Since I cant really put this in the other threads maybe you guys could give me some advice . This is about towing with my 94 Dually 454.I cant seem to pull up 6% grades with 10k loads over 45-50 mph . And the motor is really working hard . I have to manually shift from drive to second just to keep my momemtum up .If I try and put it in drive it searches for a gear constantly and I am afraid it will fry a clutch plate . Now I am thinking of putting a gear vendor in this truck but do you guys really think this would solve my problem by splitting the gears . They are very pricey but so is a new truck . I have a 6.5 I am going to try out and see if it does any better . What do you guys think about the gear vendors?

You might try thinking of going with different gears in the rear end. What do you have now?

Pretty sure 4.10 would have to double check on this .Yes it is I looked at the sticker for it .

That engine is only rated at 230 hp. A gear vendor OD will probably help some, but I wouldn't expect miracles.

with that big of load going up that grade the load on the motor should be pretty constant, if the tranny keeps hunting for a gear then the vacuum modulator on your tranny may be bad. (I'm assuming that year had them) if your not playing with the gas pedal allot it should find a gear and stay until the vaccum raises, (which means it finally caught up) then it would try the next gear. if you modulator is bad and/or it's leaking vacuum then it'll hunt all over not knowing what gear to stay in. by you shifting to 2nd you over-riding the automation of the modulator. easy fix (if you have one)

Ya I know the motor is kinda wimpy to say the least and its tough to put 3,500 into a truck thats this old ,but 50-54 k for a new one is a bitter pill to swallow now isnt it .
On the transmission gear hunting it wasnt like that at all , it was just pushed to the limit I think .Because once it hit the next gear it just bogged down pretty quickly . To tell you the truth I kinda baby her a little I just hate to push the peddle to the floor for the entire grade plus I dont think thats a good thing to do with a load like that .
Probably time to get a new Diesel :rolleyes:. It's hard for me to part with her we have been together since 94 ....:(

Well if you don't want to spend the cabbage for a new truck, you can spend a lot less and go Forced induction. You only have 77,000 miles, It'll take it just fine. a gasser will never make the torque of a diesel. but you can almost double the torque you have by force feeding it. I get the same, somtimes better milage than I did stock. Oh, if I'm aggressive I can suck up fuel really quick, but just driving around It's not that different. and I can spank the unsuspecting pretty easily :D

Well if you don't want to spend the cabbage for a new truck, you can spend a lot less and go Forced induction. You only have 77,000 miles, It'll take it just fine. a gasser will never make the torque of a diesel. but you can almost double the torque you have by force feeding it. I get the same, somtimes better milage than I did stock. Oh, if I'm aggressive I can suck up fuel really quick, but just driving around It's not that different. and I can spank the unsuspecting pretty easily :D

When you say "Forced Induction" are you refering to supercharging ?

Yes, some great kits available these days. I don't think I'll ever own a non FI vehicle again, it's a huge difference.

Well its another option I will look into ( supercharger) thanks.

Yes, some great kits available these days. I don't think I'll ever own a non FI vehicle again, it's a huge difference.

Well its another option I will look into ( supercharger) thanks.


x2.... magna makes a good charger that doesnt rob too much power off the engine. 3500 on a new charger definitly is a lot easier than 45k on a new truck....;)

Ya I know the motor is kinda wimpy to say the least and its tough to put 3,500 into a truck thats this old ,but 50-54 k for a new one is a bitter pill to swallow now isnt it .
On the transmission gear hunting it wasnt like that at all , it was just pushed to the limit I think .Because once it hit the next gear it just bogged down pretty quickly . To tell you the truth I kinda baby her a little I just hate to push the peddle to the floor for the entire grade plus I dont think thats a good thing to do with a load like that .
Probably time to get a new Diesel :rolleyes:. It's hard for me to part with her we have been together since 94 ....:(

Sell the 454,and drop in a 94-98 12V cummins 5.9. Its better than any of the new diesels out there,since its emisssion levels arent required to be so low,they were able to focus on durability,and economy,unlike the new diesels that have had to sacrifice both to have a clean tailpipe.The 12V is easy to work on,gets MUCH better fuel mileage and way more reliability than all the new trucks.Easy to upgrade to run with the new trucks power wise too.

That engine is only rated at 230 hp. A gear vendor OD will probably help some, but I wouldn't expect miracles.

What year did they go to 290 hp? That's what my old 97 Vortec 7.4 was rated at IIRC and it was kind of doggish with a heavy bumper pull TT.

vortec style came out in '96 for the 350 and 454 IIRC. That's where the big jump in hp/tq came from.

have you got fresh fluid and a clean filter in the tranny? we had a 91 with the 454 tonowanda and it could pull our dual tandem 32' gooseneck and 555d ford backhoe 80mph up any hill we crossed.

have you got fresh fluid and a clean filter in the tranny? we had a 91 with the 454 tonowanda and it could pull our dual tandem 32' gooseneck and 555d ford backhoe 80mph up any hill we crossed.
Yes I do , and I always thought this truck could handle it , I have that same motor . I was wondering about the injectors on the TBI .Can they go bad or get real gummed up and affect performance ?

update : The wife said lets just get a new truck in a few months . :D Now I have to decide which one I like the best its down to the the GMC and Dodge I'm afraid . I know that statement will get some snickers , but I have looked at the two and like what ive seen . I hate decisions !! :rolleyes:

Gut the short block, add forged pistons, crower rods, Isky camshaft with 10-12 Deg lobe separation on about 650 lift.

Pull anything you wanna!

Well I bumped this back up again because the plan has changed - but again . Seems to be a constant around here but what the heck . I just cant seem to sell myself on the new truck idea when I have a decent one that can be upgraded a bit to satisfy my needs .
So I am just going to start putting mild upgrades in her .
So I wanted to ask you guys about those chips that they program for your ODB-1 . They claim to deliver 30hp gains which I would be happy with for starters . Are these for real or just a gimmick ? Anyone use one ?

One part number is all you need...

ZZ502

Well its another option I will look into ( supercharger) thanks.
If your mechanically inclined,just swap in a Cummins 12V diesel.It costs literally 200-400 dollars to buy governor springs and buy/grind the fuel plate,which will conservatively yield you 250-300RWHP and 750-800ft lbs torque lbs torque at the wheels with exc relaibillity and effortless towing.You wont even feel the trailer behind you,it wont even kick down on hills towing,unless they are big suckers.Try to get that from a 454 at the wheels,you'll spend more than the swap costs,it'll be finicky and it will need 3800-4500rpm to do it,not 1500-2500RPM where you need it.Last reason you will get 16-22 mpg with a Cummins 12v empty and 10-15mpg pulling heavy.

One part number is all you need...

ZZ502

Only 6,698 $$ , not a bad motor at all I guess I'm not going to get out of this cheap .

Jim---

Don't give up on your BB!! Its' mileage indicates it
is time for some fixes to make it perfect. Try adding a
few inexpensive parts. NAPA Parts. Do a tune-up. But
not an ordinary tune-up. Add a set of 41-993 AC Delco
Platinum plugs gapped at 45-thousanths. Add the cap and rotor from NAPA's best. Throw on a set of their Blue
Max Wires. Use the NAPA/Wix filter products. Put a top-of-the-line NAPA/Wix PAPER media air filter element in
it and try to duct cool, outside air to the OE air cleaner.
Go to Autozone and buy their 185* F. thermostat for
$9.99 and put it in the engine. It says Duralast on the
box, but it is really a Motorad high-flow stainless unit.
Lastly change over to Mobil 1 15W-50 Syn Motor Oil.
It will freeze the engine's wear at your 77 K miles (barely
broken in) and the engine will clean up internally and
get better with each oil change. After a few crankcases
of the Mobil 1, you can begin to stretch out the time
interval between changes...

Use a fuel injection cleaner called Techron by Chevron
in the Top Tier gasoline and have the fuel pressure
checked after installing a new gas filter. That'll give you
an idea of the health of the fuel pump, which oft-times
expires at about 50K...

The tune-up will co$t about $200 bucks in parts, plugs.
cap & rotor, wires, fluids, and filters...and I say it will
run stronger..my 454 did and it is lugging around
22,000# like it was nothing..

Steady Eddie
1998 454 Vortec
P12 Chassis/Allison
with a Newmar Coach
on it....

My Dad and I are going to talk about what option for my 454 will be best for me over the Holiday. He's an old gearhead . We already talked on the phone today for an hour . Looking at either useing the block I have and making it more powerful or just buying a new motor all together . I really want to keep the block I have . Would be nice not to have to change the wireing harneses and all the other parts. I love my truck I was looking at her today and I was thinking I have had this since new and she still doesn't leave a drop of oil on the ground and has never left me stranded ( it did once just a few months ago ) . That was a $40. fix and back on the road so no big deal / it was an idler pulley bearing that went bad of all things .
So now in my most recent thought process ( which you see changes like a revolving door ) I am going to figure on a 10k budget for this project . I still have a lot of research to do on this project and my next step is to find someone in my area who can handle this job . I can turn a wrench but my skill level only goes so far basic tune-ups and such are about my limits . Plus I got this leg thats in several pieces from a motorcycle accident so I am not of much use at this time .All your ideas are great and appreciate all the input you have given me and please keep em comming .

Edelbrock make a kit to convert it to port injection. Still uses the stock TB, but you pull the injectors. They also make a .25" stroker crank for the one pc rear main seal blocks. That along w/a .060" bore would get you 496:D. Put a set of Vortec heads or Merlin heads on it. Adapt a nice hydraulic roller cam into it.

That is what I was going to do to my 93 before I got the LLY.

Jim--

Your father and I sound like old friends. Please tell him
that my suggestions are to reduce the idea of heat-induced
spark retard from crippling your BB's power output.
My Vortec L21 454 is an OBD2 compliant rig, different
than your OBD1 454, but both are subject to spark retard. You will lose horsepower in Arizona from the
heat. The spark retard is built in and it yanks timing
out of the motor at certain temperature points. My
L21 454's brainbox has the ability to pull fully 20-
degrees of timing out. That equates to a net LOSS
of 80 Horsepower, with no driver input from you.
You could spend thousands of dollars searching for
an additional 80 HP and it is there all along.

The plug gap narrowing trick on an 8.1 L engine has
given consistant gains of 18 rear wheel horsepower
on Brazel RV's chassis dyno and RWHP horses are
BIG, much bigger than Flywheel HP. Like a Draft Horse
compared to a Pony.

I like your idea of keeping the original block. The part
numbers match and that may be worth alot to someone
someday. It DOES NOT need to be bored out or changed
in any re-builder's way--at 77K it is new, doesn't leak,
and is fine...your admitted easy use tells me it is perfect. It has tons of torque, you just need to help it
get there..Air in air out, like Gale Banks...only cool.

Steady Eddie
"Cool is as Cool Does"

Rebuild, to what you want. Great rebuild with excellent parts, to make 425HP, 650TQ range would only accumulate to about 2500 bucks. Probably your best...and cheapest for the best idea.

However, fuel mileage with any configuration on a gas rat will suffer greatly.

In your post #19 you asked about OBD-1 chips and said
you'd be happy with a 30 HP increase, I think you can get there (30HP) with a tune-up and a change in fluids
and filters and new, re-gapped plugs...

Two schools of thought. On the one hand, some would
say to tear into your perfect BB, do a bunch of expensive
machine work, that you probably can't check the quality of, and go with it. On the other hand, when your rig was new, it had lots of steam, what changed??

Steady Eddie
L21 Vortec

Jim I just read the post and based on my experience you have a fuel issue. I'm not saying a new engine won't be cool but you should at least fix this one first and then decide if you really need to spend $10,000 or just $300. If you get this one running right you might find just a few upgrades to it will be enough.

Unless you've already tried a fresh fuel filter and found no change pull the filter off and try to blow through it. If you have to use your diaphram to force air through that's a problem. This is the problem in at least 80% of my customers lack of power or trans hunting under load concerns.

Also the TBI's do mess up, usually it's just one and the engine runs lean on one injector and rich on the other. I've seen it several times on older GM TBI's still in service. The O2 sensor only sees the end results and so the ECM keeps adding fuel until it's in specs. If it's a weak injector that means 4 cylinders will be lean to ok and four will be way rich but the whole thing is never right. What you guys should do is pull off the engine breather and hook up a variable advance type (adjustable) timing light upto the coil to distributor spark cable. Then start the engine and aim the flash at each injector's spray pattern while revving the engine up and down in nuetral. You may have to adjust the timing advance reading on the light to get a good view of the fuel spray. What you should see is a nice cone spraying down that gets thicker when you blip the throttle open. When one (or both) are bad you'll see the cone falter or the pattern goes away and drips off. They should always look the same, if one is different go by what I described as to which is bad.

The last thing is fuel pressure, the regulator is built into the TBI, it's the gold (usually) bump between the injectors up high and offset. It should maintain 10-14 PSI at WOT under a load, at least running through 3rd gear to 5,000 RPM in your manual trans truck. The higher within limits the better for power. The biggest problem here is that you have to have a special tool and gauge to monitor the pressure on the GM TBI. Find a shop that will check it for a reasonable fee or just get a rebuild kit and replace the regulator if all else fails.

Keep in mind a fuel pump can just get weak or restricted. If I observe low pressure I have to find the rubber section of the return line under the floor pan front and clamp it off. Then do the test over again. If the PSI stays low it's the fuel pump not the regulator, if the PSI goes way up and stays there it's the regulator on the TBI.

If you see any of these things with the TBI unit and also have some throttle shaft slack in the housing due to wear you might as well swap on a rebuilt TBI unit and get new everything all at once.

Vernon