Went to pull off the interstate on a trip and the trans shifted down quite hard and the ses light came on. Went into limp so we stopped and took a look. Oil was leaking out the center housing btw the trans and trans case. Seems I had a u-joint that was siezed and the vibration cracked the center support. We are stuck so I limped to a dealer and he replaced the support for the sum of $2500. I could accept that if it was fixed but the trans still is in limp mode, the dealer didn't have a clue about the code 1711, and we are still stuck in a hotel. I bailed the truck out of the dealer, talked to Joe at suncoast, which I should have done in the first place, but we need a shop that will fix the problem with out any crap and quickly. I don't have access to a shop or tools or a spare vehicle here so I was wondering if any one knows of a place in the Fargo ND area that could help. I have a couple of leads to check out tomorrow but any help would be invaluable. Thanks, Doug

Allison LCT1000 DTC P1711, P0872 After Completing Repairs - kw automatic GMT800 harsh hard intermittent leak noise repeat shift #PIP3059 - (Jul 9, 2004)

Allison LCT1000 DTC P1711, P0872 After Completing Repairs

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The following diagnosis might be helpful if the vehicle exhibits the described symptoms in the PI.

Condition/Concern:

Code P0872 or P1711 setting soon after a transmission repair. Generally, the vehicle did not exhibit the code prior to the transmission repair.

Recommendation/Instructions:

Investigation into DTC P1711/P0872 has shown that in most cases trucks that set this code have had a cracked transmission adapter housing. Bulletin 03-07-30-031 contains details on the adapter housing repair. Cracks in the adapter housing can allow dirt and sand to enter the transmission resulting in stuck shift valves in the valve body. To reduce the possibility of setting a DTC P1711/P0872 when repairing a cracked adapter housing, the following five steps should taken:

<LI type=1>Clean the transmission oil pan thoroughly inside and out. <LI type=1>Replace the fluid filter located inside the oil pan (P/N 29537965). <LI type=1>Replace the spin-on fluid filter (P/N 29539579). <LI type=1>Thoroughly flush the transmission cooler and lines using TransFlow tool J 45096.
Be sure that the transmission fluid is refilled to put the oil level in the "cold" range with the engine running and the transmission in park. Do not shift from park into a forward or reverse range until the oil is in this "cold" range.
By reducing the amount of dirt and sand inside the transmission, the chances of setting this DTC will be greatly reduced. The following checks help in determining the if shift valve "E" is stuck in the bore or shift valve "C" has a oversize bore or if the condition is related to the wiring.

Cycle the ignition key to the run position with the engine off, the TFP (Transmission Fluid Pressure) switches "C" "D" and "E" should all read OFF on the Tech II scan tool. Upon starting the engine the TFP switches "C" "D" and "E"should change from OFF to ON The above 2 steps indicate that the TFP switch, wiring and TCM are functioning properly Once the transmission reaches a Steady State first (1st) gear the TFP switches should read"C" OFF "D" ON "E" OFF, if "E" does NOT change to OFF once the transmission has reached a steady state first (1st) gear the "E" shift valve may be stuck in the bore or the "C" shift valve is loose in the bore causing a bleed action to the "E" valve. This will force the "E" valve into the ON position once this occurs DTC P1711 or P0872 will set after 2 seconds. The valve body assembly should be checked for a stuck valve and rear cover should be replaced (if cracked) as required for this condition. The valve body should be torqued to 100 inch pounds. Over torquing the Transmission Fluid Pressure Switch (TFP) may result in shorting out the TFP and setting DTC P1711 or P0872.

If the "E" switch changes to OFF, the condition may be intermittent and the DTC flow chart should be followed to see if another condition can be found for the DTC P1711 or P0872.

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Please follow this diagnosis process thoroughly and complete each step. If the condition exhibited is resolved without completing every step, the remaining steps do not need to be performed. If these steps do not resolve the condition, please contact GM TAC for further diagnostic assistance.

Models:

(01 - 05 Chevrolet Silverado) and (01 - 05 GMC Sierra) )

Wow, is that bang on or what!

Thats, exactly what I was looking for. You would think a GM dealer would have access to that bulletin! If I read correctly, the valve body will have to come down for an inspection and a cleaning. The dealer pulled the trans, dissassembled the trans from the pump back and changed that support plate. They never even took the pan of the trans. Could have quite easily got dirt into the trans and left it there. Thanks a lot for the info. Doug

We have some techs here that kick a$$. :ro)

Could also be as simple as this:

Over torquing the Transmission Fluid Pressure Switch (TFP) may result in shorting out the TFP and setting DTC P1711 or P0872.

Can you also post this TSB? 03-07-30-031 Since it also pertains to him.

Where is the TFP switch located? They told me that they never had the oil pan off, not sure if that is true but i do know it was never cleaned up. I guess I would hav e to cover all the bases since I don't exactly know what was done.

If it is the same 'pressure switch' as I am looking at in my manual, it is located on the valve body.

A switch was replaced. No descrip. Part #97365821 The work order says the trans was removed to install torque conv updates. To my knowledge the torque was working fine, the cracked rear housing however was not. I was told that the trans had to be removed to replace the rear housing. Joe from suncoast said that was not true. I have rebuilt many transmissions but have never even seen a breakdown of the Allison. I guess live and learn.

Stick around, I'll see if i can look up the part #

It looks like the GM and Allison #'s are different, sorry I can't help.

GM PART # 97365821
CATEGORY: All
PACK QTY: 1 CORE CHARGE: $0.00
GM LIST: $105.61
OUR PRICE: $60.20
DESCRIPTION: SWITCH

Transmission Leaks, Slips, Vehicle Will Not Move (Replace Rear Extension Housing, Change Torque Covnertor Relief Spring/Lube Regulator Spring, Diagnose/Repair Driveline Imbalance) #03-07-30-031C - (Aug 2, 2004)

Transmission Leaks, Slips, Vehicle Will Not Move (Replace Rear Extension Housing, Change Torque Convertor Relief Spring/Lube Regulator Spring, Diagnose/Repair Driveline Imbalance) 2001-2004 Chevrolet Silverado 2500/3500 Series Pickup Models (4WD Only)

2001-2004 GMC Sierra 2500/3500 Series Pickup Models (4WD Only)

with Allisonฎ 1000 Series Automatic Transmission (RPO M74)

This bulletin is being revised to add a Lube Regulator Valve Transmission Serial Number Breakpoint and clarify the proper installation of the lube regulator valve. Please discard Corporate Bulletin Number 03-07-30-031B (Section 07 - Transmission/Transaxle).

Condition

Some customers may comment that the transmission leaks from the rear, slips, or the vehicle may not move.

Cause

This condition may be the result of a cracked extension housing caused by a driveline imbalance. Driveline imbalance may be caused by any of the following components. This is not an exhaustive list and other conditions that are not noted here may be found on vehicles.

<TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> • </TD><TD vAlign=top>Damaged or worn U-Joints (inspect both front and rear driveshafts). </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> • </TD><TD vAlign=top>A front or rear driveshaft that is out of balance due to the following conditions: </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> - </TD><TD vAlign=top>Foreign material stuck on the front or rear driveshaft (mud, concrete, tar, etc.). Nothing should be on the driveshaft. It must be clean. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> - </TD><TD vAlign=top>A damaged front or rear driveshaft (bent, dented, etc.). </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> - </TD><TD vAlign=top>Foreign material that affects the motion of the U-Joints. All of the U-joints must be free to move within their full range of motion. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> - </TD><TD vAlign=top>Balance weights missing from a front or rear driveshaft. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> • </TD><TD vAlign=top>For additional Items that affect driveline imbalance, refer to Corporate Bulletin Number 02-07-30-024, Diagnosis of Cracked or Broken Transmission Case, and the Vibration Diagnosis and Correction sub-section of SI. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
Correction

Use the service procedure below to replace the rear extension housing (steps 1-42 & 86-101) and to access and change the torque converter relief spring and lube regulator spring in the front support assembly (steps 43-85). The converter relief and lube regulator springs are being changed to reduce the possibility of setting multiple DTCs or experiencing a delayed engagement on the first start-up after sitting unused for an extended period of time. The converter relief and lube regulator springs are used in 2004 production and do not require changing on 2004 modelsbuilt prior to Indianapolis Plant Serial Number 6310234829, Baltimore Plant Serial Number 6320154492 and Remanufactured Transmission Serial Number 9620011913 .



Notice: Do not attempt to replace the transmission extension housing with the transmission in the vehicle. Several internal components are held in place by the housing and they will come out of alignment during reassembly. Attempting to do so will result in the following conditions: <TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> • </TD><TD vAlign=top>Displacement of eighteen (18) clutch springs </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> • </TD><TD vAlign=top>Damage to C5 clutch plates </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> • </TD><TD vAlign=top>Damage to P2 & P3 thrust bearings </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> • </TD><TD vAlign=top>Improper transmission end play </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> • </TD><TD vAlign=top>Shop comebacks </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>


Notice: Failure to diagnose and repair the cause of the driveline imbalance may result in a repeat cracked extension housing.



Important: When performing this repair, the following steps must be taken to reduce the possibility of setting a DTC P0872 after the repair.
<TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> • </TD><TD vAlign=top>Clean the transmission oil pan thoroughly. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> • </TD><TD vAlign=top>Replace the fluid filter located in the oil pan with P/N 29537965. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> • </TD><TD vAlign=top>Replace the spin-on fluid filter with P/N 29539579. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> • </TD><TD vAlign=top>Flush the transmission oil cooler and lines using J 45096. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
<TABLE border=0><TBODY><TR><TD vAlign=top> • </TD><TD vAlign=top>When the transmission is refilled, make sure that the oil level is in the "cold" range with the engine running and the transmission in Park. Do not shift from Park into a forward or reverse range until the oil is in this "cold" range. </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>


Important: After completing this modification, the transmission control module (TCM) shift adapts must be relearned for proper transmission operation. For MY 2001 using the Tech 2ฎ, select Special Functions (F2), Transmission Output Controls (F1), Preset All Tap Cells, Disconnect the Tech 2ฎ. This action will reset all clutch adaptives and requires the vehicle to be driven. For MYs 2002-2004, follow the procedure outlined in Corporate Bulletin Number 02-07-30-032 to quickly relearn the transmission shift adapts.

A switch was replaced. No descrip. Part #97365821 The work order says the trans was removed to install torque conv updates. To my knowledge the torque was working fine, the cracked rear housing however was not. I was told that the trans had to be removed to replace the rear housing. Joe from suncoast said that was not true. I have rebuilt many transmissions but have never even seen a breakdown of the Allison. I guess live and learn.The switch is probably the NSBU. If you look at it it should be brown if it's a new one. The converter updates should be done whenever the trans is removed for work. It will prevent the drainback issue. As for removing the trans to replace the rear housing, it is required by GM and Allison. I don't doubt Suncoast can do it in the truck without a problem but it is very risky because the bearings between the planetaries can fall off center and will cause serious damage if reassembled that way.

Thanks GMCSID. I got the truck into an Allison shop this morning and they backed up the removal of trans to do that support. The tech removed the valve body and the E shift valve was stuck with some kind of grit. It was cleaned and polished and put back together. They changed both filters and said the trans looked to be in good shape. They weren't too happy about the edge juice and said to be careful with it. All back together and it works fine. They got me in at 7:00am and done by 10:30. Very professional and knowledgable. Would recomend Interstate Powersystems to any one who ends up in trouble with Allison in the area. Thanks for all the help we are a couple days late but still heading to Michigan for our camper. Thanks to this site and the knowlege of the techs, we are continuing with our holiday instead of heading home. Greatly appreciated. Doug

Glad all is well now. Too bad you had to dish out $2500.00. It's times like this that makes you wish you bought the extended warranty.

ETA: How common of an issue is this? I had some issues during and after towing my trailer the first time when it was empty... Fluid leaking from the tailshaft (during and after) and a few range inhibiteds after the first time. Didn't have a lick of trouble towing the trailer the second time MUCH heavier (loaded). The rear seal is still damp with fluid. Tech couldn't see anything wrong, though.

Glad all is well now. Too bad you had to dish out $2500.00. It's times like this that makes you wish you bought the extended warranty. Depending on his mileage, he could be out of it already even if he did... If I still lived and worked on Long Island, I would probably have close to 60K on it and it's not quite a year old!

Rear housing can be done with the trans hanging, but by the time you get done dicken with it, the trans is out anyways.

Biggest risk is having the spacer between the P2 and P3 sungear slip out and you wont be able to line it up very well, and likely not with the oil hole lined up.

I don't mean to hijak the thread, but I have a question for dmaxallitech, MikeL, or one of the other Allison experts. If you fry the Allison (one too many boosted launches or whatever), and it won't move when you put it in drive, what gears would you be able to get the truck moving in assuming you have a Tech2 or something else that will interface with the ECM/TCM and command gears?

Cougar 281

That is a loaded question. There are many ways the TCM will go into limp depending how severe the damage done. If the C1 are totaly gone, you will not go forward. Usually the Ally will default to the next lowest gear from the one that defaulted. The Ally can limp to nuetral under certain circumstances. I have had that happen on a road test and without proper scanner you are stuck. Usually shutting engine off for a few seconds will reboot the TCM and you can get on with it. I cleared the code and all was fine. Never did find out why it happened. Usually the C2 and C3 will slip and cause a limp. For the guys that don't know what a limp is; Limp-Home mode is a program the TCM ( transmission contro; module ) falls back on when the TCM sees a problem that it feels needs attension. It usually confines you to one gear only.( meant to get your attension and to a repair facility)
mike

We made it to Muskegon MI. Truck preformed very well. Tomorrow we will hook up a Cougar 281 to it and tow back to Manitoba. Little nervous about the truck after the trans problem. I think from now on I will change U-Joints as a maintenance item. I would suggest to any one to take a close look at your U-Joints. I couldn't feel a vibration in mine but the front one was finished. The vibration comes on so gradual , that with a 2500HD on the roads I drive, I couldn't feel a thing.

After over an hour of searching (I searched before posting the Q, then finally just found it), I found the thread (http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=26677&page=4&pp=10&highlight=tech+allison+interstate) (post #36) I was looking for where I thought I saw of someone getting the truck to move after cooking the C1's. According to Mackin, you can get it to go (again, assuming you have a Tech2 or something else with a bidirectional interface to the ECM/TCM) after frying the C1's. Obviously, if you just put it in drive, it won't go, but (according to Mackin) if you command a higher gear it will.

You're probably reading this asking "Why the heck is he asking this dumb question?". The reason is, I'm sure I'm going to fry something (C1 or otherwise). Weather it's before or after I get a Juice or predator, I don't know, but I have a Non-GM extended warranty, which says http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/images/smilies/blahblah.gifin the event of a failure, get your vehicle to a "Licensed repair facility" http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/images/smilies/blahblah.gif. Someone else here posted that when his Allison puked at 36,600, he had you (I think) install a SC III and the warranty company (non GM, I assume) paid for it. When my time comes, I would like to do the same thing and get my truck to Eric for a Stage IV (assuming he's (Merchant Automotive) a "Licensed reapir facility"). Problem is, if it happens and I can't get it to move period, I won't be able to get it to him unless I had "planned it".

I have the Ease Simulation PC Based OBDII scan tool, which assuming the version that supports my truck has bi-directional controls when it's released, I will have a lot of the Tech2 functionality (not all, obviusly) including the ability to command a specific gear. The version I have now which does not support my 04 (only supports to 01) had bidirectional contols that worked on my '97 Silverado (EGR, engine speed, transmission gear command, etc).

Sorry to hijack your thread MaxOD, but no one would answer my question when I asked it one time before.

If you fry your C1 clutch you are finished as far as forward movement goes. If you damaged C1 and limped the trans, and there is a little life left in them, then yes clearing the code will get you going. It depends on the extent of the damage.

I had absolutely NO forward motion in my truck matter of fact I was towed to a destination.Didn't have a Tech II

If you have 4 wheel drive and a Tech II (both a must) it "maybe" possible to get a truck with C1 fried,fried to were you have made soup bowls out of your steels,been there done that.Helps to have a co-pilot as in passenger,although a "tech" did this alone.

You must use 4 lo, this isn't for the timid. Once rolling you have to use Tech II to command shifts getting into 5 (Overdrive) off the C1's ASAP like real soon. ;)

Once your on the interstate use cruise so there are no downshifts,you'd never know your tranny is broke!


Then it's home sweet home bound!