won`t sell something they do not believe in.

And not one blanket/wraps manufactor has defended their product and promoted it here on this discussion.

I think my point has finally been made.
Have a nice day.


:funnypost you keep trusting your people its a free country , i am shure they do alot of custom really tricked out duramaxes and race projects , and every one here knows who they are , oh wait no one will list there source of " experts " and results of ACTUAL tests performed :D

"Thats nice".

I guess my point was not recieved at all.
"Every" mod, performace type dealer (10) I have spoke to, and/or called since this discussion has been going on, does not recomended using blankets or wraps.

Now! Why would that be, they could be making money durning these bad times, but they won`t sell something they do not believe in.

And not one blanket/wraps manufactor has defended their product and promoted it here on this discussion.

I think my point has finally been made.
Have a nice day.Care to share who these "performance type dealers" are and what their credentials as an authority on the Duramax, or any turbo diesel for that matter, are?

Care to share who these "performance type dealers" are and what their credentials as an authority on the Duramax, or any turbo diesel for that matter, are?

My responce is, you do have a telephone don`t you, and are you able to look up performace shops anywhere in the USA and Canada and do some research ???? "I did."
Find out for yourselves make some phone calls look up shops anywhere like in Arizona,Nevada,California,NewMexico. "I did"
That would be the only way you might get off your high horse, and think twice before you fall off.

And for "Utahski" on the argue part what are you and a few others doing for the last, what 10 pages trying to make yourselves look cool telling me if I have not tried it then how could I know.
You expect people to just do it, because you said so, "I`m sorry not me, I am not a follower".
All I am doing is suggesting one`s that are interested in doing this to check around and see what real live professional shops think about the idea.
Then go from there.
To do it just because "so and so" said it is a real cool thing to do is real foolish on their part.
Do some real research, and actually talk to real people. "Again I did"

And as I have said more than once, several people I have known and trusted for 40 + years and in the business says it is not a good idea.
"Why can`t you just get over it"
You said what you felt on the blankets.
But I guess I`m not allowed to voice opinions that have been given me, to pass on as well.
I am certainly not going to install exhaust blanks/wraps when I have been strongly advised not to.
Apparently this was just a oneway topic with you fellars, only your way.
In fact this was not even the topic thread, someone went off topic.
"So get over yourselves" I have.
"By now"

"I love my BD Manifold" By the way that was the topic.

subscribed for later

My responce is, you do have a telephone don`t you, and are you able to look up performace shops anywhere in the USA and Canada and do some research ???? "I did."
Find out for yourselves make some phone calls look up shops anywhere like in Arizona,Nevada,California,NewMexico. "I did"
That would be the only way you might get off your high horse, and think twice before you fall off.

And for "Utahski" on the argue part what are you and a few others doing for the last, what 10 pages trying to make yourselves look cool telling me if I have not tried it then how could I know.
You expect people to just do it, because you said so, "I`m sorry not me, I am not a follower".
All I am doing is suggesting one`s that are interested in doing this to check around and see what real live professional shops think about the idea.
Then go from there.
To do it just because "so and so" said it is a real cool thing to do is real foolish on their part.
Do some real research, and actually talk to real people. "Again I did"

And as I have said more than once, several people I have known and trusted for 40 + years and in the business says it is not a good idea.
"Why can`t you just get over it"
You said what you felt on the blankets.
But I guess I`m not allowed to voice opinions that have been given me, to pass on as well.
I am certainly not going to install exhaust blanks/wraps when I have been strongly advised not to.
Apparently this was just a oneway topic with you fellars, only your way.
In fact this was not even the topic thread, someone went off topic.
"So get over yourselves" I have.
"By now"

"I love my BD Manifold" By the way that was the topic.

what you really need to realize is we are saying your sources arent credible nor are you , opinions are great if they are given after the propper testing. untill then they are peoples gut feelings which for me doesnt cut it . as i stated above list what test was performed and the results . And for the record we are discusing a turbo charged duramax diesel with tubular headers !

My responce is, you do have a telephone don`t you, and are you able to look up performace shops anywhere in the USA and Canada and do some research ???? "I did."
Find out for yourselves make some phone calls look up shops anywhere like in Arizona,Nevada,California,NewMexico. "I did"
That would be the only way you might get off your high horse, and think twice before you fall off.

And for "Utahski" on the argue part what are you and a few others doing for the last, what 10 pages trying to make yourselves look cool telling me if I have not tried it then how could I know.
You expect people to just do it, because you said so, "I`m sorry not me, I am not a follower".
All I am doing is suggesting one`s that are interested in doing this to check around and see what real live professional shops think about the idea.
Then go from there.
To do it just because "so and so" said it is a real cool thing to do is real foolish on their part.
Do some real research, and actually talk to real people. "Again I did"

And as I have said more than once, several people I have known and trusted for 40 + years and in the business says it is not a good idea.
"Why can`t you just get over it"
You said what you felt on the blankets.
But I guess I`m not allowed to voice opinions that have been given me, to pass on as well.
I am certainly not going to install exhaust blanks/wraps when I have been strongly advised not to.
Apparently this was just a oneway topic with you fellars, only your way.
In fact this was not even the topic thread, someone went off topic.
"So get over yourselves" I have.
"By now"

"I love my BD Manifold" By the way that was the topic.Based on your response, I'm going to guess you are NOT going to tell us who you called and what their background in diesel performance is.

D R C I have a very simple solution to this. Test it. It doesnt matter what anyone says. Trents truck is fast, and getting exponentially faster. Hes a hell of a mechanic and knows a great deal and I speak with him regularly and he refuses to post up and hype things up. He tests, and posts the results. Simple stuff really.

what you really need to realize is we are saying your sources arent credible nor are you , opinions are great if they are given after the propper testing. untill then they are peoples gut feelings which for me doesnt cut it . as i stated above list what test was performed and the results . And for the record we are discusing a turbo charged duramax diesel with tubular headers !


Thanks Trent for your help. I talked to the gentlemen today and everthing worked out great. thanks

DRC you are wrong, trentnell is right. Unless you are melting the uppipes/headers until then, keep all of the heat in.


JMO

Id say keep it on topic but I think thats out the window now :D

So I WILL say keep it civil. Argue facts with no BS. :thumb:

Well that was good for a laugh. Some of the points brought up against blankets/heat retention materials were borderline comical. "Cooked gaskets"? No wonder it's so hard to get a quality turbo blanket business off the ground with uninformed people saying that reputable diesel shops don't recommend heat blankets. I know for a fact that it isn't true, I make the only blankets that are specifically made for today's light duty diesel trucks, stock or not, and I have never had a shop buy from me with the intention of testing these blankets or heard any bad test results. I have got nothing but positive feedback on the performance of the blankets from customers, with the exception of a few errors that were mine, not the blankets or material construction.

Not trying to push a product but this whole "cooking the engine, gonna ruin everything with a set of blankets" mentality is getting old.

Levi

[quote=lishle65;3362482]Well that was good for a laugh. Some of the points brought up against blankets/heat retention materials were borderline comical. "Cooked gaskets"? No wonder it's so hard to get a quality turbo blanket business off the ground with uninformed people saying that reputable diesel shops don't recommend heat blankets. I know for a fact that it isn't true, I make the only blankets that are specifically made for today's light duty diesel trucks, stock or not, and I have never had a shop buy from me with the intention of testing these blankets or heard any bad test results. I have got nothing but positive feedback on the performance of the blankets from customers, with the exception of a few errors that were mine, not the blankets or material construction.

Not trying to push a product but this whole "cooking the engine, gonna ruin everything with a set of blankets" mentality is getting old.


Thanks for your help Levi. :D

Have you ever actually held one? That manifold is less than .100" thick in most places. If you try to do any porting you'll likely cut right through it.

You guys knock yourselves out. In the next 4-6 weeks some good stuff should be out and about, very much like a full header.

Just wondering where they are going to find the room for "almost" 4' of tubing for each primary, to make it a tuned header. If it's not tuned you might as well keep the log style header.

I have installed a bunch of them, and have one on my own truck. My experience is, it does exactly what I wanted it to do, replace the restrictive stock manifold and have a pre-drilled EGT port. I did not notice one bit of difference after the install, but it's a peace of mind thing for me, and nothing else.
Feel good mod:) At most 50f on a 500hp tune but i would rather run it than run a stock manifold
Here's the goods...


http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03007_Resized.jpg
http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03008_Resized.jpg
http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03009_Resized.jpg
http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03010_Resized.jpg
http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03012_Resized.jpg
http://www.fleeceperformance.com/Media/Manifolds/DSC03013_Resized.jpg


Material is cast stainless.

Thanks,

Brayden
Nice Brayden!
Why cast? 321 is to costly?

I'll probably ditch the heat shield mounts too. Not sure yet... what do you think?

They take up to much room ditch all but the DS manifold:D

Originally Posted by confrontational http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/images/buttons/viewpost.gif (http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?p=3340569#post3340569)
To be honest it's a waste of money. Wait a bit and see what comes out. ;)




You guy`s are the first that I have read that states it is a waist of $$$.
The wait a bit and see what comes out statement "what" else could possibly come out to improve the manifold area??? Not much room.

I am getting the BD manifold mainly to have the use of the egt with my Insight.

I already have a mech egt gauge comming off the pass side manifold
and I want to keep it functioning.

I guess my last ? would be, have both of you installed the BD and speaking from experance and dyno testing ??? Just curious.


What else? lots could improve;) BD is a mod that you dont see any difference or very little....Dyno????OMG if you see a difference on a dyno
i would be shocked. Its a feel good mod and will last a long time without issue

Its not a waist of money IMO but it is a mod you wont notcie any differnce on. I still rather it than the stocker:)

So just how big do you think a log style manifold needs to be? How much cross sectional area does that model have? What kind of port geometry?

Pretty bold statement from glancing at some pictures. If you're gong to step the log style manifold up in large steps then how large do you suppose the uppipes should be? Anything over 2.125 is for the big boys.

2.125 is huge IMO spagetti style is never going to be long enough or ever correct

People need to realize it is turbo charged and go from there JMHO


But i dont think the plastic will hold up:D

Wow, this went well beyond the BD manifold .....


I don't feel wrapping the manifolds will yield any gain in underhood temps while driving .... there is constant airflow through the engine compartment......

I'm not a full on racer though so maybe thats why i don't see the purpose.


Back tot he BD manifold. I run one and i like it. It gets rid of the huge dent restriction and it is tapped for the pyro making it an easy install and if i need the truck to be back to stock i still have a stock untapped manifold ....


Yes the BD removes the dent but that is just 1 of many restrictions


You dont have to be a full on racer to realize underhood temps or realize the bennifit??? I really dont even understand that point of view?

Underhood temps is a concern! You should know this Greg?

Rick D? Stainless headers and up pipes, probably the best thing going and no need to wait.

I dont agree with that

Heat sheilds suck, ceramic coating and header wrap will suffice.

Header wrap rusts will cause rust and ceramic coating flakes into the turbo....How is that suffice?

You need at least 2 feet of stainless (Brake tubing) to isolate the drive pressure sender or gauge from the exhaust. We sell pressure transducers that integrate with EFILive for this.

6" is is penty IMO if you can touch the tubing after hotlapping im sure 6"is enough,Not that it hurts to have more...just saying what i see.Ive been running a DP gauge for 3 years now and never a issue with 6":D

My first concern would be by wraping the exhaust manifold would keep the heat in a heck of alot longer than I would think would be good.
Unless your living in Alaska or somewhere like that with freezing temps.
Otherwise I don`t feel it is a good idea, no way for the heat to escape out being all snugley and hot for a long time.

Keep the heat where? In the exhaust? and that is bad?:D NO that is a good thing....Keep it in the exhaust where it is meant to be:)

i am not questioning them not being a nice item.


It's just the original point of the thread was about a BD manifold that is a direct replacement for one side for $300 or less ...

That is being compared to headers that can be anywhere from 3 times that to 7 times that price....


racer stand point - headers and uppies ...


regular towing and daily driver the BD manifold is the way to go.


Just my thoughts.

Greg if you could remove heat faster wouldnt that help enen in a stock stuation? I think it would GM didnt care IMO or they would of made a seperate manifold for the 2500/3500 trucks JMHO

"God" 85 degrees how did you`all survive.
The temps we delt with yesterday and everyday from now till the end of Oct. was a chilling 106 degrees. And top out usually somewhere around 120+ in the shade before its all over.

By the way the shop I`ve delt with for 35+ years installed my BD manifold.
I quized him some more on the exhaust wraps/blankets and why they are seriously not recommened.
If they get wet the wraps/blankets will hold the moisture in and will corrode the metal.
The blanket will hold more heat internally which will eventually cause damage to seals etc. etc, from the extreem heat being held in.
And all header manufactors will void the header warranty, if damage/corrosion occures within the warranty period and they find out someone used the wraps/blankets, which I did verify that.

Anyway just something to seriously think about.

What did they say about the BD:D The gakets on the turbo can handle ALOT!??? What seals are you refering too??? Turbo,exhaust? Many of us put them to the test daily.Ive personally seen a 2000f gauge wrap around and my seals are good:D What is the temp that they go bad???:D:D:D

I like the idea of a blanket over a wrap the blanket will allow moistur to escape where is a wrap wont ( oxygen can get in it can get out )

Basically putting it but you are WRONG:)

Ok, you're quoting fabricated mild steel headers vs a cast iron manifold.

Care to explain the metallurigical differences between the two?

Question, have you EVER seen ANYTHING made of decent cast iron corrode in a structurally destructive manner? No, and you never will. It's not in the physical make-up of the material. If it's crap pig iron maybe, (like brake rotors) but not good iron.

Notice that every manhole cover, stormwater drain inlet, etc, in the country is made from cast iron. They sit through some harsh winters covered in salted road grime, city pollution, etc and they don't corrode and fail. Go around an older city, Philly etc. The manhole covers are wearing down due to a hundred years of traffic, visible wear on the surface of them. But they don't rust in place, they aren't falling apart from corrosion.

You can wrap a cast iron manifold with whatever you want, soak it in salt water every day of it's life, and it will be around longer than any of us.

Yes Iron "rusts", in a patina sort of way. Fresh iron goes through some stages, turns orange initially, and very soon turns that almost black color. From that point on the corrosion is almost non-existent.

Steel and iron are not the same, don't react the same, and don't wear the same. So comparing a wrapped steel header to a cast manifold is asinine at best.

So either use a cast BETTER manifold what Brayden I think is desighning or use 321 SS??? No?

Um, I understand this isnt a total performance website and more for DD but are we not trying to improve are trucks? Stock sucks,BD is a lil better
Ricks are a work in progress and so are Braydens....Atleast someone realizes the need for something better:)

What seals could possibly be harmed on a motor by retaining heat in the exhaust system? That is what it's built to do, excavate superheated gases from the engine.

Btw your theory is fundamentally flawed. IF you would have used a decent blanket the heat NEVER would have escaped the manifold, thus the floor board in your moho would have never gotten any hotter than ambient temp, or from the radiant heat of the block itself.

I have blankets on turbine housings where the manifolds will glow red, yet the blanket will barely reach 150F when loaded at full tilt. With in 30 seconds of shutting it down you can hold your palm to the blanket. Find me ANY header you're willing to do that to.

As well, wrapping the manifolds reduces general underhood heatsoak by a substantial margin. Keeping as much heat inside the tubes and pumped out the back is the best possible scenario.

I think you need to stop theorizing your own made up fizix and pay attention to some basics of thermal conductivity.

I don't like to argue, I just can't stand uneducated goods spreading misinformation like it's the gospel.

YA:D It is not that complicated

No matter if its a gasser or diesel heat can cause the same damage.

The part you guys don`t seem to comprehend, is the heat being held in and the only escape is thru the exhaust ends up being extreem internally.
The compairson on headers v.s. cast iron manifolds is cast iron retains a hell of a lot more heat and to blanket them is even a worse idea.

Lets get out there and do some towing in 120 degree temps and pull some long steep grades with my coolant and trans temps hitting 220-230 degrees and see who`s lasts longer, and who`s gets hotter.

And like I have said several times I have contacted several known professionals that deals with this stuff.
And I`m pretty sure I`ll stick with true professional people that I know personally. Besides they could make $$ off of me selling this stuff and they don`t and they won`t even carry them or suggest them.
Why is a blanket a bad idea?
thats funny , i only know if one person who builds duramax headers and he made the ones bolted to my truck ;) and knows they are covered in blakets .so who are all of these deasel header experts you have spoken with ? and also tell me because i would love to know how the heat is going to travel into the motor when the exhaust is flowing out of the motor and the blanket doesnt allow heat to soak the block ?

and to your point above i would take your challenge any day of the week , dont get fooled by my racing pics my truck is still a tow rig and tows a 14k load all summer long all through the hot desert .

Trent what do you know? you just test stuff and report unbiased info.....Shame on on you:D:D

No matter if its a gasser or diesel heat can cause the same damage.

You really have no idea?:eek:

The part you guys don`t seem to comprehend, is the heat being held in and the only escape is thru the exhaust ends up being extreem internally.
The compairson on headers v.s. cast iron manifolds is cast iron retains a hell of a lot more heat and to blanket them is even a worse idea.

Lets get out there and do some towing in 120 degree temps and pull some long steep grades with my coolant and trans temps hitting 220-230 degrees and see who`s lasts longer, and who`s gets hotter.

And like I have said several times I have contacted several known professionals that deals with this stuff.
And I`m pretty sure I`ll stick with true professional people that I know personally. Besides they could make $$ off of me selling this stuff and they don`t and they won`t even carry them or suggest them.

Go-rv-ing.com is a great website:D your info is so far from reality its not even funny

Sorry dont mean to come down on you,But you are wrong.In so many ways

If you care to argue? who is making thes ridiculous staements? What testing have they done?What wraps have they tried? And are they a member of the Good Sam club:D Honestly, think about what you are saying
it makes zero sense?

Go-rv-ing.com is a great website:D your info is so far from reality its not even funny


:muahaha:

I agree with Brayden on the size. I inadvertently did a test for him of some headers that did not work out because they were too large. Anyone without real world experience needs to step back and listen to some of the guys that have tried different setups like Trent and take some notes. It's how you learn.

The BD is one of the biggest ripoffs for a Dmax. $400 for piece of mind and no performance or EGT changes? Money well spent there.

I agree that the BD manifold has no performance value what so ever. I had one on my truck and have installed others. The best thing about it is the EGT port, but I'd keep my $300 and get out the drill and tap. The dent in the stock manifold isn't really much of a restriction - if you cut it and look at the cross section you'd see that the manifold was designed to have the dent. If you want to install it for "piece of mind" or so that you don't have to risk cracking a manifold from drilling and tapping (although I've drilled and taps dozens of them without ever cracking one) go right ahead. From my testing I know the (lack of) potential gains.

I have Rick's headers and up-pipes on my truck and have been one of the testers through the last few design changes. I had them on a stock motor that I pushed hard enough to destroy a piston. And now I have them on the built motor in my sig. I don't want coating on the inside because as sweetdiesel said there is the risk of it flaking and getting ingested by the turbo. I don't want to wrap them because it doesn't work that well and holds moisture right against the pipe. When I have the money I will be asking Trent where he got his blankets as I would like to reduce my under hood temps and feel the the blankets will be the best way to do it. They can breath to where I don't feel moisture is an issue - especially with stainless headers; they will keep the heat in the exhaust where it belongs - which will help with turbo spool up. I will also be looking into a turbo sock as well. My downpipe will be getting header wrap around it since I've caught the fire resistant insulation on the firewall on fire during a sled pull.

As for getting extremely hot you guys are not grasping the fact that things aren't going to get any hotter because they are insulated. The exhaust gasses coming out are going to be the same temperature they were before, and the headers can only get that hot. If you have something that is 1000* and you blow 1000* air at it will it get any hotter? If you are 98.6* and crawl in a sleeping bag will the inside of the bag get any hotter than 98.6*? The answer to both is no. Take a radiator for a water heated building and put this header blanket material around it - the room will no longer get heated and the radiator will be the same temperature as it was before - no extra heat will magically happen. After making a pass down the strip, down the sled track, or pulling a trailer up a steep grade and coming to an idle the flow of 320*-350* exhaust gasses through the headers will cool them to 350*, and before you see it on the pyro the headers will have to soak up the heat inside the blankets and evacuate it out the exhaust as well. Trent says this still happens quickly. Shut the motor off and you have a header and blanket that is 350* against a gasket and head that was just flowing over 1250* air - I really doubt you are going to hurt anything, and even further doubt that the 30 or so pounds of material at 350* is going to heat soak the 1000 lb motor full of coolant and oil that is all around 200*. I would be willing to bet they all settle out to very close to the engine temps, then drop slowly from there. I think the biggest thing you are failing to realize is the heat we are all talking about is coming from the engine and it going back to the engine will not hurt anything in least.

The "experts" that you've dealt with for 35 and 40 years obviously have very little experience with turbo charged vehicles, especially diesels and are giving you their opinions based on what they've heard or possibly seen on gas vehicles with thin walled mild steel headers. Mild steel headers rust away very quickly to begin with and I wouldn't ever wrap or blanket them and expect them to last. If you were to blanket the headers on your 460 in your RV the floor would be alot cooler because all of the heat would go out the exhaust and not be radiating to your floorboard. If you have mild steel headers they wouldn't last long though.

That's a good explanation. But it makes too much sense.....he won't like it and he won't listen.

That's a good explanation. But it makes too much sense.....he won't like it and he won't listen.

I hate when that happens. Something makes so much sense that I can't understand it, and instead of asking for information, I spew hate and discontent about something I don't know anything about.

I hate when that happens. Something makes so much sense that I can't understand it, and instead of asking for information, I spew hate and discontent about something I don't know anything about.

Hey, I was saying the same thing on page one, and don't know how people can justify things with no actual hard data what so ever.

Hey, I was saying the same thing on page one, and don't know how people can justify things with no actual hard data what so ever.

Hard data or not, if people want to put a part on their truck for whatever reason, it's their choice. My point was directed at people who say certain parts don't work, not from them having personal experience with it or any real factual information to go off, but because they heard someone, somewhere, sometime, tried one and it didn't work. I hate the he said she said game.

I hate the he said she said game.

Exactly... In my world "billy bob from unnamed diesel shop said it would make my truck melt" isn't good enough for me.

Exactly... In my world "billy bob from unnamed diesel shop said it would make my truck melt" isn't good enough for me.

I agree. If people are willing to put up that a shop tested it and it didn't work. At least be willing to tell who tested, or speak intelligently about the testing results and why it won't work. It'll benefit everyone in making an informed decision when it comes time to buy parts for their trucks. Just my $.02

I tried to put it a few different ways so that some people might begin to comprehend. I think the biggest thing is that the places these people are talking to are going off of results of header wrap on mild steel headers. When we are talking about cast manifolds and/or stainless/inconel headers and up-pipes.

"Thats nice".

I guess my point was not recieved at all.
"Every" mod, performace type dealer (10) I have spoke to, and/or called since this discussion has been going on, does not recomended using blankets or wraps.




:rolleyes: What? did you call your local chevy dealer down the street? Or is this some info you got off of Rving.com? They know their high performance well!!! :idiot:

the bad thing is you cannot go by 1 engine/car/truck, variables can help/hinder testing. that is why beta testing normally put out handful to offset variables. sheilding/wraps/lagging have been used on fleet/commercial/marine applications, these are under high loads for long periods of time(60-90% load continuos for days) so i can not forsee problems, should expect power/economy gains from external parts in cooler air, cooler intake air(+HP/engine longevity) faster and thermally denser exhaust flow to turbo. i have seen a product that was aimed at OEM where cast iron or aluminum was cast then recast with thermal material that gave strength to manifold and rejected heat inward, single installable component. i expected to see this on the 4.5 or cummins v6/8 engines. i would not be surprised to see on ford's new engine, remember testing plastic engine components(block/heads) back in early 90's

i agree with containing the heat, look at the marine industry and the diesel engines that run at lemans, take a look at the 4.5l duramax and the fords there must be some good reason to not release all that heat to the other components of the engine, right ?

I need to know about longevity were i work stainlesssteel cracks a lot mostly around vibration and we all know diesels rattle.

And lets all get to the point of whats a great product and were do i get it. thanks.

If you are 98.6* and crawl in a sleeping bag will the inside of the bag get any hotter than 98.6*? The answer is no.

You obviously dont understand thermodynamics, or the human body.

The human body is a engine that regulates its core temp at 98.6 by shedding tremendous amounts of heat into the ambient environment surrounding it.

If you incase this engine inside a insulated envelope ( the sleeping bag) ... this discarded heat has no where to go, and the temperature inside the envelope will rise. This in turn will defeat the bodys ability to regulate its core temp, so this will rise as well.

Your "playground" analogies dont work.

You obviously dont understand thermodynamics, or the human body.

The human body is a engine that regulates its core temp at 98.6 by shedding tremendous amounts of heat into the ambient environment surrounding it.

If you incase this engine inside a insulated envelope ( the sleeping bag) ... this discarded heat has no where to go, and the temperature inside the envelope will rise. This in turn will defeat the bodys ability to regulate its core temp, so this will rise as well.

Your "playground" analogies dont work.

My point is that it is not going to get dangerously hotter than what it already is. While in the military I've spent quite a number of nights sleeping in a sleeping bag when it was under 20 degrees - with the 3 bags completely zipped up all completely zipped up with about a 2" hole for air I never woke with a fever.

EGT probes are mounted in the exhaust manifold and read temperature at the hottest point. Insulating around the manifolds is not going to cause temperatures to get any higher than what you are already seeing on the EGT gauge.

These compairsons are getting ridiculous but they are very humorous.
But a big thumbs up for "AlisoBob".
I was saying this earlier but got beat down from only 2 believers at the time.

Anyway what happen to the discussion on BD Manifolds :confused:

You obviously dont understand thermodynamics, or the human body.

The human body is a engine that regulates its core temp at 98.6 by shedding tremendous amounts of heat into the ambient environment surrounding it.

If you incase this engine inside a insulated envelope ( the sleeping bag) ... this discarded heat has no where to go, and the temperature inside the envelope will rise. This in turn will defeat the bodys ability to regulate its core temp, so this will rise as well.

Your "playground" analogies dont work.

this analigy has no place in this dicusion , this is not a sealed invirnment , there is alot of air cooling the mentioned area , its just flowing through exhaust system , i though we went over this already :rolleyes:

These compairsons are getting ridiculous but they are very humorous.
But a big thumbs up for "AlisoBob".
I was saying this earlier but got beat down from only 2 believers at the time.

Anyway what happen to the discussion on BD Manifolds :confused:

You did say it earlier , you were wrong then and still are now .

One thing, using any full body analogy is fairly bad because you can overheat it. Just as you can overheat the truck by blocking the radiator.

The point being, no matter how much insulation you add, the external temp of the manifold will NEVER exceed the temp of the heat source (EGT). It's just not physically possible as you're not adding any external heat energy.

The only thing you're doing is keeping that heat from radiating to everything around it which includes the airbox, underhood air, CAC pipes, etc.

I recently spoke with a friend who is an engineer at CAT. Their stances is 110% blanket/wrap EVERYTHING exhaust related. Contain as much heat and energy inside the exhaust as possible and keep it away from everything else.

Man, you guys have been busy over here.):h

a header upgrade would be wise for a upgraded turbo .... a stock turbo, a bd manifold would do just fine... just my opinion. but why pay more, create more work for yourself, for a very lightly modified truck ?

Actually, I have a set of log headers especially for small and stock turbo's. It's not uncommon to see 30-50 hp increases with no other changes. Overall drive-ability is greatly enhanced too. We'll be testing at the track soon also.

Coatings are to keep heat in because exhaust that stays hotter stays expanded and moves faster.

Exactly. Thermal energy is our friend too.



I know of 4 different companies working on castings at this time, me included. Mine will be totally different from the pictures Brayden has posted.

I'm also testing other alternatives. ;)

this analigy has no place in this dicusion , this is not a sealed invirnment , there is alot of air cooling the mentioned area , its just flowing through exhaust system , i though we went over this already :rolleyes:



You did say it earlier , you were wrong then and still are now .

"Why thank you, I do want your ego to rise real high then eventually fall like a lead balloon.
That would be real cool to see.
"Huggs and kisses"

That would be real cool to see. "Huggs and kisses"

:Whoa:


Comon fellas stop all the damn insults. FACTS keep threads open while having good debates. Insults will get it closed. This is a good thread so lets keep it open. Thanks.

All the heat that is being created by the engine is exiting the exhaust therefore even if the headers or turbo is covered it still exiting the exhaust even if it does raise the "temp" like some say. There should be no hold up at the headers.

So what types of gains are gained with just installing better aftermarket Up pipes? Hp, Drivability, spool up etc.. Ill be looking to do just up pipes and then possible headers down the road.. Sorry if its been discussed already, I tried reading all 14 pages but started going cross eyed :lol:

So what types of gains are gained with just installing better aftermarket Up pipes? Hp, Drivability, spool up etc.. Ill be looking to do just up pipes and then possible headers down the road.. Sorry if its been discussed already, I tried reading all 14 pages but started going cross eyed :lol:

My freind dynoed before and after and he picked up 25-30hp at the rear wheels and better spool up from just the up-pipes .

My freind dynoed before and after and he picked up 25-30hp at the rear wheels and better spool up from just the up-pipes .

Trent, the hi flow up pipes can be installed to the factory manifolds?

Trent, the hi flow up pipes can be installed to the factory manifolds?
Yeap.

Yeap.


Thanks

Thanks
But I think those uppipes works with the manifols. I believe the uppipes for the headers are alil longer. So if your thinking bout mabey running headers later on you might wanna get ask Rick. Also the uppipe dont have the Y for the EGR. So that will need to be blocked off if not already.:D

So, will these headers and up pipes and stuff do any good on a relatively stock LLY? In a little while I will have a tuner (probably Banks Six Gun or Economind) and an exhaust upgrade.

Mark

i just picked one up off of ebay for 250. with shipping.

So, will these headers and up pipes and stuff do any good on a relatively stock LLY? In a little while I will have a tuner (probably Banks Six Gun or Economind) and an exhaust upgrade.

Mark
Yes, I have a set just for you. ;) PM me or one of my dealers if you're interested.

Yes, I have a set just for you. ;) PM me or one of my dealers if you're interested.
RICK, WHAT ARE THOSE MANIFOLDS IN YOUR AVATAR?

Sweet.. Got a set of RDL up pipes on way..