Dough that is!!! What would one expect to pay for the Full Stage II, Triple disc, and fluid OTD?? Alli is gettin kinda loosehttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/images/smilies/rolleyes.gif figured I should start savin', and I'm on the fence as to which way to go.
TIA

I dont think your gonna be able to get one at this point, from what I heard they are still working on it. Price will likely be in the 5k range for complete.

As far as pricing goes here's the deal. Remember, these prices are for an installed unit in Canadian dollars. Stage 1 consists of: Transgo Shift Kit, DTT Stage 1, single clutch torque with billet cover and an over haul kit w/upgraded stator support rings. $5500.00 CDN. Stage 2 includes everything Stage 1 has but also includes C3 and C4 upgraded piston set and CNC machined housing for $6990.00 CDN installed. In US funds that's roughly $4550.00 installed for a Stage 1 and $5800.00 installed for the Stage 2

I didnt think DTT used a trans-go shift kit?

The transgo shift kit is not necessary with the DTT system. But I feel that the up graded trim valves worth it.

TranyTom
Fine Tuning
Montreal QC Canada

Hmmmmm

Hmmmmm
Eric get to bed you're up way to late.

Hmmmmm
Hmmm is right... Still not sure why this trans is so expensive...Care to enlighten us more???

Nick can’t make change. He has the conversion wrong.
It’s Stage 1 $4250.00 & Stage 2 $5300.00 installed.

That’s That’s All.
Tom

For alot of guys that have gone to dealers or sent there transmission here, providing that they are in good shape (transmission not customer ):h ) the cost goes way down, because DTT like the factory clutches.


DTT stage 2 $1700
DTT new TC $1395 (not yet available)
DTT shift system $225
Overhaul Kit $270 approx.
Build Labor $500
If clutches are bad then price would go up. Misc parts that might be bad could also affect price.

Although if a guy needs a complete rebuild cause he Juiced it:ro) then I would say that the price would probably be $4500-$4700. When you consider the parts that you get that will increase holding capacity over and above just changing clutches and a shift kit.

The way I figure it if your coming to me you've all ready juiced it (limped it).
So you need a full rebuild. I will have a reduced price if the unit is new or has low miles.

Tom

Limping an Ally usually does not require a full rebuild. So far I have found it to be rare.
mike

Guys,IMO no one has built a true fix for the allison until now. Who else is actually fixing these units,and increasing the apply piston size? Shift kits only can do so much.DTT has increased the clamping pressure on the clutches beyond what anyone else has done.I know that when i get my allison ,it will be getting a DTT stage 2 treatment:ro)

John I knew that you would need a chevy. :nutkick: Now you can go fast. :evillol:

cause he Juiced it:ro) .


OMFG!

A Guy makes one little mistake and suddenly the name Juice becomes synonymous with "FUBAR"

Tough Crowd!):h

OMFG!

A Guy makes one little mistake and suddenly the name Juice becomes synonymous with "FUBAR"

Tough Crowd!):h
Juice
Your'e so easy to pick on. :whip: ):h

Juice
Your'e so easy to pick on. :whip: ):h

Yup.. ain't that the truth!

BTW, The Downshift issue has been resolved 95%:ro)
Working with DTT .

did the flash help?

Guys,IMO no one has built a true fix for the allison until now. Who else is actually fixing these units,and increasing the apply piston size? Shift kits only can do so much.DTT has increased the clamping pressure on the clutches beyond what anyone else has done.I know that when i get my allison ,it will be getting a DTT stage 2 treatment:ro)
John, you know what they say about opinions. I might also add how can YOU deem that DTT has the "true fix for the allison"? Not knocking DTT (I give them an A+ for there different direction) but there Allison's just haven't been out for any proven period of time.

I know that DTT stated they were not going to go the "shift kit" route as others (see DTT cite)--I've heard/seen written that the Transgo kit is part of the Stage 1 (hum). Do you know for fact that they've actually increased the clamping pressure, :blahblah: as you've stated? It takes more than just bigger pistons to get the job done--are they real gains or just some new eye wash?

I know that ATS and Suncoast's products are proven and both companies pioneered the high performance Allison while others have sat along the sidelines.

Lastly, the Stage 2 seems a bit pricy compared to the competition, what's the warranty. Thanks for the opportunity to reply.

For alot of guys that have gone to dealers or sent there transmission here, providing that they are in good shape (transmission not customer ):h ) the cost goes way down, because DTT like the factory clutches.


DTT stage 2 $1700
DTT new TC $1395 (not yet available)
DTT shift system $225
Overhaul Kit $270 approx.
Build Labor $500
If clutches are bad then price would go up. Misc parts that might be bad could also affect price.

Although if a guy needs a complete rebuild cause he Juiced it:ro) then I would say that the price would probably be $4500-$4700. When you consider the parts that you get that will increase holding capacity over and above just changing clutches and a shift kit.Are these CND prices? (I hope, I hope, I hope)

John, you know what they say about opinions. I might also add how can YOU deem that DTT has the "true fix for the allison"? Not knocking DTT (I give them an A+ for there different direction) but there Allison's just haven't been out for any proven period of time.

I know that DTT stated they were not going to go the "shift kit" route as others (see DTT cite)--I've heard/seen written that the Transgo kit is part of the Stage 1 (hum). Do you know for fact that they've actually increased the clamping pressure, :blahblah: as you've stated? It takes more than just bigger pistons to get the job done--are they real gains or just some new eye wash?

I know that ATS and Suncoast's products are proven and both companies pioneered the high performance Allison while others have sat along the sidelines.

Lastly, the Stage 2 seems a bit pricy compared to the competition, what's the warranty. Thanks for the opportunity to reply.
Well, I have been 'BTW' (Beta Test Whore) for quite some time now. (Re: See Signature)

I believe the mathematics on more surface area and higher pressures utilizing larger apply pistons. These types of major modifications are not something you can buy off the shelf like extra clutches. They take time to build, and time to test. IIRC we have thrown away more than 9 different Stage 1 Transmission configurations on my truck to get that stage where it is today. Stage 2 has been much easier. (for me, anyways)

There is not one transgo part in my transmission.... The reason is I am testing what Bill has done with his system.
One interesting note. The DTT apply system has been slow in release because IT IS a revolution where the Allison is concerned. NOBODY has done this amount of changes to the pistons and researched it. Last i checked, CNC parts for an LTC1000 in this size were not available at GM or Allison.):h

Me, I don't know squat about an automatic, but as a Physics Nut, I do understand the laws governing pressure and in this approach, where they are peerless in that respect.

Is it the be all end all? I do not know. Time will tell that tale. One real nice thing about DTT is their tenacity in their dealing with me.

I have their home number, their cell numbers etc. Once a week they get a report on what i find when hauling livestock, Hay, Plywood, Concrete or rubbish.
What do i 'feel' in upshifts?
What do i 'feel' in downshifts?
What are my thoughts on any changes for the RV'er , Livestock hauler, or Weekend Warrior or Daily Driver?
For every change they have asked those answers. To the best of my ability I have provided them.
I want all 4 of those abilities... and durability.

We (DTT and I) have had one B of a time on some of these 'development parts' Ever wonder what the cost of making 10 sets of different pistons on a CNC machine is? Then tesing them out and finding the closest one is still not right?
I'd be lying to everyone if i did not say we (DTT and I) have been frustrated at times, Long days travelling, 15 hours of intense work each day by the re and re crew; And the continual test, retest, teardown and rebuild time. But they have come through in a big way for me. Their hospitality at their home and workplace; positive attitude has been nothing short of amazing.

To Date, I have whipped this Stage2 Like Dog..... WHILE TRAILERING!
(All of 528 hp too):h ) And not a whimper.

As a side note, without their vouching for my character, the LB7 Twins would be a long time in coming. Thanks Nathan (Idaho CTD), Thanks to the Kondolays.

I am not afraid to post any of this. Am I cheerleading? YES! Have I been treated beyond my expectations? YES! Is my Transmission working well? YES! Can I tow with 500+ HP? YES!








Would I do the same things all over if i could go back in time to 2003?



YES!



In my opinion, all the manufacturers make a good product.

Can't wait to see what others think of Stage2!:ro)

(If you guys thought Stage1 rocks ..... wait until you get a taste of #2!)

Juice - appreciate your straight up reply! Hope the thing works out well for you. I know somewhere I've read/heard that the Stage 1 uses a Transgo Shift Kit--No? What's the new DTT converter all about? Thanks again, time will tell, then I'll make my decision on whose Allison will find a home in my truck.

Juice - appreciate your straight up reply! Hope the thing works out well for you. I know somewhere I've read/heard that the Stage 1 uses a Transgo Shift Kit--No? What's the new DTT converter all about? Thanks again, time will tell, then I'll make my decision on whose Allison will find a home in my truck.I can't say much about the valves in my truck, other than they are not transgo.
nor are the springs.


The new Convertor.... is under wraps.... All they will tell me is that it will be a night and day difference from the prototype convertor i am currently using.

I am hoping DTT considers me for testing the new convertor, but at this time there is another truck out there that is getting the Stage2 installed, and he should probably be the one to test it. My convertor needs are covered for now with this one, and i do not want to be selfish...If they ask me to test it, I will gladly accept. If they want someone else to, that is fine too.

It is a pretty neat package.... I'd Love to test the new convertor, Shanti has been a real tease about it.... and it's getting to me.... When i ask about it she coyly replies that "You will love it" FCensored !

I am real satisfied with the convertor i have, BUT when they put that bug in my ear, part of me thinks it can't be any better than what i have now (Which i really like) and the other part of me REALLY REALLY wants to be sure....


On Edit: If anyone wanted to try out my truck to see what is shifted like, C'mon down or meet at a dyno event in MT or WA or ID, I'd definately let them give it a go!:)

BTW, you'd have to promise not to look under the hood.....

Mmmmm Stage 2. I can almost taste it but it'll have to wait till I blow up my Stage 1.

How are the downshifts?

Increasing piston size? Like Joe did about a year and a half ago? There is a reason he does not do that anymore. I honestly would like to see the K's work out the bugs that come along with the larger pistons. If changes are made to correct the downshifts, there goes your upshifts too..

Cant change one thing without affecting another....

I am still waiting on the sideline for a dozen of these to be out and beat on... 2 isnt enough for me.

How are the downshifts?

Increasing piston size? Like Joe did about a year and a half ago? There is a reason he does not do that anymore. I honestly would like to see the K's work out the bugs that come along with the larger pistons. If changes are made to correct the downshifts, there goes your upshifts too..

Cant change one thing without affecting another....

I am still waiting on the sideline for a dozen of these to be out and beat on... 2 isnt enough for me.

Downshifts have been solved.

All things being equal, Suncoast makes a good trans Eric. Never said they didn't. Upshifts and downshifts are excellent. Something you would need to drive yourself to have experience with.

Anyhow, I'll see you all on wed night.... I have a few miles to go this weekend!

Keep the lights burning!
:ro)

I will let you all know how the downshifts and upshifts work in a couple of weeks.

Juice, keep us posted on it. I am very curious to see how it all shakes down!

I still have a few cores here to build....Not sure what to put in them though....

I don't know what went into this latest setup. Trans was on the table for teardown and inspect in 45 minutes.

Stage 2 Teardown results as follows:

Fluid: Bright Red and Smelled like it came out of the bottle.

C1 Clutches and Steels
C2 Clutches and Steels
C3 Clutches and Steels
C4 Clutches and Steels
C5 Clutches and Steels

All were in good shape
No burning, scoring, heat checking or warping:ro)
Single Disc Convertor Is now out of my truck:help: DTT has decided to to let me test the new unit, and for now we added an OEM convertor in the interim ( Stefan's really happy about that... He's running my old convertor!)

I don't know what they did, but after clearing the cells, 1 set of shifts and it had LEARNED!
I thought BS, but the proof is in the Driving.

So in a few weeks the new single disc convertor will be in..... and I will get that one in and ditch this OEM POS..... I miss my old DTT Convertor already. When the twins are speaking, the lock only holds to 2700 RPMS on the OEM and then it blows past and tages the rev limiter Censored

Mike L's Components Are Shipping.

Mike, you are in for a pleasant surprise!:ro)

how many km on this tear down? Was it for the convert change....or a planned tear down?

If we are going to do a parts comparison then by all means let us look at parts on the table here before we get into comparisons. What exactly are we comparing.

DTT C1 piston, vs ?? They dont have one,

DTT C2 piston, vs ?? They dont have one,

DTT C3 piston, vs ?? They dont have one,

DTT C4 piston, vs ?? They dont have one,

DTT machined case vs ?? they dont do one,

What the heck are we comparing here.

If as you stated money is a factor for you, why the heck are you even looking at aftermarket. Your local tranny shop has access to all the parts you are paying premium dollars for and readily accessible to them.

Here's the thing that really amazes me, most of you dont even realise that C3 and C4 pistons double as a seal. The significance you guys are missing is that in the Suncoast kits the seals are being machined and sent back to you in your kits/ that is why there is a core charge or you would not have to send them back in. You are sending in a used part from your truck they are machining it and sending it back to someone else. How would you feel if the machined one that you got back already had 100,000 miles on it and you sent one in that only had 20.000, better yet how would you know. Why would you want a used machined seal when you are paying a new price. I am stunned that you guys are fighting to allow this process and I have to assume it is because most of you do not understand what you are allowing to happen here.

If that is what I wanted to offer you I could have done that years ago. I am throwing in the garbage what you guys are sending in for machining to these other guys , AI take it very personally being compared to that. As for the comments that the other aftermarket been doing it for a long time vs DTT , I have to ask and what have you gotten in all the years they have been doing it. A TC and a shift kit, it is not that we could not have done that, we chose not to do that. My customers do not care when they come to me that I was the first, they want the best mod they can get for their truck. I dont have anything personal against the Transgo shift kit or guys that run it, or even those that install it. Some of these installers are very limited in what they have had access to. The aftermarket had nothing else to offer the builders so they did the best they could with what they had.

My company is known for building top quality components that is why our Dodge trucks hold the power they do, 885hp and 1600 + ft. lbs of torque on a daily driven 7600 lb 4x4 street truck was no accident. They are not trailer queens, they are live street and strip driven trucks. They pull sleds and heavy RV's. We are well known for custom jobs, I am not going to offer you Chev guys any less. I am a Chev guy, even my race cars are Chevy. If you guys are happy with what you have then dont worry about us. We have no problem with that. Those of you out there running systems that are barely holding that have contacted us know who you are. You want more power, you want to go faster you want twins. Our components will help strengthen what ever you are running. You don t have to believe me, but please dont lump me in with the other aftermarket, I have re-designed the inside of this transmission not given you a TC and a shift kit and a machined seal. If you are insulted that I charge a few hundred more for the system then perhaps we are not the right company for you, and I can live with that too. For those of you that are interested in learning I will chime in as time permits.

how many km on this tear down? Was it for the convert change....or a planned tear down?
planned trip, one month in advance it was planned.
we wanted to see what the wear patterns if any there would be on the steels and clutches. Bill was quite pleased.

Even with the dshift issues we had, the build charecteristics of the components allowed full clutch contact......no burn lines or distortions.

I did not track my mileage since we did stage2:eek:

lots of good trailer pulls?.....................the hotroddin we know about.

Well Just got back from Russia & I see that I opened a can of worms.

Tom

Hey Tom welcome back. Wait till you read the Suncoast Improvments thread.

Hey Tom welcome back. Wait till you read the Suncoast Improvments thread.
LOL
Just make sure you have a cold 6 pack and popcorn beside you while reading it. The thread is a bit long

Bill, as usual you can not just let your products stand on their own merits. You seem to have to constantly berate any vendor or vendor's products. I can only guess that is what you have to do to give any creedance to your own stuff.

As to your comment about "used piston" you are as wrong about that as your Allison apply plate mumbo jumbo. Sun Coast sends new oem pistons in the stage IV kit. Because of the large numbers of these we order we have seen an unusual number of back orders. I want to have a plan to fall back on if I need to. If you are so concerned about ethics as you pretend to be why don't you find the truth before you spout lies about other venders.
I will not be surprised if The Diesel Place forums adopt the same rules that your attacks caused the TDR to use when they revoked your posting privileges. I don't know what my kit has that yours doesn't and I really don't care. I'll let our products stand on their own merit. All of this mine has theirs has and your disparaging inuendos about other people's products has no value other than entertainment so no one learns anything.

smoop

Joe , its your own words, you have a core charge, the only thing a core charge is for is when you need the part back to rework it. If you say you only need it for a rainy day to prevent back order I feel sorry for the guys that get the used seals because you are having a rainy day.

We prefer not to compromise quality up here for any reason especially rainy days.

I think we should keep these post technical and leave all this bs personality stuff in your pm's. I am getting a little tired of it. None of you guys has solved the problem yet. Go back to work and stfu.

mike

strong words from the guy that makes his living off of them


I think we should keep these post technical and leave all this bs personality stuff in your pm's. I am getting a little tired of it. None of you guys has solved the problem yet. Go back to work and stfu.

mike

For those of you that are interested in learning I will chime in as time permits.
How about just finish shipping all the parts (to Mike L.) so I can get on with the installation and see how this bad boy compares to my ATS. :bounce:

Or is it no "DTT Soup" for me? :D

No Soup For You! Back Of The Line!

Edit: 180? What have you been playing with now;)

Edit: #2 what are you 60'ing?

Sorry for the hijack

No Soup For You! Back Of The Line!

Edit: 180? What have you been playing with now;)

Edit: #2 what are you 60'ing?

Sorry for the hijackBest 60ft 1.82

13.24 had a 1.87 IIRC.

on Edit:
http://dieselplace.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=339

7500 lbs and a 167" wheel base :eek: is tough to get moving.

I figured the long wheelbase would help keep the weight transfer down a bit and help......the 7500#'s cant be an advantage though any way you look at it:D

You pretty consistent in your 60's? Bracket racing is coming up fast......

strong words from the guy that makes his living off of them
fredw
I doubt if they took me seriously and as far as diesels go; I am an enthusiast and love to work and play with them for fun. I think I do an excellent job staying on the cutting edge of the latest tech out there and am able to offer them to people. My living does not revolve around how many customers I can pull from the DieselPlace. Ask anyone who has been to my shop or talked to me. I do thank you for your concern though.
mike

fredw
I doubt if they took me seriously and as far as diesels go; I am an enthusiast and love to work and play with them for fun. I think I do an excellent job staying on the cutting edge of the latest tech out there and am able to offer them to people. My living does not revolve around how many customers I can pull from the DieselPlace. Ask anyone who has been to my shop or talked to me. I do thank you for your concern though.
mike

We'll chalk that up to...Just our members trying to give something back to their "XM Rocker"! :rockit:

Mac

T:cool: ny was right. :)