I am looking into getting a 5th wheel toyhauler but wanted to do some research on what I would have to do with my truck. I've got a cognito 9" lift with 37" tires and figured I would have to lower it to 7" and 35" tires to get the hitch height close. Well come to think of it I was looking into buying a 4500 series and that bed seemed to as high if not higher than mine. Just curious. Thanks

I am selling my 4500. You can go here to see it http://www.activeboard.com/forum.spark?forumID=91511&p=3&topicID=12499794
The bed is 38" off the ground then add your hitch height to match your trailer height. This also has gooseneck hitch under the floor plate.

Howdy!

I did a lot of research before buying my C5500. Wife want a traditional Pickup bed. I contacted Monroe who produced the bed and got the messurement and found out I could not get enough clearence between the bed of the truck and 5er. I opted to go with a Hauler from Herrin Haulers and its has worked out great. I tow a 36' 5er with it Fulltiming

"Happy Trails"
chiefneon

Go with a hauler bed, I measured and with the p/u bed even lowered and on air I found I could not tow many of the trailers I needed to. Then I read and read on hear and really decided to just stick with my dually.

My 4500 has a Monroe pickup bed. I bought the truck and trailer used in 2005. Previous owner had the trailer axles flipped and had the air hitch resessed in the bed so hitch bolted to the frame. Been full-timing for 2 yrs now with no problems. Have 6 to 7 inches between bed and trailer. John

Watch out on talking about flipped axles you could get jumped on like I did when talking about it.

What kind of hitch are any of you guys running on the hauler bed ? I'm thinking of putting a reese ..... thought I had seen a 30K unit which needs to be welded to the body. Looking at a tri-axle toy hauler.

Also - is it a good or bad idea to be running a air hitch with a air ride suspension ?

BTW - have a C7500 Monroe hauler (conversion) air ride suspension

32,000 LB Binkley/Holland hitch. $400. 2 years...no worries.

MrSteve why did you get jumped on about flipped axles? I was looking at a weekend warrior toyhauler and they say that the max bed rail height is 55" and mine was at 54" with the bags aired up. So I guess I don't need to make any changes to my current DMAX just gears and my SC5 and a few other added beef ups. Thanks for all the replies.

did you want to buy a truck and trailer? i had my trailer made for my truck, see my garage for more pics

Deere3500... It wasn't really that bad, just small can of worms opened about un safe "it" could be to. A member wanted to lower his dually to make everything level, so I asked "why not flip the axles on the trailer", all I was doing was trying to save him all the work of lowering is dually and taking away from is load height. The last post he made he is now having problems with truck ride and now has to do work on his helpers. But if he flipped the axles on the trailer, all his work would had been done and his truck could have handle the load it was made for and the ride would had never changed, oh well I tried.

The one problem with flipping the axles is that you raise the center of gravity on the trailer and some trucks driven by some drivers forget that when driving over there skill level.

This guy has 69" bed rails and tows a 52' Weekend Warrior

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=168547

i've got a o7 4500 with a monroe tow body on it 70000 miles make offer

What is the difference from a Monroe truck body (pick-up bed style) and a 01-07 3500 dually bed. Are they the same or are the dimensions and or body lines different?

Body lines are different, I am not sure if over all dimensions are the same or not... But I think the dimensions are the same. The problem that comes up with using a 5th wheel with the 4500 with a PU installed is that the 4500 is much higher in the rear then a 3500 PU, so you have more of a chance of hitting the bed onto your 5th wheel trailer.

differences are the side panels are longer on the monroes along with body lines. inside dimmensions are the same as my 03 dually.

I tow a 32' tag trailer with flipped axles behind my C4500 (4" Deavers, 40" Pro Comp Xtreme A/T's on 20x9 Aluminum Wheels "Direct Fit".

[quote=SHOCKER;2038670;]I tow a 32' tag trailer with flipped axles behind my C4500 (4" Deavers, 40" Pro Comp Xtreme A/T's on 20x9 Aluminum Wheels "Direct Fit". I have a customer with C4500 4x4 and tows a 39' Weekend Warrior and he has flipped the axles on it... no problems.


Welcome Shocker. I was wondering when I would see you on here.

Howdy! Deere3500

If your still researching for your TV I have a TrailerSaver air hitch on my C5500. I researched hitches when specing out my TV. The TrailerSaver had a lot of good things said about it and it was the best price. It also mounts on a set of Reece rails like other 5er hitches.

I had my Hauler bed made by Herrin Haulers and they installed the hitch also. If you go to their web site herrinhauler.com look at the hauler pictures my TV is the blue C4500 tuck which shows the TrailerSaver hitch.

I thing to think about before get a hitch is that these truck have a high GVW mine is 19500. They don't give much, so if the frame is not going to give something has to. This means the trailer frame and structure has to. This lead to undue stress being placed on the trailer which has lead to stress fractures in 5er trailer. Thats why a lot of MDT & HDT now use air hitches. Cost a little more but worth it down the road, and it does make the ride better.

"Happy Trails"
chiefneon

Howdy! Deere3500

If your still researching for your TV I have a TrailerSaver air hitch on my C5500. I researched hitches when specing out my TV. The TrailerSaver had a lot of good things said about it and it was the best price. It also mounts on a set of Reece rails like other 5er hitches.

I had my Hauler bed made by Herrin Haulers and they installed the hitch also. If you go to their web site herrinhauler.com look at the hauler pictures my TV is the blue C4500 tuck which shows the TrailerSaver hitch.

I thing to think about before get a hitch is that these truck have a high GVW mine is 19500. They don't give much, so if the frame is not going to give something has to. This means the trailer frame and structure has to. This lead to undue stress being placed on the trailer which has lead to stress fractures in 5er trailer. Thats why a lot of MDT & HDT now use air hitches. Cost a little more but worth it down the road, and it does make the ride better.

"Happy Trails"
chiefneon

Good point - I know which way I am going now !

I have an 06 C4500 Kodiak with the Monroe Bed, 4x4, its a big truck! I have a 05 Raptor 33' toyhauler 5th wheel. Truck has air suspension, air cab and air seats. I had the trailer lifted 6 inches and converted to gooseneck to work with my Kodiak. It works great and the ride is very smooth with the trailer on it, nothing like driving the kodiak empty (Which is bad to say the least). It rides smoother then my Ford F350 did pulling it really. The trailer does not feel unsafe and is still unphased by decent winds.

Shrug, just my experience.

I did the same thing to my 40' goose neck trailer. I raised the trailer up 6" and it works great.

I am looking to buy this 4500. but I have a 39ft Raptor. Can I get them to work together?

I can get the truck for a fair deal but am unsure if I can get the two to match up.



EXR90 can you show pics of your rig and the modifications you did to make it work?

I am looking to buy this 4500. but I have a 39ft Raptor. Can I get them to work together?

I can get the truck for a fair deal but am unsure if I can get the two to match up.



EXR90 can you show pics of your rig and the modifications you did to make it work?


Dont have useful pics handy, and my truck is in shop having a couple things done so I cant take em. My truck is an 06 4500 4x4 with Monroe bed.

Simple what I did really:

1) Use the Colibert 205 5th wheel to gooseneck adapter. Works great and is rock solid.

2) Had 6 inch blocks made for the trailer's suspension and reinforcing braces welded in between hangars and frame. I have taken it in some hairy situations already since the lift and its fine.

I had a 05 F350 4x4 before this. I had about 8 inches of clearance with the ford between rails and trailer at the tailgate area. After 6 inch lift I have same on Kodiak. My storage lot where my trailer is kept has a very gnarly, steep short incline followed by a leveling off, so it really takes the articulation to the limit in terms of clearance. I dump the bags for the approach and I clear with about 1.5 inches. With the ford I was within a hair of clearance.

Truck pulls the trailer, fully loaded, like its not even there. The exhaust brake is seriously the best thing on the truck. I hardly use the real brakes which is dynamite.

As far as towing goes, I love this truck much more then the F350. Feels very safe and very stout. I only wish it had more power. Sucks being passed by some Class 8's on steep mountains.

Pay very close attention to fit and finish on these Kodiak's before you take delivery. Especially to waves in the Monroe bedsides, cracks in the bed that were poorly fixed using touch-up paint (especially around the running lights) and or seat rubbing on the B-Pillars. There is replacement B-pillars that fix much of the rubbing but they are poorly made and are not good color matches.

Truck rides harsh empty, but is a dream when weight is on it. I have heard great things about replacing the shocks with Bilsteins's.

Also, the lights seriously suck and there is not a whole lot you can do about it. I replaced my lights with Silverstar's and it is still bad. On an unlit freeway I was seriously scared and had to slow down because visibility was so bad.

Look for rust on the suspension. The "lifts" put on the 4x4's are not painted for some reason or otherwise weather treated (on the trucks around here anyway) and are prone to rust right off the lot.

There have been known injector issues with these trucks (depending on what engine you have etc). I have an LLY and have a phantom injector problem they cannot diagnose which sucks. I am documenting each instance and will become a squeaky wheel if its not addressed soon as it is very scary to loose injectors randomly and temporarily on steep hills in certain situations.

Bed was already replaced.
Injectors are updated with 250 mile warranty on them

B pillar?????

This is a two wheel with 22.5 pushed under them.

Lift on trailer. Did you make it or have a shop do it. Man some pics would be awesome as I'm sure Ill have to have some stuff fabricated.

Ill check into the 5th conversion.

These trucks DO need more power. Solved my power problem with an Edge w/ Attitude programmer. Has 5 levels, set mine on #2 level and leave it there. Only drawback is to watch your EGT's pulling steep grades. Actually gained 1 mpg. Less downshifting pulling small hills. I also gained another mpg by using B20 biodiesel. I am a full-time RV'er so every bit helps. My rig grosses out at 30K#. 5'er's axles are flipped for my Monroe bed. Pulls great. John

Bed was already replaced.
Injectors are updated with 250 mile warranty on them

B pillar?????

This is a two wheel with 22.5 pushed under them.

Lift on trailer. Did you make it or have a shop do it. Man some pics would be awesome as I'm sure Ill have to have some stuff fabricated.

Ill check into the 5th conversion.

B-Pillar is the vertical column of steel on the walls of cab between the front door and rear door on both sides of the cab. They rub rub rub on the plastic panels that cover the b-pillars. Many of these kodiak's do it if they have the nice air-seats that Monroe puts in. Mine rubbed bad. Replacement B-Pillar's helped a-lot, but it still rubs enough where they are fixing it right now.

I wont be able to take pictures any time soon sadly, im sorry. It cost me $1,000 to have the lift made and installed on the trailer. They are just blocks made of steel that sit between the leaf's and the axel's. The braces are just square stock welded on the spring hangers (the u-shaped steel that the shackles connect to that are welded to the frame). The braces transfer latteral load. The braces are a must for a lift of this height with blocks. Also, they used thicker U-Bolt's too (I think factory was 5/16" and these are 3/8"). An alternative is to have a subframe built. More $ and is non-removable. I like the block method as I can just swap the blocks out to return the trailer to normal height before selling (braces can stay in, they dont affect height).

Sounds good and thank you.

I dont wanna f-up my Raptor and it seems your method helps. Do you have a bed hieght to share with me. Tail gate down, what is the hieght of the gate to the ground.

Im going to order the convertion but am also going to order a new 5er tongue. Did I say that right, I want the one that has air assist in it to sofen the shock that transfers from the truck to the trailer. Unless this is an issue? 5th Airborne or a Trail Air?

Another Greeny Questions. What does Flip the Axels mean?

Any one know of a place that would do these trailer modifications at?

Sounds good and thank you.

I dont wanna f-up my Raptor and it seems your method helps. Do you have a bed hieght to share with me. Tail gate down, what is the hieght of the gate to the ground.

Im going to order the convertion but am also going to order a new 5er tongue. Did I say that right, I want the one that has air assist in it to sofen the shock that transfers from the truck to the trailer. Unless this is an issue? 5th Airborne or a Trail Air?

Another Greeny Questions. What does Flip the Axels mean?

Any one know of a place that would do these trailer modifications at?

Your trailer's axles should already be flipped. That refer's to if the axles sit on top of the leaf's or below the leafs. Below the leafs is "flipped". Most 5th wheel raptors come flipped.

You cannot use an air king pin with the goose neck adapter, and there is no kingpin to goose neck adapter that has air that I am aware of. Colibert is working on making one and their R&D people told me it was about a year off. If you want air, you can get an Air Kingpin, then install the B&W kingpin adapter (The goose neck on these trucks are actually a kit from B&W) in your truck into the hole used for the goose neck ball.

Personally, I have no issue with running Goose Neck without an air goose neck, and I just came back from a 1,500 mile trip with nasty roads most of the way and it was great. Truck's air suspension does that for me. It would be nice to have it, if it existed currently in goose neck, but thats still a while off. I think your truck since it is not 4 wheel drive may have different rear suspension system. My truck has trailing arms, air bags and shocks. Your truck may only have leafs on the rear. Check that too.

I cant take measurements right now as truck is in shop. The correct way to determine the lift you need is to take the kodiak, back it under the trailer, then use air jacks (the kind used to work on diesel trucks) to lift the trailer up exactly where you want it, then measure the difference in height. Measuring the difference in bed floor to ground and bed rails to ground on current truck and the kodiak (the difference being the lift you need) is another way, but not as accurate.

I agree with the measurments but the problem is My truck squats like a summo restler when hooked up. This drop is whats is making me change trucks.

This c4500 looks as though it wont drop at all.

Air bags are in but Im afraid they are full as to give lift to allow big size tires under the truck, I will need to adjust to see if the rides smooths out some.


Again thank you for your help as I am completely in the dark about all this.

See Pics and let me know if this combo will work or not for air ride. If I understood you then no it wont.

Skips, Look at my garage. I run a 40' goose neck with a C-4500 4X4. All I did was raise the trailer up 6" by putting a 6" beam between the axles and the trailer. It was a very easy job to do and took very little time. That truck you are looking at will not squat at all.

You can not use the Colibert 205 with ANY air-pinbox. You will have to wait until Colibert comes out with their air goosneck adapter, OR have something custom made to bolt a standard goosneck shaft onto the pinbox bolt patterns so you can use regular goose neck air kits. If the truck has air ride, I doubt you will "need" the air pin box. It'd be nice.

As far as your concern about squatting, 6" will be likely be your number (or even 4" since your not 4x4) but here is exactly what you need to do if you want to be exact about this. Let me preface this by saying: Do this at your own risk. This could get dangerous if you dont know what your doing, so be careful and have someone qualified do this for you if you cant do it yourself:

Hook the trailer up to your current truck. Measure the distance between frame rails and trailer at the closet point (probably near tailgate)
Buy the Colibert 205

Temporarily install it on the kinpin to take measurements only (mount it and install the lock nut, but dont drill/tap the support bolts). Do not install/worry about the extra bolts that came with the Colibert 205 being tap/drilled onto your kinpin, they are only to prevent twisting for the most part and not for supporting load. Since you are only taking measurements here and the weight of the trailer is carried by the air jacks, there is no stress on the kingpin. Their is a massive locknut and bolt that "grips" the adapter to the kinpin and that is what does the majority of the work. Obviously you must install all the hardware per the directions later after you take your measurements and determine you are going to proceed.
Measure the height from ground to bottom of trailer at some place near the center axle of the trailer.

Call a road hoe to come out with air jacks (you will need 4). Have them lift the front and rear of the trailer 4 inches to start. They will likely charge you about $100 for this.

Back the kodiak under the trailer, and then have them slowly drop the air out of the jacks evenly until their is weight on the truck to determine any sagging.

Measure the frame rail gap, ensure it is close to or bigger then what you had before (it should be). I have 8" of clearance, but I go offroading and have a very steep driveway in my storage lot. Remeber you can dump the air bags to gain an extra inch and half or so of clearance temporarily when required. Do not drive with bags deflated!

Assuming bed rail clearance is good, Measure the ground-trailer height again as in step 4. The difference between the two measurements should be the exact size of the blocks you need to have made.
If your in Southern California I can recommend the guys that did my setup. I watched them do all of it, and it was not hard for the most part.

You can not use the Colibert 205 with ANY air-pinbox. You will have to wait until Colibert comes out with their air goosneck adapter, OR have something custom made to bolt a standard goosneck shaft onto the pinbox bolt patterns so you can use regular goose neck air kits. If the truck has air ride, I doubt you will "need" the air pin box. It'd be nice.

As far as your concern about squatting, 6" will be likely be your number (or even 4" since your not 4x4) but here is exactly what you need to do if you want to be exact about this. Let me preface this by saying: Do this at your own risk. This could get dangerous if you dont know what your doing, so be careful and have someone qualified do this for you if you cant do it yourself:

Hook the trailer up to your current truck. Measure the distance between frame rails and trailer at the closet point (probably near tailgate)
Buy the Colibert 205

Temporarily install it on the kinpin to take measurements only (mount it and install the lock nut, but dont drill/tap the support bolts). Do not install/worry about the extra bolts that came with the Colibert 205 being tap/drilled onto your kinpin, they are only to prevent twisting for the most part and not for supporting load. Since you are only taking measurements here and the weight of the trailer is carried by the air jacks, there is no stress on the kingpin. Their is a massive locknut and bolt that "grips" the adapter to the kinpin and that is what does the majority of the work. Obviously you must install all the hardware per the directions later after you take your measurements and determine you are going to proceed.
Measure the height from ground to bottom of trailer at some place near the center axle of the trailer.

Call a road hoe to come out with air jacks (you will need 4). Have them lift the front and rear of the trailer 4 inches to start. They will likely charge you about $100 for this.

Back the kodiak under the trailer, and then have them slowly drop the air out of the jacks evenly until their is weight on the truck to determine any sagging.

Measure the frame rail gap, ensure it is close to or bigger then what you had before (it should be). I have 8" of clearance, but I go offroading and have a very steep driveway in my storage lot. Remeber you can dump the air bags to gain an extra inch and half or so of clearance temporarily when required. Do not drive with bags deflated!

Assuming bed rail clearance is good, Measure the ground-trailer height again as in step 4. The difference between the two measurements should be the exact size of the blocks you need to have made.
If your in Southern California I can recommend the guys that did my setup. I watched them do all of it, and it was not hard for the most part.

Frame Rails being the top of the bed sides? Mine has a plastic covering to aviod scratches? Would this be considered the Frame Rail?

This is sounding real complicated to me. I might just have to find a company that would level this thing out for me. Being new Im not up on the terms or understand the entire set up.

I has thinking if I loaded the trailer onto my C4500 and did a mesurment from the back end to ground and the front end to ground it would give me the size of the block needed.

Ill have to figure something out or pass on the truck deal. :cool:

I meant bed rails not frame rails, sorry.

Your truck is not 4x4, its not going to need more then a 6" lift. The blocks and labor to do 2" versus 6" is the same. You will spend about $1,000 plus the adapter. You should upgrade the U-Bolts to next size up while your at it.

Find a place, but stay away from the trailer dealerships. They wanted $4,000 to do my lift, and they were just gonna sub it out to the place I ended up having it done at!!

I meant bed rails not frame rails, sorry.

Your truck is not 4x4, its not going to need more then a 6" lift. The blocks and labor to do 2" versus 6" is the same. You will spend about $1,000 plus the adapter. You should upgrade the U-Bolts to next size up while your at it.

Find a place, but stay away from the trailer dealerships. They wanted $4,000 to do my lift, and they were just gonna sub it out to the place I ended up having it done at!!