Guys, help me out here.


Went to the lake yesterday, dropped the boat in, wife started the boat, pushed boat off the trailer, she putted around the dock while I went to park the truck.


I hop back in the cab, drop it into "D", slowly start up the ramp. just as the trailer got out of the water - SLIP.


So, yeah, its late in the season, the ramp is a little slippery. Long story short, I couldn't even pull the damn empty trailer out of the lake without someone hopping on the bumper to help with traction.


Before you ask, yeah, it is only a 2WD.


Any tips for slippery boat ramps? I had a hard time explaining to my wife why my $40k truck couldn't pull the empty trailer out of the damn lake.

The two easiest solutions are keep some extra weight in the back of the truck and the other is keep your speed up as you pull the trailer out of the water.

Idea #1 . . . . Get rid of the stock tires!
I had to go into 4WD turning around on the shoulder of the road (Dry road - mid Aug, 105 degF, no rain for a month in Ft. Worth Tx). That was with my stock firestones! Now that I have my BFG's, i can cut 2" ruts in mud w/out going to 4WD.

New tires may help more than you know.
PDS

Yes, better tires would help a lot and so would about 3 to 400lbs in back of bed by tailgate and feathering power to keep traction.

Forgot about the stock tires. Yea, an upgrade there will go a long way. Best investment IMO. Taller tires! Tell the wife it is an essential upgrade to handle the massive power the D-Max is putting out http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif

Forgot about the stock tires. Yea, an upgrade there will go a long way. Best investment IMO. Taller tires! Tell the wife it is an essential upgrade to handle the massive power the D-Max is putting out http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif

I disagree on the taller tires as it will increase axle housing torque rap up at any give load with stock gears and if you go to say 35's it would be like gearing your truck up to a 3.20 something axle ratio with stock tires and you do not have to be a rocket scientist to know what that does to towing power.

I know you disagree snowman, but the problem here is traction not torque.

Sorry Corona, Snow Nut here goes off every time someone mentions taller tires.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Confused.gif

Taller tires will reduce your torque but will also increase your traction and reduce the twitchy pedal response. I nice comprimise seems to be in the 32-33 inch diameter range. Plenty of pulling power.

I know you disagree snowman, but the problem here is traction not torque.

Sorry Corona, Snow Nut here goes off every time someone mentions taller tires.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Confused.gif

Taller tires will reduce your torque but will also increase your traction and reduce the twitchy pedal response. I nice comprimise seems to be in the 32-33 inch diameter range. Plenty of pulling power.

No you go brain dead everytime you think about big tires and pretend that they have no effect on towing power, drive line strain or life and that a Dmax is immune to this. There is no FREE LUNCH HERE as you would like to believe and you hate reality checks.

I'll bow out corona. I have no intentions of fanning Snow Nut's ego. If you have more questions feel free to PM me. Then you can post what you did.

ACK - Gentlemen - to your corners!


- long term solution is a 4WD


- short term solution was to find the boat ramp that was less steep. In fact, that's what we did at the end of the day, since I couldn't even pull the empty trailer out - I wasn't even going to try the trailer with the boat on it.


I agree that the factory tires need to go - but I'll probably get 245's, just like are on it now. I gotta get like 20k on the factory ones anyway, otherwise she'll kill me. I also don't want to mess with the delta for the mileage/speedo with larger diameter tires.

Maybe you can convince here you need to trade it in for 4WD/2005 modelhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif

Maybe you can convince here you need to trade it in for 4WD/2005 modelhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif

I pulled several boats for a lot of years on nasty ramps too and even though I had 4x4 trucks most of the time I can never recall needing it to get up the ramp. A set of good grippy tires with lots of grooves and blocks in tread and maybe a few hundred pounds or ballast (a truck cap will work too) and you will do just fine.

Get those Mitchilens that have the hand come out and grip the ground http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif

go with 33 x 12.50 in an aggressive all terrain tire like the BFG. not much lag in power, wider contact patch. something everyone else here has overlooked is the power of airing down your tires. maybe a bit inconvenient, but carry an air tank and you will not have problems. drop down to 30 psi and crawl up the ramp like a champ.

I have never had to adjust tire pressure on a ramp and personally I would not want the bother of it.

I have faced the same situation with my 2WDs. Is the tread pattern that matters the most. The stock tires just don't have enough traction. I don't care if it is taller or smaller u just need to get different tires with a different foorprint than your stock tires.

I know you disagree snowman, but the problem here is traction not torque.

Sorry Corona, Snow Nut here goes off every time someone mentions taller tires.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Confused.gif

Taller tires will reduce your torque but will also increase your traction and reduce the twitchy pedal response. I nice comprimise seems to be in the 32-33 inch diameter range. Plenty of pulling power.


W/ snowman's 140hp toyota, he needs all the torque he can get http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif

Do you have a G-80?

Do you have a G-80?

Translation: Do you have a locking rear differential?http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Big Smile.gif

I think so. Came with a trailering package. I'd have to check the sticker to be sure.

I know you disagree snowman, but the problem here is traction not torque.

Sorry Corona, Snow Nut here goes off every time someone mentions taller tires.http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Confused.gif

Taller tires will reduce your torque but will also increase your traction and reduce the twitchy pedal response. I nice comprimise seems to be in the 32-33 inch diameter range. Plenty of pulling power.


W/ snowman's 140hp toyota, he needs all the torque he can get http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/HiHi.gif

For every action there is a reaction. Bigger tires equals more driveshaft torque equal more housing torque twist (this is why RR tire always breaks lose first going forward) hence less even traction.

BTW, I have 5 cars and 3 of them are 4x4's. One of the 4x4's I have had for 19 years, the youngest one I bought new 5 years ago. I keep my cars for a long time and I saved a LOT of gas in the Toyota (getting as high as 40mpg a few times) in the 210K plus miles I drove it and was a great car to drive too and never left me stranded once. It had 6 miles on it when I got it. Edited by: snoman

Wouldnt hurt to throw a tow strap(the kind with the loops on both ends and ahve a couple of screw pin clevises) in your truck. If you get in a bind worse case scenario you can ask someone for a slight pull.


Turn the juice down too.


I wouldnt really go bigger by much. Maybe a bit more aggressive, the stockers suck.


EDit: Nevermind.....thats not helpfullhttp://www.dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Embarrased.gifEdited by: ratlover

over 30mph (wheel spin counts)the G 80 does not lock


try playing with the emergency brake, the extra drag sometimes allows the spinning wheel to grab better.

According to service manual it is approx 20 mph

Keep a bag of sand with you. Sprinkle it under the tires and along the path in front of the rear tires.

That's if it's a hard ramp.

If you do have the locker it should engage no problem as soon as one side starts to spin. It engages when there is a 100 rpm difference in axle rpm. That isn't much. That's why it's called a Gov-Lok... There is a centrifical weight inside that flips out, forcing a wedge in between the side gear clutches.

Pulling a trailer up a ramp at 20 mph???? doubt it.



http://www.uscom.com/%7Ehoot/cars/duramax/gmc/mag-hytec/images/DSCN1153.jpgEdited by: hoot

Keep a bag of sand with you. Sprinkle it under the tires and along the path in front of the rear tires.

That's if it's a hard ramp.

If you do have the locker it should engage no problem as soon as one side starts to spin. It engages when there is a 100 rpm difference in axle rpm. That isn't much. That's why it's called a Gov-Lok... There is a centrifical weight inside that flips out, forcing a wedge in between the side gear clutches.

Pulling a trailer up a ramp at 20 mph???? doubt it.


I belive we are talking tire speed not vehical speed.

No I believe they are talking vehicle speed. There is a vehicle speed that the locker will not engage at.

In Hoots picture, the upper small shaft is geared to the spider gears and senses the speed difference between the tires. The more differntial, the more lockup. The lower shaft is the counter balance and senses the carrier speed. It works against the locker so at higher speeds, lockup is reduced or even prevented. When a wheel spins without the truck moving, the half shaft is spinning twice as fast as the carrier. With any forward speed, the proportion goes more and more towards tha carrier. It is the proportioning between these two that reduces the lockup, not a given speed.
Edited by: Fingers

OK,


I hate to hijack this thread, but I find myself in need of clarification on the locking diff (G80) . .


In my mind, as far as the locking capability of the G80 is concerned, there should not be a difference between vehicle & tire speed. As I see it, if 1 tire is spinning, the other tire/side locks up to compensate for the lack of traction. After that, as soon as the wheel speed goes over 20-30 mph, the locker will dis-engage again. Is this correct?


In this senario, the vehicle speed is not relevant, only the wheel/rear axle speed is controling the lock. In reading the above post, I almost got the impression that as long as the forward motion of the vehicle was below 20-30 mph, the locker would work. i.e.: the speedo showing 45-55 mph with the vehicle moving at 5 mph in the mud with one tire slipping more than the other, the locker would stay engaged. Surely this is not correct??? I have to think that the centrifical lock is controled by the axle/wheel speed. Correct?


Thanx,
PDS

The G80 is not a constantly on locker like say a detroit. The locking is more akin to a centrifical clutch. The more speed differential between the tires, the more the clutch lets out.



OK,


In this senario, the vehicle speed is not relevant, only the wheel/rear axle speed is controling the lock. In reading the above post, I almost got the impression that as long as the forward motion of the vehicle was below 20-30 mph, the locker would work. i.e.: the speedo showing 45-55 mph with the vehicle moving at 5 mph in the mud with one tire slipping more than the other, the locker would stay engaged. Surely this is not correct??? I have to think that the centrifical lock is controled by the axle/wheel speed. Correct?


Thanx,
PDS

The vehicle speed is relevant. In your example, the slipping tire is going 80-100 MPH! With that much differential, I would expect the clutches to be clamping down hard,

Agian, there are TWO mechanisms that work against each other. One senses the difference in speed between the two tires. The more difference, the more the clutch pack transfers power to the slower tire. The other senses vehicle speed at the axle and reduces the clamping force on the clutches as speed increases. It is not on or off.

Sweet, I knew it was a centrifugal(sp) clutch/counterweight system, but I did not know that the system accounted for the actual vehicle speed.


This makes more sense, because I thought both back tires were spinning in the slop for at least a couple of times when the speedo was above 30 mph. I knew about the 20 mph release, but I thought when the rear axle spin got above the 20-30 mph mark, the system released!





Thanx!


PDS

Besides the tire suggestions, you can also try to feather the brakes. Keep your rpms constant and tap you brakes lightly or feather them until you get traction. I have had to do this when I launched my boat when I had a 2wd.

If you can, try to take the ramp at an angle. This will in effect lessen the grade of the ramp.


As a side story, I was at the launch ramp pulling my Sea Doo out. I look over and see a guy with a long bed F150 trying to pull out an old 24-26 cabin cruiser. Tire smoke all over the ramp. Then, they get the bright idea of using an old Ford Thunderbird to tow the boat and F150 out of the ramp soup.http://dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Confused.gif


I always try to help out a fellow boater, so I tell them to wait a minute and I will use the truck to pull the Ford and the boat out. We hook up the tow strap and I tell the guy in the Ford to not use the gas just the break when I pull them out.


As i take the slack out of the tow strap, the guys buddy starts yelling Hit the gas, Hit the gas, I say why, I will just ldle the whloe rig up and out. With just a little gas the Ford and the boat pop up and out of the ramp soup. The look on the guys face that was telling me to floor it was pricelesshttp://dieselplace.com/forum/smileys/Approve.gif