just curious how long some of you have had a heath fsd kit installed,and failures experienced. You may also chime in with homemade kits in bumpers.

I havent heard of any guys with the Heath PMD have failure...plus if im not mistaken they have a 7yr warranty.

I've had mine for 2 1/2 years and so far no problems

I'm almost at 2 years with the Heath PMD and no issues.

Andy

Almost 3 yrs, no issues. I haven't heard of any failures.

going into year 4 on one, and year 3 on the other so far so good

My bumper mounted PMD failed - it had spent about 30 000 kms on the intake manifold though....DSG said that it was the best place to put them....yeah right...

I had a Heath PMD-2 Isolater FSD fail last month on 1997 sig truck.It was the later part # 34583 Stanadyne PMD. They are replacing under warranty. It isn't Heaths fault by any means. Just a GM statistical outcome. Now I will probably get a DIPACO driver. It was between two & three years old and maybe 40 to 50 k of use. The nature of the failure was as disturbing to me as if I had bought a new IP & PMD the same time/miles back & was having a failure. The truck lost power & kept slowing till it was barely running roughly at a slow idle & creeping in first gear. No RPM response to modulating the APP. I went less than one mile before it was on the shoulder.Thankful it was flat & paved. I had it towed, consulted with TurbineDoc,trouble shot the fuel system,nothing found there. So I hooked a temporary FSD to the harness & it ran smoothly immediately. It also st a fuel solenoid "time"code. Now I had an operative one on the IP but that is not something I would want to reconnect hanging over the engine beside the road, or worse in a traffic lane !!!. Having 250k ,mostly towing in the seat of an early 6.2 & only having a 700R4 warranty transmission problem once that I elected to stop traveling before failure is where I'm coming from!! I expect "better".

Thanks for posting, 4drTahoe! That's the first one I've ever heard of that failed.

Glad to hear that Heath is standing behind their Warranty... with anybody else, at 2-3 yrs, you'd be SOL and buying a new one. Finally, somebody got some use out of that warranty!

what is special about the Heath kit ?
I have seen atleast 70 trucks in the last 4 years with the remote kits come in the shop with bad PMD's. we even had a guy who wired computer fans around the remote kit w/pmd and it failed.

Jay

ROFL. I rest my case. If those 70 owners would have bought the Heath PMD Isolator in the first place, you might (**MIGHT**) have seen 1 truck come in over the last 4 years.

But they all elected to save $100 by purchasing something else, or by indulging themselves in a gadget rather than solid engineering, good materials, and common sense.

Really worked well, huh?

The Heath PMD Isolator works by

a) mounting the FSD on a massive, machined-surface aluminum plate that has lots of mass to absorb heat without undergoing heat soak, as well as lots of surface area to get rid of that heat faster than it can be absorbed.

b) mounting the PMD with premium thermal transfer technology and securing it to the plate with high-grade fasteners. The FSD is sealed to prevent weather damage.

c) the whole thing is moved out of the hot engine bay with an extension cable.

Like I said, solid engineering, good materials, and common sense.

No gadget fans, pelletier coolers, transverse or longitudinal fins, anodizing, etc.

Best of all, they come with a 7-yr replacement warranty.

Or, you could just save $100 and take your chances. It appears at least 70 people did.

That is the purpose of this thread to me.I am attempting to get past the flag waving for Heath, (or at least determine if that is all that it is),and determine if the actual difference is getting the pmd out of the engine compartment.My own experience was a pmd failure at 104,000 mi.,(dealer replaced,still on IP , then a lift pump at approx 180,000, then a pmd again at 235,000,(in '05)at that time moved to fender on an amplifier heatsink.This only lasted about 30,000 miles. I have now purchased a Dtech ($240) and will place it on a larger amplifier heatsink behind the bumper.I am just a dumb old country boy but $549-$240 is $309

I haven't seen any of the other PMD units so I can't say if they are good or bad. However, if "heat soak" really is the killer of the PMD then getting them out of the engine bay is paramount.

I think there may also be something in how the PMD is mounted to the heat sink. I know from experience that improper mounting will reduce the thermal transfer to the heatsink and thus...shorten the life of the component. Heath's unit comes preassembled...no "at home" assembly of the heat sink and the PMD.

$549 / 7 years = $78.43 per year
$240 / 3 years = $80.00 per year

I reckon it's how long you want the warranty to last and how long you want to keep the truck.

My 2 Cents. Happy with Heath.

I haven't seen any of the other PMD units so I can't say if they are good or bad. However, if "heat soak" really is the killer of the PMD then getting them out of the engine bay is paramount.

I think there may also be something in how the PMD is mounted to the heat sink. I know from experience that improper mounting will reduce the thermal transfer to the heatsink and thus...shorten the life of the component. Heath's unit comes preassembled...no "at home" assembly of the heat sink and the PMD.

$549 / 7 years = $78.43 per year
$240 / 3 years = $80.00 per year

I reckon it's how long you want the warranty to last and how long you want to keep the truck.

My 2 Cents. Happy with Heath.


Or as has been in past Stanadyne lasting only 6 mos so $480 in 1 yr, or in my case 3x in a single year 36K, 70K (salvaged once with a retorque) and final 4th at 119K; it would be flag waving if the Heath did not work as advertised, also the Dipaco is new to the market since 2007, Dipaco makes good stuff, but 1st go at drivers so possibly may be some as of yet undefined issues lurking, Heath is now using Dipacos with their kits but still are holding to the 7yr no BS warranty. One on truck going into 4th year and on Burb going into 3rd year

Not saying home built remotes out of bay can't work successfully, just that if by simple bad driver from vintage of lot produced; one is on the hook again to replace the driver on their own.

do you guys mount them on the inside or the outside of the skid plate under the truck?

Heath's instructions are clear - on the outside. I'm not even sure it would fit on the inside.

Rob :)

wouldn't huge puddle kill this thing?

that is kind of the point.If many of the failures were "bad lot number units "Heath would have experienced them also. I am not attacking Heath,but there are lots of ways to look at warranties. (1) customer sells vehicle before expiration. (2) price has one or more replacement unit costs built in. (3) unit is more reliable in new location. (4)any combination thereof...example ,I got five years out of the second stanadyne unit mounted on the pump,two years on fender mount. That is seven years.

My understanding is that the FSD unit is sealed against the elements, at least with the Heath Kit.

Rob :)

that is kind of the point.If many of the failures were "bad lot number units "Heath would have experienced them also. I am not attacking Heath,but there are lots of ways to look at warranties. (1) customer sells vehicle before expiration. (2) price has one or more replacement unit costs built in. (3) unit is more reliable in new location. (4)any combination thereof...example ,I got five years out of the second stanadyne unit mounted on the pump,two years on fender mount. That is seven years.


Yours lasting as long as it has has not been the norm within the community that haunts the forums; on this & other boards I've been on only one fail reported on any units since 2000 so rate is very low, one could almost say remote mounted per Heath method cures fails may be more fails out there but none on the 3 main GM 6.5 forums out there.

That is the purpose of this thread to me.I am attempting to get past the flag waving for Heath, (or at least determine if that is all that it is),and determine if the actual difference is getting the pmd out of the engine compartment.My own experience was a pmd failure at 104,000 mi.,(dealer replaced,still on IP , then a lift pump at approx 180,000, then a pmd again at 235,000,(in '05)at that time moved to fender on an amplifier heatsink.This only lasted about 30,000 miles. I have now purchased a Dtech ($240) and will place it on a larger amplifier heatsink behind the bumper.I am just a dumb old country boy but $549-$240 is $309

I completely understand and agree with both your logic and your math. Am I a Heath flag-waver? Yeah, I guess I am. Here's why...

I have a Heath. I've looked it over closely, and I think I could probably build one, 'cause I'm a handy kind of guy. I also have a computer engineering background, so I get the whole thermodynamics and circuitry thing. I could have made my own, by mounting it on a heat sink (cost, $60, probably could have made my own from an old PLC for nothing). I already have both thermal pads and Arctic Silver thermal grease, so that saves another $20. I know how to splice/solder wires, and how to use shrink-wrap and liquid tape, so I probably could have saved an additional $70 on the extension cable. I have fasteners, etc. I could have got the new Stanadyne PMD for about $340, so I would have saved myself about $209 (the average guy, having to buy all the stuff, would have paid $490, and would have saved $59)

Either way, me or the average guy saved money.

But what if one fails? Given the history of these things, it's not that far out of the range of possibility that my home-made PMD might crap out on me, agreed?

And then I have to buy another PMD, since I would be without warranty. Aside from having to go through all that stalling, having my truck crap out when merging onto the freeway, having my power steering and power brakes fail when I'm pulling my trailer in traffic, and stuff like that...

So... that's the trade-off.

Pay me now, or pay me later. Would my home-built PMD last 7 years? Maybe. Is the extra $200 I spend worth it, over 7 years? It is, to me.

You only need to use the warranty once.

Now, you might think this is flag-waving, but I've been on this forum for a long time, and I've seen a lot of people who saved themselves money by building their own. I've also seen a lot of people mad because their contraption crapped out, and they ended up spending more than they saved. The best part is, most of them bought ANOTHER non-Heath PMD, because they couldn't admit they were wrong.

Man, were they pi$$ed the second time their contraption failed!!

So that'e my story. It ain't that short, it ain't that good, but it's mine.

I truly hope your home-built unit works out for ya... I hope EVERYONE's home-built units work out.

But I wouldn't bet on it... I like better odds than that.

Keep us posted, OK?

I am playing a little of devil's advocate here. If Heath is now using the DTech unit that costs them a lot less, why hasn't their price on their PMD isolator dropped? Potential warranty padding on a mostly unproven electrical component?

I got a question about Heath's Isolater. Say you buy one, 5 years later it craps out and the 7 year warranty covers it. When you get the new one, does it come with a 7 year warranty again? If it does, then as long as it craps out before 7 years is up each time, you will never need to buy another PMD as long as you own your truck. If this is how it works, I see a lot of PMD's gettin' replaced just before the 7 year thing.

I guess that's always a possibility.

Me, if mine lasts 7 years, I would consider that a great deal. I don't think I could talk myself into contriving to have one die just before the warranty... I need to shave in the morning, and that's damn hard when ya can't look in the mirror.

I guess that's always a possibility.

Me, if mine lasts 7 years, I would consider that a great deal. I don't think I could talk myself into contriving to have one die just before the warranty... I need to shave in the morning, and that's damn hard when ya can't look in the mirror.

exactly!!! but there are some that will

exactly!!! but there are some that will

All we can do is continue to stand as a good example.
http://www.compuserve.ca/cpeh/forums/arts/gfx/paulgross_mountie.jpg

Thank you kindly.

I would think the warranty would be dated to the original date of purchase. Who could ask for more?
Leo

Heaths warranty is over at seven years. No warranty starts over but some warrantys in automotive are extended by the fact the replacement assembly/componet has a specific time & or mileage warranty that goes beyond the original time/mileage. I had a 90 Surburban 6.2 that blessed me with new GM goodwrench 1993 6.5 engine & reman Good Wrench transmission.They even changed over my ATS Turbo for nix. Besides that I lucked in to getting the complete engine core for nix that only had a few cylinders with piston ring fuel washout. IIRC I had eight years of engine coverage an near the same on the trans all total . At the time the warranty read "If a covered item failure causes a failure of another componet or assembly then that assy. is covered also". Local rebuilt IP or injectors,sublet by the dealer, or the installing tech was the culprit. ON EDIT:Well come to think of it auto batteries warranty start over so I need to retract the big NO!!! LOL

I am playing a little of devil's advocate here. If Heath is now using the DTech unit that costs them a lot less, why hasn't their price on their PMD isolator dropped? Potential warranty padding on a mostly unproven electrical component?

This is the second time I've seen this question asked, third time counting me. Still no answer. And maybe a little comparison shopping between Heath and SSDiesel is in order. SS is probably the largest remote mount provider, better price and excellent service. Going back to Stanadyne, too, I heard.
One last thought, does anyone know if DTech makes their own resistor? I can't believe Stanadyne is going to let their resistors be used in a DTech product.
This is Heath flag-waving country, tho, no doubt of that.

IMHO, the warrentee is mainly because the FSD isolator works. I also think that the slightly higher price is to cover a possible claim. Especially with the D-TECH, as it is yet un-proven in long term use. But, the statistics speak for themselves. If there is only one reported failure of the Heath unit that most, if not all members know of from this site, with most of the site running them, it pretty much speaks for itself. Common sense will tell you to forget about the SSD unit unless you move it out of the engine bay. The way it comes, you move it from where it gets the cooling of the return fuel flow, to where there is no cooling at all. The lack of cooling will let the smoke out. Don't get me wrong, SSD is a great seller, good service, great everything, but, for the FSD, we went Heath, at a time we where buying nothing but SSD. Why? Because I sit here, and use 10 minutes to search. I sometimes pass time searching the 6.5 forum.

I am playing a little of devil's advocate here. If Heath is now using the DTech unit that costs them a lot less, why hasn't their price on their PMD isolator dropped? Potential warranty padding on a mostly unproven electrical component?

You really got it on for these guys, don't you? First you claimed to be just a guy who had a couple of 'engineer friends' that sawed a DTech and Stanadyne in half and had serious problems with the DTech (you called it a Chinese copy, as I recall). Then you turn out to be a distributor that shipped over 6000 Stanadyne PMDs to happy customers (for remote mounting) with only 4 failures. ROFL.

And you spend a couple of your 15 posts flogging SSDiesel.



This is the second time I've seen this question asked, third time counting me. Still no answer. And maybe a little comparison shopping between Heath and SSDiesel is in order. SS is probably the largest remote mount provider, better price and excellent service. Going back to Stanadyne, too, I heard.

Let's check the facts, shall we?

Accurate Diesel is selling the PMD and Heat-sync kit for $360
SSDieselSupply pricing on the same kit is $375

Funny... AccurateDiesel sells the SSDiesel Heat-sync (sp) with the DTech PMD, and resistor as a package for less than SSDiesel does.

And they're a site vendor. We like site vendors.

They also recommend an extension cable and remote mounting. At $75, that puts the SSDiesel price up to $450. For a PMD that's known to fail (often in less than 2 years) with a 1-yr warranty


One last thought, does anyone know if DTech makes their own resistor? I can't believe Stanadyne is going to let their resistors be used in a DTech product.

ROFL. Now exactly WHAT do they have to do with each other?

Of course you can use a stanadyne resistor with a DTech PMD if you want... jeez. That's like saying you can't put Ford floor mats in a Chev. LOL.

This is Heath flag-waving country, tho, no doubt of that

Yep. Happy customers on-site.

I am playing a little of devil's advocate here. If Heath is now using the DTech unit that costs them a lot less, why hasn't their price on their PMD isolator dropped? Potential warranty padding on a mostly unproven electrical component?

Honestly? I dunno. Accuratediesel sells the bare DTech PMD for $240. DiPaco has listed it (earlier thread) for $299. Stanadyne prices were about $320, then went up over $400 for a few weeks, and when so many people quit buying them and started buying Dtech, they went back down. Last I looked, they were around $275 again.

Anyway, the DTech ones appear to be about $35 cheaper. If the warranty stays at 7 years, I wouldn't worry about it, but if you need to know, call Bill and ask.

Heath's remote mount is weather-proofed - most home-brews are not even assembled correctly, much less weather-proofed - shade-tree engineering has as much to do with the resulting failures as the oem mounting\location scheme had to do with those failures.

I replaced my one-and-only failure with a pre-owned module in Sept '01, mounting it on the Inj Pump, as designed, for R&D - removed it from the IP in Sept '05, mounted it on a large heatsink, where it is still fully functional to this day, well within specs, as monitored with GMTDScan, verified with Tech2.

The problem was, and always will be if not mounted\located correctly, heat related, incl specifically heat-soak - loosens tension on the high-current driver fasteners, loses electrical conductivity, things internal begin to degrade: poof!

Engine bay = bad - intake manifold bad, period, no matter what ssDiesel tells ya! - firewall bad - fenderwell bad - tiny computer fan bad (just blows concentrated engine bay heat over the module!) - if the module runs at 200deg, and engine bay is 285deg, just what, exactly, are you cooling with that little fan, eh? - apparently logical thought is not considered a prerequsite for "re-engineering" an electronic control system.

Removing\extending the ground wire attached to the Inj Pump = bad, period! - no matter what ssDiesel tells ya.

Other failures caused by placing the electronic module in any location exposed to wet weather - the module will survive repeated submerging if it is sealed:
- RTV in the mounting screw holes
- RTV on the mounting-screw threads in the heatsink (ever hear of 'seepage'?)
- NO AUXILLIARY PRE-INSTALLED HOLES IN THE HEATSINK BENEATH\DIRECTLY UNDER THE MODULE!!!!!!! - sure, lets more air in under the module......not even good when it's DRY air!!!
- RTV completely around the module perimeter where it joins the heatsink surface
- connector weatherpak in-place and sealed - can use the GM\equiv moisture-excluding grease as used in Corvette and Cadillac connectors
- make sure the harness has a service loop, where water drips off the loop at a point lower than the connector

18awg extension wiring ok to max 72" limit, must be RTV-sealed at the splices to be waterproof

Again - do not move or extend the black ground wire on the Inj Pump

Doesn't take much to emulate the Heath system for longevity\reliablity - just takes DOING IT!!!!!!!!

ifaire,I am also trained in electronics,though only a 2yr degree, but 30 yrs. ago when op-amps were new and 1k memory chips were huge.I do appreciate Heath's warranty and the confidence it takes to offer it. I now sell car audio,and I find it highly uncommon to see any electronic piece warrantied that long.I started this thread because, after searching, I found many had moved the pmd,most unsuccessfuly.The responses have shown me that the Heath units are just reaching the mileage/age that I got from the original pump mounted setup.I have not seen many homebuilt under bumper users that used new pmd's so it is still up in the air whether that is a true option or not.However if I can get 4yrs. on one pmd and 3 on the next I am ahead. I do appreciate the responses and I hope no one thinks I am bashing any vendor...t

Hi all,

ROFL. Now exactly WHAT do they have to do with each other?

Of course you can use a stanadyne resistor with a DTech PMD if you want... jeez. That's like saying you can't put Ford floor mats in a Chev. LOL.

Of course you can use a Stanadyne resistor with a DTech PMD...unless, of course, Stanadyne decides to pull the individual part numbers for their resistors and stops selling them piecemeal. Then what?
I can buy a PMD kit from SSDiesel for $375. Heath's is $549. 7 yrs. doesn't mean jack if the part is no longer around. (I have absolutely nothing against Heath, btw.) It just seems to me that if DTech were in it for the long haul, they would make their own resistor and not have to worry about Stanadyne pulling the plug.
And I did not post the devil's advocate comment. Whether or not you believe my sales figures also doesn't mean jack to me.
Finally, in my repair bays, ALL pmds get mounted on the intake because it cures the problem and they DON'T come back. 5 years and counting.

DM65,
evidence here and other sites is that intake mounts do not work, if they do; where is the warranty that backs them in that location simple as that put your or SSD's money backing that solution, Heath does NOBODY ELSE DOES period.

Without objection this thread or horse has been sufficiently beaten to death, I'm closing it, PM me if you see a compelling reason to reopen it.

In summation, Heath units work if don't they replace them, to date on this site we have seen 1 reported incident, and we track PMD successes & fails here very closely, several polls on the sitre for fails vs non fails and locations of the fails.

Anywhere underhood is a recipie for failure, simple data shows this, argue price if you will you might save a buck or 2 doing it another way than Heath does it, free market do as you wish some home builts last well outside engine bay some don't economics reality is that when the home build quits again one has to buy another at prevailing market price which to date hasn't gone down any. Generally we don't allow discussion of vendor A vs vendor B price discussion as it becomes a battle of opinion of what is the better deal another reason to lock this thread down. Opinions are like tail holes we all got one, for sure somebody won't like the way it smells :D regardless how fragrant individually we think our own smells

I reopend this at request of 4dr Tahoe he has an update to the failure of his Heath remote mount, it will remain open so long as posts remain objective and post doesn't again digress to beating of dead horses.

Well guys I reported a failure of the Heath PMD-2 FSD in my possesion & use. This unit was on the top truck in my sig when I bought the truck. Un beknowing to me the seller had purchased the isolater plate alone from Heath & installed his OWN FSD. Heath use to sell it that way at some period of time. When I sent it to Heaths they noticed the FSD was not attached by there proprietary method to the isolater plate, so no warranty .They were very nice to me,just like I was a paying customer. Not a problem for me . I also got a new heath PMD-2 ,still in the shipping box at the time with the truck also. I have a new FSD I got thru a trade so I'm going to install it on the plate. I plan to mount a second FSD on the plate as I have a used FSD & actually will use it till it dies. It is like any other used FSD ,in that it may be a crap shoot as to whether it is long or short life. It was installed new on a truck for 6 months thru the winter ,then a new pump & driver was installed so I suppose it could have long life potential. One thing for sure there is no warranty. I'm relieved as guys here were saying they knew of no failures of a Heath PMD-2 so I'm glad to not blemish the record. They,Heaths are the best & that is First in Class !!!

Good failure, then - to prep the indicated module, first check the torque on the 1/4" nuts on the two transistor drivers to see if they are currently loose - now, back them off so they are loose, then run them down finger-tight - tighten 1/4 turn more - now the module is ready for installation on the heatsink - give it a test run - again with the RTV sealing to weatherproof the installation, and yer good to go..................

That's excellent feedback. When I called Bill to order one of his FSD kits without the FSD (The previous owner of the 'burb purchased a brand-new FSD - it was still in the factory box, so I just wanted the mounting kit. Plus, I have experience as an electronics technician, so I know how to solder/use heat sink compound/RTV/torque, etc.)

Bill said they used to sell them that way, but people couldn't be relied upon to mount them properly, which would negate the warrantee, so he stopped selling them that way.

Since I have two vehicles, I purchased Bill's kit, and also bought an SSDiesel kit, and finally Kennedy's 72" harness. Having purchased one of everything, I would say that Heath's kit is the best overall, plus the 7-year warrantee is unmatched. Kennedy's harness, however, is quite a bit better than Heath's as I think Kennedy has actually commissioned a molded female connector for the extension, which is plug-and-play weather-sealed, etc. Finally, SSDiesel's heat sink is well-manufactured, with holes in just the right places, and mounts under the bumper really well. It remains to be seen which setup will last longer, but both of them are out of the engine bay. Both get pretty dirty. I did RTV-seal the under-bumper SSDiesel/Kennedy combo recently, so it's possible it may have gotten some moisture damage. We'll see!

Sincerely,

Rob :)

Nice, Rob. You appear to be covering all the bases; I appreciate the details you provide!

Facts beat opinion every time.