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here is the link where i found the article and the pics

http://www.pickuptrucks.com/html/201...sel-spied.html (http://www.pickuptrucks.com/html/2010/gm/silverado/duramax/2010-chevrolet-silverado-1500-4-5-liter-duramax-diesel-spied.html)

Thanks for the pics man, i can't wait to get my hands on one.

nice find!

Yeah, except read the article, it's just a 1500, it has 2500HD badges on it for camo. I would love to see a 1500HD CC SB, but these pics ain't it.

Yeah, except read the article, it's just a 1500, it has 2500HD badges on it for camo. I would love to see a 1500HD CC SB, but these pics ain't it.
ah read the thread title. 1500HD ;)

I just WISH it was NOT with the damn super short bed. Hell give me a 1500 CC LB and I might decide to go with a 1500

I think his point is that the truck pictured has 6 lug wheels...so the line of thought is that is not a 1500HD but rather a regular 1500.

But the pics text says Diesel V8 what's up with that???

The 4.5 is a V8.

I want to know what they did for a TRANS, I would like to maybe see an ALLISON 500??? that is what is going to make or break this truck.... if they went with a GM auto I would rather have an NV-5600

That little short grocery hauling bed does not interest me at all. A 6.5 FT. bed might just be the ticket.

I want to know what they did for a TRANS, I would like to maybe see an ALLISON 500??? that is what is going to make or break this truck.... if they went with a GM auto I would rather have an NV-5600


At this time i can not remember what it is called, but it is not the Allison. It is the 6 speed that is behind the 6.0L gas 2500HD and 3500HD.

I want to know what they did for a TRANS, I would like to maybe see an ALLISON 500??? that is what is going to make or break this truck.... if they went with a GM auto I would rather have an NV-5600


whats an allison 500???

NV5600 in a half ton light duty pickup, haha, thats almost as good as when people say "well golly I wish they put a dana 60 under the front of the Colorado, Id sure as crap buy one of them!! GM better smarten up because they would sell a boatload with an option like that"

counting down until 01duramax6spd sees this........

:D

ben



the auto thats going behind the 4.5 duramax is the 6L90

I wounder how long the 6L90 is gonna last behind a diesel?

I wounder how long the 6L90 is gonna last behind a diesel?


GM will do it right im sure. With a gamble this big (diesel in a half ton) they arent going to take a chance on an auto that "might work".

this isnt 30 years ago when the 700r4 was thrown behind the 6.2 as an afterthought.

4l60 held up fine behind the 6.5L half ton trucks.

4l60 held up fine behind the 6.5L half ton trucks.


I thought the half ton 6.5 trucks had the 4L80?

I had a 2500 LD 6 wheel lug 4x4 6.5 diesel with the 4L80E and I think all of them had this tranny. That motor in mine was rated for 185 hp and 360 lb-ft of torque though. This new 4.5L blows those numbers out of the water. What are the specs on that 6.2L gasser GM uses behind the Denalis? Is it 400 hp and 400 torque? Do they use this 6L90 behind that motor?

the 6.2 gasser (L92) in the escalades/denali's is 403hp and 417 ft lbs IIRC.

they use the 6L80. The 6L90 only goes into the gasser 2500HD/3500 trucks.

I'm not saying that GM doesn't have a trans that can hold up to the torque. BUT they got it right when they went with the Allison 1000 behind the DMAX. With the tow-haul mode, the down shifting, etc everything about my Allison is great. What i meant was for Allison to create a smaller trans to fit in the 1/2 ton frame with all of the Allison 1000 features. Only time will tell......

I think they probably will try to make there tow haul mode as much like the Allison as they can. because thats what people want, im sure they have that in mind.

I'm not saying that GM doesn't have a trans that can hold up to the torque. BUT they got it right when they went with the Allison 1000 behind the DMAX. With the tow-haul mode, the down shifting, etc everything about my Allison is great. What i meant was for Allison to create a smaller trans to fit in the 1/2 ton frame with all of the Allison 1000 features. Only time will tell......


all of the allison's features are already in place on the 6L80 and 6L90. Drive a new escalade or new body style 2500HD gasser. THey all have grade braking, shift stabilization, tap-shift manual mode, tow/haul, adaptive learning............just like the allison.

ben

The 6L90 is a GM trans with all the allison bling like duratothemax said. They already have it right.....until the 500rwhp power programmer comes out then???????

Priddy may just not be aware that the 4.5 isn't a v-8

Priddy may just not be aware that the 4.5 isn't a v-8


it is a V8

They already have it right.....until the 500rwhp power programmer comes out then???????

and what happend to the stock allison when the 500rwhp power programmer came out??????

maybe it will be a good thing, after market trans parts should be cheaper? plus gm knows how to make a good trans, they have some good autos in there other trucks, i think they can handle it. this isn't dodge were talking about, its gm, they know what there doing.

Actually, I thought 6 lugs was for 1500 or 1500HD/2500 depending on year. 8 lugs was 2500HD/3500HD. My '89 is a 2500 with 6 lugs.

The 1500hd of modern times is an 8 lug vehicle

I actually hope/ wish they would put a manual tranny in behind the 4.5 which ever a/t they will make it work but a m/t would be so much cooler.... it would make it a lot easier to get rid of my truck

I wounder how long the 6L90 is gonna last behind a diesel?

Probably the same amount of time as the Dodge trannys behind the Cummins

I'm not saying that GM doesn't have a trans that can hold up to the torque. BUT they got it right when they went with the Allison 1000 behind the DMAX. With the tow-haul mode, the down shifting, etc everything about my Allison is great. What i meant was for Allison to create a smaller trans to fit in the 1/2 ton frame with all of the Allison 1000 features. Only time will tell......
Good luck getting Ally to design a completely new tranny for a GM truck since the split. My prediction is Allison will be in one of the other Big 3's HD pickups before too much longer. I don't know when the exclusivity agreement, if there is one, expires between GM and Allison but Ally will go to where the $$ is. A cummins 6cyl with the Ally behind it would get my attention, except for all the other POS Dodge stuff that surrounds it.

My prediction is Allison will be in one of the other Big 3's HD pickups before too much longer. I don't know when the exclusivity agreement, if there is one, expires between GM and Allison but Ally will go to where the $$ is.

the allison is here to stay in the GM pickups, and you wont see an allison in any other HD pickup. I dont care any "reputable news sources" say/think/predict. GM owns all the rights to the allison LCT 1000 so they are the ones who control who gets it. Allison could pack it in tomorrow and never sell another transmission, but the 1000 would live on unaffected.

I think everyone is gonna be quite happy when they see the revised "next generation" allison 1000 in 2010. ;) :D

If any of the other big three want an allison in their pickups, they are going to have to knock on allison's door and ask them to design a whole new light/medium duty automatic transmission; which is not going to happen. Chrysler wouldnt have put the R&D into the new 68rfe and Aisin trans if they were going to suddenly go a different route in 2010. Its as likely as seeing a cummins in a GM HD pickup down the road.

as for the 6L90, it will be fine behind the 4.5 duramax, I guarantee it. The 6L90 is a brand new transmission thats only been around for a year. Im gonna have to guess they had the 4.5 dmax and its capabilities in mind when they designed the 6L90. ;)

you cant compare it to the dodge transmission, I mean, do you think chrysler engineers planned for the cummins when they designed the torqflite 40 years ago? (which is "basically" the 48re's grandfather.)

ben

Thats good news

I seriously doubt thats the end product of what we're looking for. I would almost bet the farm that the 4.5 will have an 8lug platform under it. My 1500HD had an 8lug under it with about 150ftlbs less torque. BUT I could be wrong. The current Vmax is a 6lug with an hd rear end if I remember right. But it doesn't put out 500 ftlbs.

Either way, I just bought my 2500hd duramax that I've been wanting since I turned 16, I'll be driving this for at least another 5 years. But when its time for a new truck I'll be getting into a 4.5 CCSB Z71 4x4 1500 depending on its track record then.

2010 is a ways off and I'm sure things will change between now and then, it could likely be scrapped all together with the market these days. BUT The camaro is almost here :D I'm excited about those

Too bad it has to come in the sissy new body style......

Wish they'd bring back the 92-99 body style with improved chassis and drivetrains.

That is a small box though that sucks, and can you remove the dpf or will that be against the law in 2010? Or will it just void the warranty like now does anybody know???

That is a small box though that sucks, and can you remove the dpf or will that be against the law in 2010? Or will it just void the warranty like now does anybody know???

Yes you would break the law if you took off the DPF, and void the warrenty.

the 6L90 can hold up in a CTS-V with 550hp now in production, why wouldnt it do just fine behind a baby DMax...

that truck should weigh alot more then the caddy and the little d-max should make alot more torque.

The caddy makes more torque, i believe around 540, but it is at different rpm the the baby D-max.

500 ft lbs of diesel torque and 500 ft lbs of gasser torque going into a transmission are COMPLETELY different.

Why is diesel torque different than gasser torque? I don't understand. Please enlighten me (not being a smartass; I really don't get it...).

Why is diesel torque different than gasser torque? I don't understand. Please enlighten me (not being a smartass; I really don't get it...).
x2,

:stirthepo i gotta hear this one

Why is diesel torque different than gasser torque? I don't understand. Please enlighten me (not being a smartass; I really don't get it...).

I think what he's trying to say is that diesel torque is basically close to max rated torque at all times. For example, a diesel will have say 500 ft-lb at 1000 rpm through 3000 rpm...while a gasser will (again, hypothetical) start at 200 ft-lb at 1000 rpm and increase up to 500 ft-lb at 4500 rpm.

So instead of engineering your trans for occassional 500 ft-lb usage, you basically have to over-engineer the trans to take 500 ft-lb at all times. Granted they over-engineer everything...but I think I've made my point.

He wasn't trying to say that 500 ft-lb from diesel > 500 ft-lb from gasoline.

He wasn't trying to say that 500 ft-lb from diesel > 500 ft-lb from gasoline.

I think you nailed it. Something about what weighs more....a ton of bricks or a ton of feathers? :D

Plus if a diesel is making peak torque at say 1800rpm whereas a gas makes max torque at around 3500rpm, there is more line pressure in the trans at 3500 than at 1800. Theoretically, a auto trans is more likely to slip when mounted to a diesel. At least i'm pretty sure how that works. If i am wrong, somebody please let me know.

Yup still an ugly truck.Darn it!!

500 ft lbs of diesel torque and 500 ft lbs of gasser torque going into a transmission are COMPLETELY different.

Its still a lbs of feathers vs lbs of bricks argument. With it being a smaller displacement, the odds are it'll run at a slightly high RPM range than the DMax, but still not as high as a gas. Line pressure created by the torque converter is what gives clutch packs/bands their holding power, all of which have come a long ways in the past 20 years. The 4L80 did just fine in the DMAX vans, so Im guessing the beefier 6L90 will be ok on this...and if not, its got 100k miles under warranty.

Trans pressure is created by the front pump, not the converter... (if Im not mistaken)

All im saying is the way torque is delivered to a transmission is completely different between the two engines. Say for example an all out full built TH400 that was designed for a 800hp big block would not last one 1/4 mile pass behind a 450hp dmax.

Hopefully Mike L will see this and be able to explain it better than me.

or I dunno maybe im all wrong

ben

basically lets say 500ft lbs at 1800 rpms.... thats .27 ft/lbs per rpm vs a gasser with 500ft/lbs at 4500rpm is .11 ft/lbs per rpm so the tranny needs to be able handle almost 3 x the amount of torque per rpm.... because the diesel is making it at a much lower rpm


think this is how it works

basically lets say 500ft lbs at 1800 rpms.... thats .27 ft/lbs per rpm vs a gasser with 500ft/lbs at 4500rpm is .11 ft/lbs per rpm so the tranny needs to be able handle almost 3 x the amount of torque per rpm.... because the diesel is making it at a much lower rpm


think this is how it works


Correct. And the 450 ft-lb at 1200 rpm is even more of a problem than the puny amount the gasser makes.

That bumper blows big time

basically lets say 500ft lbs at 1800 rpms.... thats .27 ft/lbs per rpm vs a gasser with 500ft/lbs at 4500rpm is .11 ft/lbs per rpm so the tranny needs to be able handle almost 3 x the amount of torque per rpm.... because the diesel is making it at a much lower rpm


think this is how it works

Torque is torque.Dont matter what rpm it is. if a gas is at 4500 rpm and diesel makes it at 1500 rpm's "THERE STILL DELIVERING THE SAME AMOUNT OF TORQUE TO TRANS.

thing is though if I step on your toe for 2 minutes and then for 20 minutes which time has more effect on the condition of the toe in the long run?

Plus if a diesel is making peak torque at say 1800rpm whereas a gas makes max torque at around 3500rpm, there is more line pressure in the trans at 3500 than at 1800. Theoretically, a auto trans is more likely to slip when mounted to a diesel. At least i'm pretty sure how that works. If i am wrong, somebody please let me know.

I believe this is what happened to Ford when they first released the PSD. The tranny wouldn't flow as it needed to until 3000+ rpm so many diesel owners fried the trannies.

thing is though if I step on your toe for 2 minutes and then for 20 minutes which time has more effect on the condition of the toe in the long run?

What???? I guess I dont get what your saying here.

thing is though if I step on your toe for 2 minutes and then for 20 minutes which time has more effect on the condition of the toe in the long run?

perfect example. What Is trying to be said here is that yes, torque is torque. Thats obvious. A diesel putting out 500 lbs of torque is the same as a gasser putting out 500 lbs of torque. That is understood. But a diesel not only gets to its peak torque faster, but at a much lower rpm. The tranny behind a diesel has to be prepared for alot more stress than a gasser because that tranny is going to be recieving the diesels peak torque most of the time. Instead of, as stated earlier, the occasional peak torque it may recieve from a gasser.

Torque is that same reguardless of whats producing it. Yes, we understand that. But If I drop a hammer on your finger and remove it, the damage is going to be less than if i dropped it, and left it there. It all comes down to the long run.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torque_converter

GM isnt rushing this to market, and has to compete head on with Fords 4.4 PS and the new Dodge Cummins HO V6. This tranny has more holding power than a 4L80E ever dreamed of, so it should be more than enough.

A CUMMINS WITH A V-8?!?!?!?! So much for the straight six. well at least there still offering it.

I heard a rummor a while back that chevy might also be trying the straight six idea. but seein as the baby DMAX is still a V-8, it seems the idea has been surely scrapped. I give GM credit for losing Isuzu for this one and going on there own.

I'm also curious as to what kind of tranny will be put behind the baby DMAX. I think we can all hope for another Allison.


wow. good info. Learn something new everyday. I would love to get my hand on one of those and take it apart myself to learn every part of it :-D

6l90

Ford: http://www.dieselforecast.com/ArticleDetails.php?articleID=208

Dodge/Cummins: http://www.dieselpowermag.com/tech/dodge/0612dp_new_cummins_v6_and_v8/index.html

I wounder how long the 6L90 is gonna last behind a diesel?not long...our plow truck is an 07.5 6.0 with the 6spd...tranny is JUNK

Isnt that the 6L50? Thats a whole lot less tranny if it is..