long story short: brand new 1000ca battery jump up and made contact with hood and basically welded it self there. has to pry up on hood to get it open. luckily i was going slow through a residential neighboor hood but i lost brakes:eek: . so i slowly applied park brake and now its melted. the rubber is totally toast, it was dripping down onto the ground. so now i have no brakes and park brake is fubarded. shouldnt i have some brakes? i thought they were just assisted. when i turn on the light switch it acts like im turning on the key, it starts the wipers and lights and the glow plug light is really dem. when it first happened i lost everything except engine and the glow plug light came on. i looked all over for burnt wires but cant find any but i can sure smell. any ideas on were to start or how to test all this to see were its messed? i dont know much about wiring so please help

your normal brakes should work just fine w/o engine on. It just takes a long time after shoving in the pedal for it to start slowing down. The brake pedal is quite stiff at first but just keep pushing on it and soon the pedal will sink in and you'll feel the brakes catch. I've had to slow down when the PMD was cutting out the engine.

Are you saying your battery jumped out of place and stuck to the hood by fusing/arching?? Thats messed up. Arn't the terminals side mounted?

By turning on the light switch you mean headlights right? Do the lights come on/wipers/glows activate when you turn the swich part way (park lights) or all the way to low beams? Unfortunately, i don't have much electrical knowledge either. Need someone to chime in. Good luck in diagnosing.

thats what gets me i have zero brakes as in nada zip zero ziltch. the only thing i can think of is it messed up the anti lock system. is there a way to disconnect this?

no they dont have side terminals. it just so happened the battery holder was gone on that side. i didnt try part way just all the way

Take the batteries out and let the truck sit for a few minutes......

Put the batteries back in and see what works/doesn't work...

i hate friggin electrical and if you can smell burnt wiring you probably have a short or two. turning something on and having other appliances come on is a sure sign. bets bet and safest would be to take it to an auto electric place. rather than the corner gas station if ya know what i mean... also my alternator pulley went kaput and had to shut down the engine to prevent overheat in mid summer on a down hill. towing a boat and camper. i still had brakes but had to push like heck.

rubber smell could be from rubber boot on park brake. ill have to cut it off i guess. i disconnected the batteries and its sitting out in the rain right now. good thing i was only a block from my dads girlfriends house. can i disconnect the anti lock and get brakes?

so from what i can see there are three terminals on the anti lock, which one would i disconnect.

oh btw it feels like there maybe something at the very end of the peddle but not much. it used to be real stiff until you started the motor.

There isn't really any point in trying to disable the ABS circuit as it won't be the root cause of your problems. Should the ABS fail the system will default to normal braking without the ABS feature. I would be more inclined to think that the master cylinder is finished hence the loss of brake peddle resistance, like stepping on the brake peddle with the engine off.

I suspect that the rubber rings on the master cylinder push rod have melted along with the boot you mentioned allowing the push rod to almost bottom out without resistance. Along with that I would check your underhood fuse block, take it apart and lift it up to see if anything looks ugly. Multiple electrical activity suggests some wiring has lost it's covering and it may be contacting other wires.

Good luck, thankfully it sounds like your PCM was spared.

alright heres a update;

got the truck home and worked on it tonight. i disconnected then reconnected all the wires on the anti lock system. i was also looking under the dash at the fuse block and found a dime wedged in the terminals:rolleyes:. all the sudden my peddle was back and i have brakes again. also found a quarter sitting on top of fuse block:wtf1: . so far i have found one wire that is scorched and melted to a couple others, it looks to be the wire coming off the guages fuse. its pink with a black tracer. does any one know were this wire goes? i really dont wanna tear the whole dash apart even though i already have half of it apart:o: .

what size wire is that Pink/black wire?

alright heres a update;

got the truck home and worked on it tonight. i disconnected then reconnected all the wires on the anti lock system. i was also looking under the dash at the fuse block and found a dime wedged in the terminals:rolleyes:. all the sudden my peddle was back and i have brakes again. also found a quarter sitting on top of fuse block:wtf1: . so far i have found one wire that is scorched and melted to a couple others, it looks to be the wire coming off the guages fuse. its pink with a black tracer. does any one know were this wire goes? i really dont wanna tear the whole dash apart even though i already have half of it apart:o: .

Well now you have 35 cents more then when you started....

starting point would be to at least wrap some electrical tape around the damaged part of the wires. keep looking for those wires and wrap them until everything is working. (wrapping/repairing if necessary).

what size wire is that Pink/black wire?

um same as all the rest under there:o:

lol....Keep looking, soon you can buy a new truck! :D

I'm too lazy to look, but here's a diagram!

ugghhh...too small...PM me your email and I'll shoot it to you! I have a feeling you'll need it!

um same as all the rest under there:o:

nuts, i was hoping it would be something simple like the ignition wire which is ususally solid pink and about 10ga in size.

no this one was about a 20guage little pink w/black tracer. went back to a cluster or about 6 pinkw/black tracer wires. the wire was still good just melted alittle rubber and made contact with three different wires at the same time:badidea:. i had to take the whole damn dash apart to get to it:mad:. got most of it back togethor but will finish tomorrow and fire it up to see if it worked.

wish me luck

aaron

might want to have a fire extinguisher rated for electrical fires standing by.....and also maybe a set of cable cutters just in cast the batteries are somehow given a dead short and a fuze doesnt blow...

oh ya for sure. i almost burnt my studebaker down messing with electrical bs(puttin in my first sterio). i hope this works. i check for like a hour and cant find any other burnt wires. i kinda makes since because of what wires it melted into

Don't forget to check the starter wires, easy to melt that insulation with a dead battery short and lots of close metal to ground to.

well, here is another update; i traced the wire being melted all the way back to the firewall. replaced it from the firewall up and still no fix.:wtf1: turning the light switch on still activates the glow plug lights and when you turn the ignition on it will activate the wipers.

what in thinking happened was the current was going throught the emergency brake switch until i activated the emergency brake then it grounded out through that.everything else seems to be working fine just when you activate the light switch something goes wrong.
:help: :help: :help: :help: :help: :help: :help: :help: :help: :help: :help:

ok well if it melted the insulation off all they way to the firewall it likely did it along the whole wires length... Go ahead and trace the wire throug hte firewall to where-ever it's destination is.

Another issue may be that the actuall solid state switch for the headlights could somehow be contributing to it...

Might also check all grounding straps in the vehicle...

and if it melted the insulation off the wire, chances are that if it got that hot it may have also melted to other wires it was wraped up with in the harness. I had a headlight wire ground out once and it fused itself to all the wires in the splitloom to the lights. damaged wire can be a real mess to clean up.:Insane:

holy crap im so lost, ive opened up every wire harness under the dash and cant find any more burnt wires. light switch still activates the glow plugs or just the light(not really sure) and the wipers. are there any relays that could be burnt that are causing this? im so lost and pissed, im pulling at strings that go no where:o: any one know were i could get wiring diagrams for this vehicle?

Did you check the fuse panel under the hood? Lift it off it's mount and have a look underneath, there's some serious amperage running into that box.

I found wiring diagrams for my truck at autozone.com
They had chassis electrical and engine electrical diagrams that were very detailed yet simple to follow. Really helped me out when I was having glow plug problems!

Also my 94 doesn't have a fuse block under the hood!

ya theres no fuse box under the hood on mine.

update; found a few wiring diagrams and found out that fuse wire(guages/pink with black stripe) actually goes to my glow plugs:wtf1: . im guessing that one of the light wires runs through the wiring harness by the glow plug wires and wiper wires on the fire wall. hopefully its not raining tomorrow so i can tear it apart and see for sure. any thoughts?

The pink and black wire you are talking about connects to both the gauges fuse and the ECM 1 fuse.....

Can you start the truck? What happens when you turn the key on?

youre right, it splits and one goes to guages and one goes to fuel heater:confused:, i didnt even know it had one of those. that main wire coming off the guages fuse is what was burned and after it left the split it was burned to the fire wall.

ya its starts, nothing really happens that i can tell when you start it. everything goes screwbally when you turn the light switch on

The gauges fuse and the ECM 1 fuse are on the same wire!!!!!!!!!

hmmm not good

If I were you I would open up my dash and start probing around with a multimeter......see if any wires are burnt on the back of the light switch....sounds like the yellow wire might have grounded inside the multifunction switch.....all kinds of fun I bet....

dash:confused: what dash? oh that dash:D it came out days ago):h which switch are you talking about? ive traced all the wires under the dash and cant find any more that are screwed up:o:

The switch you press to turn the lights on.....obviously one or more wires is screwed up on that circuit...unless the ECM is toast...

i think its one of the brown wires coming off of it that is roasted on the fire wall. they are all seperate circuits so im guess they must be touching there because they arent under the dash

Brown or tan?

Brown is either alternator (for the gauge) or for the lights.....

Tan is for the low beams...

EDIT - white, purple, gray and orange are the colors for the windshield wiper wires....

brown is for lights, it goes like eight differnet ways.


oh and white(for the wipers)

Maybe I should have worded it differently....brown CAN be for either the alternator gauge or for the lights....two different wires the same color.....

Tan is for the low beams....

White, purple, gray and orange are for the wipers...

That should be enough info to get you started....have fun

thanks for the help

oh im more than started trust me, now its just about finishing:rolleyes:. i guess now i have to pull the harness apart on the engine firewall to track it down. wish me luck(im gonna need it:o: )

Easy stuff......just takes a whole lot of time and more patience than I care to have.....better you than me ):h

lol i have to walk away about every five minutes before i start breaking things:D . i hate electrical:help:

u are using a DMM to trace the wires electrically right?

what?

multimeter...

um no not yet, basically tracing them with a circuit tester and test lights trying to trace down the problem.

um no not yet, basically tracing them with a circuit tester and test lights trying to trace down the problem.


:eek:


Get a multimeter.....way easier....

ya my dads got one. will it work right with there being a interference? i know thats what im looking for but i suck at electrical

that test light may have already fried some electrical components in your truck, and if you poke the wrong wire you'll deploy your airbag! NEVER NEVER NEVER use a test light!!!!

The ONLY time you can get away with a test light is pre EFI systems were there is NO computer present in the car...and even then you should be using a DMM.

DMM = digital multimeter.


The most useful function that most DMMs have is a continuity tester. It produces an audible beep if it finds continuity btwn the two probes.

ya i used that a couple of times but aint really helping

update; toar the harness apart going across the firewall and cant find any burnt wires:mad:. now im screwed, anybody have any ideas on what to do now? does the computer have anything to do with lights and wipers? i cant find any more burnt wires so now i dont know what to do.

could you of melted the plastic block thats in the firewall? I'm out of ideas!

I have a nearly compete harness out of a 93, but I doubt taht would help you!

i finally got that connector apart, looks to have some kind of tar like sealant. is this normal?

i can unplug the wiper motor and the glow plug module and it will still light up the light on the dash when i turn the light switch on. it glows then gets really dem real quick but stays lit. i put a light on the glow plug wires and it wasnt getting anything so now im really confused:confused:

if i turn the ignition to on and turn the light switch on the wipers will go twice. turn the ignition of and nothing.

btw doesnt matter if the ignition is on or not the glow plug will still come on when you flip the light switch.
:help:

yea, the tar like stuff is normal. Its dialetric grease.

If nothing looks melted on the block.....

you have some serious issues, and I'm not sure if you fried some electronic part, or if you have a bundle of wires melted somewhere.

Lets go back to square 1.

if a battery jumped, and grounded out, where would the current be drawing from.

Have you checed all your grounds. Your grounding strap from your engine to the block. The battery to the engine. Really strange things happen when you lose your grounding strap.

Have you tried a new battery? maybe something in the battery itself has been shorted.

Lets look at that wiring harness again. A1 and A2 on my diagram are grounds to the back of the engine from the ECU. Check those.

I dont know what else to really suggest. I'm really shooting in the dark here. Just trying to give you ideas.

thanks guipo ill go check those out today

YEa, the more I think about it, the more I think you fried some grounds somewhere. And your grounding strap is a great place to start.

well, you were right gruipo. there is a cable going from the body to the battery. i was not connected, my dad had mentioned it earlier in the week but i didnt think that was it. reconnected it and guess what:eek:

its fixed:beerchug: . i still would have had to take the dash out to fix that wire and now thats its out its getting painted to look better:cool: .

btw where exactely is the grounding strap on the motor cause i cant find it?

the grounding strap should be on the passenger side back portion near the downpipe on the frame rail. Congrads on fixing the issues! :)

One thing you might want to think about doing is the "big 3"

add 4ga (or 1/0ga) from the alternator charging post to the battery's positive, a ground wire from both batteries to chassis ground, a ground wire from both batteries to engine ground, and both battery's ground to the frame's ground. This not only gives you great grounding but also is a nice redundancy should the OEM grounds break over time.


In my case the alternator case wasnt grounded very well tothe head or block so I had to run an additional ground to the alt case and bam voltage at 14.4v rock steady on both bats! :D But I had had some goofy issues too....

thanks man, hmmm didnt see, ill have to get a closer look tomorrow. maybe the dumba$$ that changed the starter before i got it took it off:rolleyes:

but in the future be ulta ultra careful with that test light. We had an installer at our shop send 9v from a 9v battery on two leads that he thought were speaker leads....a trip to the dealer and 1500 bux later the customer had a new ECU. Apparently Matt had nuked it with 9v :eek: Another shop butchered the install and Matt was tasked with fixing it....ugg Moral of the story, 9v is more than enough destoy a modern ECU or deploy an air bag so be really really careful. :)

(generally to check speaker leads we use a high impeadance tone generator that only produces 1.5v...:D - a nifty but rather expensive toy.)

ya thats a good suggestion. i have welding cable wires going from positive to positive then both grounds to block. i hadnt thought about the frame ground thought thats a good idea

oh and now a 6gauge going from body to negative:p:

well congrats :bigglasse !!!!! i have been following this wondering what the probelm was. bad grounds can cause real weird stuff to happen. now that its fixed you get the fun task of reassembling everything. ):h

heh....I'm glad I can help. Next time I'm in your area, you owe me Wingers! :P

oh fine, jk, for sure i love wingers.

well i just fired er up about five minutes ago and everything seems to be fine. everything is apparently working as it should be:cool: . now i just need to put the dash back in and im done:ro) ive missed driving this thing so bad.

i will have to replace the upper(rubber coated cable) e-brake cable though:o: cause thats were it found ground:rolleyes:. any one know the part number for this?

oh btw thanks a million to every one that helped me out

Thanks for telling everyone how it got resolved. Sharing is cool.:ro)

heres a few pictures of the burnt wire and park brake cable

dude, you cooked that mother.

might want to have a fire extinguisher rated for electrical fires standing by.....and also maybe a set of cable cutters just in cast the batteries are somehow given a dead short and a fuze doesnt blow...

Or better yet....spend the 35 cents you found and get the proper battery hold down installed. :D

The fire extinguisher IS a good idea.


Glad you got the problem resolved.

very happy to hear you got it fixed dieselboy. I wouldn't have known where to start. Sounded like something was REALLY messed up. Dam grounds... x2 on the new battery holder:cool:

ya just went and bought me a red neck special:D bunjy cord baby:ro)(for now til i get to junk yard) i switch terminals a round and put a cover over one of them so hopefully it dont happen again