Seems over the last few weeks my engine is considerably more "rattlely" ...think I have one or two injectors that are definately knocking. Have doubled-up on the Primrose and have gone thru 3-4 tanks of fuel from different locations ...with no change. I'm in Oregon so it's not terribly cold ... 30-40's. Could I have injectors going bad? Anyone in the area want to rent a Predator for a day or 2? :) All other indications normal ...oil level ok, no smoke, clean filters, etc.

Truck has 21K ...Primrose and secondary Racor since new.

Does it knock approx the same while hot or cold? Does it get better or worse above 1500 RPM? Which fuel #1 or #2? I've also noticed a knocking/ticking sound that becomes most noticable above 1500 RPM. Kinda wrote it off as the infamous tick but that usually goes away after about 1K on the oil. This time it seems to be hanging around. Been there for about the last 4 or 5K.

I think it's most noticable cold but definately rattles after warmed up as well. Once warm I think it's most pronounced under load/accelerating. It's not the "tick" sound ... I have that too ...the tick has never gone away ...briefly after oil changes but always returns after a few hundred miles. Overall it just seems much more rattely.

I viewed my balance rates last year and documented them ...also viewed them this summer with MotoVets Predator and they looked good ...but didn't write them down. I'd really like to see what they read now and how the compare to the rates last year. Perhaps I'm being paranoid but I do have good ears ... ex Submarine Sonarman :)

Actually I see no difference either loaded or not. Seems to be related more to RPMs. Yours appears to be somewhat different. Hopefully someone who has experienced injector knock will chime in with some details as to what makes it worst.(load,rpm,temp,etc) Good Luck! Tommy

My truck with NEW injectors is noisier (but not bad) when cold as oppose to warm up,this is normal.When I had a bad injector it would "rap" when hot at idle never under load.This is only ONE example others have had different failure noises and types of bad injector failure.You may just be overly concerned also.

My suggestion would be to STOP using additives as this will mask the problem.Get a Balance rate reading tool and self diagnose and bring it in for Service if necessary.This is the best option to find out if you have a potential problem,IMO.

If you have a good dealer like some of us do (:p) ,it's a no big deal,deal!

This is and There is no reason to go and buy a Dodge,I repeat no reason ever! :D

I guess I'll try and borrow a Predator from someone local ...or bite my lip and buy one. Hate that thought ...

How much for a Predator? Maybe i'll spring for one. PM me. I have other things I would like to try too. KR

Tophog, mine knocks around 1,800 - 1,900 RPM and it seems to only do it when there is a load on the engine. It does not take much of a load as I notice the knock even on relatively small grades. I have 39,000 miles on my pickup and it has made this noise for a while now. It's possible that it has always had the knock but not sure, I just know it's been doing it for a while.
The knock goes away after I pass 1,900 RPM and then she purrs along. Most of my driving is around 70 MPH and 2,000 RPM. However, even if I continue to accelerate past 2,000 RPM the noise stops at around 1,900 RPM. Also, if I drive slower and keep the RPMs around 1,800 the knock goes away after I stop accelerating. I typically don't accelerate real fast or drive real heard as I enjoy my average 18 - 19 MPG.

I too have wondered if this is injector knock and or a reason to be concerned.

This is and There is no reason to go and buy a Dodge,I repeat no reason ever! :D

Yes but other reasons come to mind ;)

lttlfeller, my truck has nearly the same symptoms as what you described. I'm not going to loose sleep over it and will keep my ears/eyes/nose open for signs of failing injectors. The feeling is similar to knowing you have to have your wisdom teeth taken out any day without any prior warning :)

Well I got around to reading my balance rates and also found the numbers I took in Nov 03. No surprises ...pretty much look the same with #7 sticking out like a sore thumb compared to the rest. At what point/value do I become concerned? 6 or higher?

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These are the rates while in 'Drive' with brake applied ...engine at operating temp. I also posted a graph of current rates taken over 2-3 minutes while in drive.

http://home.comcast.net/~tophog/01-09-2005_balancerates.jpg

You mean #8 I'm sure. Looks like my balance rates for a long time until recently when #8 doubled that number.

Replaced all eight,all is good,real good!

No, #7 is about 4.5. The column headers/data got offset when I inserted the info into my post.

If those are in drive, your still in spec. GM says 6.0 in drive.Quit with the additive and see where it goes in a couple thousand miles.

Thanks Eric. I'll force myself not to put additive in for awhile and monitor. Yes, readings are in Drive, with foot on brake, engine around 200...after it was drove all day.

# 7 is around 1.8 when in Neutral ...as soon as I go to drive you can watch it creep up in about 5 seconds to 4.5-4.9 ... and when going to neutral it creeps down to 1.8 or so. Doesn't appear to be getting worse ...which I guess is good but doesn't give me the "warm/fuzzy feeling" either. :) Note, #7 has read +4 since new.

Eric,
This is not the first time I see someone post that additives will mask injector problems. I previously thought it was in reference to the tick. For the life of me I can't figure out how fuel additives can affect balance rates. Is it common for additives to do this? :confused:

Sorry Tophog it was a alignment issue that tricked me.
=================================

Abear the additive adds lubricity which quiets the beast.The tick is oil related if we're thinking the same.

Tommy, I have seen more then one occasion where trucks were starting to get some bad injector symptoms, owner added additive and symptoms went away, or at least got masked.

Ask Silverado Man how long it took after he quit using FPPF to get his injectors to act up again....15k miles

here's a question... does this sound normal? Bad sound byte, I can try to get a better one... Rev in neutral up to 2k followed by in gear up to about 1500 rpm's...Only happens in gear between around 1200-2200 rpm's.

http://www.skynet-mk2.com/music/Decent%20knock.wav

here's a question... does this sound normal? Bad sound byte, I can try to get a better one... Rev in neutral up to 2k followed by in gear up to about 1500 rpm's...Only happens in gear between around 1200-2200 rpm's.

http://www.skynet-mk2.com/music/Decent%20knock.wav
If that is normal I'm going to jump off a cliff. I can hear the very pronounced knock about half way thru the clip when you roll on the throttle slowly. I'm no expert ...just doesn't sound right to me. I'm sure someone that knows their chit will chime in. BTW, my knock is nothing compared to that.

Great. Last time an injector went bad, I lost the whole engine.

Unfortunately, I don't have the cash to go with what I want to do, and that's install the kennedy injectors.

Tommy, I have seen more then one occasion where trucks were starting to get some bad injector symptoms, owner added additive and symptoms went away, or at least got masked.

Ask Silverado Man how long it took after he quit using FPPF to get his injectors to act up again....15k milesIt's a catch-22 ... guys run additive thinking it might help prolong injectors, at least that's why I have always used it primarily ...and only secondarily for any water I may have in fuel.

Then when there is a sign the injectors may be acting up, cease taking medication and remove the I-V and see if lives for a week with no life support. :) I sure could tell it smoked alot more tonight on the way home from work when I layed into it (no additive) ...but doesn't smoke at idle or startup ... yet.

Here's another sound bite, figure this is clearer.

http://www.skynet-mk2.com/music/knocking%20.wav

Interesting


Mine never sounded like that under load but rather quieted once the throttle was touched.Idling it pounded way worst then that although. That definitely needs to be addressed.Have you had the opportunity to check your balance rates?

I hate to say it but if it was a gasser you would be shopping for rod bearings. Hows your oil pressure? I would definately have it looked at by one of the techs. May save you some money if you catch the problem earlier. Good luck, Doug

Oil pressure goes up to 2 bars past 60 on the meter on start up, drops down to 30 on idle, and then around 60 on actual driving, which is normal for our truck.

At 0900 I'm bringing it in for the SES light that came on a week or so ago on the drive back. I'll ask them to check the injector balance, since there is a noticeable "knock" under load. Good thing it's still under warranty.

now only if while I am at PLDC she can convince the service people with her looks and charm that everything else is warranty related, ie suspension/seals stuff...

Oil pressure goes up to 2 bars past 60 on the meter on start up, drops down to 30 on idle, and then around 60 on actual driving, which is normal for our truck.

At 0900 I'm bringing it in for the SES light that came on a week or so ago on the drive back. I'll ask them to check the injector balance, since there is a noticeable "knock" under load. Good thing it's still under warranty.


Your right on the money with diagnostic request.Certainly hearing what I heard it's a no-brainer.

Good luck MrsSpoolin

Last time I ran a Ford that's what is sounded like. Are you sure no one switched your engine??lol

Seriously now. Sure sounds like you have an injector out. Sounds like it's missing and you state it vibrates which confirms that.

Well, it's going to have to wait until I get back from school. She's not going to drive it too much while I am gone anyway so it should be ok. Just hit E so I am going to also check it with a tank of fuel with no additive like Eric said, so if it is all jacked up it's more noticable. The engine in general is louder than usual, but everything is checking out otherwise. I thought it might just be winter blend/cold temperature. I keep it plugged in because it's cold as heck here in anchorage. It's -3 F outside right now, and it ain't supposed to get warmer than 20 degrees till this weekend when it's going to rain.. rainy days are nice because it gets up to around 40 degrees, you run around in a tshirt and shorts then.. lol

Mac,
Thats the noise I was refering to getting masked with additives, I stated tick but it sounds more like a typewriter. It starts at around 1500 RPM and continues there after. I do suppose I possibly could have developed the dreaded oil tick. Doesn't seem to be getting worst but aggrivating to say the least. I'll also ditch the additives for a couple of tanks to see it gets worst. If not it may very well be the oil tick.

here's a question... does this sound normal? Bad sound byte, I can try to get a better one... Rev in neutral up to 2k followed by in gear up to about 1500 rpm's...Only happens in gear between around 1200-2200 rpm's.

http://www.skynet-mk2.com/music/Decent%20knock.wav

From the TSB about "overdrive lockout" it states the following...

" At engine speeds above 2600 RPM, and a fuel quantity supply greater than 35 cu mm, it is necessary to eliminate pilot injection to meet emission requirements. When driving at or above these speeds, main injection combustion noise may be noticeable. It is normal and not harmful to the engine."

Others have noticed that it will actually shut off at lower rpms (2000-2600 rpm and under a load) - so the above statement should probably state "OR" rather than "AND" with reference to rpm and fuel flow. My guess is that your fuel demand is exceeding 35 cu mm as you "power brake" and the pilot injection is shutting off.

- jeff