The good
A short time after the injectors were replaced under warranty, I took a 500 mile trip to Arizona and the new injectors provided a substantial boost in fuel economy. But, the glory of having a good running truck would soon turn to dread.

The bad
Days after I returned from Arizona I started my truck to go to work when the engine immediately began surging ever so slightly; it has never done this before. After a minute or two the surging seemed to subside slightly and I left for work. Two blocks later my truck was blowing heavy smoke and darkening the skies with a cloud that reeked with the putrid stench of baked motor oil.
Important note: Before taking my truck to the dealer to have the injectors replaced. I recently returned from a 2,000 mile trip pulling my tiny little trailer, or big heavy trailer, depending on who you talk to. During the trip the injectors seemed to be getting much worse, the truck was smoking significantly and EGT’s were dreadfully high while ascending hills; it was actually a little difficult to keep my EGT below 1,200 degrees on hills, and between down-shifts the EGT's could climb to well over 1,300 degrees.

The ugly
$11,600.00 MOTOR!!! The Dealer said cylinder eight was dead, and my only option was to buy a new motor from Chevrolet because the truck is out of warranty. I recently contacted Chevrolet and opened up a case with customer support and they called me back two day later to say that I’m out of luck and on my own.

The motor
I towed my truck 60 miles to a good and highly recommended Duramax mechanic who pulled the motor and tore it down for inspection. Upon inspection the overall condition of the motor was very good… an easy 8 on a scale of 1-10. The failure was isolated cylinder #8 where the piston had a clean fracture from front to back (across the wrist pin).



A penny for your thoughts; I have a 2004 Duramax LB7 with 117,000 miles and the dealer replaced five failed injectors at roughly 96,000 miles and then replaced all eight injectors a little more than a year later at 117,000 miles. Then the motor went south!

Yes, injector failures can cause piston failures. Sounds like you got the shaft from one of GM's known problems. Sorry about the luck.

Read this post. Very similar. Been going on for a while.

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=244397

Did you ever notice the engine resisting starting or a knock in the first crank?

WOW... good link! It looks like this is not an unusual failure. Steve’s post has a lot of info and he appears to have a real passion for justice. I've read all the way to page 20 and will finish the rest of the reading later. I've already spoken to an attorney and will go after Chevrolet as soon as I get all my ducks lined up in a row. I'm also planning on contacting Steve for his recommendation on how to best proceed.

Did you ever notice the engine resisting starting or a knock in the first crank?
No I never noticed any issues with the cylinder experiencing hydraulic lock. If it did happen I must not have been paying attention.

Sorry to hear about your bad luck. I wish we all could get to the bottom of this injector/piston failure. Are you running a stock truck?

^^^^im curious to know too...

Good luck.......but bad time to sue. I also have similar experience with faulty work from the dealer.

Let us know what happens.

Sorry to hear about your bad luck. I wish we all could get to the bottom of this injector/piston failure. Are you running a stock truck?
My engine is stock; I’ve only added hard parts like the Nicktane 2 micron fuel pre-filter (improves fuel filtering capacity aiding the stock filter), exhaust (lower EGT’s & improved fuel economy), exhaust brake (safety), larger transmission cooler (durability), larger capacity transmission and diff covers (cooling & durability), cold air intake (lower EGT’s & improved fuel economy), pyrometer (motor safety), billet tie rod sleeves (durability), ladder bars (stops rear spring wrap-up and tire/wheel shudder when off road), etc...

What I’m trying to say is this; the changes I made are directed at the week links of the truck and for safety/durability while pulling heavy loads. What’s broke here is GM! GM refused to warranty my motor when they know that failed injectors are causing pistons to fail in the LB7 motors. GM even admits to this in their own tech bulletin… the very bulletin the dealer gave me a copy of! So what’s really broken? I’d say that GM is broken as they failed to warranty motors (not just mine) when they know they have a problem.

The point; nothing I changed would cause a single injector to fail, and the injector failure is what broke my motor. I'll see if I can figure out how to list my trucks modifications under my user profile. Any suggestions on how to do that would be appreciated.

Good luck.......but bad time to sue. I also have similar experience with faulty work from the dealer.

Let us know what happens.
what makes you say it "faulty work" from the dealer if in fact its a know problem with the parts???

My engine is basically stock, most of what I’ve modified is intended to increase mileage and long term durability under heavy use, I guess I failed in the reliability department… or should I say that GM/Chevrolet failed to hold up to my expectations. I'll see if I can figure out how to list my trucks modifications under my user profile. Any suggestions on how to do that would be appreciated.
Go to "Quick Links" in the tool bar above. Then click on "Edit Signature" in the drop down window. Then add all you info into there...

"Quick Links" done... Thanks!

Duramax engine failure update:
I’m attaching a picture of the broken piston for anyone interested. The piston fractured down the middle and along the wristpin with no hole; it split into two pieces with only the cylinder holding things together. So far this is the only damage we've discovered and the rest of the motor looks amazingly good for one with 117,000 miles on it. To get things started on the rebuild, I’ve contacted two of the most knowledgeable individual I know to help me bring new life into the tired engine (Steve at TTS and John at DPS). I firmly believe that you must build a motor to safely handle 800 hp if you want it to run reliably at half that... so can you guess what I'm planning?

I spoke to Steve Cole at TTS last week, when my new pistons arrived, and we decided to ship them back out for the TTS "Black Magic" anodizing. My new Billet rods are ready, and the head work should begin next week after the motor disassembly is complete. Also, the final documentation and pictures on the condition of the entire motor and piston failure should be finished around the end of December. The current estimate on this rebuild is a little over $15,000.00 with all the hard parts, engine balancing, labor, etc. OUCH! What can I say but, I… I'm speechless!

Oh well… it’s my hope that at the very minimum, I will have a rock solid reliable motor when everything is said and done.

I’ll continue providing updates as we prepare to breathe new life into an old LB7 Duramax.

Daniel

UPDATE!!!

GM Lawsuit:
I’ve decided to go after GM with an attorney (Andrew) by my side, but I am reluctant to start the case because if GM files chapter 11, my hopes will get flushed along with all the other lawsuits currently in the works. Also, I’ve been following a similar issue posted by Speedpro1, called “Blown Engine!!!!”. Speed is deep into this whole broken piston issue with GM and has provided some good advice that I’ve been following. I also received the mechanics write up on the engine failure and am saving all of my old parts for evidence; saving the old parts / being unable to reuse the old parts has driven up my rebuild costs substantially, but it’s all part of the process and unlike Speed who’s had his truck in the shop for a year, I need by truck back on the road!

Engine rebuilding update:
This rebuild is taking a lot longer than I imagined! The motor finally came back from the balancing shop on Monday March 9th, and assemble began on Tuesday the 10th (yesterday). While the motor was out, I had the firewall in the engine bay sprayed with Lizard Skin’s encapsulated ceramic material to reduce the thermal load on the firewall and subsequent heat transfer into the cab. I’m also wrapping the up pipes, exhaust manifolds, and down pipe with a new Silicone based header wrap (good to 2,500 degrees), this should reduce the heat load in the engine bay and decrease turbo spool time…a win, win, no matter how you look at it. I also upgraded the break rotors to the new Cryo-treated Power-Slot units with Hawk Performance Ceramic pads.


Daniel

All,
After six months and roughly $20,000.00 my truck is finally done. I picked it up last Friday April 10th, and I am still trying to recover from the sticker shock on this rebuild! I’ve started the break-in process for the new motor; I’m staying off the interstate, modulating the throttle regularly and when I reach 500 miles the motor will receive its first oil change. God I can’t wait to get some miles on this motor!

So far...I’m very pleased with the reduced turbo lag and overall performance the new motor is exhibiting on the stock tune, and when the break-in process is complete, I plan on adding a custom tow tune to complete the package.

Heading to court; the evidence at teardown clearly shows that cylinder #8 is damaged from over fueling (stuck injector), while the other cylinder/pistons were in excellent condition. I plan on pursuing a case against GM for the costs my local dealer quoted me to replace my broken motor ($11,717.00).


Daniel

daniel good luck
can you send pics of your engine bay. we would love to see it

daniel good luck
can you send pics of your engine bay. we would love to see it

Sure…I’d be happy to share the info on my new motor. I will need to do this in several posts to take you through the reasoning behind my madness, and because I have not taken any pics of the engine resting in it’s new home. My three primary goals during this rebuild were drivability, towing prowess, and reliability. These are the three keys areas I felt were necessary if I wanted to build the best tow vehicle possible. With that being said, reducing turbo lag was job one. The stock turbo was almost shot, so I replaced the old turbo with a BD upgrade. The BD is not too big, and that allowed me to focus on increasing the exhaust gas velocity to decrease spool up times and allow me to have a responsive truck that spools quickly.

Note: Much work was done to reduce the temperature in the engine bay; keeping the heat in the exhaust system helps to reduce turbo spool-up times. Also, while the motor was out; I had the firewall sprayed with Lizard Skins thermal barrier to reduce the heat load on the trucks interior when pulling those long grades in the summer.

There are several areas I focused on to increasing exhaust gas flow and reduce turbo spool-up time.

TTS street cam was used to increase airflow and maximize torque.
TTS street series CNC ported heads with ovate springs and Ti retainers.
Custom built high flow up-pipes…with EGR. (A big thank you! To Rick Lance over at ProFab).
BD exhaust manifold...I'll take every littel bit of airflow I can get.I personally:

Matched both exhaust manifolds to each cylinder head and to the up-pipes.
Wrapped both exhaust manifolds with the new silicone based header wrap.
Both up-pipes carefully wrapped with the new silicone based header wrap, keeping the heat in the pipes reduces spool up time!
Ported the BD turbo pedestal and matched all ports to the turbo.
Port matched both up-pipes to the BD pedestal.
Here are a couple pictures…more to follow later.

Daniel

Here are side by side pictures of my Stock GM rods and the new TTS billet rods. The TTS units are a work of art; larger oiling passages, micro polishing, significantly stronger yet each one is 75 grams lighter than a stock Duramax rod.

That’s a reduction in reciprocating mass of just over 1.3 lbs (75X8=600 grams).

Also, in the background you can see my stock piston that broke when the fuel injector failed, and one of the new TTS pistons we installed in my truck.

More pics will be provided soon!
Daniel

That's cool you're doing all those upgrades but don't you think that it's kind of moot considering the part that failed and caused all the problems is a part you can't upgrade(i.e. the injectors)?

That's cool you're doing all those upgrades but don't you think that it's kind of moot considering the part that failed and caused all the problems is a part you can't upgrade(i.e. the injectors)?

Excellent point…they don’t make a better injector, but now that we are aware of the defect we can keep a close eye on them for any signs of failure. I also installed all new injectors (stock) and I’ve succumb to the fact that all eight injectors will be replaced at the first sign of a problem. I’m just hoping I can get 100K out of the injector with the additional fuel filtration (Nicktane with 2 micron filter) and fuel additives at every tank.

Other ways to protect my engine:
We installed the new TTS pistons. Steve has been working with MAHLE for two years to add strength to the top of the pistons. In addition to adding more material to the combustion bowl (much like GM did for LBZ motors), we had the piston hard anodized with a new thermal barrier material. I have no idea what the material is, but its surface strength is far superior to raw aluminum (Steve just call it black magic). I will also keep a close eye out for any signs of smoke or injector leakage, and have committed to the fact that I will need to replace the injector more frequently than you would on your average gas engine.

Note: Regularly replacing the injectors is an expensive proposition, but it is “small change” when compared to rebuilding a broken motor.


Daniel

Nice build! :thumb:

So how is your engine coming along? Any more nice pictures? :D

So how is your engine coming along? Ant more nice pictures? :D

Thank you for asking; I'm attaching some pics below of the Stock and TTS piston and will post a picture of the less than impressive engine compartment soon. Regarding the new motor… it is coming along nicely with a little over 2,500 miles on it to date. My next oil change is at 3K (1st oil change at 500 miles; 2nd at 1,500; 3rd at 3,000). I have hit a few speed bumps post rebuild; problems like 1. “Engine loosing prime” http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=30534, 2. Speedometer stopped working (I’ve learned that this is yet another common GM failure), 3. I also found a bad ground that was causing check engine lights and intermittent exhaust brake disengagement, along with engine surging issues at idle. :weld: But athat is fixed now, and I’m only chasing an oil leak on the drivers side valve cover that is driving me bonkers, but I am confident I’ll get all the bugs worked out soon and I’m looking forward to hooking up to my old broken down trailer and taking my two wonderful and patient kids out for a summer trip very soon… maybe to our local beach for a first trip.

the "black majic" is a "molyblendum?" coating. Its used to reduce piston slap, decrease friction, and as a thermal barrier also.

the "black majic" is a "molyblendum?" coating. Its used to reduce piston slap, decrease friction, and as a thermal barrier also.

Nate,
I was referring to the coating on the combustion bowl / top surfaces of the pistons. The stuff is incredibly hard yet appears to be slightly porous in nature and is a good electrical insulator with some thermal properties. Are you also referring to the same, or are you talking about the slick coating on the sides? It’s interesting that the US Navy is looking for the pure “molybdenum” and China is buying the stuff by the Tons.

Take a quart of oil with you and GET THEM KIDS TO THE BEACH MAN! Seriously, nice to hear your engine build is working out. I sure would like to get one on a stand and start working it over, she don't purrr like she used to, starting to sound more mechanical if that makes sense.

Peace

The same thing happened to me. I just paid $15,500.00 for a rebuilt GMC engine. 2003 4500 GMC Duramax Diesel. I contend that the injectors were bad and caused this to happen. The dealer said everything was approved from the zone manager for new injectors. They put in the engine, when I got the bill I said where is the allowance for the injectors. They said the new engine comes with injectors and there is no allowance. I contacted customer support. I was told that what ever the dealer says goes and their is now appealing the decision. I also requested a written guarantee from GM. All I got was a note scribbled on my receipt. 18 mo. 100,000 mi. If you can give me any guidance in this matter please let me know. I am disgusted with GM's attitude. November 20, 2009. I also have a post on this thread describing the whole problem and everything I have gone through.

Take a quart of oil with you and GET THEM KIDS TO THE BEACH MAN! Seriously, nice to hear your engine build is working out. I sure would like to get one on a stand and start working it over, she don't purrr like she used to, starting to sound more mechanical if that makes sense.

Peace
Thanks! I took the kids to Carlsbad Beach on a test run and everything worked nicely. Then I pulled my trailer up through Hoover Dam and into the Grand Canyon, somehow I managed to get the old trailer down Bright Angel Trail (man those trails are narrow)...just kidding! We rounded through Phoenix Az. and returned home without a hitch. Just wanted to say that the new motor/turbo/exhaust are doing a good job of keeping the EGT's and turbo lag under control. I have just over 5K miles on the new motor and I'm looking forward to reaching 10K on the new motor. When I reach 10K miles I'm changing back to synthetic oil and may add a new tune to help reduce turbo lag even further.

Sorry, if I spent $20k on a rebuilt motor, I wouldn't be chasing an oil leak, the folks who rebuilt it would!

daniel good luck
can you send pics of your engine bay. we would love to see it
I was browsing through some old posts and ran across this request. I've posted several pictures of my engine bay in my garage. Feel free to check them out! The engine bay still looks relatively stock as I've been building the truck to tow my large trailer reliably and provide the broadest possible torque curve, and I'm not seeking mind blowing peak HP with a big turbo and massive amounts of fuel. I'm still running the stock engine tune until I work out all the post rebuild bugs (U1800, P0089, P090). My truck recently started throwing the P0089/90 codes and then more recently a U1800 code. Currently, I have the FICM wiring harness out and I'm going over each wire individually looking for possible shorts or damage, but I'm afraid the problem may be in the bail connector to the fuse block. No luck finding hte fault yet, but I'm hopeful that I'll have these intermittent codes repaired soon.

Sorry, if I spent $20k on a rebuilt motor, I wouldn't be chasing an oil leak, the folks who rebuilt it would!

Glen, I should have responded earlier, and maybe been more clear on what transpired. When I said I was chasing the leak it was more like I'd clean up the oil residue and run it back to DPS. Then John would work on it and a week later I was back at the shop again. After three trips they found the valve cover was cracked. John at DPS replaced the valve cover back in December of 2009 at no additional charge and the leak is gone.

Cool Thread. Now, let's get out to the Dez and do some racing!

Sweet truck man! I'll tell you though, if I had a built engine, I would have put a nasty tune on there and a big turbo. :D