Intelligently Engineered flex plate for the Duramax. :cool:

Is it a new Mile L production? Available now?

Is it a new Mile L production? Available now?

As soon as I install it on a truck and see the fit it will be ready to go.

Wow, perfect timing! How does it compare to stock or ATS aftermarket?

Bentley

Thats pretty sweet, I'm kinda in the dark about this part of the drivetrain but shouldn't there be teeth on the circumference of it??

Thats pretty sweet, I'm kinda in the dark about this part of the drivetrain but shouldn't there be teeth on the circumference of it??

You have to press the starter ring around the out side of the flex plate. Thats the part with the teeth on it.

Bentley

Purty

I've seen those before somewhere.... ;)

You have to press the starter ring around the out side of the flex plate. Thats the part with the teeth on it.

Bentley


OHHHHH I see said the blind man.

This looks like a better option than the other aftermarket one. I like the idea of it being a real flex plate and not a solid unflexable flywheel.

Nice piece.

I'm not stupid just uneducated about this particular part, what is this flex plate used for?

Its the thring that your converter bolts to

sfi rating?

Looks good, still a 6 bolt. Would be nice to see next to a stocker and the 12 bolt billet one that ATS is selling. Nice going Opie.:ro)

This looks like a better option than the other aftermarket one. I like the idea of it being a real flex plate and not a solid unflexable flywheel.

Nice piece. Rob, you get one of these in your tranny before you put it back together?

Great...more stuff I need!

Rob, you get one of these in your tranny before you put it back together?

Nope:( But I'm getting pretty good R&Ring Trannys lying on my back.:D

I might run it for a while and do a tear down for a shaft and plate, also to look how everything is fairing. Most likely wait until/if I build the engine.

Yes it looks great. I'm a little worried about my ATS 12 bolt billet flexplate. It had no flex at all. When we pulled the tranny out of the crewcab I was a bit surprised that the flexplate bolts that were in the TC were not any tighter then they were. I know when Max Payne installed changed out the flexplate and installed the new 5 star with the Extreme tranny that he put them in tight. Intelligent Engineering can drill out these plates to 12 holes if a person need 12 to run with the 5 star. Nice piece of workmanship.:ro)

How do you benefit from running this compared to the stock one? The stock one doesn't flex enough, or is it to heavy?

Thats pretty sweet, I'm kinda in the dark about this part of the drivetrain but shouldn't there be teeth on the circumference of it??


This bolts to the flywheel (the part with the teeth)

How do you benefit from running this compared to the stock one? The stock one doesn't flex enough, or is it to heavy?

Stock one breaks too easy.

too easy?:think: its not like they have been droping like flies. some of them can be traced back to the alinghment pins not being installed.

too easy?:think: its not like they have been droping like flies. some of them can be traced back to the alinghment pins not being installed.

Jeremy

You would be suprised at how many bad ones I have seen and having a much heavier converter does not help.

too easy?:think: its not like they have been droping like flies. some of them can be traced back to the alinghment pins not being installed.

Jeremy, For someone who dynoed 'only' 550 RWHP, and ripped the centers out of 2 factory flexplates, and destroyed a 3rd pulling....... this is a better option.

Jeremy

You would be suprised at how many bad ones I have seen and having a much heavier converter does not help.

I would bet more than I want to know!:eek: I feel for ya Mike, when one does let go, the best case scenario is only a new flexplate to replace.

Worst case, if it tears and does not completely let go right away, you could concievably kiss the TC, Front Pump and Inputshaft away.:mad:

Hey Mike new marketing phrase for ya.

'Flexy is Sexy' or 'Gotta have Give to Live'

hey mike new marketing phrase for ya. 'flexy is sexy' or 'gotta have give to live' booooooooooooo

hey mike new marketing phrase for ya. 'flexy is sexy' or 'gotta have give to live'

Sorry Juice but that's bad.

S'ok, it was suggested by my rice crispies!

S'ok, it was suggested by my rice crispies!

Sure it wasn't the voices??

Juice is nipping on the absynth again. :drinking: :horsey: ):h

ripped the centers out of 2 factory flexplates, and destroyed a 3rd pulling....... this is a better option

Thats probably pretty easy to do when the trans "stops short"

Thats probably pretty easy to do when the trans "stops short"

Personal experience for you ben?

You wouldn't be referencing my destroyed P2 Planet would you? If that is your assumption then you are wrong on that.:rolleyes:

At what point do you need an aftermarket flex plate and around how much will one cost?

My list of things I wish I had gets longer every day...

Personal experience for you ben?

My trans parts are from florida not canada :D :p:

My trans parts are from florida not canada :D :p:

Mine were from the US as well.:rolleyes: But looks like you didn't know that either (among other things)
Are you just trying to stir things up or, do you have first hand knowledge?

I thought this thread was about the new flexplates?

Juice my point is you are the exception. Just because you've broken everything doesnt mean everyone will break the same things with the same frequency. As far as I know flexplates are not dropping like the flies you make them (and everything else) out to be. This is not a 48re. In a "majority" (yes, I know you've broken even the valve body to case bolts when you were towing 46,000 lbs gcvwr up a 36% grade at 650rwhp stp at 320* egt and 55psig of boost) of applications you do not need strong hard parts to make the allison live.

All Im trying to say, is to the guys who generally like to "mess around", 550rwhp, ~12 second 1/4 miles, etc, I would not put the need for a new flexplate at the top of the list. IMHO guys should be worrying about their rods before flexplates.

But thats just my oppinion, and as you said ("among other things"), I dont know anything, so it is nothing more than my OWN oppinion.

I will wait for mike to weigh on on what he thinks.

ben

ben stated what i was trying to say. its not a common everyday occurrence that a flex plate goes. there is no set point for one to let go. some people just tend to break more things(kinda like the bd turbo thing). not saying a new or different flex plate is bad, would love to see another sfi approved one too! i am also not saying we dont need one, i sure could use an sfi one, but not needed like rods and dual fuelers

Juice my point is you are the exception. Just because you've broken everything doesnt mean everyone will break the same things with the same frequency. As far as I know flexplates are not dropping like the flies you make them.

I will wait for mike to weigh on on what he thinks.

ben

Then try to say it without hijacking the thread or innuendo then. I do thank you for making me seem 'exceptional' though:D I push the limits, and have paid the price more than once. The truck only went through 3 flexplates, and for the miles, and power level it was at, I don't begrude/fault the stock ones at all. But if you are at/beyond 450 and use it a lot wether it be sled pulling, dragracing, or towing it is a weak link.

Again, you need to back off. 46,000GCVW up a 36% grade? You really like to exaggerate things.


Anyhow, what will be the $$$$ of the Flexplate Mike? And availability?

Juice I need to fit one first and make sure everything is ok. Looking for the correct length converter bolts right now. I was hoping Casper would be running by now.

Juice I need to fit one first and make sure everything is ok. Looking for the correct length converter bolts right now. I was hoping Casper would be running by now.

Sounds good Mike.

Are the production pieces going to be coated to prevent corrosion between the convertor pads and the FP?

SFI approval and this thing will sell like hot cakes. No flex in the flex plate is very hard on a single crank thrust bearing. All converters balloon a solid .080" when locking up, if no flex, the crank/thrust bearing takes that beating...

All converters balloon a solid .080" when locking up,


Where did this information come from as ours does not do this.

SFI approval and this thing will sell like hot cakes. No flex in the flex plate is very hard on a single crank thrust bearing. All converters balloon a solid .080" when locking up, if no flex, the crank/thrust bearing takes that beating...

ATS converters have never had this issue you speak of.

This hype about the flexplate is kinda funny, the whole reason for the a flexplate is to help prevent the cracking and bending of a stock converters stamped steel cover, once you go with a billet cover, there is no need for a flexplate as the cover of the converter makes it rigid. And this whole wiping out the thrust on the crank is even more comical. You are putting much more pressure on the thrust of the crank on a manual tranny when you push the clutch in and have the hydraulics of your slave cylinder pushing on the fingers of your 3000+lb pressure plate. Given you won't see 3000lbs of pressure on the crank because of the leverage that the fingers have, but I promise it's more than the 80psi of force the T/C is seeing during lockup.

Just so you know Ken, you'll be fine!! ;)

Flex plates are used because you can never have a perfect alignment between engine and transmission. It is impossible. Something has to give a little; usually 5 thousands is enough. Dowel pins on the back of the engine block are consistantly not true to the alignment. Flex plates have nothing to do with the stamped steel cover cracking or bending on a stock converter.

The Dowel pins are a precision hole with a precision alignment, using precision pins, unless they are left out. If it's weight your worried about one might look at the weight difference in the aftermarket converter they choose. Some are way heavier than others when there is no need for it. The flex plate is there to take up a small misalignment if any between the converter and tranmission that has nothing to do with the alignment dowels. It is also there to let the converter move a slight amount for proper pump engagement. The harmonics that comes into play is also another reason for the flex plate. Just making a new one without extensive feild testing and measuring is a crap shoot at best for a long term solution. For a race truck that only runs short burst it's a completely different world.

Wade, not picking on a your flex plate so dont get excited.

When you push in on a clutch your not doing it harshly. When you hit lockup in a built trans with no cutback, lockup hits pretty stiff. No cushy apply or even gradual like pushing down on a clutch.

Take a billit cover converter out of a truck that has been run hard and you will see rust spots on the converter that line up with the holes in the flexplate. I've seen this on all the converters, black, yellow, blue, orange, grey, and purple. I've also seen slight wear marks with the paint from the converter cover on the plate. How else does it get there if it dont balloon the gap? I doubt it jumps.

While I've only had one motor apart that had a rigid plate on it, it did show some pretty bad wear on the rear thrust bearing and I have not seen that before on a flex plate equipped truck. I will have the chance to inspect another one soon as that build gets under way.

The Dowel pins are a precision hole with a precision alignment, using precision pins, unless they are left out. If it's weight your worried about one might look at the weight difference in the aftermarket converter they choose. Some are way heavier than others when there is no need for it. The flex plate is there to take up a small misalignment if any between the converter and tranmission that has nothing to do with the alignment dowels. It is also there to let the converter move a slight amount for proper pump engagement. The harmonics that comes into play is also another reason for the flex plate. Just making a new one without extensive feild testing and measuring is a crap shoot at best for a long term solution. For a race truck that only runs short burst it's a completely different world.


The trans will never be perfectly aligned with the engine. Dowel pins or not.

There cant be more than a few tenths of play between the converter and input shaft.

The flex plate is there for the "slack" the dowels have.

I have had to fix too many misaligned dowels in the past. The precision dowl with its precision hole is prone to human error or machine error wether it be human programming or lack of proper machinery adjustment. All major car manufacturers have bulletins on repairing dowels and dowl pin repair kits are available from different sources for a reason. I do not buy the theory that dowls have nothing to do with engine and trans and converter alignment.

Steve
maybe its time for you to get out of my thread.

I have had to fix too many misaligned dowels in the past. The precision dowl with its precision hole is prone to human error or machine error wether it be human programming or lack of proper machinery adjustment. All major car manufacturers have bulletins on repairing dowels and dowl pin repair kits are available from different sources for a reason. I do not buy the theory that dowls have nothing to do with engine and trans and converter alignment.

Steve
maybe its time for you to get out of my thread.

Well I suppose congrats are in order then Mike on making such a nice piece. But I've got a couple of questions for you about this little marvel.

You say that it's nice and flexy, so how much deflection are you seeing with your new plate and under what direct stress load? How does this compare to stock? And since ours was brought up, how much more deflection does your plate have over ours at the same load?

Also the material looks to be quite thick on your plate, what is it made from?? Weight difference over the stock paper thin Flex Plate?

Just trying to get some technical info ;)

Cheers,
Wade

P.S. Mike, you know I've got to bust your balls a little, welcome to the manufacturing game!! LOL :p:

Flexplate looks good. Is this a stand alone unit, or is the ring gear still needed? Reason I ask is there is no ring gear fitted in the pics.

John, I wouldn't think you'd need the ring gear/flywheel, would you?

Mike, did you have this designed and built to address the OEM breaking around the center bolts? Its a very good idea.
At what continuous-use power levels would you recommend someone install this?

I have had to fix too many misaligned dowels in the past. The precision dowl with its precision hole is prone to human error or machine error wether it be human programming or lack of proper machinery adjustment. All major car manufacturers have bulletins on repairing dowels and dowl pin repair kits are available from different sources for a reason. I do not buy the theory that dowls have nothing to do with engine and trans and converter alignment.

Steve
maybe its time for you to get out of my thread.



:boxing: Yeah everyone that disagrees with mike better shutup.
This is a forum, its obviously not a place for public discussion.

Oh goody, flexplate wars.

Geez, Mike comes out with a new product and half the folks want to take a dump on him.

I think it's great that vendors are coming out with new products. Can't we jusr recognize this and keep the negative comments out.

Well I suppose congrats are in order then Mike on making such a nice piece. But I've got a couple of questions for you about this little marvel.

You say that it's nice and flexy, so how much deflection are you seeing with your new plate and under what direct stress load? How does this compare to stock? And since ours was brought up, how much more deflection does your plate have over ours at the same load?

Also the material looks to be quite thick on your plate, what is it made from?? Weight difference over the stock paper thin Flex Plate?

Just trying to get some technical info ;)

Cheers,
Wade

P.S. Mike, you know I've got to bust your balls a little, welcome to the manufacturing game!! LOL :p:

Wade
I never brought up the ATS plate and I never critisized it. This thread is about my flex plate and not a comparo. I may have different ideas about this and who's to say I am wrong or right. I have seen a lot of flex plates break in my 42 years in this business and have seen what fixed the cause . I talked to a lot of people smarter than I about this, all of them in the transmission industry not in the tune up business, and formed my opinion and went with it. I have showed pictures of this plate which has not been installed in a truck nor tested yet. It will be; so for the time being, get off my back.

Flexplate looks good. Is this a stand alone unit, or is the ring gear still needed? Reason I ask is there is no ring gear fitted in the pics.

This is a direct replacement of the factory ring gear only. The flywheel is separate and is reused.

Mike L. you do not want to event go there and you know it!

As far as what Eric is seeing it is not from the converter balloning it's from the flex plate doing its job. If the converter was doing what he thinks its doing the converter clutch would not hold as the front cover is what the clutch seats on. On a stock front cover it does deflect but not on a billet cover. Weather or not this new flex plate works is yet to be seen and as far as any design work on this new flex plate you would need to talk with the guy who did it and his name is Opie from Intelligent Engineering.

There cant be more than a few tenths of play between the converter and input shaft.


The flex plate is there for the "slack" the dowels have.

There is much more runout than a few tenths in the alignment area. It would be nice if it was this good but there are to many tolerances between all the parts. The alignment dowels and the holes they go in are controlled this good but not the rest of the parts.

Mike L. you do not want to event go there and you know it!

As far as what Eric is seeing it is not from the converter balloning it's from the flex plate doing its job. If the converter was doing what he thinks its doing the converter clutch would not hold as the front cover is what the clutch seats on. On a stock front cover it does deflect but not on a billet cover. Weather or not this new flex plate works is yet to be seen and as far as any design work on this new flex plate you would need to talk with the guy who did it and his name is Opie from Intelligent Engineering.



There is much more runout than a few tenths in the alignment area. It would be nice if it was this good but there are to many tolerances between all the parts. The alignment dowels and the holes they go in are controlled this good but not the rest of the parts.

If you would have read my first post you would have seen who made the flex plate as everyone else has. As far as your threat, you can shove that. I still can't understand why you are allowed in my thread. Twice now you have made the comment that it remains to be seen if it works and you know that it has not yet been installed in a truck. I could not get away with that here.

Wade This thread is about my flex plate

It's not your flex plate it's Opie's so he would be the one with the engineering answers. I have not said anything good or bad about the flex plate just that it needs to be tested in the field, so calm down. Hope it all works out when it gets completed. Eric made a misleading statement and I said our converter would not ballon the front cover. The flex plate is there for alot more reasons then the precision dowel holes and pins being wrong and you of all people should know that.

Your converters are built by Precision Industries and yet you call it yours.
What's the difference? When I intoduced Opie's shafts the post were wacked because he is not a vendor here so we agreed that I would call them mine to be able to post. I gave Opie credit in my opening line in the first post without using his name. Now if you think I had nothing to do with the design of this flex plate you are grossly mistaken. Why don't you wait till I put it in a truck and then rip the design to pieces? I am now done and will not post anything further here, it's all yours.:D

You are correct that Terry builds our converter design for us, not a big secret. It's our design, that's why its ours. Just like R&R builds our rod design for us again no big secret, it's our design. Were having Camshafts and Head gaskets made now too and guess what we will not produce those either but then they are our design again. We designed the products and have them fabricated for us.

I have said nothing about the flex plate design other than it needs to be feild tested but I guess that's ripping it up to you. When were you going to get around to letting people know I designed the cooler mounting kit and supply the fittings for you? You seem to have put your name on that as well.

Another promising thread goes right in the shi##er.
A shame.

Well, It was good while it lasted.

I'm re-opening this thread for the continued discussion of the original flex plate. Steve and Wade, please do not post further in this thread. You both have a conflict of interest. If you want to continue discussing the technical details of converters, flexplates, etc than start a different thread that isn't product specific and all of you can go at it (so long as it doesn't get personal, again).

The discussion about our "vendor conflict of interest policy" which is unrelated to this thread has been moved to the appropriate place here: http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=150359

I think this a good product idea and I have seen stock flex plates broken with just an Edge Juice and a stock trans and converter.

I'm re-opening this thread for the continued discussion of the original flex plate. Steve and Wade, please do not post further in this thread. You both have a conflict of interest. If you want to continue discussing the technical details of converters, flexplates, etc than start a different thread that isn't product specific and all of you can go at it (so long as it doesn't get personal, again).

The discussion about our "vendor conflict of interest policy" which is unrelated to this thread has been moved to the appropriate place here: http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=150359


:thankyou2

Wwjd

How much power would you need to have to get this, and also, does it help at all with shifting, and 1/4 mile times?

How much power would you need to have to get this, and also, does it help at all with shifting, and 1/4 mile times?

Dont look for gains like that, think of it to help hold the truck together to complete that stuff.

This would be considered a "hard part" like a billet shaft. Not going to make a change you can feel, just will make the driveline stronger

I believe its called a non HP mod ! One that is necessary to make it stronger but you don't gain any HP ! They are the ones you have to drink away as they don't give you that approval feeling on the Seat of the pants . They do, however; give you the piece of mind though when you do want to let it fly ! .........Wheres my drink now ?

I agree with Eric in the above statement.

Ok guys,

First off any thrust on the converter will be taken up in the rear since the converter is floating and not loaded on the front or rear.

As far as the converter clutch hitting with force, that is not true. The converter is still PWM controlled (trimmed on) so there is no harsh thrust when the clutch applies. You are squeezing out fluid when the clutch comes on and you can only do it so quick.

Mike has devolped a great product but there is no substitute for the billet flex plate. If I wasn't running the high HP, Mikes would be a great alternative to the stock one but the billet flex plate is the safer way to go.

Ok guys,

First off any thrust on the converter will be taken up in the rear since the converter is floating and not loaded on the front or rear.

As far as the converter clutch hitting with force, that is not true. The converter is still PWM controlled (trimmed on) so there is no harsh thrust when the clutch applies. You are squeezing out fluid when the clutch comes on and you can only do it so quick.

Mike has devolped a great product but there is no substitute for the billet flex plate. If I wasn't running the high HP, Mikes would be a great alternative to the stock one but the billet flex plate is the safer way to go.

I am not allowed to post about said subject but your opinion made me smile.

More aftermarket parts for Duramax Diesel parts == GOOD.

Just adding to my shopping list for when i have an extra $10,000 lying around...