I have installed an auxillary tank in the bed of my truck. The tank is designed to gravity feed into the original tank of the truck. The auxillary tank is vented to atmosphere and there is a line connecting the two tanks to provide a vent for the factory tank. This tank has been in the truck for about 6,000 miles with no problems. The truck now won't start. I changed the fuel filter and found about a teaspoon full of crud in the filter. I had the truck towed to the dealer and they say that the problem weld sl*g and crud from the auxillary tank plugging the injectors and the injector pump. Is this possible or is the crud they found the material I have read about on this forum that is in everyones fuel lines? Would it be possible for weld sl*g and crud from the auxillary tank to get through the fuel filter and plug the injectors and injector pump? If so how? The dealer wants to charge me $3,800 for the repairs to replace all injectors and the injector pump. Edited by: Tomnavigator

Sorry to hear your problem, but I am not an expert. Someone will chime in.

I think they are trying to not do the work... Logic prevails here... If the tank/aux tank is before the filter, the system should be handling it.


Personally, I would go to another dealer (if you can). If they give you the same answer, take the tank out and go to yet a third dealer.


In the end, I doubt it is your fault!


HTH

How long was the fuel filter on the truck before you changed it. How did the filter look otherwise? If you haven't looked inside one before, do a search for filter pics and they'll see lots that are 'used up'. any sign of the crud in the pleats of the filter? Crud from the tank should have plugged the filter and created drivability problems before it got passed the filter and caused damage. If it was running good before the no start then its hard to believe the source was in the tank. You could drop the main tank and see if there's anything in there, a lot of work but if its clean, it would tell the tale.

Good luck.

FWIW-There has been 3 posts that I know of from members who cut open their OEM filters and found the filter base plate had fallen off allowing fuel to bypass the filter. I am one of those 3 and this is one of the reasons that I'm glad I run post OEM filtration. What really bothers me is the fact that only a few members cut open filters which would lead me to believe this problem is a little too frequent. What about the other 99% out there who doesn't cut them open??? http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Confused.gif I'm not sure if this is your problem but if they can identify sl*g and crud I would say the soarce is making it past the filter. I would go to your dealer right away to get that filter and inspect it. Hopefully they still have it.


If you want to see pics of a failed filter go to the link in my sig.


Tommy

Thanks for the replies.


1) I bought the truck with 38,000 miles on it. It now has 50,000 miles and this is the first time I replaced the fuel filter.


2) I did cut open the fuel filter and the bottom plate was on the filter element.


3) There is a gap of about 1 1/2 inches between the bottom of the filter element and the bottom of the filter (the area for water to accumulate). There was less than a teaspoon of grit, etc. in this area. I cut off the filter media and opened up the pleats to look at the filter media. The pleats of the filter were stained dark brownish black but there was no layer of crud on the pleats which could be scraped off. I have cut open fuel filters on my cars in the past and have been able to scrape off a layer of built up on plugged filters. This filter did not have a layer which could be scraped off.


4) I pulled out the factory fuel tank and was surprised at how clean it was. There was not even enough material in the bottom of the tank to cover lincoln's head on a penny. I guess that the continuous circulation of fuel to the fuel injector system through the filter keeps the tank clean.


I do not see how anything significant can get past the filter element unless the filter element is defective.

The way I see it GM speced the filter and this filter was the last thing your fuel saw before the pump and injectors. If they say trash caused the problem then I would take this case a little higher up through their chain of command. I seem to think persistance in your case should pay off.


Good Luck,


Tommy

First off that is a bargain for a NEW High Pressure pump and 8 brand spanking new injectors INSTALLED please get it in writing so when we roll out of warranty we can roll in there and get'er done! http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif





You didn't tell them about the crud did you? What happened to rule number one,Never volunteer info?


If it is a plastic aux tank ,I know you said sl*g,there were one or two guys that reported plastic chunks floating around or in the filter.


The bottom line as said above the OEM filter should catch any debris that will harm the injection system.You have to have them explain how it was possible to pass damaging sl*g.


Good Luck.


Mac





Nick what's the problem with s l a g ? http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Geek.gifEdited by: Mackin

You didn't tell them about the crud did you? What happened to rule number one,Never volunteer info?





Deny everything, admit nothing and make counter-accusations!


Learned that in the Army. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Approve.gif

mac - dunno what is wrong wtih slag but i fixed it!


anyways, i would probably just go to another dealer. change your fuel filter FIRST and don't volunteer anything.. if they asked you if you changed it say yes. if they ask you how often you change it say every 12k.. it sounds as if they are trying to give you the run around, but i might just go elsewhere if its do-able.Edited by: Diesel Power

If a dealer denies warranty, doesn't that get logged against the VIN, so if he was to take it to another dealership, they would just deny it also?

well are they charging you diag time if so how much....

Lets start with the injectors...What do they say is wrong?

Ask them the flow tests....Visually see them
What is the Api rating of the fuel.
The flow form the pump should be 12-14ml (correct me if I am wrog Eric)

that is each bank.Lt side and Rt. 4 injector 3-4 ml each =12-16Ml.

If no fuel flow out you have a restriction but most likely Bad pump.

Over flow is injector issue and the diag is to go to the bank with over flow.
now the Valve covers come off.....if you need help with this its alot to understand PM me I will give you my Phone # Patrick

I have replaced 4 fuel filters and cut them all open and have never seen any water or crud or sludge at the bottom of the canister or in the filter medium.


Further gravity feed isnt DOT approved there has to be an auto shut off for the fuel line.


You need to flush the entire fuel system before any work is done on that truck.


good luck

If a dealer denies warranty, doesn't that get logged against the VIN, so if he was to take it to another dealership, they would just deny it also?


It's my belief the dealer cannot void your warranty. They can refuse to do your warranty then you climb the ladder. Call 1-800 get a regional involved,blah blah.


The dealers are independently owned.


I believe the dealer also calls and ask for procedure or anything questioable for warranty coverage . The problem is if the Dealer ship puts warranty coverage in and it gets denied by GM then their stuck with the bill. The consumer is long gone and would ,shrug them off.


I doubt that in this case the dealer has done anything but say we're not fixing it ,but I could be wrong. It would be best and try and work with them at this point and see where there at.


Tell them you respectfully dissagree and would like the option to go else where.


If you push it then I believe they will make the call,have regional come and sign off or "flag".





Mac


Edited by: Mackin

"The few, the proud..."
FWIW-There has been 3 posts that I know of from members who cut open their OEM filters and found the filter base plate had fallen off allowing fuel to bypass the filter. I am one of those 3 and this is one of the reasons that I'm glad I run post OEM filtration. What really bothers me is the fact that only a few members cut open filters which would lead me to believe this problem is a little too frequent. What about the other 99% out there who doesn't cut them open??? </v:stroke></v:f></v:f></v:f></v:f></v:f></v:f></v:f></v:f></v:f></v:f></v:f></v:f></v:ulas></v:path><o:lock aspectratio="t" v:ext="edit"></o:lock></v:shape></v:imagedata></v:shape> I cut my filters open. So far, no base plate separation, no rust.

Has there ever been a poll taken regarding the defective filter issue?
I wonder if it was just a bad batch.

I'm not so sure gravity feed is a good idea either. The way I see it with an auxiliary tank you should have a transfer pump AND it’s a great opportunity to PRE-filter your fuel before the primary tank. Call me a filter nut, but triple filtration does not seem unreasonable to me. I know this is a bit off topic, but you could even aggressively filter that fuel between the aux and primary and if the filter gets plugged, no biggie---you won't be SOL if you are found without an extra filter. Just use the primary tank and change the in-between filter at you next earliest convenience.<IMG onMouseOver=

Does GM use a Filter between Dual tanks on Chassis Cabs ?????


If they do not and only use a transfer pump there you have a good argument.


See what else they say, and get it in writing..........if they are bluffing they won't write it down.





TONYEdited by: GMC-2002-Dmax

I have a new pump and 3 new Injectors....For spares in case I ever need one. I bouth these at a car show in South GA. Brand ne win the factory unopened box..Wasn't to cheap but was cheaper than buying them from the stealer. These are new GM not aftermarket or remans...I might sell them if you are in a bind with this.

What ever you don't take the truck to Bob Hook Chevrolet. or it will be screwed up even more. Trust me on this. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Angry.gif

Interesting post.....


Tony has a point, is there a filter on a chassis cab truck with two tanks? NO. But, GM put it there, so thats ok. ( second tank)


I think that regardless of what the crap is in the fuel, the filter should stop it, Can they actually see crap someplace it shouldnt be downstream of the filter? Where do they see it? How do they know it come from the welding slag? I aint buying it either way. Does the truck run? Why the trip to the dealer, I missed that.

Eric,


He was having starting problems that's why he had it towed to the dealership.

ahh. thanks. missed it.


Then I am with Patrick.. I wanna see/know test results. If contaminated crap etc did it... prove it.


Any tech can claim that xxx caused the problem, takes a real one to prove ithttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Cool.gifEdited by: dmaxalliTech

dam right..... http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clap.gif http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clap.gif http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Clap.gif

Eric,


He was having starting problems that's why he had it towed to the dealership. My truck was having the same issues. Make them prove the fuel damaged the injectors. The stock fuel filter should have done enuff to keep this from happening in the first place.

The stock fuel filter should have done enuff to keep this from happening in the first place.

And if they still insist that it was "slag" from the tank then they are admitting the stock fuel filter is really inadequate. Ask them if they wish to put in writting the stock filter is not adequate for the application. Until they do that then it is a warranty job.


Jim

The stock fuel filter should have done enuff to keep this from happening in the first place.

And if they still insist that it was "slag" from the tank then they are admitting the stock fuel filter is really inadequate. Ask them if they wish to put in writting the stock filter is not adequate for the application. Until they do that then it is a warranty job.


Jim


Amen, Jim!!!





Hey Tomnavigator, any updates?