Just got my Transgo Jr. Installed last weekend. So naturally my desire to play around has gotten worse. Bumped the tuner up to Level 5 and things got hairy. Once or twice I put it down hard and the rpms flared but I didn't go any faster so I let off. Most of the times it would take off right away so I guess I can blame this on transmission learning. The second issue I was having is it wouldnt take long at all to hit 1700*. When that happened I backed off. I figure after about 40-60 feet it would hit 1700 from a slow roll of about 20 MPH. So what do you guys figure is the deal? Do I need a lift pump to run such tune? Would low fuel pressure cause high EGT's?

When I was running the PPE tuner on the higher setting I would 1700 also...Just the nature of the tuner I think...Just dont hold it at 1700 for more than a couple seconds and you should be fine...I got the water/meth and it helped...Then twins and now no probs.

PPE's tunes all ran hot on my truck too.

Time for some upgrades my friend.....1700 is an awful lot for the engine to take. Plus the added hp/tq to the trans, definently look into trans upgrades maybe a lift pump as well.

I have a Transgo Jr. installed. Like I said, i'm just playing around right now. But that is my question. Will low fuel pressure cause high EGT's?

I have a Transgo Jr. installed. Like I said, i'm just playing around right now. But that is my question. Will low fuel pressure cause high EGT's?

Yes.

I have a Transgo Jr. installed. Like I said, i'm just playing around right now. But that is my question. Will low fuel pressure cause high EGT's?

No low fuel pressure is not going to cause high egts . Its opposite . Motor is running with less hp starving for fuel . different than a lean gasser . Not related to egts running shy on rail pressure . Im running shy on fuel right now on mine and seeing 1550 instead of 1700+ .

PPE is a bit more conservative on injection timing and this causes more egt's . Why you here alot of guys running lower egt's with efi . More injection timing quicker makes for less egt's . Higher cylinder pressure though . Is kind of a trade off on whats worse . EGT's vs. high cylinder pressure from quicker injection timing . PPE is also huge amounts of pulse width , meaning alot of fuel . Also big on egt temp list . I have run ppe tunes for years and know exactly the egt's your refering to .

The things that can help are , better breathing intake , filter , and intake and mouth piece . , better intercooler , more efficiant turbo , twin turbo's would be the best way to cut the egt's down . Getting a lift pump is something you should do , but not going to change your egts , just make it run better and hold rail psi .

EGT's will definately kill turbos and piston , but so does cylinder pressure from higher injection timing . Usually lifting the heads off motor with alot of cylider pressure is common .

Been there done that .

lol ok so what kind of EGT's am I looking at with a lift pump installed. Also, can you explain to me why low fuel pressure causes low EGT's? Always trying to expand my knowledge.

Yes.

Am I wrong on this Chad ??


Im no expert , just what i thought .

Thanks John. I posted just after you did. I modded the stock airbox and the filter is brand new. I dont think that people upgrade the mouthpiece on a LBZ do they? What else can I do minus the intercooler/turbos/intake?

lol ok so what kind of EGT's am I looking at with a lift pump installed. Also, can you explain to me why low fuel pressure causes low EGT's? Always trying to expand my knowledge.

Well let see , on my ppe #10 there is 3350 pulse width and about 31* total timing . Then there is how quick this come in . The ppe comes in slower than most efi tunes . Ususally making for higher egt's and with huge amount of fuel . PPE is probably the most fuelled tune out there . 3350 is huge . Usually at 1/8 mile I was pushing 1800* going through the lights

Ran this for years and only killed alot of turbos and then finally cracked a piston . From obviously high egt's . I was holding it for long periods in the 2000* range though .

My efi tune I was running was 2800 pulse width ( less fuel ) and same 31* total but came in a tad quicker . Only saw 1550 going through the lights .

I saw considerably less egt's on the efi tune . Made alot more power too , you could feel it . Was like I was runing N20 .

Funny how that worked using less pulse width meaning less fuel . On my ppe I blacked out the track going slower and on the efi with less fuel it was charcoal grey and much faster . Again ... funny how this works .

Pushed my head gaskets same night racing this tune . Cylinder pressure . The truck was obviously to me making much more power on the efi tune . And I was really happy with the egts being much lower . Very noticable to .

Ran a half second quicker at the track that night on the efi tune also . Then saw the dex leaking down side of block next morning .

About the best I explain it with my knowledge . Probably from high cylinder pressure leading the piston with timing to much for the weight of my truck . This tune had never hurt a 2500 . I found my grey area on cylinder pressure and pushing a head gasket .

Good stuff though , and why it is very important to know the guy tuning your truck with efi . I know my friend well and it was good tuning , just a tad hot for my weight .

Oh man. I'm in deep. So basically, running higher ppe tunes, i'm eventually going to destroy something engine related?

No , not if you take it to 1700 and get out of it after just a few seconds . But hell ya , you hold it up there and you will hurt stuff for sure . Its just a matter of time .

Tuning , Its a balance on egt vs. cylinder pressure . Quicker injection timing is also hard on the motor , There is a fine line of balance here and what the gurus discuss alot and I try to follow and understand .

Im certainly no expert , but I am kinda telling you the basics about it . Im sure a few gurus will chime in and help you understand better or correct me .

I can only tell you so much . I am a good wrench and understand all the motor , but no tuner yet . Hopefully in the future I will understand this even more.

I am on my 3rd motor , so some of my info is from experience .

Its really hard to tell how long you can run those EGTs. But it will wear your engine out at some point. Best to insure yourself a bit and upgrade the necessary components.

Thanks everyone. Your input is greatly appreciated. Maybe Water Meth is my answer? But will that raise cylinder pressure to concerning points?

I would bet you will hurt the motor quicker with crazy egt's before a really good efi tune with more cylinder pressure . Pushing a head gasket is much different than melting a turbo or cracking a piston . As long as I just melted turbos I was ok with that . You must also remember how heavy my truck is and how much weight affects egt and makes them move considerably faster than your 2500 . I also have held mine to over 2000* for long periods of time in the dunes getting up long sand hills .

So dont panic at my issues either . you will have to hold your for a very long time up there to cause this .

Im kind of a retard when it comes to lifting on the pedal . Almost to the top ..... just a little more ..... almost there .... egt's are off the gauge and unreadable with the crap I pull on mine .

Most would tell you I should have blown up 10 motors by now .

Johnny


You can do it on either of the tunes , your right foot and lifting is mostly involved here .

Thanks everyone. Your input is greatly appreciated. Maybe Water Meth is my answer? But will that raise cylinder pressure to concerning points?

I think this is a good choice to help out a bit . Dont think you are even close to concerns on cylinder pressure yet .

PPE level 5 , your fine . Just watch how long you cream it up there in the 1700 + range and above .

Am I wrong on this Chad ??


Im no expert , just what i thought .

John I'm wrong. I was equating low rail pressure and boost levels on my 03. When I had low rail pressure my truck had high EGT's because my boost was only in the 26 psi range..., then added a boost valve and a lift pump at thesame time and lowered my EGT's down to 1500° area at WOT, but my boost was at 32 #'s. The boost is what did it, not the rail pressure. Sorry for the confusion.

Here is a quote from Dan to contradict my post above, but take everything on these boards with a grain of salt.
If you are maintaining the commanded desired pressure then your fuel system is keeping up with the tune, once you can not hold commanded pressure you will start loosing HP/TQ and raising egt’s and loosing efficiency...

The goal for maximum power output is to run the highest tune (largest pulse width) while still maintaining commanded fuel pressure....

The HPCR (High Pressure Common Rail) injection system is built on this principle...

More pressure=better atomization=more efficiency…..
Last edited by Dan@PPE : 01-09-2008 at 08:05 PM.

So how do I know if i'm maintaining pressure?

EFI Live, Edge Insight, PPE rail pressure gauge will work for that.

Log it with efi live or a tech 2

Hmm. I have neither. Would it be safe to assume I am not maintaining rail pressure. Especially since level 4 I hit at max 1300*?

Again I dont think you are keeping up with the pressure . A lift pump would be a good addition . Chad made a good point I didnt think about . What is your boost # psi . If you werent making as much boost as your supose to , then you might be up a hair . Those egt #'s are pretty much the norm for ppe tunes . Theyre hot to say the least .

Fuel in the exhaust also helps spin the turbo , If you were a bit shy you could be down a bit on psi boost . Still think you should get a lift pump . I can almost guarantee you are down a bit of rail psi . Just from all the other trucks I have seen . When was the last time you changed your fuel filter also . I try to do mine every 3000 miles . Bigger tunes and more fuel means more volume thru filter and dirty quicker . Lift pump is needed either way for bigger tunes . I kind of forget about this alot . I have 2 cp3's on mine and no lift pump . I keep up , but I to should add a lift pump . Just havnt because I am not losing rail psi on logging with tech 2 or efi live .

Filter has 50% left on the DIC. Not sure how many miles are on it. Maybe time for a change. As far as boost #'s I believe I am right around 28 to 30. I think. I will have to check next time I run it.

Filter has 50% left on the DIC. Not sure how many miles are on it. Maybe time for a change. As far as boost #'s I believe I am right around 28 to 30. I think. I will have to check next time I run it.

That is plenty of boost . I would do your filter at no more than 3k and not go by the dic myself .

I think everything on your truck is fine , and you should consider a lift pump . EGT's will still be the same probably , but maybe better hp on the upper end from holding rail .

Alright. Thanks John. You've been a big help.

Any time brother . I wish I had more for you . When it comes to turning wrenchs on them I could be more technical . Tuning .... I know enough to be dangerous though . LOL

Im sure some gurus will come in and give you some better pointers .

Hellrazr, I don't see a EGR blocker in your sig. If I remember corectly my truck ran lower EGT's after installing a blocker. Before the blocker my truck would black out the track all the way down on level 6 running about 97 mph, I could only build high 20's for boost. After I installed the blocker boost came on quicker and held at 32 psi. My smoke cleared up allot and my trap speed was about 103. Another thing to think about even though your EGT's get really high there only at a dangerous level for about 3-5 seconds running the 1/4.

ppe is top notch. johnny knows what he is taking about.if none of that works consider a bd manifold and diamond eye down pipe. those alone on my truck were good for 200 plus degrees cooler on the egt side beside letting the truck breath better. lift pump is a darn good idea when running a big tune. It helps out a ton on the top end. My lly on tune 10 would kinda fall short on the top end but after the lift pump it pulled and kept pulling. so when your egts start climbing they are probabley right and your running out of fuel. hit chad up at alligator performance. I bought everything from him and he is the homie. great prices and super fast shipping.

Sup , Sean llyppe . howz the water meth kit been working for you .

Get a lift pump bud, your truck will be/feel stronger.

so far so good. I was drowning the motor so i moved the start psi back and it feels much better. cant wait ti mix 50/50

Good deal , probably better to only use it as much as needed and not overkill . Maybe if your were really hammering it in the dunes going up Oldsmobile . ;)

Doesnt that just make you want to go out .... hahahaha

I have the blocker installed. Went for a run yesterday and here are the results. From a 30-35 MPH roll, I laid the hammer and hit 1600 pretty quickly. Let off and looked down and was only up to 65 MPH.

I run level five now and I was mashed on this straight away from a roll of about ten MPH and was at 100 and was at about 1500(tow-haul and manual put to 5th gear for longer power hold up to 110mph)... Maybe get an intake? I know mine ran cooler after that.. It would bury the needle at 16 when I was on a dirty fuel filter.. Now on a brand new one and thats when it ran cooler. So probably getting more fuel.

You think its my fuel filter? Cheap fix I guess. I will have to change it with the oil this time.

I would change it and see what happens. I am waiting to get a lift pump and water-meth to help out soon... Then time for a trans. But see what happens if you do that.

I think you and I are at the same point on the shopping list. Lol.

Ha ha for sure from looking at our sigs... Just takes money and one thing at a time! Well for me at least

Besides the EGTs, you're gonna prob kill the tranny soon. Better start looking into that if you wanna keep the tuner turned up.

Your probably right. I dont drive like an idiot though. Pretty conservatively. Well see what happens.

You guys are lucky the later trucks trans is stronger than the 5 spd stock .

loaded ppe tune 4 on my lly 10 mins later limped it. havent with the lmm yet but it just takes a matter of time,heavy foot and me behind the wheel. hopefully with the transgo it will hold it together abit longer.

lets hope so .

I drive pretty conservative as well. Just have it on there for the douche riding my tail, needs some smoke.. Or just in case when that time comes to go against a fellow Powerchoke, Cummins, or fellow d-max whatever it is! I am saving my pennies! lol Or a awesome burnout thats always fun!!!

Good info John and Chad:thumb:

im kinda new to this but u guys think the ppe boost controller would help out hellrazr78?

im kinda new to this but u guys think the ppe boost controller would help out hellrazr78?

He already has the programmer so there's no reason for the boost controller.

just an idea, i noticed that LWATSON has both. if it works it might be the most cost effective way to lower his egt's. im considering it because my bully dog on extreme pegs the egt gauge also.

I just installed dual lift pumps. They definitely help keep rail pressure and make the level 6 perform like it is supposed to. Before the pumps it would fall flat on anything above level 4. As far as egt's, the PPE runs a little cooler now with the pumps. I keep mine on level 6 (350 hp), but I dont put it to the floor at every light either.

I just installed dual lift pumps. They definitely help keep rail pressure and make the level 6 perform like it is supposed to. Before the pumps it would fall flat on anything above level 4. As far as egt's, the PPE runs a little cooler now with the pumps. I keep mine on level 6 (350 hp), but I dont put it to the floor at every light either.

Dual lift pumps? Really?

Yes:rolleyes::p:

Yes:rolleyes::p:

Oh, IC that you're just talking about the TTS things.

Do I sense a little sarcasm from a Cali dude or a little smart assness?

Do I sense a little sarcasm from a Cali dude or a little smart assness?

To each their own, that's all.

Enlighten me, I am no expert.

Enlighten me, I am no expert.

I just don't care for the stuff.

When I add the lift pump my EGTs went up alil. Also if his probe is mabey mounted too deep wouldn't that give him a lil higher faults reading? Just throwing an possibility out there.

When I add the lift pump my EGTs went up alil. Also if his probe is mabey mounted too deep wouldn't that give him a lil higher faults reading? Just throwing an possibility out there.

Your EGTs went up cause you added fuel. More fuel = higher EGTs.

What lift pumps do you use?

dual lift pumps? and no its not CA sarcasm :rolleyes:

Here is a pic. Maybe some of you guys call them a two-stage lift pump assembly instead of dual lift pumps. What difference does it make? No pun intended :iamlost:

What lift pumps do you use?

I have the Airdog 150

The tune written with the fuel desired will make the fuel meant to be there ..... be there with a lift pump added . not run shy .

If you were running low on rail pressure it would be like being on a smaller tune , meaning less fuel less egt usually . EGT's and power are directly related . So theoretically your egts should get higher if you keep up with rail and make the HP the tune desired with the rail psi desired being kept up with .

Damn did that make sense .

? earlier about boost controller on truck with ppe tuner . Yes you can add it and alot of guys do . They just use it on smaller tunes usually to crank a bit more boost on grdes with controller . Usually on say tune 2 ppe , it is about 26 psi . So you juice it a hair on grades to help out some on high egts towing up grade . Now if you add it to race tune you wouldnt want to do that . The tune already has max psi in it and you would be over cranking it and make to much boost . You will also notice at cruise a difference when running the boost controller . It accelerate the vanes to move much quicker . Was originally meant for before you had boost in tunes . The tunes have it all in them now . I havnt run my boost controller for a few years no . I still have it bolted in ther , just disconnected . I noticed at cruise down freeway that with the contoller hooked up and turned all the way down , that it was 5 psi more no matter what , than what wass in tune with out it hooked up . So I disconnected it .

I hear guys that are doing this , but dont really advise unless only used for towing and adding a hair of boost . This 5 psi thing should be noticed also . Probably my guess , worse mileage with boost in tunes and usuing boost controller even turned all the way down in off position .

My advise , you dont need to ever run these stock turbos past 32 psi for most efficiant flow vs. restiction . I wouldnt ever crank them past 34 -36 with knob on a spike and fall back to 32 if your going to do it . Those are your psi #'s to stay below with controller added . You will see if you do , hold steady throttle on freeway turned way down and just turn switch on and off and you will see a automatic 5-6 psi . Thats what mine did also . So ck this if you try it . I would run flat ground with it off for mileage and only use when needed . also you can only turn the knob 1/8 to half for these boost #'s . Turn the knob past half way and everything goes wacking with it also .

I got the same results as you with my boost controller, mine is also unhooked. I would see 40+ psi with it off on level 6. The only time I use mine now is when I tow my fifthwheel. It works great on level 2 at about 65 mph my EGT's are around 1100*, with the controller turned up about 1/5-1/4 turn it adds about 5 psi cruising and my EGT's are 850-900. Set up like this I never go over 1000* even when accelerating up to speed or climbing a moderate grade. I guess what I'm trying to say is mine does nothing for me as far as performance, but it works very well for managing EGT's.

Im kind of a retard when it comes to lifting on the pedal . Almost to the top ..... just a little more ..... almost there .... egt's are off the gauge and unreadable with the crap I pull on mine .

Most would tell you I should have blown up 10 motors by now .

Johnny
.

I love this guy!!!! :cookoo:

I have to live with him .... :lol:

I have to live with him .... :lol:

:rotflmao:

From my experience EGT's go way up when you lose FRP. The tune tries to open the pulse even more to keep up with the demanded fuel. I was running into this at the track. I cant use my Race tune until my pump gets here. At WOT it will fall flat after 3rd gear and the EGT's skyrocket. I ran a 14.1 having to lift for every shift. When logged you can see the pulse open as FRP falls. I dont know if its just my tuning (duramaxtuner) that does this. But on my DD with a lower pulse, it wont fall flat and I turned a 12.98. The PPE on level 5 doesn't seem to do this. I think the pulse is only 2750, but it seems to come on way slower.

and your temps were ??

1800-1900 when it cuts out. 1500-1600 on a normal pass. When it loses FRP, the EGT's jump so fast the needle blurs :D
I got my lift pump on the way, so it should be fine this weekend. hoping for a 12.5

1800-1900 when it cuts out. 1500-1600 on a normal pass. When it loses FRP, the EGT's jump so fast the needle blurs :D
I got my lift pump on the way, so it should be fine this weekend. hoping for a 12.5
Good luck ! What brand lift pump did you get?

Thanks buddy!
PPE for now. Hopefully it will last.

1800-1900 when it cuts out. 1500-1600 on a normal pass. When it loses FRP, the EGT's jump so fast the needle blurs :D
I got my lift pump on the way, so it should be fine this weekend. hoping for a 12.5

Opposite of what I would have thought . I have 2 cp3's and dont run out of pressure . No lift pump . I have been experiencing what I thought to be to good to be true egts and thought i might be low on rail or needed a lift pump . Weird . Maybe I am off on this i guess .

1800-1900 when it cuts out. 1500-1600 on a normal pass. When it loses FRP, the EGT's jump so fast the needle blurs :D
I got my lift pump on the way, so it should be fine this weekend. hoping for a 12.5

I think you can get that 12.5 with the tune i made you. :)
your 200 or so lbs lighter than me. ;)

Opposite of what I would have thought . I have 2 cp3's and dont run out of pressure . No lift pump . I have been experiencing what I thought to be to good to be true egts and thought i might be low on rail or needed a lift pump . Weird . Maybe I am off on this i guess .

I think it may be how my tune is written. You shouldnt have low frp with 2 CP3s. I just got my lift pump on, so I'll see tomorrow. Should be able to keep up with the pulse now.

I' finally was able to run my truck with the PPE Level 6 no de-fuel between shifts.
I' haven't had time to put mylift pump in yet. But man I'have never seen such high
EGT'S 1700-1800.
Put my blocer plate in. Still enough smoke to make the roads a hazard behind me.....LoL.
If its not one things its another.
Only took 2 weeks on PPE Level4 and I smoked my tranny....
Gotta get the EGTS lower. thats too high.

With my hot+2 E.T. I can peg my gauge at 1600 degrees pretty easy. When i had low fuel pressure my egts were worse. When i fixed my low fuel pressure problem my egt's were cooler...

Good To Know. Hopefully when I get the lift pump in this week it will be better.

The lift pump helped alot as far as power goes. But Still running really hot. Anything I can do? OR I am just going to have to put twins on it......

The lift pump helped alot as far as power goes. But Still running really hot. Anything I can do? OR I am just going to have to put twins on it......

X2 I got higher EGTs after the lift pump too. Guess your choices now is water/meth, headers and up pipes, EFI or twins.:D

did you feel a difference in level 4 with the lift pump? Mine feels like it falls on its face after 3rd or so.

Level 6 with the lift pump. The truck halls some ASS. Throws some serious amounts of smoke as WEll

works for me. Lol. Comon transmission.

Im having the same issues with high EGT's . I installed the Labonte W/M had to use 2-m14's and a 10 waiting for another 14. Added another t- fitting to run all 3 spraying on WFO pulls and have primary shut off, brought down EGTs about 200-300. This is with PPE on level 5. Gonna thro in the blocker plate maybe this will help some too. At times it will still hit 1650 depends on when ya hammer it.

man i need to hook up my egt gauge on my new edge, i run my truck up till the mirrors start shaking my buddy on a sport bike said i was around 140-145 when i backed off. need to put my mirrors in next time! but i bet the egts where going crazy never had a egt gauge on all 3 duramax's it will be nice to see where their at! (not that im going to back off) lift pumps are a must!!!:)

Im having the same issues with high EGT's . I installed the Labonte W/M had to use 2-m14's and a 10 waiting for another 14. Added another t- fitting to run all 3 spraying on WFO pulls and have primary shut off, brought down EGTs about 200-300. This is with PPE on level 5. Gonna thro in the blocker plate maybe this will help some too. At times it will still hit 1650 depends on when ya hammer it.Def. do the blocker plate. My truck ran allot better after I blocked the EGR. Your boost will build faster and peak higher and you'll have less smoke.

I installed my blocker plate last night... It spools MUCH quicker and I can hold a much higher boost, instead of spiking it or hit it throughtout going WOT... And now there is barley any smoke on the 300 tune when it used to black out a 3 lane highway... Thats fine... It LIGHTS and TAKES off like a bat out of hell....

Def. do the blocker plate. My truck ran allot better after I blocked the EGR. Your boost will build faster and peak higher and you'll have less smoke.
Did the blocker plate and no difference in EGTS. Almost seemed worse :eek: maybe its the probe location. But it should keep the intake cleaner , what a mess when I took it off to install the w/m nozzles. Also noticed a bit quicker spool, the peak was the same at 36 WFO. Acording to the Labonte controler..Ic PPE has an update since mine and it looks like they have even more HP on the levels 5-6 now lol.

Did the blocker plate and no difference in EGTS. Almost seemed worse :eek: maybe its the probe location. But it should keep the intake cleaner , what a mess when I took it off to install the w/m nozzles. Also noticed a bit quicker spool, the peak was the same at 36 WFO. Acording to the Labonte controler..Ic PPE has an update since mine and it looks like they have even more HP on the levels 5-6 now lol.You may want to consider doing the pvc reroute also. The oil from the pvc mixes with the soot from the egr and makes mess in the intake.

You may want to consider doing the pvc reroute also. The oil from the pvc mixes with the soot from the egr and makes mess in the intake.

What kinda EGT's are you running with your current setup?