Well I made up my own plate this afternoon to block the EGR and got some interesting results. I was expecting all my codes and CEL to return as soon as I took off down the road like usual, but to my surprise, no light. So when I got back here I put the scanner to it and it came up as PASShttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clap.gif. Not sure how long it will last but I figured it would set the codes being it is basically doing the same thing as unplugging. The truck even seemed to run a bit better then it did while just unplugging it. Who knows?

interseting..... Could be the real deal!



What did you make it out of? I'm deciding between aluminum and stainless steel.

I made it out of 1/8 aluminum sheet metal. Used the picture fingers put up of his, and it was pretty easy to make. Just cut out a piece of metal about 5 inches long and 3 inches tall. Find center to center of the studs. Drill a 3/8 hole on center about 1.25 up from the bottom of the plate, and then you can simply trace out the rest of it once you get the stud holes cut out.

I would recommend against the alum. Look at thew scorch marks on my metal plate. I think it is getting close to the melting point of the Alum. Thin steel would be better

I would think if there is aluminum heads on the truck that aluminum would be fine, I could be wrong tho.

When I get one of these plates from Fingers, Ill be willing to test and post results from a CA emissions truck...unless tbone beats me to it.


I HOPE THIS IS THE FIX FOR US CA and FED emissions guys!!

I have a Fed emission truck. It seems to keep the codes away for now. The melting point of aluminum is 1220F and steel is 2750F, so Fingers has a good point on that. Well I have a nice template anyways and can just go cut one out of steel now. I think the plate will be ok for over the weekend tho.

dojohnso,


Well, I'm keeping my fingers crossed for you, but I'm not going out and betting on it either.


Good Luck,
Dennis

Well just got done making the steel plate. I have an aluminum template here if anyone is up to making it on their own. I will ship it to you as long as I can get it back. PM me.

how long does it take to install the plate.....

bout 5 minutes or less

How about a pic of the process? http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif

yes a pic would definately be nice

Yes, a pic PLEASE http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clap.gif

I unpluged my egr and it did not throw on the light.I checked for codes with my scanner and it said it had none. Had a limp home mode the other day and took my truck to my good friend Randy at Molle Chevrolet. Code was low fuel pressure, ie clogged filter. Best mileage I ever got. Randy also showed 4 egr codes and when he said that I told him I had unplugged it. Might be a warranty problem if they can track the codes when we can't. I used an Actron CP 9150 to check. I contacted Actron and they said they have nothing better. Does anyone know of a scanner a guy can afford that will show the codes and also injector balance rates??

I ordered a gasket from the dealer to use as a template for a block off plate. They will be laser cut out of stainless steel. Would anyone be interested I would only charge for material and shipping.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Ermm.gif

I sent a pattern to Reliver and he has cut out a prototype and test fit it.

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/DZ6_MVC-001S.JPG


Up to you. The thread is
http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=13040&TPN=15

Looks nice.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Rock On.gif I was going to have one lasered out also, but I got beat to it.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Ouch.gif


Edited by: KTDURAMAX

Very nice. My homeade is not as pretty as that one, but it gets the job done. By the way still no CEL which seems to still amaze me being it was on all the time before and all I did is plug in the EGR and add the plate. The truck seems to run much better then it did with just having it unplugged.

I have arranged with Reliver to collect money for the blocker plates with my Paypal account and pass it on to him if that is easier for people. Credit Cards are OK. My Paypal account is:

Daedalus1@verizon.net

Plates are $7.50 and include shipping. Make sure you provide your name and address.

On Edit: Fixed a typo in the Paypal address. sorryEdited by: Fingers

Emerick115,


This appears to be great news for the guys with NE emissions at least. Hopefully, those with California emissions will have the same luck. This is awesome! It's amazing how this forum is solving a pretty tough nut to crack. The ingenuity is astounding.


Dennis

Will the Egr plate block off help fuel mileage???? An where exactly is it??? I know that may be obvious looking @ the motor but im a retard ok!!! Also that plate is sweet looking, i like many others will want to try this ...

Will the Egr plate block off help fuel mileage???? An where exactly is it??? I know that may be obvious looking @ the motor but im a retard ok!!! Also that plate is sweet looking, i like many others will want to try this ...


We're not related, are we?http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif


Open the hood, look in from the passenger side just to the right of centerline all the way in the rear of the engine bay on top of the motor. You should see where the EGR valve tube comes straight back and meets with exhaust tube coming up from behind the engine. Where those two meet, you put your 'Finger.'


Dennis

I fabbed up a plate this morning out of a piece of sheet metal. I decided to remove the studs and have a look at the gasket and use it as a pattern for the plate. The gasket is just a thin sandwiched steel part, 2 thin pieces with a spot weld on each end.


Went for a run down the highway and noticed that my exhaust is louder for sure, I have no cat either, I am assuming that all of the exhaust gasses are headed out the pipe (like they should be)


Has any one else noticed this? especially at about 1500 rpm. It sounds alot better to me,


Rob

Bad news. CEL came on again tonighthttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Cry.gif. I was pulling about 8500 lbs tonight and the light came back on. This time tho it only thru the po401 and po404 codes. It was about 90 degress amd very humid and my truck only got up to 203 degrees up the biggest hill with the AC on full tilt. I think we may have solved the temp problems. As for fuel mileage, that went in the toilet due to the fact that my foot got heavier with the cleaner running prophttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clown.gif.

Question,


If you have the plate installed, and plug the EGR valve back in will this allow fuel to enter the canister when it cycles open and closed?





Rob

Question,If you have the plate installed, and plug the EGR valve back in will this allow fuel to enter the canister when it cycles open and closed?Rob


I don't think you have a full picture of the system, Rob. The plate blocks the exhaust gas inlet from the rear of the engine to the EGR valve. The canister is a cooler with a flowing engine coolant jacket to cool those gases after they pass through the EGR valve to be routed into the intake for recirculation through the intake valves. There is no fuel in a diesel until it is direct-injected into the cylinders at piston top dead center. The blocked off EGR will just be a "dead-ended" system on the intake with no exhaust gas pressure or flow since the source of exhaust pressure is blocked.

IC,


Thanks for the explanation, TDC is what I wasn't thinking about when both valves are closed





Rob

This time tho it only thru the po401 and po404 codes.

what scanner are you using?

P0401 makes sense, no flow through the EGR valve. P0404 is a bit confusing, that says the actual valve position does not compare to the commanded position. You got the plug plugged in? With the plug in I would have expected only the P0401.

Jim

For me, this egr crap is like deja vu. My 86 Toyota 4x turbo would never idle smoothly until I started blocking off the egr, then it was perfect. Made me crazy for a couple of years 'til I discovered the cause. Disconnecting the vacuum didn't faze it; the valve always leaked a little. For that little thing, a piece of beer can always did the trick and lasted a long time. Even forgot to remove it on a couple of smog checks and passed fine. The plate pix above look almost identical to what I was making, just bigger, and I left just a little tab on top to grab. I'm just grateful for a cat-less, egr-less LB7, given the impending emissions attention that is coming for us all.

emerick,


that's too bad. But you didn't throw the light until you were pulling? Maybe for normal driving it will be fine. . . we still don't know about the California emissions guys, though. . . Anybody try it yet out there in the Golden State?


Dennis

Would it hurt anything to just drill a small hole in the plate?

wouldnt hurt anything, but you would still get the insuffecient egr code because you aren;t getting the max egr flow.

It also seems like drilling a small hole would also let in soot and heat. Granted, probably not as much as stock, but eventually, like when towing, it would reach the same temps as with no plate. Short trips a small hole would probably be a benefit, long trips would probably be a detriment (JMO).


Dennis

wouldnt hurt anything, but you would still get the insuffecient egr code because you aren;t getting the max egr flow.

But that's the question. How little can you get away with?

Even 10% is too much getting back into the cylinders...

Fingers, how much did your engine temps go down after you added the plate? Does it seem like the fan cuts on less?

I havn't done official runs yet due to my sched and the weather. However, initial impressions are good. Hills that would cause overheating haven't and I'm running cooler all around. I've been able to stay at WOT without fear. All in all, a good deal for me.

I will post when I do my controlled runs with and without.

So I guess it still runs at the same normal operating temp as before, correct? (Which would make sense, as that is controlled via thermostat)...


So you are going to have to put a load on it to see, I guess...

Actually, it is running cooler. Probably just cracking the first themostat. Before I ran near 210 all of the time.

The real test will be loading it on a hot day with the AC on.

What temp do you run right now?


Forgive my ignorance, but what do you mean by the "first" thermostat?

Light loads, down hill and such I am running 195. Never get over 210.

Dmax has two themostats. one set for I think 195 and the other I think at 210.

I think it runs cooler as well. I loaded up on saturday an made some uphill pulls in 90 degree very humid weather. The highest the juice recorded was 202 which sounds good to me. I do have a question tho. Once the computer sees the EGR flow is too low, does it do anything to compensate for that??? For some reason the truck seems snappier when the light is off. It very well may be just me as well also.

The ECM is doin something different, I just don't know what....yet.

I'm looking at two solutions at the same time. One is to restrict the EGR flow, but leave enough to fool the MAF sensor. The other is to use the EGR valve position sensor output to modify the MAF sensor signal. Should be a simple circuit once I get the ranges for the two sensor outputs.

So it wasnt just me then.

Fingers, you 're looking for a signal...right? Why not mod the signal? Forget the EGR and keep it blocked......just mod the signal. Of course that's more easy said than done.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Embarrased.gif

That is what I would like to do. If I can mod the signal, I can keep the EGR completely plated AND keep the ECM happy too. I should be able to inject the correct voltage into the MAF sensor signal with a transistor driven by the EGR signal once I know the ranges I need to deal with and still keep the EGR signal reasonably clean.

These computer driven trucks are nice....if they would just quit intergrating them so da-gum much. One board "does it all" and you just can't "pull the plug" without having an issue ...or a poor running truck.

This time tho it only thru the po401 and po404 codes.

what scanner are you using?

P0401 makes sense, no flow through the EGR valve. P0404 is a bit confusing, that says the actual valve position does not compare to the commanded position. You got the plug plugged in? With the plug in I would have expected only the P0401.

Jim


I know it does'nt make sense but I get both codes just by removing the cat (with no MIL). If I disconnect the EGR I also get a P1404 and an illuminated MIL.

An adjustable version of the EGR blocker plate is on it's way to me for testing. Will post what I find, if I find anything.

Well it seems opening the blocker plate at all defeats the whole purpose correct? Or is this just a test to figure out how to trick the ecu?

There are those that would prefer to not have codes and a light. So even reducing the flow would be a benifit for them.

For me, it is a curiosity.

What would be really cool, is if you had one that you could control from the cab or would open when the truck was off, then stay open for a minute, then shut. I think that would remove all codes and problems with the EGR since the continuously running diagnostics on the EGR would pass (IIRC, they only check stepper motor position vs. input position), and the startup MAF/EGR diagnostics would pass (since the blocker plate would be open until completion). Once the initial startup diagnostics were complete, close the blocker plate and drive on. . . .


You need to get emerick115 or one of the other California guys that are throwing codes due to EGR to see if it would work. Not sure on the NE emissions, though. Fingers, you have NE emissions, right? Maybe the same there.


Dennis

I have the NE emissions I would think being I am from NY.

There are those that would prefer to not have codes and a light. So even reducing the flow would be a benifit for them.

For me, it is a curiosity.



why are people worrying about turning on the light ?? with all these mods we do for performance, who cares about a light being on. just get a scanner to check it to make sure its nothing major and clear them from time to time - it takes all of 30 sec's.

The light would annoy the hell out of me personally.


And the questions would annoy me even more. How come your new truck with 5k on it has the check engin light on?

Received my plate today and of course installed immediately. EGR unplugged for about two weeks, throwing two sets of four codes and SES light. After plate installed, cleared codes and cycled 3-4 times around the block...no SES and no codes. I have not put under load but will tomorrow and update then.

P.S. No Cat either
P.P.S. also posted in EGR unplug thread

I think I have Federal emmisions. Haven't looked at the sticker in the glove box for the code. There is nothing under the hood at all. I'm in Western PA.

A quick warning. Make sure you get the exhaust flanges sealed up good when you install the plate. If it leaks, you will see a drastic drop in your fuel economy. Personal experience.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif

Got my plate today and installed it. I assume I got it right. Other than making sure the nuts are tight again is there anything else I need to do to make sure the exhaust flanges are sealed?


I will be towing my trailer to the property this weekend, I will watch my temps to see if there is any change.

Got my plate today also, I got it installed over the exhaust pipe, had a hard time getting it started and did not seem to run real well.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Geek.gif what did I do wrong?

might be a dumb question but can you interupt the exhaust gas in between the cat and the intake. cap off the cat end and put a filter on the other end and let the stepper motor pump in clean air instead of soot. just an idea, i know nothing about egr's

Got my plate today also, I got it installed over the exhaust pipe, had a hard time getting it started and did not seem to run real well.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Geek.gif what did I do wrong?

It is leaking.

I would think you should be able to feel a leak just putting your hand around it while idleing

Not if it in on the bottom of the flange. Also, there is very little preasure at idle. The leaks I had were all at the top though. My First prototype plate was thick and had a tendancy not to seal correctly at the top of the flange. I have more practice than most putting it in and out.

Reliver has sent me a copy of the production plate. I am going out and put it in shortly and will try to get some pics.

maybe I should be more clear I put it at the end of the exhaust tip was that the wrong location?

Wickedfn4u, I gotta see a picture of thishttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif

Step by step...

I cut an extra gasket using the plate as a template. You can buy one or go without, your choice. I didn't get any leakage without but your milage may vary.

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/DEC_DYI_8.jpg

Some landmarks to help you find the place to put the plate

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/B5D_DYI_1.jpghttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/598_DYI_2.jpg

Using a 12mm socket, Loosen the two nuts holding the flange together. It is a bit cramped, but I was able to get in there with my big paws. Back the nuts off all the way. You do not need to remove them.

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/1A5_DYI_3.jpg

Spread the flange by prying them apart with a screwdriver, prybar, or as I did, wrench handle.

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/EE7_DYI_4.jpg

Now you can slip the plate between the flanges. The original gasket was stuck to the jacket side of the flange, so I put my new gasket on the opposite side of the plate. Make sure the plate is down on the studs before tightening. There should be little if any of the plate showing above the flange.

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/82A_DYI_5.jpg

http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/uploads/C3B_DYI_7.jpg

Tighten the nuts and your are done. Start the engine and check for leakes.

Fingers,


Nice pictures. Did you have an assistant? If not, you're one talented individual.


Dennis

i can walk and chew gum toohttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif

At the same time? You are too much.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif Sooner or later I'm going to hack out a plate and put it in. Right now, temps aren't a problem, but I'll be kicking myself the day my truck it heating up and I didn't 'Finger' it.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif Hopefully this will work for all the California and NE emissions guys. . . They should all send you an extra $10.00 for keeping the light off for them.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clap.gif


Dennis

Fingers: Thanks for posting the pictures, it's a big help in explaining the install.

I have what are hopefully a few simple questions:

In the comments covering the first photo discussing a second gasket, you mentioned "You can buy one or go without", I assume this means buying gasket material rather than the actual gasket. Do auto stores, such as Auto Zone, carry the material, and is there a specific name for the material? I don't know sqwat about gaskets, so I want to be sure I get the right stuff, considering the high temps.

What is the purpose of the hole cut in the gasket? Is it to prevent the gasket material from getting damaged by the heat? Could you also list the diameter of the hole cut-out.

How difficult is it to separate the cooler from the exhaust? I looked at the forth picture, but cannot figure out how the position of the wrench handle will pry the two pieces apart. Maybe it is one of those things that will make sense once I do it.

Thanks for the help.

Fingers: Thanks for posting the pictures, it's a big help in explaining the install.

I have what are hopefully a few simple questions:

In the comments covering the first photo discussing a second gasket, you mentioned "You can buy one or go without", I assume this means buying gasket material rather than the actual gasket. Do auto stores, such as Auto Zone, carry the material, and is there a specific name for the material? I don't know sqwat about gaskets, so I want to be sure I get the right stuff, considering the high temps.
<font color="blue">Most any gasket material will do. NAPA and such will carry it. You can, if you want, buy an actual factory gasket. Just tell em what you want.</font>

What is the purpose of the hole cut in the gasket? Is it to prevent the gasket material from getting damaged by the heat? Could you also list the diameter of the hole cut-out.
<font color="blue"> The hole is 1-3/8. I cut it just in case the heat had any effect on the gasket material.</font>

How difficult is it to separate the cooler from the exhaust? I looked at the forth picture, but cannot figure out how the position of the wrench handle will pry the two pieces apart. Maybe it is one of those things that will make sense once I do it.
<font color="blue"> Pry it apart any way you see fit. I wedged the wrench handle between the exhaust pipe and the mounting bracket just below the flange. </font>

Thanks for the help.
<font color="blue"> Hope it helps </font>

Thanks for the info fingers, I could'nt help but wonder how you got your call sign of FINGERS......noticed your thumb looked a little short!!!......p.s. How much longer before you expect to have new sticks out? no hurry just wondering................Rick

Thanks Fingers, I'm Glad We Have You Around.