Hey guys I am looking at a 5 car trailer and cant find any info on what the 4500 can handle! The trailer I am looking at is the http://www.kaufmantrailers.com/catalog.php?ID=6dc3a6f161b4246237b31fa4979a334b6b6 160530909f2617f1b659a7d9d297d

What are you of you guys towing and what is the weight??? This truck seems like it can handle alot

i tow a 32 foot flatbed gooseneck when loaded tips the scales at 25,000 pounds. gross is around 36,000 pounds. feels very comfortable in the 5500. i'll get some pics up for ya soon.

This is what I tow. :D
http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll85/c4500matt/DSC00001.jpg

Depending on configuration ~ 13k

Truck weighs 11,400 depending on fuel level....maybe a bit more.

Trailer weighs 18,400...depending on how much crap the wife loads in it.

Right around 30,000LBS on any given day.

The truck can only tow, gross combined, what it is registered for

GMT states 26K GCVW [to 30K with 2250? ally]

You can get inspected and re-certify your GCVW
but all structual changes [tires/axles etc] would have to meet new GCVW your are trying to obtain

THat cant be true almost everyone towing cars is way over the gcvw the DOT doesnt even care at all! I see dodge 3500 with 4 car trailers and they breeze through!

I am thinking the 13k tounge wieght is about right like volvo said... Can the 4500 handle that???

Hey Matt did you stop at scales with this??? That is a sweet set up!

Must have been hitting havasu

This is what I tow. :D
http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll85/c4500matt/DSC00001.jpg

Yep, Havasu! No scales. Everytime we came to a scale it said no pickups, so we blew right by with no problems. The boat and trailer come in at about 7200#.

Thanks for the compliment

Hey Matt did you stop at scales with this??? That is a sweet set up!

Must have been hitting havasu

The truck can only tow, gross combined, what it is registered for

GMT states 26K GCVW [to 30K with 2250? ally]

You can get inspected and re-certify your GCVW
but all structual changes [tires/axles etc] would have to meet new GCVW your are trying to obtain

Who recertifies it? Is it only for commercial applications? My understanding is that the GCVWR of 26,000 is due to the weakest link in the system, and that is the parking pall on the Allison transmission. That was told to me by an Allison rep at an RV show, and the dealer here seems to agree. The dealer though, also stated that he thought the transfer case in our 4x4 version of the 4500/5500 might also limit it to 26K as when he plugs in certain combinations of optional equipment (tranny?) for the 5500 he could get it to that 30K MeGMFan mentioned, but the moment he tries to put in the 4x4 option it kicks back down to 26K (though that could be because that tranny option is not available in 4x4 trim.)

So as long as you have the 2WD and don't try to park on a hill without the E-brake on, you can probably take a lot bigger trailer than the 26K would imply. I mean, come on...my buddy with a Dodge 3500 SRW 4x4 truck can tow a trailer about 12K and be under his GCVWR and I can only tow about a 13,500# trailer and be under my GCVWR.....but there is no way he would be safer or better off with his truck.

In any case, I'm wondering who can recertify a GCVWR or GVWR. I'd like to swap out the rear springs on my 4500 to be a little heavier and if there is a way to 'officially' change the GVWR to the 19,500# that the 5500 has I'd like to do it. I am under the impression that is the only difference between the 4500 4x4 and the 5500 4x4. I weight out at about 18,250# in my current setup. I'd also like to be able to tow a heavier trailer (around 20K) with a small crawler/dozer on it.

Yes I was speaking commercially
DOT or State truck inforcment is who you would contact
as well as what your RMV?DMV registration states

GCVW is not just the parking pawl
Legally, it is tire capacity and braking and axles etc

Where most may lose it is on pin weight
axle is 13,500lb as well a 4/ 225F's @3415lb ea

Yes I was speaking commercially
DOT or State truck inforcment is who you would contact
as well as what your RMV?DMV registration states

GCVW is not just the parking pawl
Legally, it is tire capacity and braking and axles etc

Where most may lose it is on pin weight
axle is 13,500lb as well a 4/ 225F's @3415lb ea

Well, I realize it is the sum of the parts, however, that is typically the weakest link in the chain, e.g. my old 2500 had tires/wheels rated at 3043 a piece and the GAWR (for the rear) just "happened" to be 6086. Coincidence? Doubtful since that axle is rated higher by the manufacturer of the axle. It might ALSO be because GM put crappy brakes at the axle ends...and I can attest to poor brakes (1997 - drums) for sure.

For my Kodiak (and I thought they all got the same G rated tires, but maybe not) my 245R70/19.5 G rated (Goodyear G124) tires are rated for 4410 (when used as a dually) so my TIRES/Wheels on the rear are rated for 17,640. The axle is rated for 13,500. Empty, even with the heavy heavy flatbed with boxes, the rear weighs out at about 6000/6500 or so.

What would the Pin weight be for a 20K gooseneck trailer? My dad's 11,000 5th wheel has a pin weight of about 2500....so is 25% about standard? If so, a 20,000 gooseneck trailer will have a pin weight around 5000...making my rear axle carry about 11,000-12,000 pounds, or WELL within the axle rating.

However, that puts my GCVW at about 32,000, which is well over the listed GCVWR of the truck. Why? Something about the overall vehicle (a weak link somewhere) and in my mind, most likely the drive train OTHER THAN the axles.

Look at it from a different angle: FORD rates their F550 with a GCVWR of 33,000 pounds! It has the same S135 axles as on the Kodiak (I think...not 100% sure but I know it is rated at 13,500.) So what else is different? The transfer case...not sure what they use, and not even sure what the Kodiak uses....and the transmission.

I had already looked around at documentation for the Allison, and to my surprise, was beginning to get the impression the Allison (the one put in the 4500/5500 not the bigger brother used in the 6500 and up) lists 26,000 as it's limit! That seemed odd (can the Torkshift really be a stronger tranny?) and when I went to that RV show the Allison rep admitted to me that yes, 26K is what they hold as it's limits. I told him about the Torkshift and Ford rating at 33,000 and he said "they must use a dirveline brake for the parking brake" which may or may not be true. He did say they had plans for a better parking pawl that would raise it to 30K sometime in the future....this being about 2 years ago I had the talk with him.

So the bottom line to me is that the Allison is the limiting factor as far as the GCVWR and responsible for the 26K rating we get. The Dodge 5500 also rates their at 26K. Coincidence? I think not. I think it is a combination of Allison rating the parking pawl at 26K, AND the magic commercial "threshhold" being loosely considered at 26K.

Ford seems to have a parking pawl workaround (in the Torkshift tranny or external to the tranny), combined with their MARKETING department has gotten more powerful than their LEGAL department or something...because I truly believe our Kodiaks/TopKicks with the Allison/Duramax (combined with 5.13 gears for crying out loud) are just as capable at hauling a 33K combined load than the F550.

I am very open to being convinced otherwise, but that's the way I see it. It was tempting to me to get a 550 over the Kodiak just because of that higher GCVWR but I really want a GMC if possible as "Me Also a GM Fan". :)

There is another element to this weight rating thing you all seem to be missing. Yes, the trucks can probably handle more than the rated GCWR (that is provided by the mfg sticker on the vehicle), however, I have been warned on more than one occaision by law eforcement that insurance companies will deny coverage on any person/vehicle towing more weight than the vehicle is rated. So if you happen to be in any situation where your liability coverage is needed, you had better be within the proper weight rating limits posted on the truck and trailer or you can be held personally liable with no insurance coverage. Yikes!:eek:
Rodeo Sue

Btg
but there is anlther rub, when you are commerciall and not a RV where load doesn't change

When your running a 3 or 4 car carrier, or equipment trailers you have a lot of weight forward of the axles and have lots more tongue weight, sometimes rated up to up to 15-20K lbs

Imagine 2 6000lb pickups up over the back of the goose or 5'r

you are saying that you can tow a 26k trailer or that the max weight for both truck and trailer is 26k for the traini???
does having an air ride increase the towing weight and does having bigger tires help ?
as far as towing goes.
If parking on a hill is the only problem then you could always buy blocks for the truck and trailer , simple fix right?

ooh by the way
which is better Goosneck or fith wheel??
as far as trailers
and why???

ooh by the way
which is better Goosneck or fith wheel??
as far as trailers
and why???

Depends on what your doing. 5th easier easier to hook up if thats what you are thinking. As for weight, which comes up way too much, GCVW is 2600. That means no matter what your towing not matter what its rated for the combination of the truck and trailer cannot be over 26000. So like I said in the second post, assuming 12k curb weight you can tow 14k legally.

why are ther more gooseneck trailers for guys with regular pickup beds that fith wheels?

No clue. Probably a combo of cost and a 5th eats more space. 5th wheel is a stronger design with the load better distributed. But to be honest if you are towing a trailer within the weight limits, just get a tag trailer. Even if you have 1k pin weight the topkicks will more than handle it.

Those of us that tow using goosenecks (horse trailers) are usually towing places theat 5th wheels cannot go....i.e. hilly, dirt roads.

Thats a really good point. Most of the new 5ers can almost pivot on par with a goose neck. But if the ground is really uneven we go back to the pintle.

My 07.5 5500 4x4 is rated at 30,000 combined gross. Ordered it that way, has Ally 2350,
Link air ride

here is my trailer and truck when it was stock....
http://img364.imageshack.us/img364/7554/toyhaulerem8.th.jpg (http://img364.imageshack.us/my.php?image=toyhaulerem8.jpg)
After lift...
http://img103.imageshack.us/img103/7600/028nv2.th.jpg (http://img103.imageshack.us/my.php?image=028nv2.jpg)

The other day I saw this GMC C4500 2wd with the basic setup and he was hualing a four to five car trailer. He had a weight sticker that was 45k.
How is thatt possible? The name of his company was Rick's Extreme Auto Transport.
I would love to talk to this fellow and ask what he did to his truck and what type of setup he has in the bed

Krazybains....nice setup - love the gooseneck trailer (I need to find one like that). You...umm....might need a drop hitch for the trailer int he second photo ;)

Haulztoyz - didn't know you could get the 2350 and still have the 4x4. But that might also validate what the Ally guys told me, the 'standard' (1000?) Allison tranny is what limits things to 26000 GCVWR......

Krazybains....nice setup - love the gooseneck trailer (I need to find one like that). You...umm....might need a drop hitch for the trailer int he second photo ;)

Haulztoyz - didn't know you could get the 2350 and still have the 4x4. But that might also validate what the Ally guys told me, the 'standard' (1000?) Allison tranny is what limits things to 26000 GCVWR......

LOL yea still working on that.

Hey guys I am looking at a 5 car trailer and cant find any info on what the 4500 can handle! The trailer I am looking at is the http://www.kaufmantrailers.com/catalog.php?ID=6dc3a6f161b4246237b31fa4979a334b6b6 160530909f2617f1b659a7d9d297d

What are you of you guys towing and what is the weight??? This truck seems like it can handle alot

I can say I saw a Chevy 3500 pulling that same 5 car trailer one day. I thought he was nuts, but the 4500 could do it. The power is the biggest problem, as the 4500/5500's seem to be detuned compared to the 2500/3500 engines. I haul cars, and have (or have had) a D/A 2500, (3) 3500's, a 4500, and a 5500.

Kaufman's 4 car EZ Loader is probably a better solution, or their new Mini 5 trailer. Its a 5 car, but less frame work and less weight. Loading the top rack is scary looking though. Mini5trailer.com shows you video of how it works. The new 5 car is $18,800, their regular 5 car trailer is nearly $23k.

The other day I saw this GMC C4500 2wd with the basic setup and he was hualing a four to five car trailer. He had a weight sticker that was 45k.
How is thatt possible? The name of his company was Rick's Extreme Auto Transport.
I would love to talk to this fellow and ask what he did to his truck and what type of setup he has in the bed

Where did you see this? I can check my directory of haulers, perhaps I can come up with a phone number for you. FYI, our 3500 Chevrolet is tagged at 34,000. 45,000 for a 4500 series is believeable.

The other day I saw this GMC C4500 2wd with the basic setup and he was hualing a four to five car trailer. He had a weight sticker that was 45k.

Was it the trailer ID tag that said 45K
or something on the truck
In my experiance, what DOT goes by is the door tag

And to further shock you, I have a Dodge crewcab shortbed [not dually] with GN, in my area, that is always loaded with 3 on a take3

Just because it is done, doesn't mean it is LEGAL

the 45k was on the cab rear doors both sides.

the 45k was on the cab rear doors both sides.


Was the apportioned weight?

braz

Where did you see this? I can check my directory of haulers, perhaps I can come up with a phone number for you. FYI, our 3500 Chevrolet is tagged at 34,000. 45,000 for a 4500 series is believeable.

Where was this truck seen at??? It's possible they could be one of our sub-contractors!?!? Please advise.

in Sol Cal

my 5500 4x4 is reg. with USDOT for 40,000 GVCW. They did not even inspect the truck before issuing Gross weight. when i pull in the scale (if i get a red light on the trasnponder) i have no problems.

The markings and the door (business name and USDOT #) are all they need at the scale shack. must be readable from 50 feet.

The other day I saw this GMC C4500 2wd with the basic setup and he was hualing a four to five car trailer. He had a weight sticker that was 45k.
How is thatt possible? The name of his company was Rick's Extreme Auto Transport.
I would love to talk to this fellow and ask what he did to his truck and what type of setup he has in the bed

I found him in our system, it took some digging because the Extreme is spelled "Xtreme" in his company name. I emailed him, and hopefully he will join DP if he's not already on. His profile in the system shows a 4 car Kaufman trailer.

I Tow The Jeep On A Flatbed, Tows 6k With Incredible Ease.

We tow the boat with ours. Truck doesn't get used much other than the occasional short trip.

Does anybody know whether you can hook up a goosnect with a fith wheel setup? if yes how?:rolleyes:

DrawTite does or did make a bedmount that would swap between goosy and 5'r
But I think there is issues with the Monroe beds

I have a fifth wheel that you can change to a goose neck. Just pull a lever under the wheel wall of the back drivers side tire. The whole fifth wheel comes out it is just sitting in there in a square tube. Pull it out and drop the goose neck connection in and it locks down when you release the pin in the wheel wall. It is a B & W Hitch

Does anybody know whether you can hook up a goosnect with a fith wheel setup? if yes how?:rolleyes:
I use a B&W turnover ball setup to tow both gooseneck and fifth wheel. Their Companion fifth wheel hitch mounts onto the gooseneck connection with no other rails. I do have to take the Companion out when I just want to tow using the gooseneck. The gooseneck connection is rated at 30K and the fifth wheel is rated at 20K.

Does anybody know whether you can hook up a goosnect with a fith wheel setup? if yes how?:rolleyes:


I've seen adaptors where you can remove the gooseneck coupler from the trailer and install a new coupler that has a kingpin that hooks up to your 5th wheel hitch.

I have the same one as brave 313. I know once you take it off there is just a block. How does the Goos nect adaptor look like for that hitch?

I have the same one as brave 313. I know once you take it off there is just a block. How does the Goos nect adaptor look like for that hitch?


I am not with my truck or I would take pictures for you. But when you remove the 5th wheel hitch it leaves a square hole in the bed. The goose neck is a piece of square tubing that goes in the hole and pins just like the fifth wheel there is a flat plate that sits on the bed and the ball above the plate

is it a specific one or it can be any goose?

is it a specific one or it can be any goose?


I have one specific to that hitch only because I ordered it with this. But any goose next will fit as long as the goose neck you are using will fit in this square hole and pin the same. I had one of my welders look at it because his hitch is a little different so he fabricated one that fit in the square hole of my truck and the top part fit his trailer. Took him about 1 hour to fabricate and we tryed it clean fit. Of course we sent it off to be tested for strength at one of our testers that test some of our rig equipment. I want be back for a couple of weeks will send pictures later

has any one tried to put a lowboy trailer on their truck?
will it work or just not meant to be on our trucks?

has any one tried to put a lowboy trailer on their truck?
will it work or just not meant to be on our trucks?

Nope....but I am wondering along the same lines, if a 'standard' gooseneck will fit both a regular pickup as well as a taller 4x4 Kodiak? A buddy and I are thinking about buying a trailer and sharing it, but wasn't sure if a standard gooseneck will fit both or if we would have to get an adjustable neck or what. It sure seems like AI see a lot of Kodiaks with gooseneck (or other for that matter) trailers that are tilting like crazy.