You've all heard about it by now, Suncoast is releasing a Stage IV upgrade kit.:ro)
Overview of changes include:

Increased C1 friction surfaces, 16. LIII kit used 15 and stock was 12. C1 backplate will be replaced with kit unit and core is required on the original.

8 C2 frictions, and current C2 apply plate

7 C3 and C4 frictions, C3 backplate gets replaced as well as C3/C4 pistons. Core is required on these items.

Shim for P1 ring gear spacing due to increased number of C3 clutches.

Pressure regulator gets a .125" shim to bump pressures slightly.

Redesigned C1 backfill valve, intended to provide faster filling of C1 apply piston, thus quicker apply.

New Stator support bushing, transfer case gasket, extension housing gasket and sump and spin filters are included as well.

Uses the Suncoast triple disk converter.

This kit is not intended for the average DIYer but experienced installers should have no trouble with it.

Prices are $2665.00 for the Complete L-IV kit plus shipping and 250.00 core on the converter, C1 backplate, C3/C4 pistons and C3 backplate.

Kit is only avail in complete form, no partial kits will be sold. I have a kit coming for my truck and will post results as soon as its in.

Contact me for any questions and if I cant answer you, I can get the answers.

How much should I expect to pay for an install? What kind of power will you be pushing through it?

One more... Would this setup be over kill for say only 150 to 200 horse over stock and if so what should I be looking at. I daily drive my rig and just want surprising power not to take home trophies. I only have a Predator (40 hp for winter toy towing) and Banks Turbo back as of right with stock gearing and 315/70-17's. I know I don't want to bend that Alli, I just want a reliable set up for solid power increases. I would not mind truck pulling for the fun of it but none of the local contests will even allow trucks as heavy as mine to pull anyways so mostly it will run unloaded with occasional boat towing under 7k lbs and sled hauling also under 7K lbs.

no such thing as overkill when building a transmission.

I will do these kits installed w/choice of fluid for 4200.00

Price increase over my normal 3500.00 charge accounts for the increased price of kit and more involved install.

I remember the days when I was happy with my 90 hp juice and thats as far as I wanted to go......):h

Better too much than not enough especially if you are paying someone else the install costs, its not as bad if you arnt since you may potentialy only eat the cost of new clutches and upgrade part.......

That's weird.....it's almost like I have seen that kit before..... ;)

I think you will have good results.

Yeah, I heard a guy had one similer to that:)

That's weird.....it's almost like I have seen that kit before..... ;)

I think you will have good results.

How much horsepower will this kit be good for?

As Much As You Can Throw At It!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

How much horsepower will this kit be good for?Plenty:ro)

Duno if i would go that far, everything has its limit but right now if you are drug free you should be fine. Welcome and watcha got?

I dont think your gonna go much more then what this kit is. Its right there with the ATS minus the co-pilot.. A L V isnt much more and its not gonna hold much more then this will...

I dont think your gonna go much more then what this kit is. Its right there with the ATS minus the co-pilot.. A L V isnt much more and its not gonna hold much more then this will...
Thanks for sharing the Stage IV kit info, let us know you driving impressions when you get it done.

T:cool: NY

Duno if i would go that far, everything has its limit but right now if you are drug free you should be fine. Welcome and watcha got?

I'm not exactly what you would call drug free on my Stage IV, and it is not even the new and improved Stage IV either. I have well over 40 full nitrous passes on mine plus all the other regular abuse. I think the new version will hold up to plenty of recreational drug use..... :D

Have question, (about the only place that has good ally info!)

I know thats rated for diesel hp cause of ton of torque that made, but what would the rated hp for an ;)warmed;) over 8.1. be on the level 3 or 4. I know tierod is getting SC level 3, and will be spaying a 250 shot on his 8. whatever(8.5 I think) :ro)

I am deicide on whether to keep allison or not. since I can get a pro-built 4l80e(direct swap) that will handle 800hp++ at $3100 out the door. And will handle the rpms of gasser. Not to mention lots of stall converters aval, and some have seen up to a 80-90hp gain in rwhp just switching to a 4180e(ie less power lost)

Just need help in deicide on keeping the ally. :confused: Since next winter, new motor will go under construction.

I would suggest that you do what you feel is the best for your truck, the 8100 revving may exceed safety margins for rpm on the ALLISON.

Talk to the guru's and see what they say.

T:D NY

Not to hijack thread.

But what are the exact rpm limits, input??? output??. Cause I know that once bigger turbos come out and more aftermarket hard parts come along, should be some high strung DMAX's But I have never gotten a straight answer out of anybody yet.

Why could an ally not run high rpms, like 5500 to 6500 rpm tops, is all I am looking for. What apperently blows up, and why?? Just too much mass and too big assembly??

Well talked to ats, sounds they will build me one, for about $5400 out the door. But still can't get a answer on the rpm limit, guess tierod will be the test bed, as his combo will turn about 6200 rpm is where there cam need to run.

I was refering to the wacky ones running everything including the kitchen sink bolted to it;) That might hurt one? I duno. My point was it aint going to get phased by anything out there on just # 2. When in doubt level 5:ro)

You also have a lite 2wd truck:p :rolleyes: (sarcasim) watcha weigh again? :ro)

I was refering to the wacky ones running everything including the kitchen sink bolted to it;) That might hurt one? I duno. My point was it aint going to get phased by anything out there on just # 2. When in doubt level 5:ro)

You also have a lite 2wd truck:p :rolleyes: (sarcasim) watcha weigh again? :ro)

:mad: now phil........cant you ever talk nice to others??? ):h

eric.... are you still thinking about using the co-pilot, if you get this kit now??

Allison is rated for 5000 rpm input speed

Jeremy, dunno

8100hammer, what is the redline for the 8.1 behind the allison?

8100hammer, what is the redline for the 8.1 behind the allison?
Stock it shifts at 4500rpms but also rev's out at 5000rpms if held in one gear.

Allison is rated for 5000 rpm input speed

Jeremy, dunno Thanks, well have been manualy shifting at 5400rpm for sometime now ooops.


Still does anybody know what will happen what parts go kaboom. this is proable the only hang up on getting a SC level 3 or 4 for me.

Still does anybody know what will happen what parts go kaboom. You'll wish you had a trans blanket if that happens...:eek:

Again what goes kaboom, or what lets go???
where is the weak link???
How do people know that it will go kaboom at 6000rpm??
what rpm does it go kaboom at??
Has anybody seen this happen?? proof?? pics??

Hurry up tierod, we need data!!

Thats what allison has rated it at......i dont think anyone has the balls to see what comes flying outa the case when you exceed thier recomendations and at what rpm that actually happens. Like Eric said i would recomend a blanket at least. Them are some big hunks of scrapnle if things go south...........

If you're going to be running over 5000 rpm I wouldn't use the Allison. GM has tested this and while the failure point is somewhere above 5000 rpm I wouldn't want to find out exactly where.

Who ever finds out what the limit/weak link is wont be able to talk much about it unless they have wireless internet in the hospital room

Who ever finds out what the limit/weak link is wont be able to talk much about it unless they have wireless internet in the hospital room

Bubba said "I can't feel mah legs" an I said "Bubba, dat's cause you ain't got no legs!" ):h

Bubba said "I can't feel mah legs" an I said "Bubba, dat's cause you ain't got no legs!" ):h

):h ):h ):h

welll I will have an allison transmission for sale mid summer

SOLD.

PM me

We don't want the P3 planet turning much faster than engine speed. So at 5K rpm's at .71 o/d, wouldn't that planet be turning around 6500? My math may be wrong, but it's still too fast, although I don't think it would come apart till after 7K rpm.(famous last words).
mike

Eric is sure quick on the draw when something comes on sale eh? Someone will see that trans again with new guts...

Eric is sure quick on the draw when something comes on sale eh? Someone will see that trans again with new guts...That makes a rebuild a 2~1/2 hour swap.........get ir done before lunch and then rebuild the core at your leisure.........

Sounds like a good idea

Eric is sure quick on the draw when something comes on sale eh? Someone will see that trans again with new guts...
He's gona get p-ssed when I buy it from under him.):h I'll offer him a goat or a sheep to satisfy him. ( maybe a blow-up doll):ro)

Actually I think THIS is a picture of Eric.

I do not think you could get him to part with his favorite one

Juice

You and I both know it was the beer that put that grin on his face.):h You are a bad man!:cool:

Juice, You promised to never show that pic again! Now, who is who? Bahhhaaa

Mike, your to cheap to buy a core... I am too....crap.

I will beat you to it, your to busy in the So-cal for a trip east! LOL

Eric

You got skinny legs dude.):h and that sheep is a bow wow. You lack taste bro.):h

I think I found a better pic of Juice....):h

Mike, I bet you didnt even see me take this pic...-:t

I think I found a better pic of Juice....):h
Nice to see I can still get the CHIX!:ro)

Nice to see I can still get the CHIX!:ro)Crap..good point. That's Nick's girl friend, he better not see that!):h

):h ):h ):h ):h You guys are certifiable!!!):h ):h ):h ):h

You guys just can't keep a secret. Now see what happens, I just received word from the SPCA demanding that we eliminate the 5 orifice inflatable goat from our stage IV kit. H-m-m-m back to the drawing board. We do have a surplus of alligators down here. My only concern is that Eric and Mike having not much experience with reptiles might get the install backwards and use the wrong end.

Smoop ;)

Wow thats a turn for the worst. haha

Also cool your jets on my allison, have to see what happens to tierod's ally first. around 625 hp on the motor, then hit it with a 250 shot of nitrous, He is planning on runnnig a SC level 3. heck if it holds, I will thinking about a level 4, but plan to contain the powerband on the new motor within 6000 rpm mark.

Hammer, its worth more money ( your core) before you grenade it..LOL

I am gonna try and find some reptiles down on the bayou next month.... I'll show Joe that he is right about Mike at least

So does the stage 5 have the inflatable goat or the alligator?:confused:

I prefer inflatable sheep.):h

So does the stage 5 have the inflatable goat or the alligator?:confused:You get a voucher for both with your core return I think rat...):h

Voucher for both!? Schweeeeeet!:cool: :ro)

I'm an IL guy so I have no expereince with gators. They are water tight though aint they?

I prefer inflatable sheep.):h
Ya.... and the main difference between an herbivore and a carnivore..... THE TEETH:eek: ):h :eek:

so watcha saying bout the wolfpack?

so watcha saying bout the wolfpack?
Top of the foodchain!:ro)

Much better than what i was thinking):h

Much better than what i was thinking):h
Froggy Style?):h

and an informative post continues to take a slide down hill........):h

Crap..good point. That's Nick's girl friend, he better not see that!):h
Hey I didn't realize she was telling me I needed to gain weight when she compared me to Got Juice!

and an informative post continues to take a slide down hill........):h
I blame smoop. Thought the man was above being corrupted by us low lifes.):h Goes to show you he is nothing but a sinner like the rest of us.:D Now Got Juice is a bad man to the bone. May the fleas of a thousand camels nest in his crotch):h .
mike

I May the fleas of a thousand camels nest in his crotch):h .
mikeNow that is FFunny.

You have never even said something like that to me so I feel much better now.. Hey Juice, you might be able to still get the chick, but your flea-o-meter is sure to turn them off):h

Now that is FFunny.

You have never even said something like that to me so I feel much better now.. Hey Juice, you might be able to still get the chick, but your flea-o-meter is sure to turn them off):hThis might be true, fleas could be irritating... though i would imagine not so bad as the 'lice' one could obtain from the sheep you were in deep with):h

S'ok though..... I'd rather be caught 'humping a camel' (sic) than 'fleecing the sheep'):h :eek: ):h

So did you get all 99 Sheep with your 'Serta' mattress? *SORRY*:eek: ):h

Eric
I have this bad feeling that Juice is going to hammer me.:eek: I'm a man; I can take it. I hope.:rolleyes:

OH man....this thread has really slid off the deep end....

Juice, If I ever meet you in person, I'm gonna have Mike give you a "Sheep Bite" on your..um, arm.

OK, I'm a little peaved. Just did my Suncoast III and NOW they release the kit I really wanted.

Eric
I have this bad feeling that Juice is going to hammer me.:eek: I'm a man; I can take it. I hope.:rolleyes:
DING DING DING DING... all right Alex... we have a winner.

Pic#1

Mike in Action... not work safe!

Is that 'Shag' Rug?:eek: ):h *SORRY* I know.... you are only 'Harvesting' the Wool right?):h

OMG!

Mike, gittem!

"Who's yo Frooooooooggie!"):h ):h ):h ):h ):h ):h

Alrighty,

I have seen about enough.....................:eek:

Sheep are one thing, but this is getting bad............I can't look at this no more.........):h

I might have to split this thread and move the stuff to off topic.........
:rolleyes:

Gheeeeeeshhhhhhhhhh


I gotta go, clean up this mess and turn the light off,


T:cool: NY

ok ok ok.... I'll stop..... I won anyways. ;)

hmmm----
well---its cheaper than my ATS------but is it better????

hmmm----
well---its cheaper than my ATS------but is it better????
Well it's cheaper!

hmmm----
well---its cheaper than my ATS------but is it better????define "better"

Only to slightly redirect this thread (back on track:D ), but Eric have you had a chance to install your LV4 yet?

How about posting some Pics of the kit?

I didnt take any pics of it, but I will get some in the next coming week down at the open house. I never even thought about taking pics of it for some reason.

Its in and have about 600 miles on it, shifts are quick and firm, yet very stock like in granny mode. Its a bit stouter feel then the III kits seem to be. Hard to get a good feel for it with this low of miles on it, Most of them came today with a round trip to Chicago.

I didnt take any pics of it, but I will get some in the next coming week down at the open house. I never even thought about taking pics of it for some reason.

Its in and have about 600 miles on it, shifts are quick and firm, yet very stock like in granny mode. Its a bit stouter feel then the III kits seem to be. Hard to get a good feel for it with this low of miles on it, Most of them came today with a round trip to Chicago.
Try any "BIG" VA's out to see if the trans likes it................

:cool:

It did at first, then they started playing ugly again....

I'm gonna get ahold of Tomacs Quad and stack it and see how it does with the rev limiter raised

I'm gonna get ahold of Tomacs Quad and stack it and see how it does with the rev limiter raisedGET ready for some odd stuff...........won't make a difference..........

Anyway, glad to see the Stage IV is getting it done..........

You and Mike L. both had waited out most of the rest of us before upgrading :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

You and Mike L. both had waited out most of the rest of us before upgrading :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:Problem is, not even close to being done 'experementing'. I just bought a core and got my name in for a DTT stage II.... thats a 2 hour swap tops....:ro) (once the trans is assembled)

and then back again....

and then again

I could test 2 transmissions at the strip in one afternoon....hmmm

Man, when a thread gets off track it gets off... a looonng way. Juice that just to D@# funny. I think someone has too much time on their hands!?
Eric- is the lvl 3 still the one for towing or is lvl4 the one I need to save the pennies for- new trucks only home about 3 weeks now and here I go talking about more upgrades to the old one- I wonder if I can get it past the wife with the its broke and I need to fix it? :rolleyes:

LOL@ Blizzard.... they asked for it... all i did was post the appropriate replies!

NOBODY will pull the wool over Mike's eyes that BAAA dly again i bet!

Juice- man I am ROTFLMAO, when I should be finishing the plow for my customer. O well can't work all the time.

bliz...jury is still out. Suncoast IV is a good kit, but DTT promises to get attention. Mike L and I will get a few of these installed and we will see what happens.

Juice

I just showed my wife froggy in action.:eek: She laughed.):h She says your'e nuts.):h

Juice

I just showed my wife froggy in action.:eek: She laughed.):h She says your'e nuts.):h
LOL.... and i am sober!

I can be outrageous when under the influence.

Pass the Absinthe!:ro) :ro) :ro) :ro) :ro) :ro) :ro)

hmmm----
well---its cheaper than my ATS------but is it better????
Were you refering to the sheep?

eric: tell me more on the level 4, shifting getting better, level 2 is still working good for me, held close to 550 the other day, was planning to do the level 4 this week, anything i should have the installer know, thanks fred

All around very good unit. The VA and it dont play well togather, but I am thinking of trying a Quad stacked with it just to see what it does with the extra R's. Works great with Edge box. Joe built me a good converter that works very well.. Better then Anything Else I have driven.

All around very good unit. The VA and it dont play well togather, but I am thinking of trying a Quad stacked with it just to see what it does with the extra R's. Works great with Edge box. Joe built me a good converter that works very well.. Better then Anything Else I have driven.
Yeah....but what about that core trans you just bought?????????

Joe built me a good converter that works very well.. Better then Anything Else I have driven.
Is this converter different than what every one else has?

All around very good unit. The VA and it dont play well togather, but I am thinking of trying a Quad stacked with it just to see what it does with the extra R's. Works great with Edge box. Joe built me a good converter that works very well.. Better then Anything Else I have driven.
eric: are you talking the jkva, having some of my best numbers with the 170jk stacked with the 150pp, have you tried that yet, have a extra, if you want to try it out, seams to improve shifting, also raises rev limiter, thanks fred

Guy, it feels better then the normal SC I normally use. Also feels better at low end then the two TTS units, although I have nothing to prove it. I know what my truck feels like and it is different now, the TTS units I installed, not much seat time in before and after, however the two that I installed the customer didnt notice anything different. I always ask them. Bigd here is one of them and the other I installed is a local guy that only reads. Fingers has one in his too, he didnt mention any thing that felt different.

Fred, yes, the JK unit. I would be interested in trying a pp, PM me with details on that. The only thing I have used that doesnt agree with this trans so far is that Big VA... looking for answers.....

Fingers has one in his too, he didnt mention any thing that felt different.

I haven't commented because I don't feel qualified. :)

Since I did a SCIII at the same time, I am not sure how much is the TC and how much is the SC3. With a stock tune, I noticed almost nothing. At the 65 and 85 tunes on the Predator, there is a marked difference. For lack of a better description, it scoots along better. Feels like the truck dropped 1,000 lbs of weight. Personally, I don't trust the seat'o pants meter and barring a huge change, would only trust track times or some other measuring device.

There are no rattles and it operates smoothly. The engine is happy and the shifts solid and on time. (after a long learning curve.) I'm happy, but I have nothing else to compair it to.

I am towing for the first time with it today. We will see.

Guy, it feels better then the normal SC I normally use. Also feels better at low end then the two TTS units, although I have nothing to prove it. I know what my truck feels like and it is different now, the TTS units I installed, not much seat time in before and after, however the two that I installed the customer didnt notice anything different. I always ask them. Bigd here is one of them and the other I installed is a local guy that only reads. Fingers has one in his too, he didnt mention any thing that felt different.

Fred, yes, the JK unit. I would be interested in trying a pp, PM me with details on that. The only thing I have used that doesnt agree with this trans so far is that Big VA... looking for answers.....
That's great news! We as the customers have benefitted from competition between vendors. It seems like Suncoast has improved their converters as a result of seeing the TTS converter. I wonder which company is going to push it to the next level?

It also sounds like you current and previous Suncoast converter owners need to send your converters back for an update.

Guy, I agree with you that the competition is being pushed to the next level on a daily basis. But I also know that my converter design was done before any mention being made of a TTS converter. Way back when Joe or JK posted a pic of a twisted driveshaft, its the same converter that is in JK's level V now as well(according to Joe).

Regardless, you wont go wrong with any of the major converter players on the market. To be honest, I chose the Suncoast converter based on price, as I am a dealer. Couldnt justify the 1500 for the TTS.

We are still dealing with SOTP feel here and nobody has proven anything on a track or dyno so who knows?

Need my hoist at that track or a way to load up a dyno or some kind of test to really see the results, but you know what? I dont care. They are all good.

Eric,

I'm sure you can agree that the coincidence of Joe stating that he had "Reverse Engineered" a TTS multi and you getting a new specially built converter is pretty hard to explain away.

I'm sorry if anyone here feels like I'm being a jerk about this transmission/converter stuff, but I'm trying to cut through all the Bullsh*t.

Smoop drew first blood by bashing/diminishing another vendors design here on the forum, and you know how I feel about vendor bashing.

I strongly encourage "Vendor" participation here because as a community we all benefit from their knowledge. As you have seen in the past I also strongly discourage "Vendor" attacks, for the same reason. The more Vendors that share their knowledge here in a "positive" manner the better it will be received by the community....... and the more Vendors and members we will attract, once again benefitting the entire community

I did all my back to back "tuner" testing because I found I couldn't believe the numbers that some were getting/posting since they were not duplicable on my truck.

I can only assume that we were not privy to the whole story on why these trucks can accomplish what they did.

Basic scientific testing dictates that the results must be repeatable under like and kind testing conditions.

If I...... or someone else for that matter, can't duplicate the results either on the dyno under controlled conditions or at the race track under similarly controlled conditions then I must assume the results are bogus. That is not to take away the accomplishments of anybody's truck. It is merely to remind people that there are lots of members of the community that don't post and are watching what some of the more vocal members here buy for their trucks, they spend their hard earned cash based on our recommendations and expect to see the same results. I feel a responsabilty to these members to provide accurate information, not to pimp product. I want the best for my truck and am willing to do a substantial amount of testing to find out what works. If you choose to follow my combination you will have the same results. I'm not here to play poker and omit details, I can do that at my local NASCAR track, and I have......winning championships in the process. I'm here to participate in the community by sharing information on a hobby we all love.

I guess I'm just weird about things like integrity and ethics. That also explains why I have no tolerance for piracy of other peoples hard work or intellectual property.


At any rate I'll end this :rant: as I felt like I needed to explain some of my actions/reasoning here on the board as of late.

I would like the community to feel free to PM me with your thoughts.

I agree 100%with Trippin as you can see by my posts. We are here to share and learn from eachother. By cutting through the BS we all win, even the BSers.

Other than the impossible "Test both at the same track, same truck, same day" method, how would you start to test differences in convertors?

Am I right in assuming the differences would be in the first 330' of a dragstrip? Or what else could you do?

Guy, well said, and as nature of the beast so to say, in order to get the real good info, we seem to have to weed through the BS to get there. I learned a chit load in just the last few weeks with all the stuff. Smoop, Diesel Tech, Bill and Stefan have taught me a lot with out even knowing it. The reality is, IMO, is that all this converter/tranmission nirvana is actually proving nothing. Look at the fast guys, they are running Suncoast, ATS, you with your ATS/TTS combo....Nobody seems to jump out and call huge attention.

One thing that can be said for sure, is that the testing of this stuff while benificial, still dont mean anything. What works for one may not work for another. If your getting a power box, they are all good, some may have better this or that, but overall....

Transmissions can fall under the same catagory. Each unit has its pros and cons.

I guess this is all just getting tiring to keep reading.. I enjoy all the opinions and input, but if all we do is ***** about this and that..boring....

There is just way to freaking much talant on this board to turn it into a *****board.

McRat, 60' times would be the most effective way as your in second gear shortly after, but traction plays a limit, 330' would work too, but by then your likely in lockup and it dont matter who's converter you have at that point. Torque multiplication only has effect in unlocked mode.

Testing a converter.........in a drag strip situation I would think the best converter would be the one that gave me the best 60ft times. However, this could actually mean a converter with more stall and/or less torque multiplication as traction does indeed become an issue.

Now drivabilty on the street for my dual purpose truck, (you know the one I bought to tow my trailers with and then discovered it would dust off most Corvettes on the street) would dictate that I may want something different, this type of test I would think could perhaps be done by monitoring some parameters with a Tech 2. :confuzeld

Certainly SOTP is subjective. However, I do know what I felt when I wasn't aware the converter had been changed in my truck. The results of blind taste test can be pretty interesting.:driver:

Unfortunatly, the only consistant way to point out the differences in TC's is on a loading dyno. Same truck, tc after tc after tc. I have no idea what that would prove though.

What works at the track gets too complicated with engine output, suspension, weight........all factors in how good a TC is for a given application. The racers already know it is a black art and spend a lot of time and money getting it all tuned in.

As far a tranny kits, my opinion is that it is a durabilty/driveability issue as much as anything for the majority of us. I know it is for me. All I really want is a tranny that will take everything I am going to dish out to it and still shift cleanly.

Meanwhile, I towed with the new setup today. Grossed around 26,000 lbs like most days. Pedater at 85. Loaded the machine in the "normal" position giving me about 2000lbs tongue weight like I usually do, but couldn't keep the back tires planted pulling out. Hmmm. It would break loose with the stock converter too with the 85 HP setting, but not at every friggin light! Next test will be later his week when I move the machine again. I will move the machine forward for some additional weight on the tongue. I have NEVER been able to break the tires loose when loaded tongue heavy. (I load this way to get traction on the dirt roads.) We will see how much torque multiplication I get then.

Ok, now we have to decide who has the better SOTP meter!

LOL, Different strokes for different folks...

Ok, now we have to decide who has the better SOTP meter!


"Mtomac"

Dumb question:

Does the convertor lock up on the 1-2?

No, unless I comand it with my scanner. In T/H the converter will lock early in second gear, and in O/D at wot, it will lock at the top of second gear.

tow-haul, locks in 2nd and higher.

All my review is worth is the tire spin. If it still breaks the tires loose when I have 4000 lbs tongue weight, I will be impressed.

The reason why I ask, is that the 1-2 shift is fairly big jump, and if the convertor isn't locked, convertor stall effects might be seen past the initial launch, but should certainly be done by the 330' which is the next set of lights at most tracks.

I can think of quite a few people that I think have a very nice SOTP meters that I wouldnt mind calibrating. Definatly not Mike, and i dont think any of them hang out here. Problem is the few nice insturments I have gotten to ride in my truck find the black smoke and loud exhaust to throw them off and they have no desire to let me do any testing. There seems to be some software crash due to incompatibility?:confuzeld Maybe I need some more stickers and a wing?:confused:

Guy, it feels better then the normal SC I normally use. Also feels better at low end then the two TTS units, although I have nothing to prove it. I know what my truck feels like and it is different now, the TTS units I installed, not much seat time in before and after, however the two that I installed the customer didnt notice anything different. I always ask them. Bigd here is one of them and the other I installed is a local guy that only reads. Fingers has one in his too, he didnt mention any thing that felt different.

Fred, yes, the JK unit. I would be interested in trying a pp, PM me with details on that. The only thing I have used that doesnt agree with this trans so far is that Big VA... looking for answers.....
So I guess the BIG VA is "STILL CREAMING" even the latest and greatest converter ................

I guess we can rule out the TC then............

I agree with you Eric, still looking for the answer...............I beleive the answer is not to be found in the transmission or TC.............:Nothing_f

Testing the converter is something that I've been working on with the dyno. However the best suited SF test to do so doesn't seem want to cooperate so it may take a custom test.

I've been working with Joe on converters since some time this summer, so tighter converters and such is not something that he just started playing with. I posted this image back on 9-27 well before any news of a TTS triple release:

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/82B_Twisted_driveshaft.jpg

Tony, I dont think the answer for that big VA is in the converter either. I am not an expert on the R&D area, but on my truck it bobbles on the 2-3 and the 4-5. Those two shifts have the C3 in common, perhaps not coming on fast enough? I dunno. Regardless, Its just that one unit and I would like to find a way to make it work, just dunno.. who knows, my core may solve that problem...?

dammit eric:

have to wait another week till i get my improved converter):h , joe feels it would not be a big difference, but might be noticable, waiting on ups again

will do a gtech before and after:ro)

Tony, I dont think the answer for that big VA is in the converter either. I am not an expert on the R&D area, but on my truck it bobbles on the 2-3 and the 4-5. Those two shifts have the C3 in common, perhaps not coming on fast enough? I dunno. Regardless, Its just that one unit and I would like to find a way to make it work, just dunno.. who knows, my core may solve that problem...?
So let's look at your statement in further detail..........what is it about C3 that has changed in my tranny, yours,JK's and was not changed in BMDMAX's.....;) .....I think I know the answer...............do you.............:eek:

I still do not believe the tranny to be the problem as other tuners stacks etc click off the shift fine.............and I am not trying to hijack either............just wondering if you know the changes made to C3 by SC from Brandon's Stage IV to the later STAGE III kits and the newer STAGE IV Kits..........:)

Think about it..............:D

It may relate to what we are discussing it may not...........but you have brought up an interesting theory..........

T:cool: NY

Oddly enough (to throw another log on the fire here) 1-2 2-3 3-4 shifts are letter perfect for me... the 4-5 bobbles only 20% of the time

Tell you one thing..... it ain't the convertor. IMHO

The Edge Juice Hot will roll off and pause HARD on the same conditions that the VA bobbles on...

The Edge Juice Hot will roll off and pause HARD on the same conditions that the VA bobbles on...
Comp Juice has no bobble on my 4-5 shift.
DEFUEL turned off on all shifts.

Tony, I dont know what is different in Brandon's but I will see it apart this week, and watch his new truck get a V. I guess I dont know what your hinting at, but it may come to me in my sleep someday....

Kennedy

I have seen that same drive shaft picture post on the dodge boards as coming out of a dodge truck from Suncoast. If you go back and do a search on this site you will find Ghettosled tore his drive shaft from his D-max with a ATS transmission and the TTS Xtreme tune. The converter has little to do with a twisted drive shaft, it's mostly how they are driven and at what power levels.

Just to clear the air a little around here the TTS converter design was introduced 1 1/2 years ago as a single plate and was released in a triple plate design last July. The converter design was release along with the Transgo kit we developed with Transgo. Long before you and Smoop started the R&D of your truck! The only difference being a single plate or triple plate design. Smoop has taken them both apart and had plenty of time to do the R&D.-:t

Eric

Put the Tech II on and take a snapshot of the VA shifting problem, anyone with a basic understanding of the system can figure it out as it's a very simple problem! A converter isn't going to solve it. Here is a true comparision of the currently sold Suncoast triple and the TTS triple http://dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=22868
This was a three month old Suncoast and changed to a TTS triple.

GJ
Just remember that when defuel is turned off on the Edge unit it has nothing in the world to do with the factory defueling in the ECM.

Steve,
First of all I challenge you to back up the statement"I have seen that same driveshaft picture post on the Dodge boards as coming out of a dodge truck from Sun Coast" find and post it or admit to a blantent lie. To go one step further how about a wager, put your money where your mouth is.

We shipped a total of 5 converters to Transgo between 01/03/03 and 07/16/03 to use in the Allison S/K development. Some of these converters were installed in your truck, Transgo's truck, and Joe 2's truck. We never asked nor expected them returned, I am curious why you did not furnish the converters since you were in the development stage. According to you Transgo and Sun Coast just stumbled along until the enlightened one appeared. All those wasted years.
The driveshaft was twisted during a brake stall test, of course any idiot would know that had nothing to do with torque multiplication
smoop

Joe

What you did and didn't ship to Transgo is and was between you and them. The converters I designed were used in the Transgo truck during and after development, if you do not believe me maybe you had better talk to Dave Hardin at Transgo as he installed my prototypes in the truck. Then again you could talk to Mike L. about it as well. They stayed in the truck until the day it was sold. Yes, I drove the truck with your converter and that is the main reason I did my own. Just as you did I never asked for them back nor did I expect them. As far as Transgo stumbleing along without TTS or Suncoast, your truely reaching now.

They know alot more about the interworkings of an automatic than you or I ever will. The difference is I know alot more about electronics than you or Transgo ever will, that why we teamed together to get the job done.

You want to bet so let's let Mike L. finish testing all the triples in his own truck. He has an ATS in there now and he has one of yours and one of mine on the shelf to go in. Once the testing is completed he will post his findings. If as you have posted before the TTS is just stock with bent fins we should come in last and you've won the bet, but on the other hand if the TTS is the converter of choice I win.

Bending a driveshaft can be done for many reasons and you and I both know it. To say it was just from a converter is Censored and you know it!

Steve,

I have been associated with Gil since 1965. I can think of no one besides my father that I hold in higher love and respect. I would not even think of doing him the dis-service by dragging one of his associates into this #8&/ slinging. In ending this I will bow down and say you are the brightest and the smartest and you invented everything. Now, don't you feel better?
smoop;)

Oh, by the way the shaft was twisted, not bent and I did not catch the amount of the wager.:help2:

:Nothing_f :ro) :confused: :eek: :mad: ):h :exactly: :)

Joe

You asked and I responded but you didn't believe me so I refereed you to people I knew you would trust for my proof. I have done work with Transgo since 1989 so this wasn't the first time. That being said there is no need for anyone to bow down to anyone here. As I recall you drug me into this by telling everyone how bad my design was/is and how good yours was. That they were paying for nothing special. The fact is I did not care for the way your converter worked so I did my own. I never belittle yours just stated the differences between mine and everyone else's. I am smart enough to know what I like and what I don't, and if I don't like it it's up to me to do something about it. So I worked out my own design based on what I learned from people I trust. I never took yours or anyone else's apart to see what you were doing, that's not my style. I can also tell you that the first one I did didn't work well but that's just part of learning. I kept at it until I was happy, and now that they are on the market it seems to make a lot of other people happy as well.

Yes, the shaft in the picture was twisted and bent in my words, but if you think a converter is the reason why I must disagree with you. I would like to see a stock truck with just a converter twist or bend a shaft like that, never going to happen. Unless of coarse it was damaged to begin with!

I assume the bet is on the outcome of the testing being done by Mike L. How about a c note on the wining converter.

:grd:

cohuts, cohuts

cohuts, cohuts
Is that asheep call?

Is that asheep call?
I think it's Canadian for "DTT and Westers rock" :eek:

):h just canadian slang

Does anybody know of a good trans shop around Salem Oregon?
Thank You

I did all my back to back "tuner" testing because I found I couldn't believe the numbers that some were getting/posting since they were not duplicable on my truck.
I can only assume that we were not privy to the whole story on why these trucks can accomplish what they did.

Basic scientific testing dictates that the results must be repeatable under like and kind testing conditions.


TTS Xtreme only=503HP/1087TQ,

Well then I'm off to get my Vin to TTS! :muahaha: We get sunny Southern California Days.Have Pump have SuperFlow! :grd:

When you guys are done,and the puddle of piss dries,someone send me a PM what's the best Allison upgrade.


Regards :thankyou2

[QUOTE=smoop]Steve,
" First of all I challenge you to back up the statement"I have seen that same driveshaft picture post on the Dodge boards as coming out of a dodge truck from Sun Coast" find and post it or admit to a blantent lie. To go one step further how about a wager, put your money where your mouth is."

Steve,
I don't see what you don't understand about the above statement, in relation to any mention of a wager.You made a false statement and I challenged you to back it up.

The driveshaft in the picture was posted in humor as "the fusible link". The shaft came from my truck (which is not stock). No one indicated it was nor that it measured torque multiplication, it just happen to occur during a brake stall test on a torque converter. Where you read the extra BS into it, escapes me.

I hope this will be the last post in what has become a personal p-----g
contest between you & I. If it continues lets find another forum where we don't have to bore the guys that just wanted some diesel info.

smoop

Gas Ex

Try Rick @ Salem Transmission-503-364-4714

smoop

I'll give him a call! Thanks Smoop

DTT headquarters is about 4.5hours away from you. If you want you can give me a call and go over your set-up(866-504-4002), plus that way you could see some D-Max twins.:ro)

DTT headquarters is about 4.5hours away from you. If you want you can give me a call and go over your set-up(866-504-4002), plus that way you could see some D-Max twins.:ro)
If one were to make the trip up there would they actually get to SEE the twins? If one were to actually see the twins (even if pictures weren't allowed) one may have to make the trip :cool:

I take it ( one ) might be making a trip?:ro)

When you guys are done,and the puddle of piss dries,someone send me a PM what's the best Allison upgrade.


Regards :thankyou2



Mack I have not had any verbal abuse lately and was feeling a little lonely.

SO here is the link you requested.

http://www.atsdiesel.com/products/products-gm-transmission.asp

Mack I have not had any verbal abuse lately and was feeling a little lonely.

SO here is the link you requested.

http://www.atsdiesel.com/products/products-gm-transmission.asp
Bronco,

Stop cluttering up our pissing match with facts and useful information.
:blahblah:

Bronco,

Stop cluttering up our pissing match with facts and useful information.
:blahblah:
Thanks Trippin, I am starting to feel better. Maybe Mikey and Supperman can come on and smack me around.


If it is usefull info you want, here is some more.
http://www.atsdiesel.com/atsu/atsu-impeller.asp

After visiting this site for years, last night was the first time I found and read the ATS version of how torque converters work and what goes into making a good converter. It is 5 pages with consecutive links. Some interesting reading.

I was suprised to se that they mention Suncoast and BD by name in this right up. Wonder what DTT and TTS have to say about there surface area?

Bronco,

The clutch area for the Sun Coast triple disc is 96" sq
Smoop

If one were to make the trip up there would they actually get to SEE the twins? If one were to actually see the twins (even if pictures weren't allowed) one may have to make the trip :cool:

Well swing over and pick me up.... Everybody loves twins..;)

Wonder how many miles that is?

Well swing over and pick me up.... Everybody loves twins..;)

Wonder how many miles that is?1124.64 miles and at 100mph one could be there in a day :badidea:

Sp33d........ you know that sounds kind'a like it couldn't be done. Well, I spoke with Juice about 9 hours after departure, go figure? Holly SCensored T!







Burner-------------------------> :D

Bronco
I suggest you stay out of any of my posts. I will tell what you are doing to some of the vendors here. I don't like you. I will leave it at that.

1124.64 miles and at 100mph one could be there in a day :badidea:
Two people on a yak? I don't think so.:ro)

Mike, them thar Yaks....uh, they got muffle bear'ns in them? :anitoof:

Bronco
I suggest you stay out of any of my posts. I will tell what you are doing to some of the vendors here. I don't like you. I will leave it at that.
Thanks Dad. I needed some repremanding.

Two people on a yak? I don't think so.:ro)
If that yak had the predator or tts tune installed we could go 120.... They get pretty unstable at that speed I hear though.. Better ask Got Juice, I think he runs his yaks pretty hard.:eek:

Bronco
I suggest you stay out of any of my posts. I will tell what you are doing to some of the vendors here. I don't like you. I will leave it at that.
Okay Mikey, You had to go and post something like this. Normally no big deal, but now I have members here sending me PM's asking me what the hell you are talking about.

So basically you have hinted that I have done something to some of the vendors here.

So spit it out!

Lets clear the air.

she is in, had a dealer in montana do the install(never did a allison before), i waited to receive the newer tq converter from suncaoast(thanks joe) and all went well, biggest job was finding a 1and 7/16 wrench to turn the engine to remove the tq converter bolts, i had to run to a store and buy one):h , kit seamed straight forward, and total install took about 7 hours, if i did it again, take another hour off, i gave a little test drive after without relarning the tranny, shifts were very direct, did a relearn and all seams to be good, a bit sharp still when going to reverse from a forward direction, as for the level two, we seen slipage on the 2 and 4 cpacs, keep you informed with the higher hp levels i want to throw at it, thanks fred

Anyone in the Baltimore - Washington DC area that could install the level 4 Suncoast kit?

Call Joe @ Suncoast 800-868-0053

He found a dealer/installer close by for me.

Thanks Tony... I don't have my truck yet, but with the tuner and future mods I plan to do, looks like the trans will be the weak link.