Here are picture of Cognito's leveling kit and dual shock loops installed on my truck. I went with Bilstein's 5100 shocks all the way around. I have green keys and the leveling kit adds about another inch so the front is increaded three inches. I have installed three inch blocks in the rear to get my rake back. The kit was easy to install with only minor issues. Sorry about some blurry pictures but I was using my phone to take pictures but I just could not take good pictures from a distance.

One more pic. The ground slopes in the same direction as the rank in this picture. So the rank to the truck is exagerated(SP?). I now have the factory rank to the truck. I missed the factory rank when towing.

Looks very nice! ;)

Thanks, just wished the pictures turned out better.

I just installed the same kit minus the dual shocks. Truck rides %100 better than just green keys.

Hey guys...does the kit lower the diff at all?

I am suprised it makes that big of a difference in the ride compared to the green keys. What part do you think has the bigest impact on the ride...the shocks back in the right location?

? how much better and what difference does the dual shock set up work ? ive always wondered about this

This leveling kit does not lower the diff. Do not be surprised about the ride quality with this kit. This kit corrects all the bad things when you add keys or crank the torsion bars. Here is a link to a thread that discusses this kit:

http://dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=18972&highlight=leveling

I would say it is combination of diferent things that make it ride better. The stop bumps are relocated to the correct location and the kit put the shock back in its correct location too. Look at the above thread to see what all get changed with this kit.

The first person that PM me, gets to have the OEM shock relocators for free (just pay the shipping). I went with dual shocks in the shock hoops so I did not need the shock relocators.

Hey guys...does the kit lower the diff at all?

I am suprised it makes that big of a difference in the ride compared to the green keys. What part do you think has the bigest impact on the ride...the shocks back in the right location?

My camera phone sucks big time. Those are such crappy pictures. I have a regular digital camera but it stopped downloading to the computer.

I like it! How much of a difference is this kit vs the Rancho kit?

Hey guys...does the kit lower the diff at all?

I am suprised it makes that big of a difference in the ride compared to the green keys. What part do you think has the bigest impact on the ride...the shocks back in the right location?
It improves the ride because it corrects the geometry of the front suspension. I will also note it shoud drive better due to correcting steering geometry. The suspension is allowed to move instead of being bound up by the limitations in the factory upper control arm.

The dual shocks will also go a long way to help control the additional up-travel created by cranking the bars. Further, dual shocks should prevent or greatly help the bouncing noticed by other members when the green keys are cranked.

If I was planning on running large tires by only cranking the torsion bars I would definately buy this kit. It should extend the longevity of many of the front end components.

need more pics......how about the CVangles ?

Not sure how to answer this question? Because the two are different in so many ways. If you are starting from scratch get a lift kit. If you have gone the route of torsion bars and/or green keys, then this is the way to go. In the long run you will probable spend less money for a lift kit. You just have to pay for it up front. Green keys and cranking the torsion bars will cause premature wear on steering components, ball joints, cv joints, wheel bearing, tierods, etc.....

I like it! How much of a difference is this kit vs the Rancho kit?

BassinRVer,

I've been waiting for additional feedback on this kit, I watched 8.1gasser's thread for awhile and now it's good to see some positive feedback. Couple questions though....

1) Just kinda curious of a time frame, does this install take quite some time or is it pretty straight forward? Any tricks? And of course I know it depends on mechanical ability, so I will say that yes I do know how to turn a wrench.

2) Also on the Bilstein's, do you have a part #? I'll more than likely go with the dual setup as well.

3) Is there plenty of clearence with the 35's? Do they rub at all? What's the width of the tires and B.S. of your rims?

Right now I have 325/60/18's which is basically a 33 x 13 and while it is livable with the T-bars cranked up a bit, I'm looking to "kill two birds with one stone" here, get a better ride quality and lift the front up just a little bit more for clearence.

I'd appreciate any help! Thanks!

The dual shock setup is better for when you heavy EXTRA parts up front, like a plow or front end replacement. I personnally like a stiffer suspension.? how much better and what difference does the dual shock set up work ? ive always wondered about this

The CV angles are not changed with this kit. I have 85000 miles on my truck with about 65000 miles with green keys and my CV axles are fine. People have commented on increased wear on the CV axles with torqued torsion bars or green keys but I have not experienced that problem. I have however experienced increased wear on all other front end parts.need more pics......how about the CVangles ?

1) The time frame to install the kit is small. I installed the front dual shock hoops and the leveling kit in 4.5 hours. I would say almost three hours were for the shocks hoops. The shock hoops required drilling thru the frame in three places; drilling thru both sides of the frame. The leveling kit was the easiest to install. I also installed Cognito's pitman and idler arm braces on the same day. So I did the dual shocks, leveling kit and braces all in one day. And that included several, several trips to Autzone for large hand tools.

2) All my reciepts are at home. But I' not sure if they were on it. I will go out to my truck and see if the Bilstein's have the part number stamped on them like the Rancho's RS9000 do.

3) I have 16x10 with 5 inch back spacing. The width of my tires are 12.50 inches. I have no rubbing issues. But remember I have previously done alot of trimming in the past to get my 35 to work back then. The leveling kit does add another ONE inch of travel, actually alittle more than an inch but I do not remember the exact amount.

Hope this helps.

BassinRVer,

I've been waiting for additional feedback on this kit, I watched 8.1gasser's thread for awhile and now it's good to see some positive feedback. Couple questions though....

1) Just kinda curious of a time frame, does this install take quite some time or is it pretty straight forward? Any tricks? And of course I know it depends on mechanical ability, so I will say that yes I do know how to turn a wrench.

2) Also on the Bilstein's, do you have a part #? I'll more than likely go with the dual setup as well.

3) Is there plenty of clearence with the 35's? Do they rub at all? What's the width of the tires and B.S. of your rims?

Right now I have 325/60/18's which is basically a 33 x 13 and while it is livable with the T-bars cranked up a bit, I'm looking to "kill two birds with one stone" here, get a better ride quality and lift the front up just a little bit more for clearence.

I'd appreciate any help! Thanks!

BassinRVer,
1) Just kinda curious of a time frame, does this install take quite some time or is it pretty straight forward? Any tricks?
The only trickly part is that the new upper control arm does fit very tight. You have to take a cressent(SP?) wrench and pull the tabs out a little to get the new upper control arm in. The tabs get pulled back together as you retighen the bolts on the UCA. The only other same glitch I had was that the new upper control arms have grease fittings where the bushings go next to the frame. I had to re-tap the holes because there was metal shavings mixed with paint in the holes for the grease fitting. No big deal thought. I first I thought the control arm did not fit, but then I figured out that you just needed to pull the tabs out alittle to get them to go in.

With the dual shock hopps, the only trickly part is on the passenger side near the front of the vehicle. When you drill the hole for the mount towards the front of the truck on the passenger side, you have to make sure you do not drill thru the bracket that holds the idler arm to the frame. It's not really the ilder arm but the thing that mounts to the frame and the actual idler arm.

BassinRVer,


2) Also on the Bilstein's, do you have a part #? I'll more than likely go with the dual setup as well.

The part number for the front shocks are F4-BE5-6251-H5, Series 5125 (these are for the dual shock hoops). I am pretty sure that is the part number for the front shocks. I am wearing dress clothes so I can not get under my truck to see the rear numbers.

Basically from that kit I can see you are replacing the upper A arm. You can get that from Fab-Tech IIRC. And it will cost you a lot less money...I think...

I installed the basic kit in about 2 hours including new shock in the factory location. Upper arms fit well just needed a tap with a rubber malet. I clear the 305's with no rubbing yet.

I will be adding the Cognito kit soon. I am installing it for a couple of reasons:

The design looks sound and should not create problems, actually eliminate some.

The UCA is tubular, has larger ball joints and has zerk fittings to lube at axis point at frame

You can add Dual shocks which is what I want but do not want a full on 6" lift kit. I have a K3500 and do not care much for the look of lifted Dually's. They lose complete functionality. I just want to add a couple inches

Also adding the steering enhancement kit.

I am going to do a pic shoot when we are installing. I am taking truck to Justin in Bakersfield to install. I am waiting for Reunel Frontend replacement and winch install before we do it. This way we can level with the additional weight on the nose. Should be in the next couple weeks if all goes as planned.
<!-- / message --><!-- sig -->

Are you front axles level?

In that second picture it looks like you CV is at an angle...like the it's tilted down...like you are limited in down travel if the CV were not destroyed...that is, if down travel is not limited.

Then again maybe I'm not looking at it right. Axles need to be flat though...

Are you front axles level?

In that second picture it looks like you CV is at an angle...like the it's tilted down...like you are limited in down travel if the CV were not destroyed...that is, if down travel is not limited.

Then again maybe I'm not looking at it right. Axles need to be flat though...
A flat axle shaft is ideal but CVs were specifically designed to operate continously in two planes. Even your major lift kit manufactures do not drop the diff as much as the control arm brackets. As a result CV angles will not be flat even with a lift kit. Depending upon how severe the angle is and how abusive the owner is the life of the CV will be shortened by running at excessive angles. In my experience a few inches of angle does not have a profound effect on the life of our CVs.

I will also note it shoud drive better due to correcting steering geometry. How does it correct steering geometry???? I didn't see anything in the kit that would address the steering components....only the supports for the pitman and idler arms, but they are correcting a weakness, nothing to do with geometry though.

I realize it will make alignments easier/more friendly...but the few that I have done had no problem getting the proper specs.....with the green keys.

Where can I find info on/buy these kits? and after install how long of a shock are you runnin?

1) The time frame to install the kit is small. I installed the front dual shock hoops and the leveling kit in 4.5 hours. I would say almost three hours were for the shocks hoops. The shock hoops required drilling thru the frame in three places; drilling thru both sides of the frame. The leveling kit was the easiest to install. I also installed Cognito's pitman and idler arm braces on the same day. So I did the dual shocks, leveling kit and braces all in one day. And that included several, several trips to Autzone for large hand tools.

2) All my reciepts are at home. But I' not sure if they were on it. I will go out to my truck and see if the Bilstein's have the part number stamped on them like the Rancho's RS9000 do.

3) I have 16x10 with 5 inch back spacing. The width of my tires are 12.50 inches. I have no rubbing issues. But remember I have previously done alot of trimming in the past to get my 35 to work back then. The leveling kit does add another ONE inch of travel, actually alittle more than an inch but I do not remember the exact amount.

Hope this helps.MUCH APPRECIATED!!!:ro)

It's always nice to first hand experiences before tackling projects.

Thanks again!

This was a easy one to tackle. A no brainer.

After this morning hauling AZZ to work I got to really FEEL how the dual shocks perform. As I was going faster than normal over the routine bumps and dips on my route to work I could tell that the dual shocks really smooth out the rough bumps and dips. I can SAFELY go faster over bumps and over those concrete gutters that cross prependicular (SP?) to the road, you know the ones in subdivisions where they put up sign for "DIP AHEAD". It was really cool feeling my front suspension in action, I can not wait to do it again BC it was so much funner. Thanks Cognito for your great products.

MUCH APPRECIATED!!!:ro)

It's always nice to first hand experiences before tackling projects.

Thanks again!

How does it correct steering geometry???? I didn't see anything in the kit that would address the steering components....only the supports for the pitman and idler arms, but they are correcting a weakness, nothing to do with geometry though.

I realize it will make alignments easier/more friendly...but the few that I have done had no problem getting the proper specs.....with the green keys.
The redesigned upper control arm allows you to put more caster in the front end which helps to control wandering. Also it will allow the alignment shop to get the camber closer to factory spes without compromising the caster. On every truck I have aligned that had aggressive T-Bar cranking you had to compromise between factory spec caster or camber. There simply was not enough adjustment to bring both into specs at the same time. This kit allows you to bring both well into factory specs while easing the bind on the upper ball joint.

So how does it "Magically" correct the C.V. angle?

I'm happy for you if it addresses alignment issues.

As to the CV angle, obviously if you start out at an angle, which from the picture it appears to be a considerable one, you in turn start out with a more limited degree of travel in which the CV can operate with normal reliability. Somewhere in the mix the angled CV joint need to be protected, i.e. longer bumpstops, using the shocks to limit the travel, limiting straps...thus limiting usable travel and in turn causing the shocks to dampen within a much shorter stroke--leading to shock overheating, poor performance, and possible premature failure. So, yes THAT short-coming--created by NOT lowered the differential--is answered with dual shocks...cool.

Personal experience in that a product performs up to our expectations is subjective and after spending hundreds, sometimes thousands of dollars there is the psychological effect.

As to how abusive the owner is, somewhere a line must be drawn between trucks that are DRIVEN, trucks that see little dirt, and trailer queens.

Inches of angle is irrelevant. It is the degree of the angle to be precise.

For you owners of the Cognito kit I got a few questions regarding this kit.

Do you need to have the green keys?

How much extra height will it add from just stock?

Do you need longer shocks?

Thanks

LA DMAX

So how does it "Magically" correct the C.V. angle?
I said it before, this kit does nothing to the angle of your CV.

For you owners of the Cognito kit I got a few questions regarding this kit.

Do you need to have the green keys?

How much extra height will it add from just stock?

Do you need longer shocks?

Thanks

LA DMAXYou do not have to have green keys or cranked torsion bars for this kit. It raises the front end higher to get rid of the factory rank in the truck. But this kit was designed to correct alignment geometry if you do have cranked bars or green keys. The kit adds alittle over an inch to the front. The kit includes brackets to raise the lower end of the shock so longer shocks are not needed. This kit put the OEM length shocks back in it's sweet spot.

Bassin, thanks for the write up.

I am liking the idea of lifting the front end an inch without cranking.

can i buy just the shock extensions? i would like to add an inch to my shock to have it back to stock location in the shock housing. if not does anyone make them?
thanks patrick

I am liking the idea of lifting the front end an inch without cranking.
Wait a minute....how can an upper A-arm lift a truck one inch without cranking or different keys? It was my understanding that the kit only corrects the front suspension geometry to allow for a lift by cranking/keys and stay within alignment specs.

You do not have to have green keys or cranked torsion bars for this kit. It raises the front end higher to get rid of the factory rank in the truck. But this kit was designed to correct alignment geometry if you do have cranked bars or green keys. The kit adds alittle over an inch to the front.Good question, I read Bassin's note differently. So, does one need to crank?

I think I found the answer...on Cognito's web site:
8 out of 10 GM 8-lug vehicles do not even need new torsion bar adjusters to level out. Typically, with a Cognito leveling kit install, the factory torsion bar adjusters are turned all the way up, and that’s it!

Would you be able to throw this setup on a lifted ride? Like 6" RCD or 6" Fabtech, it should work, shouldn't it. Just trying to find some options, so i don't get raped at the stealer if my ball joint should just happen to go bad some day.

Would you be able to throw this setup on a lifted ride? Like 6" RCD or 6" Fabtech, it should work, shouldn't it. Just trying to find some options, so i don't get raped at the stealer if my ball joint should just happen to go bad some day.
No you do not need it. The knuckle in your lift kit has already been redesigned to compensate for the lift. You would severly mess up the geometry if this kit was added plus void all warranty from both manufactures.

Also you will be replacing ball joints, cv shafts, steering components and wheel bearings more often than a non-lifted truck. The extra leverage on factory components greatly accelerates their wear. The shop that did you kit should have explained this to you and you should be planning on their replacement in the future.

I said it before, this kit does nothing to the angle of your CV.
I also said this and made the comparision to most lift kits on the market in reference to the CV angle.

No you do not need it. The knuckle in your lift kit has already been redesigned to compensate for the lift. You would severly mess up the geometry if this kit was added plus void all warranty from both manufactures.

Also you will be replacing ball joints, cv shafts, steering components and wheel bearings more often than a non-lifted truck. The extra leverage on factory components greatly accelerates their wear. The shop that did you kit should have explained this to you and you should be planning on their replacement in the future.I currently don't have a lift but, looking to get one soon. I'm just doing some research before i start breaking things and wearing stuff out, (ie. ball joints, tierods, idler arms....) Just so I'm not stuck in a corner buying over priced parts from GM, while I could be getting aftermarket parts cheaper and designed alittle better. Just like the bigger ball joints offered in this kit. Thanks Original Diesel for your help thou bud!

I currently don't have a lift but, looking to get one soon. I'm just doing some research before i start breaking things and wearing stuff out, (ie. ball joints, tierods, idler arms....) Just so I'm not stuck in a corner buying over priced parts from GM, while I could be getting aftermarket parts cheaper and designed alittle better. Just like the bigger ball joints offered in this kit. Thanks Original Diesel for your help thou bud!
I have done many IFS lift kits and it amazes me how many people do not understand the increased leverage put on the truck. Most accelerated wear will depend directly on the tire/wheel combo. If you stay with a qualtiy radial tire and a qualtiy standard offset wheel you will be doing yourself and your truck a favor and extending part life.

If you search this forum you will find all kinds of complaints from people who have bone stock trucks that have worn out front end components in the 80-100k range. It is questionable if the factory componets are strong enough even for a bone stock truck with 245s. Compound this with a set of 35s and you have an even worse situation.

I just try to tell people up front with GM IFS trucks that front end components are normal mantinence, like brakes or fluid changes. Expect to be changing you idler arm, pitman arm, tie rod ends somewhere before 100k. Ball joints are hit or miss. I have seen many last 200k+ and some crap out at 50K, go figure. Unit bearings are even worse, they go out whenever with no apparent pattern. This is the price we pay for a Cadillac ride...................

Good luck with you lift ;)

i've got a question i'm wondering if this kit will work with my CST spindle lift,i think it would because the only that changes is the spindle itself,so i'm hoping someone could give me ther opinion

got any more updated pics?

Do you need the green keys with the kit to get around 2" of lift? I Just want to level out my truck, and I dont want it to ride like crap like my old truck did with the green keys. Also is the new pitman arm needed?

Basically from that kit I can see you are replacing the upper A arm. You can get that from Fab-Tech IIRC. And it will cost you a lot less money...I think...

Is this true? Anybody gone with Fabtech vs Cognito on upper a-arm, if so, where do you get them?

I'm new to the diesel world and to this forum so please forgive me if this is a stupid question or if I am asking it in the wrong place.

I just purchased my 05 GMC 2500HD CC DMAX/ALLY and am thrilled.

I would really like to put some larger tires and wheels on the truck, but don't want to get too big.

I have read up on the Cognito Leveling kit and after reading this thread am conviced that it's the way to go.

I would like to run 305/55/20 on 20x10 wheels with the Cognito setup. The tire/wheel combo should be approximately 33" tall and around 12" wide.

After all that, here's my question. Will I be able to do it?

not with 10" wide rims

Might work depending on backspacing... If they are tucked in more they won't hit the fender when turning.

Thanks for the replies. I still like the idea of the cognito system, just have to figure out another tire wheel combo.

The Weld EVO wheels in a 20x9.5 have a 6.12 backspace.....should work pretty good. There is someone else on here running the same combo, might have to do some searching of the tire size or wheel size and you should be able to find it......looks good though.