I am in the market to purchase a 2009 Duramax. By reading some posts, I get the feeling due to EPA regulations, some would prefer an older truck. Talking to GM mechanics, they say to get a 2007 or newer model truck for overall fit, finish and reliability. My question is should I be looking at a 2009 or would an older truck be better? This will be my first diesel. I currently drive a gas GMC with a 5.0L engine and put 10K to 15K miles per year on the truck. I will be pulling a 9,000 pound trailer occasionaly, hunting, fishing, as well as commuting to work.

It really depends upon what you want. I like the new body style and currently have a 2008. The main drawback with anything over 2007.5 is that the diesel has a DPF which hurts the fuel economy. The motor burns cleaner if that is important to you, but you lose about 2MPG. If you only drive about 15,000 miles per year, 2 more or less MPG is not going to mean that much as you are only talking about 180 Gallons difference. Over a whole year that is not much so get what you like. 9000# will be nothing for a Duramax to pull. Look at new and used and find one that suits your needs. Prices are really reduced right now on new and used. Good Luck.

Get the 2007.5 or newer, you will not regret it. I have 65k on mine, and have yet to have any problems with the DPF. In fact, the only repair I have done at all was the EGR valve at about 6k, but it sounds like that was corrected with the 2008 models as noone has mentioned that problem since the 08 came out. I have left mine stock, but even then, you will have plenty of performance with the LMM and 6 speed Allison.

Define "occasionally" and distance and terrain.

I bought to pull my 8k boat several times a year over 500 mi streches 5 times a year and some shorter pulls for 3-5k tow miles total per year.

Dmax does have more power while towing but the new gassers are pretty stout too. Maint cost is double a gasser between oil and fuel even at extended intervals and there are extra headaches like gelling, adding suppliments (I run suppliments year round, see other discussions)
Depending on the markets , over the last several years Diesel fuel has been more than gas combined with the affore mentioned emmissions (DPF) has killed the non-towing fuel MPG advantage of diesel.

One thing that drew me to the D-max was the weak tow ratings on the gasser. I have since found you can simply get a heavier hitch for $300-400 and rating is solved. If you are 9k, non-weight distributing, you should get the heavier hitch anyway as the stock is only rated to 7500 on the d-max :mad:

9k on of a gasser is up there but very doable (2500 SB max recomended 10k w/ 3.73 rear, dont get the 4.10 if it is your daily driver, your mpg will suck enough you may want to look at a diesel)
IMO, knowing what I know now, I would take a much more serious look at a gasser.
I dont have diesel smoke in my eyes like some, just calling it like I see it.

Prices have not been this good on trucks since America started its love affair with the SUV and truck 15yrs ago and the mfg started increasing their margins. New is great if you like new, Used is depressed as well since the New is going so cheap.

Chargeit, by occasionally I mean 10% to 20% of my total mileage is pulling my 9000# trailer (1500 to 3000 miles). Where I live there are many hills, and the problem I have with my GMC with a 305 is on the hills my speed drops down to 30 MPH. It doesn't have the power to maintain the speed. Also I worry about the strain on the engine and transmission. My truck is not built to handle those loads. When I run empty I am getting around 20 MPG, and it drops to around 10MPG when pulling the trailer. As for getting a new gasser, I was told the 2500HD with the 6.0L gas engine only gets 6 to 10 MPG.

When towing, you'll see better mileage with the diesel as compared to the gasser. I think you would be ok with a 2009 model year, but 2010 is when Big Brother puts the emmisions severely in place. It all depends on what you want. If you like the looks of the older Duramax's get one of them. If you like the New Body Style get one of those. I love mine...and I'm in a part of the country that probably won't give two shits about whether I keep my DPF on or not...I'm just waiting until my warranty runs out.

Get the LMM

last time I checked my dealer (Century Buick,Pontiac,GMC) here in Tampa FL still had 2 brand new 2007.5 LMM on the lot. I bet you can get those dirt cheap. Might be worth looking into.

Chargeit, by occasionally I mean 10% to 20% of my total mileage is pulling my 9000# trailer (1500 to 3000 miles). Where I live there are many hills, and the problem I have with my GMC with a 305 is on the hills my speed drops down to 30 MPH. It doesn't have the power to maintain the speed. Also I worry about the strain on the engine and transmission. My truck is not built to handle those loads. When I run empty I am getting around 20 MPG, and it drops to around 10MPG when pulling the trailer. As for getting a new gasser, I was told the 2500HD with the 6.0L gas engine only gets 6 to 10 MPG.

Only when towing. 6-speed plus vvt and 3.73 helps keep economy in upper teens on hwy unless you're gunning it. 6.0 has plenty of power, but obviously won't tow 12k up grades as easy as a duramax.

I went gas as I've read too many horror stories about dpf clogs/cracks/regen issues when not working the 08+ diesels with heavy towing. They are not suited as daily drivers with numerous short trips running empty. Shame, as I had to end a long history of driving diesels thanks to the EPA.

I've had 3 DuraMax trucks, an LB7, an LLY, and now an LMM.

Loved them all, but the LMM is definitely the strongest of the three. Also the current body style (07.5 and later) is much better in terms of lack of rattles, fit and finish.

I have an LMM and I love it, but I also took the dpf off and blocked the egr off and rerouted the pvc, but I am also not worried about a warranty, I just like the look of the NBS style trucks

I've had 3 DuraMax trucks, an LB7, an LLY, and now an LMM.

Loved them all, but the LMM is definitely the strongest of the three. Also the current body style (07.5 and later) is much better in terms of lack of rattles, fit and finish.

no rattles on my 04 LB7. but, i have talked to a bunch of nbs owners with rattles. gm has a tsb on them.

Get the LMM

x2

I have had 3 of the old body style and love my LMM better than all of the others. More comfortable and runs great. I did mod the older ones but am going to leave this one alone for now runs good enough for me and I do not believe my mileage is much if any different.

I think you will see a huge tow power difference from an old 5.0 to the new 6.0. You dont say what year your current truck is but looking around the best figure I can find is a max of 230 hp and 300 f/lbs torque.
Compare those to the new 6.0 at 360 hp and 380 f/lbs.
You are talking a 150% hp and 128% torque increase!!!!

The dealers are so desperate to move trucks, borrow one for the weekend and see what you think. A 100 mi round trip tow will tell you a lot.

My real world comparison would be, my dad's old 91' Ford 5.0 TBI which was a dog.
I previously pulled my 8k with a 94 Suburban 350 TBI, it got the job done but like you experienced, would get drug down to 40's on a good hill climb.
Pulled the same boat loaded with a buddy's '05 chev with 300 hp, 360 torque and a 4.10 rear. It pulled well, milage was 9ish.
Another 1000 mi pull from KC to Austin with an 06 F-150 at 7.5k was not a prob either but u did know it was back there. 9ish mpg
My d-max pulls like a beast, breaking the tires loose fully loaded as one might expect with a light tune pushing me an estimated 400+hp and 700+torque.

If variable costs are the decision point the math is pretty easy.
9 gas vs 12 mpg dmax --- 10-20%
19 vs 19mpg --- 80-90% (not starting a mpg war, just putting a realistic est to gm's 21 mpg gas claim and an averge to generous experience of d-max)
Again, add a typical +10% cost diff for diesel fuel, twice+ the maint cost and a 50% ROI for the up front cost of the deisel engine when you go to sell and I dont see where the expense can be justified on economies alone

Sounds like you have your heart set, I pretty much did too, just giving you what you prob dont want to see.

You didnt answer my tongue vs weight distributing trailer so my guess is it is not weight distributing and you should prob budget for a heavy duty hitch like the Draw-tite Titian.
I know I got away with my Suburban at 6.5k on my 8k boat but......

To answer your original question dont wait for 2010 if you are set on a diesel.
The LMM is a little tighter interior but weaker sheetmetal (pound on the rear fender of both).
LBZ doe not have the emissions constraints but is a little dirtier smelling as an older style diesel will be.

My current truck is a 97 GMC with a 5.0L engine. I don't have my heart set on a diesel. Until now, everyone I taked to said to go diesel. The main problem with my current truck is the lack of power when towing my 9000# trailer, and love the idea of the diesel power for towing. I just found this website (and glad I did). I posted to get knowledgable advice before making my purchase. The one point that was brought up is that 80% of my driving will be city commuting (short trips). Correct me if I am wrong, but from what I am reading, these short trips will be very hard on the diesel.

Also, I have a top of the line Draw Tight weight distribution hitch with a sway control mechanism built in for towing my trailer.

Thanks for all your advice.

The short trips can be if you have the DPF.... if you don't drive enough highway it wont regenerate as often and you will get crappy gas mileage. If you drive enough highway (or ~20min trips @ 35mph or above) this wont be a problem. I took my DPF off and I love my truck. I'm in a rental dmax right now and I forgot how much power these trucks have even at stock. This one has a DPF and it's fine. I've had it for a week so far and no issues. I'll be in it another week here but I don't expect any issues...

The diesel will be more expensive, but if you can afford it I would do it. You wont ever have a doubt that you will make it up that hill... if you get a '07.5-'09 duramax pull off the DPF and you'll love the truck even more. They're great stock but I'm glad I pulled mine off... I've seen 23-26mpg highway with my truck :D

How much work is involved in pulling off the DPF and what warranty issues will there be?

Theres a lot of info... search through the forums... I know in the exhaust forum there is a long thread about DPF related stuff.

The quick run down... Not much work involved pulling it off... you swap the exhaust and the rest is a matter of plugging in a programmer and following the instructions. You can go big and have more customization with EFI-Live or just buy a box and hit "flash" or whatever.

Warranty... it can void it... but it wont automatically void it.... the big factor is how your dealer feels about mods. I've been to two different dealers to have warranty work done and neither gave me any crap about having my mods done. If I remember correctly I even took it in with a tune on it. I got comments from all the guys in the shop for how they liked my exhaust...

Your dealer might not be the same way... but it is possible that they could void the warranty.

With this being my first diesel and coming from a gasser...I say buy it! I don't feel like you will regret buying one even with all the new emissions crap on them. As someone else already stated, you can drop the DPF if you wish to do so, especially if you're dealer is alright with that.

I have an '08 LMM, and I love it. I traded in Colorado for it. Talk about an upgrade! As far as the fuel mileage goes, I was getting on average 12 mpg with it and 15 to 16 mixed city/highway (about 18-20 highway) with D'max. So even with the cost of diesel, it is cheaper to run the D'max truck (not counting maintenance and payment).

Buy the truck you want that meets your needs. The DPF (short trips will definitely kill MPG if in regen, cold doesn't help either) is real heart-burn for some, but I have not had any issues with mine as of yet. And if you are looking to do a lot of mods, you might end up voiding your warranty, so another factor you should consider.

Probably the one bad/good thing is that there is so much computer control, that sometimes things just go nuts.

Whether old or new, they all have some issue.

Have you test driven an LMM, Yet?

If so, you probably have your answer.

I had to order my '09 2500HD - supposed to be here in 6-10 weeks.

And don't think that diesel is going to stay around 2.30 /gal either. It may be double that by the end of this year if OPEC has their way. And if Obama has his way, he's gonna put a "carbon" tax on everyone, drive our economy to zero, and we'll all die broke - So I say, Go For It ! :saluteusa:

PS: Sorry to get off subject

9K lb boat shouldn't get you down to 6 MPG unless your flogging it. Go to Pickuptrucks.com and see if you can still read their "Heavy Duty Shootout". The 6.0L GM in certain tests smoked the Ford V-10. The six speed trans really woke that motor up. You could even stick with a 3.73 but a 4.10 would keep the trans from shifting as much on hills.

When the economy returns diesel will go sky high again. Other countries use a lot of diesel and that is that.

Bottom line if you are looking for the "perfect tow" then diesel gets the nod hands down. If you had a 5'er then I say go diesel but with the boat which has a lower profile and weighs only 9K then the gas would do it. Never would I think of towing 9K though with anything that is 1/2 ton. Motor has no guts, nor does the trans and nor do the brakes. Definetely go 3/4 ton and that alone will make you feel better.

If you go with the diesel leave it stock until warranty runs out. Lot of folks here mod to go fast and no diesel motor ever coming out of a factory was designed to go fast. They were designed to pull and pull they do. If you compare an '06 and up Dmax with an '05 it infact has a 60HP tune with the warranty fully intact? What more could you ask for?

9K lb boat shouldn't get you down to 6 MPG unless your flogging it. Go to Pickuptrucks.com and see if you can still read their "Heavy Duty Shootout". The 6.0L GM in certain tests smoked the Ford V-10. The six speed trans really woke that motor up. You could even stick with a 3.73 but a 4.10 would keep the trans from shifting as much on hills.

When the economy returns diesel will go sky high again. Other countries use a lot of diesel and that is that.

Bottom line if you are looking for the "perfect tow" then diesel gets the nod hands down. If you had a 5'er then I say go diesel but with the boat which has a lower profile and weighs only 9K then the gas would do it. Never would I think of towing 9K though with anything that is 1/2 ton. Motor has no guts, nor does the trans and nor do the brakes. Definetely go 3/4 ton and that alone will make you feel better.

If you go with the diesel leave it stock until warranty runs out. Lot of folks here mod to go fast and no diesel motor ever coming out of a factory was designed to go fast. They were designed to pull and pull they do. If you compare an '06 and up Dmax with an '05 it infact has a 60HP tune with the warranty fully intact? What more could you ask for?

Great post. Here's the link:

http://www.pickuptrucks.com/html/2007/shootout/hdshootout1.html

The big diesels are happiest when worked and can get temperamental if not.

Don't let anyone frighten you away from a diesel by telling you that they have to be worked. I have a 08 LMM an mainly use it for commuting to work and short trips to town (5 mi round trip). I have not had any problems. I can see where long idling could cause a problem with the dpf. But just shut it off instead of idling. You also need to drive it far enough at least once per tank full to regen the dpf. You do not, however, need to "work" it. It is an awesome truck when you do work it, but also a very capable commuter. Not to mention the LTZ is like ridiing in a Cadillac (just not quite as smooth).