I'll be looking for a new truck next fall. Am considering a Dodge with CTD.Is it true that 2005 is the last year for CTD in Dodge trucks? heard they will be replaced with a Mercedes diesel. If it's true does anyone have any info on the Mercedes engine? What's the HP and torque? should I get a CTD while I can or wait a little longer and get a Mercedes?http://dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big%20Smile.gif

Looking at the rumor mill this is what I found...





Cummins has an exclusive arrangement with Dodge for light duty trucks through the 2007 calendar year





Pete

So who gets the motor next? I heard that Ford is after them in 2007, Cummins that is, any truth to that at all? Hoot?

One rumour I heard was after 2007 there will be no more Cummins as it is today. Technology and emmisions may kill it.

I think you are right on the money there hoot (as usual) I got out of the heavy truck industry a few years ago, but quite a few of my friends are still in it. Emissions laws are going to be tough on all of the large engine manufacturers. Being that Diamler/Chrysler is owned by mercedes, it's not really a question of if, but when the mercedes diesel finds it's way into the Dodge pick-up platform...The only way I could see Cummins staying in dodge trucks is by a complete failure to intregate the new mercedes motor to the rest of the chassis OR a huge uproar from the consumer (in other words, you loyal dodge fellas. Having said that, it would take a huge insurgance for cummins to stay in your trucks....

An ex military diesel tech said the Mercedes diesel will be an awsome motor. I had heard a while ago that the Mercedes would be an option. Cummins still the standard.

Now I had also heard that diesel engines (all) were going to be done away with, because of emissions.



<font size="6">?</font>

Leave it to big CORPORATE FAT CATS to mess up a great thing.
I wouldn't mind a Cummins in a Ford F 250,but not having a Cummins in a Dodge would be a HUGE mistake I believe.Edited by: DGFoster

I don't think an uproar will change the government mandate

i had the chance to look under the hood of a dodge sprinter. it is a slightly oversize van, freightliner makes an almost identical vehicle. they are powered by an inline 5 cylinder mercedes benz diesel. it did have common rail injection, and an aluminum head. i did not see a horsepower label, but they said it gets 24 mpg. anyone seen one yet? wil

Tons of them out there. Even branded as Dodge now.

The sprinters are low horse motors (I think 160 or so) But the Germans are light years ahead of us in automotive technology IMO And I have ridden in many Mercedes TD's and let me tell you from experience they flat a$$ run! BTW try to buy a new Friegtliner and tell me what engine youll end up with?

Since Mercedes owns Freightliner, the Freightliner version of the Sprinter van will have a Mercedes diesel.

So then what will happen when that motor is gone? What is in the works for newer designs to keep the dodge name up there with the ranks of the others?

I had heard that when F#*d does away with their diesel, the V10 will be the replacement.



Don't know if this is accurate. ????

The Ford Triton V8 and V10 are being replaced because they suck and
even Ford knows it. My roommate knows one of the guys at Ford who's
designing the replacement motors. He says that if they suck, he'll
personally punch himself in the face.

I don't think an uproar will change the government mandate


I don't think an uproar is what I meant.

Ok, no uproar. How about we all go and drive our trucks onto the steps of the Capitol Building? I'm sure that will go over really well! http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/smiley2.gif

I guess after thinking about it,it would make sense for DC to go witht he Mercedes diesel since it is in there own stable,but it would be nice to offer both as an option.

Ok, no uproar. How about we all go and drive our trucks
onto the steps of the Capitol Building? I'm sure that will go over
really well! http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/smiley2.gif



You'd get a better response by driving them in.

Let's face it fellas.no matter how many power house ,diesel guzzeling ,black smoke belching trucks we buy. Them bleeding heart do gooder soccer mom types will some how find a way to take a big proverbable sh*t on all of us red blooded, hard working men!!! It never fails that when something good comes along,so does a tree hugger with an agenda. Man, that felt good to get of my chest!





DIESELS LAST FOREVER,TRENDS DON'T!!!!!!

Mercedes own Freightliner and cummins isn't an option in the MTD or larger truck due to the reliability not being there. The M2 the new version of the FL60 has two engine choices the MBE 900 or Cat C7. 2007 the big rigs need catalitic converters that have a seperate fuel nozzle to inject fuel into it every so often to cause a compete burn the emission standard is going to be difficult to meet because of the idle time on these trucks. Davehttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/smiley1.gif

if im not mistakin arent diesels clearnering burning then most gas motors?

if im not mistakin arent diesels clearnering burning then most gas motors?



In certain pollutants that the EPA monitors, diesel are inherently cleaner than gasoline engines (hydrocarbons and carbon monoxide). Diesels do not meet the current NOX standards and are substantially worse than gas engines in terms of particulates. The latter two are the pollutants that the manufactures tried to improve upon beginning in 2004 (with the Cummins 600, DMAX LLY and Ford 6.0L engines). They still have a ways to go to meet the 2007 standards which are around the corner.

so the way ya'll are talking if anyone is going to buy a diesel it would be now?

I would say that this is the golden age of muscle diesels. Once
emissions laws catch up on the NOx and particulates, it'll be downhill
from there.



Of course, what the EPA doesn't bother to look at is the total amount
of these gasses emitted rather than the percentage. I'm pretty sure
that while the percentage of these undesirable gasses is higher, the
overall sum is lower. Plus diesels are the obvious answer to reducing
our dependency on foreign oil, but it seems Americans want their
gassers...



Except for us!

I heard that!!! This is a heavy topic, and I have heard rumors that Dodge is replacing the Cummins, and that Ford would pick it up totally (they have already for their Heavy Trucks F650 and up) . If so, why are they (Ford) trying to keep up with Dodge/Cummins when they would be able to drop in the Cummins and get everything Dodge had??? Cummins would be hard to replace, but Mercedes would probably be able to get the job done. When all this happens though (if it does), the age of the "Muscle Diesels" will be over!! Diesels have always had the bad rep of "black smoke blowing" and "loud" and "fuel unfriendly". Heck, a buddy of mine couldn't believe how quiet and smooth mine was when we road to work the other night, made him wish he hadn't bought that F350 4X4 with 5.4L Triton (11mpg l/u!!). None the less, our trucks smoke because we make them. They are loud because we make them loud. People don't really pay attention to how they have changed and been made more fuel efficient and environmentally friendly.


As for the soccer moms'....they want our Big Trucks off the road so they don't have to worry about us running them over when they pull out in front of us!!

This is a heavy topic, and I have heard rumors that Dodge is replacing the Cummins, and that Ford would pick it up totally (they have already for their Heavy Trucks F650 and up) . If so, why are they (Ford) trying to keep up with Dodge/Cummins when they would be able to drop in the Cummins and get everything Dodge had??? Cummins would be hard to replace, but Mercedes would probably be able to get the job done. When all this happens though (if it does), the age of the "Muscle Diesels" will be over!! Diesels have always had the bad rep of "black smoke blowing" and "loud" and "fuel unfriendly". Heck, a buddy of mine couldn't believe how quiet and smooth mine was when we road to work the other night, made him wish he hadn't bought that F350 4X4 with 5.4L Triton (11mpg l/u!!). None the less, our trucks smoke because we make them. They are loud because we make them loud. People don't really pay attention to how they have changed and been made more fuel efficient and environmentally friendly.


As for the soccer moms'....they want our Big Trucks off the road so they don't have to worry about us running them over when they pull out in front of us!!


I heard that brother......i could kill about 30 people in vans about everyday....just cause we're all better drivers and have more versitile vehicles than them don't mean that they have to discriminate....i mean just cuz our vehicles don't fit in the back of an S-10....my gosh!!!

Off topic: I guess you guys did know even jeep is getting a mercedes diesel now in the liberty.

Yup. Five cylinder.

Its not a Mercedes. <font size="2">2.8-liter turbo common-rail diesel engine that makes 160 hp and 295 lb-ft of torque. </font><font size="2" face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">VM Motori, which is owned in part by Detroit Diesel, a DaimlerChrysler company, is the manufacturer of the engine.



</font><span ="testo">Cento, Italy is the origin of the engine.</span>

Its not a Mercedes. 2.8-liter turbo common-rail diesel engine that makes 160 hp and 295 lb-ft of torque. VM Motori, which is owned in part by Detroit Diesel, a DaimlerChrysler company, is the manufacturer of the engine.

Cento, Italy is the origin of the engine.



But, since DaimlerChrysler is owned by mercedes...I would say that in a round about way, it is a mercedes...sort of anyway...


Edited by: partsguy662

It's not right to call an Italian diesel a Mercedes or an Isuzu diesel a GM.


Edited by: hoot

MY OPINION:


Replacing the Cummins engine in the Dodge truck with any other brand (with the possible exception of a CAT engine) would be a HUGE mistake on the part of Dodge. The majority of Dodge diesel owners bought their trucks for the Cummins engine,,,,period (you all can say what you want,,,, we all know the truth). Sales of Dodge diesel trucks would plummet as loyal Cummins engine enthusiasts would defect to Ford. You would hope the executives that make these decisions in Detroit know this. Sometimes however, these individuals are too isolated in their cozy offices and they have lost track of the real world.


From Cummins perspective, they would be much better off from an engine volume point of view in going to Ford. Ford has over 50% (approx) of the light duty diesel truck market (GM and Dodge combine for the other 50% - Someone can post the actual percentages). Cummins could increase their engine volume by another 60% by going with Ford. I suspect the Ford diesel truck percentage would increase to 60%-70% as loyal Cummins owners move from Dodge to Ford. The big question - would Cummins be better off financially? All depends on how the deals are structured.Edited by: OC_DMAX

How do you explain people purchasing a Isuzu powered diesel? Wouldn't they run to Ford?

All depends ( I am guessing ) on the current contracts. Cummins
has a excellent reputation. Dodge has done well with it.
Why shoot themselves in the foot? But if Fhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/smiley35.gifd is the parent company of Cummins.... Fhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/smiley35.gifd doesn't seem to like Navistar, anymore.

How do you explain people purchasing a Isuzu powered diesel? Wouldn't they run to Ford?


I could interpret the above question several ways.


1) There is no comparison between the old 6.5L Detroit Diesel/GM design in the older GM trucks and the current DMAX. A substantial increase in performance. For a brief period of time, the DMAX set the performance standard. Took both Ford and Dodge several years to catch up to the standard the DMAX set in 2001. You owned them all, right? (6.5L - DMAX - Cummins)


2) I would bet the GM diesel truck sales would also go down, with many GM owners now buying a Ford with a Cummins engine. (Unless GM substantial increased the performance of the DMAX to counter.)


I believe the Cummins to be the best light truck power plant today (My opinion). Unless Dodge has something up their sleeves and is going to replace it with something substantially better, it would be a big mistake letting that powerplant go.Edited by: OC_DMAX

<div ="txt">When does the Cummins and Dodge contract expire?</div>


<div ="txt">

<font face="Arial, Helvetica" size="2">Cummins
and DaimlerChrysler signed a Long Term Agreement several years ago that
made Cummins the exclusive supplier of diesel engines in Dodge Ram
pickups through 2007 calendar year. The partnership between the two
companies extends from in-plant support to service, on-site engineering
to marketing support. Cummins has shipped nearly 1,000,000 engines for
the Dodge Ram and we continue to forge a successful team with Dodge and
all of DaimlerChrysler.

</font>


<font face="Arial, Helvetica" size="2">Cut through the BS, what does the horse say?http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/smiley4.gif

</font>
</div>

gettin back to the whole soccer mom thing, theirs no easier way to piss someone off than to blow some smoke all over their shiny little car, find some one ridin ur bumper, blow some smoke on em and ull notice they backoff somehttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/smiley36.gif gotta watch who u do it to thoughhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/smiley18.gif

All depends ( I am guessing ) on the current contracts. Cummins
has a excellent reputation. Dodge has done well with it.
Why shoot themselves in the foot? But if Fhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/smiley35.gifd is the parent company of Cummins.... Fhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/smiley35.gifd doesn't seem to like Navistar, anymore.




Ford the parent company of Cummins???



<font size="7"><span style="color: rgb(255, 0, 0); font-weight: bold;">NOT</span></font>

everyone says that cummins is owned by ford, try and tell them that ford just own a part in cummins and theyll tell u u dont know what ur talkin bout, nobody will belive me

O.K. I plead ignorance. Who own Cummins? I thought it was Fhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/smiley35.gifd.

Getting rid of the Cummins is the dumbest thing Dodge could do. That motor is the only reason they're still in bussiness. If Ford is smart they'll pick it up. Even if it didn't have as much power as the others, a Ford/Cummins would sell.