At first the sound was an occasional very, very faint but steady tick from the engine that would go away merely by shifting it in and out of gear (manual trans) while driving. It would sound fine for a while, then the ticking would come back. I was thinking it was a clogging fuel injector, or some other obstruction in the fuel lines. It was only like that for a day or two. Things got substantially worse yesterday, and I managed to limp it the 3 miles or so home. Out of nowhere, the noise changed to a very loud metal-on-metal grinding noise, almost like a chattering. As I drove it home, the noise would increase with the RPMs and then all of a sudden totally disappear for a second or two, then come right back, all the way til I made it home. The engine seemed to be running fine all the while (except for the noise), so I assumed it was a problem with the transmission or engine/ trans connection. When I got it home, it started fine the first couple of times I shut it on and off to diagnose the location of the noise, then it died and now won't start...traced back to not getting fuel out of the fuel pump. I replaced it with a brand new one yesterday, ran a line from a fuel can into it, but nothing is pumping out of it. The engine cranks and cranks just as good as ever, no unusual noises or grinding, etc.
I'm a DIY mechanic at best, any ideas what I am looking at? I assume the push rod that operates the fuel pump isn't "pushing", meaning more significant damage inside the engine somewhere? I had also read a thread where one guy had to push the push rod back in when he installed his new fuel pump, maybe I need to do that? Broke crank, timing chain, or bearings maybe? Where should I even start?

was it possible to determine what side of the engine the noise was coming from?

how is oil pressure?

liftpump pushrod drives off cam on camshaft,hardly ever gives problems.is not the cause of grinding or clattering
if noise has generated cause a timing gear slipped on camshaft the engine would have died and prob would have caused valve and piston damage.
i would take the oilfiller tube of and see if the IP turns when cranking.check to see if IP gear is not turning on IP shaft.if all checks out fine ,IP gone south. altough the grinding noise sounds more like bearing seizure.
broken crank?? possible.check for movement at crank pully versus flywheel movement

It sounded to me like it was coming most from where the trans bolts up to the motor, on the bottom towards the back. My father-in-law thought it was coming more from the drivers side leaning to the front. I'm sure the fuel pump is not the original problem, but it wasn't pushing any fuel so I replaced it anyway. No fuel coming out of the new one either. Oil pressure has always been ok. The gauge was always erratic, but I figured it was normal for a truck this old. I believe the IP is still fine because there was a small amount of fuel that came out when I opened the injector lines and cranked it over. Granted it wasn't much, just what I believe was left in the lines before it stopped running. Could a prob with the clutch have anything to do with it? It's been needing a replacement anyway, it was next on my to do list. It had been making a slight grinding noise only when the clutch pedal is fully depressed, but still shifted and ran fine. Now wondering if I should just go ahead, bite the bullet, and start shopping for a new motor...:(

I re-read your post, Bison, and took some notes. I will be getting back into tomorrow when I have the time to take it all apart proper. I have been leaning towards the bearings myself as a similair thing happened to my buddies 6.2 last yr. Any ball park ideas of what kind of costs I am looking at as far as what parts I will need to/ or should replace if I break it down and do it myself?

It sounded to me like it was coming most from where the trans bolts up to the motor, on the bottom towards the back. My father-in-law thought it was coming more from the drivers side leaning to the front. I'm sure the fuel pump is not the original problem, but it wasn't pushing any fuel so I replaced it anyway. No fuel coming out of the new one either. Oil pressure has always been ok. The gauge was always erratic, but I figured it was normal for a truck this old. I believe the IP is still fine because there was a small amount of fuel that came out when I opened the injector lines and cranked it over. Granted it wasn't much, just what I believe was left in the lines before it stopped running. Could a prob with the clutch have anything to do with it? It's been needing a replacement anyway, it was next on my to do list. It had been making a slight grinding noise only when the clutch pedal is fully depressed, but still shifted and ran fine. Now wondering if I should just go ahead, bite the bullet, and start shopping for a new motor...:(So you seem to have 2 problems,one is no fuel which sounds like after all is not related to your noise. two is the noise what you believe has now is to do with the clutch.
so i wasted my time trying to help diagnosing the engine.

wear on the clutch plate has taken up the slack between clutch diaphram and throw out bearing,causing it to run along all the time ,so its buggered up now.
on the fuel,you need to bleed it good. put some air press in the tank to force fuel trough the system,is easyer on the starter.
no need for other engine just yet.
Pry the crank fore and aft to see if you have to much play in the axial crank bearing,should be very slight[few thou, no more than 1/32"]

It sounded to me like it was coming most from where the trans bolts up to the motor, on the bottom towards the back. My father-in-law thought it was coming more from the drivers side leaning to the front. I'm sure the fuel pump is not the original problem, but it wasn't pushing any fuel so I replaced it anyway. No fuel coming out of the new one either. Oil pressure has always been ok. The gauge was always erratic, but I figured it was normal for a truck this old. I believe the IP is still fine because there was a small amount of fuel that came out when I opened the injector lines and cranked it over. Granted it wasn't much, just what I believe was left in the lines before it stopped running. Could a prob with the clutch have anything to do with it? It's been needing a replacement anyway, it was next on my to do list. It had been making a slight grinding noise only when the clutch pedal is fully depressed, but still shifted and ran fine. Now wondering if I should just go ahead, bite the bullet, and start shopping for a new motor...:(
I had exactly the same ticking noise problem with mine, started sweating bullets like you. I found my flywheel cover was making contact with the flywheel bolts. Pulled the cover off, it was a little tweaked (don't know how or why, but it was). I straightened it out, put it back on, and wiped the sweat off my brow. I suspect you are right about it being 2 different problems, but I've been wrong before too. I would double check the pump installation. If you happen to have an electric, you could just bypass the mechanical. Good luck

I re-read your post, Bison, and took some notes. I will be getting back into tomorrow when I have the time to take it all apart proper. I have been leaning towards the bearings myself as a similair thing happened to my buddies 6.2 last yr. Any ball park ideas of what kind of costs I am looking at as far as what parts I will need to/ or should replace if I break it down and do it myself?don't get ahead of yourself, take that flywheel cover off [cant remember if it is removable]and check that throwout brg. and check your crank end play,if play is good, bleed the fuel system,get it running .

if you happen to have a spun main brg then the damage is done allready,but in that case you most likely wont have gotten home with it. your oil pressure should be steady at all times,put a manual gauge on and verify pressure.

don't get ahead of yourself, take that flywheel cover off [cant remember if it is removable]and check that throwout brg. and check your crank end play,if play is good, bleed the fuel system,get it running .

if you happen to have a spun main brg then the damage is done allready,but in that case you most likely wont have gotten home with it. your oil pressure should be steady at all times,put a manual gauge on and verify pressure.
They just have a sheet metal plate on the front of the bellhousing extending from the bottom of the block flange, its not a sandwiched plate, so you can remove it. You can't check the throwout bearing thru there, but you can check crank thrust.
Pull that flywheel cover, as Bison suggests, check your crank thrust, leave the flywheel cover off. Bleed your fuel system and get it running, again as Bison says, if your tick is gone with that plate off...you've found your prob. If its still ticking...well...if the noise truly is coming from the bellhousing area, probably should put a clutch kit in. Good luck

one other thing i like to add before you get all worked up about it, make sure your grinding noise is not coming from a brg in the the klingons like the AC or so or a front whl brg.

one other thing i like to add before you get all worked up about it, make sure your grinding noise is not coming from a brg in the the klingons like the AC or so or a front whl brg.
Klingons huh? Where's captain kirk when you need him:laugh_exp:laugh_exp:laugh_exp

Ok. Took off oil filler cap and can see movement from the IP when I crank it over. I got underneath and and found what i believe might be the problem...the bell housing is literally cracked in half!! Now what kind of problems am I looking at and as this ever happened to anyone else? I will post a pic as soon as I can...

http://img34.picoodle.com/img/img34/3/8/9/t_truck002m_3fcba44.jpg (http://www.picoodle.com/view.php?img=/3/8/9/f_truck002m_3fcba44.jpg&srv=img34)

My guess is the trans is slowing the engine down enough to keep it from starting (?) Can I disconnect the trans from the engine and slide it back a few inches to see if it would help it start? What should I disconnect and where?

That explains your noisy problem allright. i am not sure on your yr but aren't you suppose to have 2 braces going from motor mount brackets to the bottom of the clutchhousing? are they missing? what the heck happened there.
you could jack the rear of engine up to aline things and try to start it,altough i think you should bolt other bellhousing and clutch in before something else happens that is going to be more costly.
the engine is prob OK,just fuel issue.

Cool. Thanks so so so much for your input. I'll have to look to see if there's a bracket missing like you said. I bought it used last year, so who knows what has been added/ taken off. It's the main reason I haven't tried to turn up the IP for more power...it's probably already been done a few times by now :rolleyes:. Tomorrow I'll re-fit the lift pump again to make sure everythings all right. I read a post earlier that the pushrod broke on one guy's 6.2, so I'm gonna check that out and make sure mine hasn't done the same. As for jacking up everything inline idea...I'm charging the batteries overnight tonight, so I'll try it right after I do the pump. I'll definately keep ya'll posted.

Adding to the comment I made earlier about what kind of nightmares you might run into when buying a 25-yr-old vehicle with an unknown number of previous owners and I just realized I have no idea what trans I might have in this beast. All I know is that it's a manual with 3 speeds and OD (4 speed?)

I also noticed that the driveshaft connecting the front to rear transfer case has not only been unattached at the rear, it appears to be about 3/4" short of making contact (?) Does that have anything to do with the lift that was installed, or worse, a non-factory (unknown) transmission? How do I identify what type I have?

Adding to the comment I made earlier about what kind of nightmares you might run into when buying a 25-yr-old vehicle with an unknown number of previous owners and I just realized I have no idea what trans I might have in this beast. All I know is that it's a manual with 3 speeds and OD (4 speed?)

I also noticed that the driveshaft connecting the front to rear transfer case has not only been unattached at the rear, it appears to be about 3/4" short of making contact (?) Does that have anything to do with the lift that was installed, or worse, a non-factory (unknown) transmission? How do I identify what type I have?You could easely have some mismatched components there.Who knows what stunts have been pulled with the truck to make that housing crack. a bad lift job can have ill results.there should be a sticker on that tranny,go from there,post results in drivetrain section of the site.
someone will pipe in.

According to the '82 GM manual, the 89mm 4 speed with OD was the only one used in 1982. The 89mm (3.5 INCHES) is the distance between the centerlines of the main and counter shafts. Looking at a picture of the transmission, it has a left side shifting plate cover with two shift arms side by side. On the lower left rear below the plate is a third shifting lever. On the left forward side is a drain plug.

The manual shows a strut running from the transfer case to a bolt on the bellhousing/engine which is only on the automatic transmission. On my 1982 Blazer with my 700R4, I have struts running from the transfer case to the front MOTORMOUNT BRACKETS. Tell me about it!
This transmission has a removable bell housing so it can be replaced without getting another transmission.

[quote I also noticed that the driveshaft connecting the front to rear transfer case has not only been unattached at the rear, it appears to be about 3/4" short of making contact (?) /quote]

I assume you are describing your front drive shaft which runs from the front differential to the transfer case. If you have much of a lift, there's a good chance it will have to be extended or replaced. The rear of the shaft where it attaches to the transfer case should be a Cardan Joint with a square flange with four bolt holes. It also should have a slip joint at the forward end. There might be enough length in the slip joint to extend it and make the shaft work.

Thanks for the additional input guys. Joel is right on about my transfer case to front differential connection (which I mistakenly called a front transfer case:eek:), there is a square plate with 4 holes to bolt them together. I'll get started on that right after I solve the probs I've been posting about here.

Embarrassed to admit it , but I have only pulled and replaced 1 (!) engine in my life. Never had to do pull a tranny. Prolly a dumb question, but exactly what needs to be removed and how do I go about doing it? I can't seem to figure out where to disconnect the trans from the transfer case, which I assume has to be done in order to slide the trans back from the motor...?

Found out my trans is the NP833. Looks like I'm in for a treat...

To explain the whole procedure is to much typing. i suggest you get a manual,only $20 or so .It ain't to difficult of a job,but you need to know what to do and you need a good floorjack.a tranny jack would be better , if you got a buddy to help hold things steady will make it easyer.

I found this in a Four Wheel Offroad Mag:

"Question:
I have an '87 GMC 1/2-ton 4x4 with a TBI 305, manual transmission, and a NP208. The transmission is not the desirable SM465 but rather another four-speed with a high First gear ratio and an Overdrive. I pride myself on knowing every engine, transmission, transfer case, and differential out there, but this particular one eludes me. I remember a tech question many years ago in some 4x4 rag about an overdrive tranny like mine that may have been put in some GM diesels. They tagged it an NP833. Could this be it? Also, the reverse in my tranny is up and to the far left. This thing must be rare so I will probably yank it for a milder project down the road that may see some road time before I break it.
Justin Baker
via 4wheeloffroad.com

Answer: The crew at All-Trans transmission parts verified that you do most likely have an NP833, also known by GM as an MY6. The case is usually aluminum, but was available in cast iron. First gear is 3.09:1 followed by 1.67:1, 1:1, and .74:1 overdrive. These cases were found in light-duty GM trucks and vans between 1982 and 1987 as well as some Chrysler vans and trucks between 1976 and 1985, but never behind a big-block or a Cummins diesel. The major issues with this transmission involve failure where the counter gearshaft goes through the case, but if your case is not leaking from the front of the case it is probably fine. To make it last, do not put the truck under excessive loads while in overdrive."

The NP 833 is a GM MY6 and also the 89mm four speed with OD. As I recall, the max torque is about 225 ft-lbs.

Woodchuck 1021, I sent you a private message today.

UPDATE:


Got everything apart today and found the problem that caused the "crack" in the bellhousing. Seems it was actually a "cut" from the inside caused from a broken spring on the pressure plate...

http://img33.picoodle.com/data/img33/3/8/16/t_Moretruckpim_ba71269.jpg http://img33.picoodle.com/data/img33/3/8/16/t_Moretruckpim_d2a63e3.jpg http://img33.picoodle.com/data/img33/3/8/16/t_Moretruckpim_dadc452.jpg


Also got a start on the fuel problem. It seems I hadn't pushed the lift pump rod back far enough before I bolted the new lift pump on. Charging the batteries tonight and gonna try to start her tomorrow. Hopefully I'll have some fuel moving thru the lines and she'll get to running...:)

UPDATE:


Got everything apart today and found the problem that caused the "crack" in the bellhousing. Seems it was actually a "cut" from the inside caused from a broken spring on the pressure plate...

http://img33.picoodle.com/data/img33/3/8/16/t_Moretruckpim_ba71269.jpg http://img33.picoodle.com/data/img33/3/8/16/t_Moretruckpim_d2a63e3.jpg http://img33.picoodle.com/data/img33/3/8/16/t_Moretruckpim_dadc452.jpg


Also got a start on the fuel problem. It seems I hadn't pushed the lift pump rod back far enough before I bolted the new lift pump on. Charging the batteries tonight and gonna try to start her tomorrow. Hopefully I'll have some fuel moving thru the lines and she'll get to running...:)
yip that will do it,shows how important proper diagnosis is

Motor is toast. Cranks super-slow and makes a rythmic thumping noise as it turns over, and no fuel into or out of the lift pump.
I had started a search earlier this week for a replacement engine, and I found one that I have a question about. How much damage could be done if an engine was cranked over for 20 secs without oil in the pan? He claimed that he had drained the oil for an oil change and tried to start it b4 remembering to refill :eek:! The engine has since been taken out of the vehicle so I won't be able to see or hear it run. Would that not do any major damage if it was only for the 20 secs like he said, or should I just run away now?

Probably means 20 minutes! 20 seconds will not cause any damage-- sounds fishy to me!:eek:

Motor is toast. Cranks super-slow and makes a rythmic thumping noise as it turns over, and no fuel into or out of the lift pump.
I had started a search earlier this week for a replacement engine, and I found one that I have a question about. How much damage could be done if an engine was cranked over for 20 secs without oil in the pan? He claimed that he had drained the oil for an oil change and tried to start it b4 remembering to refill :eek:! The engine has since been taken out of the vehicle so I won't be able to see or hear it run. Would that not do any major damage if it was only for the 20 secs like he said, or should I just run away now?THink man, check your liftpump again. in former post you said pumprod was not up in the bore when you bolted the pump down,in that case you bend the lever out of wack,wont pump no more.
Hold the rod up against the camshaft with a finger,let someone else crank the engine,and feel if the rod moves in and out on the cam.if it does,turn engine till rod goes in deepest,put lick of grease on the rod to hold it in before bolting GOOD pump on.If it DOES not then camshaft is not turning along. then take timingcover of and have look see why.

I would not get the other engine[could be big trouble]running 20 sec ??without oil is damage

Update: I now have fuel out of the lift pump!! :) Not running yet, but I think that is a good sign that there's no major mechanical damage inside the motor. If it starts tomorrow it's looking like I'm gonna need a new pair of batteries as well as all new clutch parts since I've worn them down pretty good a few times now...but hey, still cheaper (and easier) than a new motor and/or trans.


:eek: :mad: :( :rolleyes:...in that order. My three year old daughter likes to play mechanic with me, so I let her have a ratchet or two and some parts to play with while I'm working to keep her out of the way and safe. When I wasn't looking, she stole (and lost!) one of the four transmission to bellhousing bolts out of the end of the trans where I had left them. Ah, the joys of parenthood, lol.

IT'S RUNNING!!!!!!:D:D:D:D:D


Thank you all so much for your help...now all I need now it to get it all back together and back on the road...thank you, thank you, thank you, thank you!!!!


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